Does having an account and posting in this forum mean being a member of JTF?

[Raulmarrio2000]

To the Leaders of JTF, can you reply to this question? Are those who post here considered members of JTF?
Here in Argentina, there is  Law 23592, Art 3, paragraph 1, which says that anyone who is a member of an org which promotes racial hate, (the judges generally include involuntary incitement as well) must spend 3 years in a Federal Jail. If so, I could be arrested at any time. A single visit to the site by anyone willing to report would be enoough to take me to jail.
The funny thing is that due to the posts against Gypsies, I could be reported by the very same Jewish orgs I help. The Jewish community here, has always watched racism, and has issued declarations defending the Gypsies!

[Joe Schmo]

To the Leaders of JTF, can you reply to this question? Are those who pot here considered members of JTF?
Here in Argentina, there is  Law 23592, Art 3, paragraph 1, which says that anyone who is a member of an org which promotes racial hate, (the judges generally include involuntary incitement as well) must spend 3 years in a Federal Jail. If so, I could be arrested at any time. A single visit to the site by anyone willing to report would be enoough to take me to jail.
The funny thing is that due to the posts against Gypsies, I could be reported by the very same Jewish orgs I help. The Jewish community here, has always watched racism, and has issued declarations defending the Gypsies!

I'd be nervous if I lived in a Socialist-totalitarian state and was a frequent visitor to JTF, yes.

[Ultra Requete]

The liberal Jews are mad; they always support the minorities against mayorities even if this minorities are hateful to Jewish people and zionism; they do this even in Israel. Chaim is right calling them self hating.
I coud be putto to jail too, there is no freedom of Speech in EU; that why I can't post any information on this site sp please don't ask personal questions.

[Raulmarrio2000]

I'd be nervous if I lived in a Socialist-totalitarian state and was a frequent visitor to JTF, yes.

Well, Argentina is not socialist, the current Govt. is leftist though.
But the Law against racism was enacted and even written by a centre right member of the Congress in 1988. It was very wellcomed by the Jewish Leaders here. I have used it to report neo nazis. Almost everyone in prison by this Law was charged for anti-Semitism.
It's obvious that the Law cannot protect only Jews. If another group is offended it must also apply. The only problem is that some judges may not make a difference between just posting non-racist articles in a forum where anyother has said something derogatory for a minority, and actually promoting racism.
Some judges have even sent people to jail for confessing publicly that they had prejudices against the Jews. No matter if it was a confession of their evil inclintions, or an attempt to promote hate. One lawyer interpreted that the only legal way of confessing prejudices is at the doctor's or privately before a priest.
Having a nazi book is also punished, no matter if the person reads it only for historical reasons.

[Merkava]

Hello Raul,

I live in Argentina too and I will have to report you. I will also report myself.

[Dexter]

No, it doesn't. As you can be a member in a Nazi/Facist/Communist forum and argue with tham doesn't mean you are a Nazi, Facist, Communist etc' (I don't compare JTF to Nazism of course).
I don't think there is any official member of JTF, only members in JTF's forum.

[Raulmarrio2000]

Here it would be ok to have a Kach Chaptel since there is no Law against political ideologies. We don't have the concept of a "subversive foreign org" as Americans. It' also ok to insult an official and noone will sponsor a charge (only that the offended official might demand as a citizen).
Only it is forbidden to incite to break the Law inside the country according to the Penal Code. Theorically, if someones incites not to pay taxes, he can be charged. But in practise it is never done.
However, in case of racism, the authorities are very strict, specially in larger cities.Besides the judges themselves, there are many orgs. established by the government or private communities, which sponsor charges.
That's the difference with USA. In USA Kach and Kahane Chai are outlawd, but JTF is legal. In Argentina you could have Kach and Kahane Chai, since it is allowed to exprress one's views on international politics freely, but perhaps they would not allow JTF for the slightest suspect of racism agaisnt Blacks or Gypsies.
In Israel it's forbidden to be a Kachnik, simply because they don't allow you to disagree with Israeli democracy. In Argentina you are allowed to disagree with the system of govt. (only that perhaps, your party could not be registered to take part in an election).
In small towns the police is not so strict. I found 4 svastikas painted on the walls here in 2005, and no authority had started the prosecution, until I, myself, sent rhe report to a Jewish org in BA.

[Merkava]

Well done

All of these attacks should be documented.

[Raulmarrio2000]

JTF doesn't have anything against Gypsies. The person who wrote that was an evil missionary who wanted to smear the good name of JTF.

It's ok that you clear it.
There's a text docummented in the Hall Town here which is considered derogatory to Gypsies. A Major's secretary quoted it once in 2001. I sent a protest demanding that this text should be erased from the archive, but the Head of the local Council replied that's it has no sense to judge a text that was only an argument in a debate and not a rule. There was no prosecution, since it had been archived 2 years before the AntiRacist Argentinian Law was enacted. Here noone can be accused for something he did before a Law was encated.
Anyway the whole Council had a special meeting to deal my protest, and they sent a sealed letter to me replying to my petition.

[Joe Gutfeld]

I don't know.  I have been called a member and I only post on the forum.  I haven't donated money to the cause.

[Merkava]

I don't know.  I have been called a member and I only post on the forum.  I haven't donated money to the cause.

What are you waiting for ?

[Raulmarrio2000]

Well, I donate to Jewish orgs in Argentina. Honestly, I'd prefer to donate to Kach, only to save Israel. I have no interest in saving the West. There may be honest people in Western countries, of course. But do you think any non-Jew, (except for the Noahides, and some other people, who really love Israel) would abstain from marrying a Jew? I certainly am compromised with Jewish survival, and would never marry a Jew being a Goy. Do you think "righteous" Westerners would freely abstain from marrying a liberal Jewess?  I don't think so.
Rav Kahane Z"L HY"D discouraged Jews form making deals with Goyim.

[Merkava]

Well, I donate to Jewish orgs in Argentina. Honestly, I'd prefer to donate to Kach, only to save Israel. I have no interest in saving the West. There may be honest people in Western countries, of course. But do you think any non-Jew, (except for the Noahides, and some other people, who really love Israel) would abstain from marrying a Jew? I certainly am compromised with Jewish survival, and would never marry a Jew being a Goy. Do you think "righteous" Westerners would freely abstain from marrying a liberal Jewess?  I don't think so.
Rav Kahane Z"L HY"D discouraged Jews form making deals with Goyim.

You strike me as a really righteous gentile. Well done for donating to Jewish orgs in Argentina 
If you like donating and volunteering for good causes I recommend you look into Sar-El. Its a great voluntary experience helping the IDF in Israel. It lasts for 3 weeks.  As far as Kahane goes, I am no expert but I haven't heard of him discourging Jews from dealing with our Christian brothers. 

[Raulmarrio2000]

You strike me as a really righteous gentile. Well done for donating to Jewish orgs in Argentina 
If you like donating and volunteering for good causes I recommend you look into Sar-El. Its a great voluntary experience helping the IDF in Israel. It lasts for 3 weeks.  As far as Kahane goes, I am no expert but I haven't heard of him discourging Jews from dealing with our Christian brothers. 

1- To be righteous I'd need much more than defending Israel. I should care more to do Hshem's will and avoid sins.
2- Helping IDF scares me, what if the money is used to uproot Jews from Yesha? IDF destroyed Gush Katiff. Anyway, I have sent a very strong protest to the Israeli Embassy here. I accused them of apikorsut and ethnical cleansing of Jews, quoting Shulchan Aruch where it says that traitors deserve death and no funerals or kadish. I beggged them to repent before the destruction began. I doubt any Israeli org would accept me.
3- Rav Kahane didn't say anything about Christians, as far as I know, but he said Jews should not make any treaty with non-Jews, neither depend of them. They must trust only in Hashem. But of course, a Goy can defend the Jews by his own will, without any treaty compromising the Jews.

[Dr. Dan]

To the Leaders of JTF, can you reply to this question? Are those who post here considered members of JTF?
Here in Argentina, there is  Law 23592, Art 3, paragraph 1, which says that anyone who is a member of an org which promotes racial hate, (the judges generally include involuntary incitement as well) must spend 3 years in a Federal Jail. If so, I could be arrested at any time. A single visit to the site by anyone willing to report would be enoough to take me to jail.
The funny thing is that due to the posts against Gypsies, I could be reported by the very same Jewish orgs I help. The Jewish community here, has always watched racism, and has issued declarations defending the Gypsies!

This is a forum which does NOT promote racial hate. Look up the definition of racial hatred and if you feel bashing hateful cultures and hateful people irregardless of race is considered racism in Argentina, then I would be careful. 

now there are racists on this forum...but jtf as an organization does not promote racism.

[Raulmarrio2000]

This is a forum which does NOT promote racial hate. Look up the definition of racial hatred and if you feel bashing hateful cultures and hateful people irregardless of race is considered racism in Argentina, then I would be careful. 

To accuse a culure of evil is not considered racism in Argentina, but it's punished with the same sentence to 3 years in a Federal Jail, together with racists.
The crime is called "Discrimination". No matter if you offend a race, a religion or a political ideology. If you speak against the Torah, it's not racism, since you are not offending the Semite race, but you would go to Jail nevertheless. Up till now noone has been charged for speaking against the Koran or the Gospel, as far as I konow, but in case someone is reported for that, the same would apply.
For example, yesterday I went to the doctor, and we chatted about my emotional problems as well as my physical diseases. I commented that I had sought emotional help in Judaism and Torah. He told me that "Judaism was not good because Torah separates the Jews from the rest of society". It was a private chat, anyway, if I report him, he would be charged.

[Wayne Jude]

Raul we do here know about you alls insane laws.That being said why go to jail for discussing topix.?IT really is your call.YOU know we are not racists!

[Raulmarrio2000]

Raul we do here know about you alls insane laws.That being said why go to jail for discussing topix.?IT really is your call.YOU know we are not racists!

The problem is that perhaps you don't know my contry and the society here. There used to be a lot of anti-Semitism here. It was common to hear people saying things like "Jews are all wealthy", "Jews don't marry goyim b/c they feel superior", "Kashrut is an old superstition" and so on. That's why the goverment enacted a Law to deal with that problem, now anyone will think twice before saying something like that. The Law was enacted in 1988, and the Senator who wrote it was not leftist, but from a rightist wing of the Radical Party.

[Wayne Jude]

You would know better than us.DO what you feel is right for you!

[Raulmarrio2000]

You would know better than us.DO what you feel is right for you!

In fact, at that time, I aimed to convert and lived almost as a Jew. I was tired of being hurt by those anti-Semite statements. It was a problem here anytime I said NO, when somebody invited me with Treif, they would make fun of me for following " an old fashioned religion". So I was glad when it was definitevely forbidden by Law to criticize a persons beliefs. It may be a limit to freedom of speech, but it was worth the price. Even now that I have decded to rmain a goy, I don't eat pork or shellfish, so I do not take food in a meeting with goyim, I only eat at home. And noone can make hurting comments against me for that, because of that Law. Of course it is not very usefull in this small Town, where people will make hurting remaks anyway, but at least I know that the Law is on my side.

[Wayne Jude]

Bro I Was born a JEW but can't help beyond that.Some one with knowledge help Raul!

[Raulmarrio2000]

Bro I Was born a JEW but can't help beyond that.Some one with knowledge help Raul!

If you were born a Jew.....why are you Christian white nation? Have you converted to Christianity?
If so, haven't you thought of coming back to Torah?

[Bodhi]

  Yes, you arte now officially a "terrorist" and probably on the no fly list.....

[Dr. Dan]

You would know better than us.DO what you feel is right for you!

In fact, at that time, I aimed to convert and lived almost as a Jew. I was tired of being hurt by those anti-Semite statements. It was a problem here anytime I said NO, when somebody invited me with Treif, they would make fun of me for following " an old fashioned religion". So I was glad when it was definitevely forbidden by Law to criticize a persons beliefs. It may be a limit to freedom of speech, but it was worth the price. Even now that I have decded to rmain a goy, I don't eat pork or shellfish, so I do not take food in a meeting with goyim, I only eat at home. And noone can make hurting comments against me for that, because of that Law. Of course it is not very usefull in this small Town, where people will make hurting remaks anyway, but at least I know that the Law is on my side.

Choose your words wisely...Don't sound blunt when you want to criticize others.

[Raulmarrio2000]

  Yes, you arte now officially a "terrorist" and probably on the no fly list.....

I know that perhaps I may be in a no-visa list for USA and Israel. Not because of my posts here, but due to the dact that I have sent many protests to US and Israel claiming that Rav Kahane was right. But we don't call anyone a "terrorist" here, just for speaking. Here, a terrorist is someone who puts bombs or thereatens others.