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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: White Israelite on May 09, 2010, 09:44:38 PM

Title: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: White Israelite on May 09, 2010, 09:44:38 PM
I am wondering what everyone here thinks of Keffiyehs. Please read the topic before voting. As we all know, keffiyehs are considered by most people to belong to the Arab culture, but now a Israeli company is starting to market Israeli style keffiyehs. Some people are appauled by this on both sides, some Jews state that this is a symbol of terrorism and even Dunkin Donuts pulled an ad with Rachael Ray because it was seen as offensive as she sported a black and white style keffiyeh. Others such as Arabs are actually offended because they claim that Jews are stealing something that is uniquely Arab.

Others say that keffiyehs are infact not uniquely arab but they are also part of Jewish culture as Jews originate from the middle east and it was common for Jews from Yemen and other parts of the middle east to wear them as part of their culture/upbringing. Some of the very first aliyah pictures show Sephardic Jews wearing keffiyehs. Is this a symbol of terrorism or something that is a part of the sephardic Jewish culture that should be seen as something else?

Here is the Israeli company and keffiyeh that is being marketed.

http://www.thekef.com/

(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/ISRAKEF550.jpg)

(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/kef2.jpg)

(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/kef1.jpg)

(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/kef3.jpg)

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_uPzsiWdvLoQ/SGo6P6SNBDI/AAAAAAAAAZU/fwbNRWY4OvM/s400/israelikaffiyeh.jpg)

The producer of the keffiyehs defends them with this statement.

"As you know, we (Shemspeed) have recently released a new version of the Keffiyeh; an Israeli version which is blue and white designed by Dveykus. There are many variations of the Keffiyah both in color and style, all with a very long tradition and history. In order for everyone to understand where we are coming from and in order to prevent anyone from taking offense, I have decided to release this statement:

My family originates from Yemen, where my ancestors had lived for close to 2,000 years. Nearly 100 years ago, my Grandmother’s side of the family decided to move to Adis Ababa, Ethiopia and then to Israel, in 1933 (Southern Syria/Mandate Palestine at the time). On my Grandfather’s side, our family emigrated to Israel in 1924. Jews indigenous to the Middle East, such as my family is, have worn some variation of the “kefyah” (cap/kippah) and keffiyah (head/neck scarves) for thousands of years. The original purpose of the scarves, was to provide protection from the sun and sand. We have had some Arab friends take offense to our new scarf-remix. In response to such, I thought it was essential to release this statement in order to clarify the historical facts on the ground and, to provide some context. I as a Jew am not offended by the Pope who wears a “kippah” and in the same respect, I don’t feel there is any reason for anyone taking offense to a Jewish person wearing a version of the Keffiyah which they identify with; especially considering the significance of this article of clothing in both of all of our histories. There are numerous variations of the Keffiyah today; the red and white Keffiyah is associated with Jordan and worn throughout the Middle East and Somalia and have been worn by Bedouins for centuries. The black and white Keffiyah, idolized in the 1960s by Yasser Arafat, has become the symbol of the Palestinian resistance movement. The way that symbols are politicized and used to divide people, rather than as common ground for discussion and dialogue is exactly the kind of thought-provoking topic that we at Shemspeed explore with our music, as well as our programming. Our Israeli remix of the Keffiyeh, available through Shemspeed, is just one more interpretation of a scarf worn by our brothers for thousands of years. We hope you enjoy them.

- Erez Safar, Founder & Director of Shemspeed"

Here are some pictures of Sephardic Jews wearing keffiyehs. First yemenite aliyah.

(http://en.wikivisual.com/images/c/c9/First_aliyah_BILU_in_kuffiyeh.jpg)

(http://en.wikivisual.com/images/5/56/Op_Magic_Carpet_%28Yemenites%29.jpg)

19th century algerian jew

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/03/AlgerianJew.jpg)

Maimonides

(http://www.aoc.gov/images/maimonides.jpg)

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/07/Maimonides-2.jpg)

now i'm going to show you what the terrorist palestinian version looks like, the difference in pattern

Note the black and white pattern, these are always the design you will see at protests in the US

(http://cdn.buzznet.com/media-cdn/jj1/headlines/2007/04/david-beckham-colin-farrell-keffiyeh.jpg)

(http://gothamist.com/attachments/nyc_arts_john/052808rachaelray.jpg)

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2346/2486886023_6fb707a4b9.jpg)

How do you feel about the keffiyeh in general? Do you see it as a terrorist symbol or as something that is a part of the middle eastern region? Please post your views.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks on May 09, 2010, 09:45:54 PM
Are you saying the beautiful Rachael Ray is pro-Fakestinian?
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: White Israelite on May 09, 2010, 09:46:36 PM
Are you saying the beautiful Rachael Ray is pro-Fakestinian?

Anyone who sports a black/white version of the Keffiyeh, that is uniquely a "fakeistinian" design.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: muman613 on May 09, 2010, 10:23:02 PM
Kill them all!

Joking... But the Phalistinking kafeyahs would get poop in their burgers from me...

Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: MassuhDGoodName on May 09, 2010, 10:30:12 PM
What happen'd to that schwartze's head?    :o

Jeez Louise!

Looks like his momma squeezed him out into the toilet and crunched his head in six different directions -- cone shaped on the very top, recessed in the front where half his brain is missing ...

Looks like a textbook case of advanced Kuru!    >:(
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: New Yorker on May 09, 2010, 11:11:01 PM


In my opinion wearing a Keffiyeh is the same as wearing the swastika.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: JTFenthusiast2 on May 09, 2010, 11:22:49 PM


In my opinion wearing a Keffiyeh is the same as wearing the swastika.

Absolutely.  Whenever I am in Union Square, my best friend and I are on 'Keffiyeh watch;
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: MassuhDGoodName on May 09, 2010, 11:35:47 PM
I have always believed that Jews will only be fully integrated back into Eretz Yisrael when we throw off western styles of dress in favor of a style more in tune with the Middle East.  After all, that is who and what we are...a Middle Eastern people.  In my opinion all the adaptations borrowed from Europe must go!  The suits, ties, hats, and heavy shoes of Europe are poorly suited to the clime in Israel, and only help to reinforce the false perception that Israel is an outpost of Western imperialism.  Israeli architecture for the most part looks perfectly Middle Eastern, with no attempts made to emulate Continental house design.  Our language, history and culture are all of the East.  So, why not our clothing?  I vote for the "Israeli keffiyah", and hope that it's just the beginning of a new trend in Israeli fashion.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Rubystars on May 09, 2010, 11:40:08 PM
I laugh whenever I see a Muslim wearing a Calvin Klein head scarf.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Ari Ben-Canaan on May 10, 2010, 01:03:56 AM
Everything involved in Islam should be banned.  From the Koran, to Halal food.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: IsraeliGovtAreKapos on May 10, 2010, 01:19:18 AM
Massuh is correct on this one.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Zelhar on May 10, 2010, 02:24:17 AM
Keffiyeh is a very practical accessory in our region. However I think Jews should use Keffiyeh with different patterns than the Arab/Islamic traditional pattern because like it or not, it has become a symbol of Arab terrorism (especially the "Arafat" pattern).
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Luigi on May 10, 2010, 03:13:13 AM
The Israeli keffiyeh is a good idea. I'm sure it will [censored] the Nazi muslims...   ;D
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: IsraeliGovtAreKapos on May 10, 2010, 03:13:45 AM
We should understand that we live in the Middle East and not the Middle West. It's time to change our clothing to something more related to the region but eliminate any hostile signs like the Black-White version used by Al Arabi Hmaars.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: TruthSpreader on May 10, 2010, 04:52:33 AM
Any Islamic material should not be allowed.

Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Irish Zionist on May 10, 2010, 05:16:22 AM
I hate even the sight of that untalented dirty bag Colin Farrell.   >:(
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: White Israelite on May 10, 2010, 09:48:04 AM
I like Massuahs response, some scholars are mixed what the ancient Israelites wore and I am not 100 percent positive if the Keffiyeh is something recent from the region becoming heavily arabized (some have made statements that the Sephardim/Mizrahi were forced to wear this clothing to blend in, others have claimed that the Sephardim/Mizrahi are the result of conversions) or otherwise.

I find it irritating that people still refer to Sephardim as "Arab Jews" (there is no such thing as an Arab Jew). While I do know that there are similarities for example there are Israeli/Kosher versions of some middle eastern cuisine.

I do agree that the majority of people would view a keffiyeh as a symbol of terrorism today however.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: TheCoon on May 10, 2010, 09:59:45 AM
The item of clothing itself is not evil at all. I say ban the dirty arabs and their sympathizers who wear it.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Ari Ben-Canaan on June 07, 2010, 07:11:57 AM
After some thought I have changed my mind and I like the Israeli keffiyeh.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Ben m on June 07, 2010, 07:34:52 AM
of course they should be banned! this is part of the unwanted arab culture.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Hyades on June 07, 2010, 09:16:04 AM
They have become a fashion accessory. But even though I say, they should be forbidden. And if a designer now decides to make the burqa a fashion accessory, would the world accept it also? Would they accept swastika shirts and jackets?
These foulards are ugly. Even the cloth that my cleaner uses looks better than that piece of garbage.  ;D
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Dr. Dan on June 07, 2010, 12:56:20 PM
Meh...

If one chooses to wear at is a traditional thing because they just happen to live in the windy sunny desert and this happens to protect him and he happens to be Jewish and hopefully a Kahanist, then why should it matter if he is wearing it?

If it is just for fashion, then it's just plain ugly and remind the people of this generation of the Nazi Muslims and Yasser "Gay"rafat.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Kahane-Was-Right BT on June 07, 2010, 01:04:32 PM
I have always believed that Jews will only be fully integrated back into Eretz Yisrael when we throw off western styles of dress in favor of a style more in tune with the Middle East.  After all, that is who and what we are...a Middle Eastern people.  In my opinion all the adaptations borrowed from Europe must go!  The suits, ties, hats, and heavy shoes of Europe are poorly suited to the clime in Israel, and only help to reinforce the false perception that Israel is an outpost of Western imperialism.  Israeli architecture for the most part looks perfectly Middle Eastern, with no attempts made to emulate Continental house design.  Our language, history and culture are all of the East.  So, why not our clothing?  I vote for the "Israeli keffiyah", and hope that it's just the beginning of a new trend in Israeli fashion.

Even though I agree that Jews should adopt Beged Ivri and middle eastern style clothing, I don't think the "kefiya" is included in that.   Look closely at the depictions of Maimonides and the Yemenite Jews and the Algerian Jew here.  I don't see any kefiyas.   Jews wore turbans, tunics, etc.    Not kefiyas as far as I know.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Ben m on June 07, 2010, 01:19:46 PM
I have always believed that Jews will only be fully integrated back into Eretz Yisrael when we throw off western styles of dress in favor of a style more in tune with the Middle East.  After all, that is who and what we are...a Middle Eastern people.  In my opinion all the adaptations borrowed from Europe must go!  The suits, ties, hats, and heavy shoes of Europe are poorly suited to the clime in Israel, and only help to reinforce the false perception that Israel is an outpost of Western imperialism.  Israeli architecture for the most part looks perfectly Middle Eastern, with no attempts made to emulate Continental house design.  Our language, history and culture are all of the East.  So, why not our clothing?  I vote for the "Israeli keffiyah", and hope that it's just the beginning of a new trend in Israeli fashion.

Even though I agree that Jews should adopt Beged Ivri and middle eastern style clothing, I don't think the "kefiya" is included in that.   Look closely at the depictions of Maimonides and the Yemenite Jews and the Algerian Jew here.  I don't see any kefiyas.   Jews wore turbans, tunics, etc.    Not kefiyas as far as I know.
guys,guys,guys.let's make an agreement okay.you will dress youselves in middle eastern tincs and turban and i will continue to hang around with my shirt and pants and nothing that even resemble arab dress.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: White Israelite on June 07, 2010, 01:30:56 PM
I have always believed that Jews will only be fully integrated back into Eretz Yisrael when we throw off western styles of dress in favor of a style more in tune with the Middle East.  After all, that is who and what we are...a Middle Eastern people.  In my opinion all the adaptations borrowed from Europe must go!  The suits, ties, hats, and heavy shoes of Europe are poorly suited to the clime in Israel, and only help to reinforce the false perception that Israel is an outpost of Western imperialism.  Israeli architecture for the most part looks perfectly Middle Eastern, with no attempts made to emulate Continental house design.  Our language, history and culture are all of the East.  So, why not our clothing?  I vote for the "Israeli keffiyah", and hope that it's just the beginning of a new trend in Israeli fashion.

Even though I agree that Jews should adopt Beged Ivri and middle eastern style clothing, I don't think the "kefiya" is included in that.   Look closely at the depictions of Maimonides and the Yemenite Jews and the Algerian Jew here.  I don't see any kefiyas.   Jews wore turbans, tunics, etc.    Not kefiyas as far as I know.

Your right, they resemble turbans rather than keffiyehs, can you repost the pictures? They didn't show up.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Kahane-Was-Right BT on June 07, 2010, 01:40:12 PM
I have always believed that Jews will only be fully integrated back into Eretz Yisrael when we throw off western styles of dress in favor of a style more in tune with the Middle East.  After all, that is who and what we are...a Middle Eastern people.  In my opinion all the adaptations borrowed from Europe must go!  The suits, ties, hats, and heavy shoes of Europe are poorly suited to the clime in Israel, and only help to reinforce the false perception that Israel is an outpost of Western imperialism.  Israeli architecture for the most part looks perfectly Middle Eastern, with no attempts made to emulate Continental house design.  Our language, history and culture are all of the East.  So, why not our clothing?  I vote for the "Israeli keffiyah", and hope that it's just the beginning of a new trend in Israeli fashion.

Even though I agree that Jews should adopt Beged Ivri and middle eastern style clothing, I don't think the "kefiya" is included in that.   Look closely at the depictions of Maimonides and the Yemenite Jews and the Algerian Jew here.  I don't see any kefiyas.   Jews wore turbans, tunics, etc.    Not kefiyas as far as I know.
guys,guys,guys.let's make an agreement okay.you will dress youselves in middle eastern tincs and turban and i will continue to hang around with my shirt and pants and nothing that even resemble arab dress.

You can wear whatever you want, but some of us consider historical reality as an important factor in deciding what is authentic Jewish culture.   Some of us here consider historical reality, stam, unlike others who seem to think history is irrelevant or can be invented wholecloth on whim.  Look in the Torah and the Talmud and you will see an ancient style of dress that is no longer in style for most peoples today.   If arabs dress like us, let them, but let them keep their unique cultural symbols like the kefiya which I want nothing to do with.

I certainly prefer beged ivri (especially if I'm living in a nationalist settlement in Judea/Samaria, God willing) to wearing a black cloak and top hat.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Kahane-Was-Right BT on June 07, 2010, 01:40:48 PM
I have always believed that Jews will only be fully integrated back into Eretz Yisrael when we throw off western styles of dress in favor of a style more in tune with the Middle East.  After all, that is who and what we are...a Middle Eastern people.  In my opinion all the adaptations borrowed from Europe must go!  The suits, ties, hats, and heavy shoes of Europe are poorly suited to the clime in Israel, and only help to reinforce the false perception that Israel is an outpost of Western imperialism.  Israeli architecture for the most part looks perfectly Middle Eastern, with no attempts made to emulate Continental house design.  Our language, history and culture are all of the East.  So, why not our clothing?  I vote for the "Israeli keffiyah", and hope that it's just the beginning of a new trend in Israeli fashion.

Even though I agree that Jews should adopt Beged Ivri and middle eastern style clothing, I don't think the "kefiya" is included in that.   Look closely at the depictions of Maimonides and the Yemenite Jews and the Algerian Jew here.  I don't see any kefiyas.   Jews wore turbans, tunics, etc.    Not kefiyas as far as I know.

Your right, they resemble turbans rather than keffiyehs, can you repost the pictures? They didn't show up.

Oh I dunno, they come up when I click on the thread (in your first post). 
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Ben m on June 07, 2010, 01:46:04 PM
I have always believed that Jews will only be fully integrated back into Eretz Yisrael when we throw off western styles of dress in favor of a style more in tune with the Middle East.  After all, that is who and what we are...a Middle Eastern people.  In my opinion all the adaptations borrowed from Europe must go!  The suits, ties, hats, and heavy shoes of Europe are poorly suited to the clime in Israel, and only help to reinforce the false perception that Israel is an outpost of Western imperialism.  Israeli architecture for the most part looks perfectly Middle Eastern, with no attempts made to emulate Continental house design.  Our language, history and culture are all of the East.  So, why not our clothing?  I vote for the "Israeli keffiyah", and hope that it's just the beginning of a new trend in Israeli fashion.

Even though I agree that Jews should adopt Beged Ivri and middle eastern style clothing, I don't think the "kefiya" is included in that.   Look closely at the depictions of Maimonides and the Yemenite Jews and the Algerian Jew here.  I don't see any kefiyas.   Jews wore turbans, tunics, etc.    Not kefiyas as far as I know.
guys,guys,guys.let's make an agreement okay.you will dress youselves in middle eastern tincs and turban and i will continue to hang around with my shirt and pants and nothing that even resemble arab dress.

You can wear whatever you want, but some of us consider historical reality as an important factor in deciding what is authentic Jewish culture.   Some of us here consider historical reality, stam, unlike others who seem to think history is irrelevant or can be invented wholecloth on whim.  Look in the Torah and the Talmud and you will see an ancient style of dress that is no longer in style for most peoples today.   If arabs dress like us, let them, but let them keep their unique cultural symbols like the kefiya which I want nothing to do with.

I certainly prefer beged ivri (especially if I'm living in a nationalist settlement in Judea/Samaria, G-d willing) to wearing a black cloak and top hat.
fine.as long as you guys will not make me wear that clothes i will not say a thing.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Kahane-Was-Right BT on June 07, 2010, 01:48:41 PM
fine.as long as you guys will not make me wear that clothes i will not say a thing.

Why would I make you wear anything?

You shouldn't assume that because certain religious Jews do something they will force everyone else to do it if they ever get the chance (or even if not).   I think that is something the Israeli media taught you (and maybe some haredi political parties/adherents to these parties), but it's not true.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Ben m on June 07, 2010, 01:59:55 PM
fine.as long as you guys will not make me wear that clothes i will not say a thing.

Why would I make you wear anything?

You shouldn't assume that because certain religious Jews do something they will force everyone else to do it if they ever get the chance (or even if not).   I think that is something the Israeli media taught you (and maybe some haredi political parties/adherents to these parties), but it's not true.
ammmm,actually it is both the media and the haredi parties that taught me taht.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Kahane-Was-Right BT on June 07, 2010, 02:02:21 PM
fine.as long as you guys will not make me wear that clothes i will not say a thing.

Why would I make you wear anything?

You shouldn't assume that because certain religious Jews do something they will force everyone else to do it if they ever get the chance (or even if not).   I think that is something the Israeli media taught you (and maybe some haredi political parties/adherents to these parties), but it's not true.
ammmm,actually it is both the media and the haredi parties that taught me taht.

That's what I said.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Ari Ben-Canaan on June 07, 2010, 05:11:31 PM
(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/kef3.jpg)
Israeli keffiyeh
(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/ArmyGreenKeffiyeh2_240.png)
IDF keffiyeh
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Luigi on June 07, 2010, 05:37:52 PM
I like the Israeli design. Especially because it upsets the Fakestinians big time.
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Hyades on June 09, 2010, 06:24:03 AM
(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/kef3.jpg)
Israeli keffiyeh
(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/ArmyGreenKeffiyeh2_240.png)
IDF keffiyeh

Wow! Where can I get those? :)
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Ari Ben-Canaan on June 09, 2010, 07:15:16 AM
(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/kef3.jpg)
Israeli keffiyeh
(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/ArmyGreenKeffiyeh2_240.png)
IDF keffiyeh

Wow! Where can I get those? :)

I believe this site called "The Kef" sells them.

http://thekef.com/
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: JTFenthusiast2 on June 09, 2010, 09:37:15 AM
All Keffiyehs look ratty.  Painting a Jewish star on an armband won't make it look pretty
Title: Re: Keffiyehs, do you think they should be banned or allowed?
Post by: Hyades on June 09, 2010, 09:54:52 AM
(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/kef3.jpg)
Israeli keffiyeh
(http://shemspeed.com/thekef/ArmyGreenKeffiyeh2_240.png)
IDF keffiyeh

Wow! Where can I get those? :)

I believe this site called "The Kef" sells them.

http://thekef.com/

Thank you!  :dance: