Please sticky until Chaim sees: My response to the poll policy

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Shalom Chaim,

I take responsibility for starting a raunchy poll last week, quite out of the blue, purely for amusement purposes. It was not as bad as some others I have put up, but it was obviously inappropriate and I knew/know better. I do not at all contest the new absolute zero-tolerance policy regarding raunchy posts. What upset me was only that it appeared that Satmarism was being defended. That angered me and DownwithIslam a lot, not being told I could not make lewd polls about our enemies.

While on the subject of Satmarism: while it may be true that there are individual examples ("onesies and twosies") of Satmar members who are alright Jews, they are the exceptions to the rule (as you obviously know). Those couple of Satmar participants in JDL were nice people despite being Satmars, not because of it. They had to make a personal decision to override Satmar theology to do what they did, and they would be considered heretics by their other brethren. I know that you would affirm that 99% of Satmars are Jewish Amalek and Biblically/Talmudically are considered sheer and utter rodefs. I think that any kind of defense of this perverse cult of Judaism on this forum should be absolutely forbidden.

So, that is it. I do not at all defend my inappropriate action in this case and apologize for it. But I don't think that any kind words for a pernicious cult that is diametrically opposed to orthodox Judaism, Christianity, and all that JTF stands for should be tolerated for one moment.

G-d bless you,
Chaimfan

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Sorry to see, you are completly ignorant about Jewish groups. Most "Talmudic Judaism" does not have a problem with Satmer, and I have been in lectures where amoung other groups some of the ideas by Satmer were mentioned (and these lectures were given by very great outstanding Rabbis, with very great personality and depth in knowledge in Judaism, not even Askenazic, but Sefardi and Bukharian Rabbis).
 I do not appreciate anyone calling my fellow Jews 99% Amalik, and if anything someone like you has a much greater chance of being amalik then those Jews people happen to disagree with. (dont spinn this into me saying you are amalik, but I am saying that if anything you are much closer to amalik then they are). And I dont appreciate expecialy a goy calling Jews Amalik.

[Dr. Dan]

Listen...you can hate and scream and cry about those who are wrong or disagree with you, but your messages and polls that are suggestive of homosexuality is not the appropriate way of talking about anyone really...especially religious Jews who are misguided terribly on the issue of Israel, fellow Jews, and the Lubovitch.  WE do not need to stoop to their level.

Rather, what is effective is to take their arguements that are against Israel and fellow Jews and righteous gentiles, and rip them apart with arguements proving them wrong.  This is a forum of intellectual power and righteous behavior. Evil speak and sexual suggestive comments are completely tantamount to this movement and this forum...very inappropriate.

Also a little hint...making fun of people behind their backs is not half as affective as it is in their faces..

ANd with religious Jews, Satmar or not Satmar...making fun of them in their faces makes one look lower than their evil behavior..and to a bystander who knows nothing...well, he might take the side of the evil group and not the one who makes fun of it.

[Lisa]

Great post, Dr. Dan.

[Dr. Dan]

CF and DWI are very smart passionate people...I love them both.  But it's sometimes wise to control your anger...I get angry too..and sometimes I have flipped out..I never won a conversation flipping out.

[Archie]

but I am saying that if anything you are much closer to amalik then they are). And I dont appreciate expecialy a goy calling Jews Amalik.

Tzvi, I think you are much more closer to Amalek than I am.

I find it odd to find a guy with your mentality on a Kahanist site.

You are lucky to get away with this ''I praise the Satmars'' bull.

To CF: Evidently, you lost this battle. The admins have sided with Tzvi.

I think everyone should just burry the hatchet and move on.

Peace.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Listen...you can hate and scream and cry about those who are wrong or disagree with you, but your messages and polls that are suggestive of homosexuality is not the appropriate way of talking about anyone really...especially religious Jews who are misguided terribly on the issue of Israel, fellow Jews, and the Lubovitch.  WE do not need to stoop to their level.

I already apologized for the lewd and lascivious poll and never once defended it.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Sorry to see, you are completly ignorant about Jewish groups. Most "Talmudic Judaism" does not have a problem with Satmer, and I have been in lectures where amoung other groups some of the ideas by Satmer were mentioned (and these lectures were given by very great outstanding Rabbis, with very great personality and depth in knowledge in Judaism, not even Askenazic, but Sefaradi and Bukharian Rabbis).
 I do not appreciate anyone calling my fellow Jews 99% Amalik, and if anything someone like you has a much greater chance of being amalik then those Jews people happen to disagree with. (dont spinn this into me saying you are amalik, but I am saying that if anything you are much closer to amalik then they are). And I dont appreciate expecialy a goy calling Jews Amalik.

I'd like to see what Chaim has to say to this. 

[Lisa]

People, just remember something.  

We have Jews, Catholics, Protestants, Eastern Orthodox Christians, Noahides, and atheists on this forum.  So Chaimfan, even though you mean well, I think, and everybody here, has to be careful about criticizing members or denominations of another person's religion.  Otherwise, we would all be at each other's throats, and we wouldn't get anything done.  

As one example, the Jews or Serbs here may not agree with the positions of the RCC over the years.  But that should be no excuse to make derogatory comments about their leaders. We have wonderful Catholic members here, and we want them to always feel welcome.  And the same holds true for Satmars.  We will certainly have differences with some of their Rabbis and followers.  But that's no reason to compare all of them to Amalek.  

So like I've often said before, just stick to the facts when you're discussing your opinions, and you should be fine.  

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Lisa, I see Satmarism as no different from Lutheranism or replacement-theology Christianity. While there are individual exceptions in all three faiths, the fact is that if you strictly hold to the core teachings of them, then you are, by definition, an anti-Semite. The vast majority of all three religious denominations are devout Jew-haters.

My advice to any Satmar (or Lutheran, or replacement-theologian) who is not anti-Israel is to get out of the denomination now and turn to Biblically orthodox Judaism or Christianity.

[Chaim Ben Pesach]

                                                                                                                   בס''ד

A Jew who informs on his fellow Jews or who joins with enemies of the Jewish people is כרת or cut off from the Jewish people. These self-hating Jews are known as the ערב רב erev rav. The Vilna Gaon, HaRav Tzvi Yehudah Kook and HaRav Meir Kahane all defined erev rav traitors as the most dangerous enemies of the Jewish people, far more dangerous than Gentile anti-Semites. HaRav Kahane always said, "We don't have an Arab problem. We have a Jewish problem," which means that Jewish traitors are the ones who bring disasters upon the Jewish people. Therefore, erev rav traitors like Peace Now, Nateuri Karta and the news media/Hollywood/multinational corporation "Jews" are the number one enemy of the Jewish people. And yes, these erev rav traitors zealously support the Muslim Amalekites and all other Amalekite enemies of the Jewish people - therefore the erev rav traitors are Amalek.

Now I am not willing to classify all Satmar Chasidim as Amalek. But some of them certainly are. Those who want the Muslim Nazis to exterminate little Israel because they want to see the Zionist Jews murdered - anyone who feels that way is Amalek. And there are Satmar who feel that way. I know because many of them told me so when they used to call in to a radio program that I did in the 1980s called "The JDL Speaks" on WNYM. I also got Rabbi Kahane a half hour weekly program on that radio station, and the Satmar had the chutzpah to curse Rabbi Kahane as well. I don't blame all of the Satmar because I love my fellow Jews, and I want to give every Jew the benefit of the doubt. But I do not love traitors and informers who support Amalek, and at least some of the Satmar fall into that category.

Tzvi, I do not have סמיכה or rabbinic ordination and so I usually am not able to give פסקי הלכה or halachic determinations. But I am going to פוסק despite not being a rabbi on one matter: the demeaning manner in which you address CF as a "goy" or as DWI's "Mexican friend" is completely against the Torah way. To show contempt for someone just because they are Gentile is utterly un-Jewish behavior. Especially a righteous Gentile like CF. I urge you to publicly apologize to CF. Not for his sake, he doesn't need your apology. But you should apologize for your sake, because your behavior toward him constitutes a clear עברה or transgression of Torah law.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

PS: Lisa, the other thing to add is that Catholic and Orthodox theology do not require you to be an anti-Semite in order to be a member in good standing of the denomination. That's where I would draw the line between them and Satmarism. If a religious sect requires you to believe something outrageous by its very nature, then I tend not to have much respect for it.

If Chaim does not want me to speak ill of the Satmar any more, I will respect it.

Peace out.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Thank you, Chaim. My contributions here are over. I consider this case closed. I just wanted to let you know that I don't at all disagree with obscene humor being declared verboten.

G-d bless again.
Chaimfan

[Gruzinit]

All this name calling and deragatory remarks are getting us nowhere. We don't have to agree on every topic, but a certain degree of respectability must be maintained. C.F.'s poll was improper, but it has brought a rather important issue into the forefront. I highly doubt Reform or Reconstructionist Jewish arguements against Israel would be held to the same level as the Satmar are allowed to get away with...

Personally, I think Satmar who openly preach this type of drek should be given the same treatment we delve out to the Shimon Peres, Norman Finklestein or Joe Liberman types. We all have squabbles and disagreements over issues, but i doubt any of us would condone their atricious behavior, the Satmar should be held to the same standards, instead of using their stance as "religious Jews" as a sheild against criticism.

[DownwithIslam]

but I am saying that if anything you are much closer to amalik then they are). And I dont appreciate expecialy a goy calling Jews Amalik.

Tzvi, I think you are much more closer to Amalek than I am.

I find it odd to find a guy with your mentality on a Kahanist site.

You are lucky to get away with this ''I praise the Satmars'' bull.

To CF: Evidently, you lost this battle. The admins have sided with Tzvi.

I think everyone should just burry the hatchet and move on.

Peace.

Archie, you are a real kahanist. Unfortuantely, that cannot be said for everyone who contributed to this thread. I wont really continue this fight as its not good for the cause but I have to say that Tzvi Ben Roshel should not be used as an example of a model religious jew by people reading this thread because he is openly violating the torah obligation to be humble. I guess he only follows the rules that Rabbi Mizrachi discusses in his lectures I guess he never discussed humility. I would hope he publicly apologizes to Chaimfan as CBP himself instructed him to. I dont believe he will though because Chaimfan is "Below his stature." Anyhow I wont continue to post in this thread as I dont want it to turn into another multiple pager but I would hope these personal attacks against me and Chaimfan will stop. Thank you.

[DownwithIslam]

All this name calling and deragatory remarks are getting us nowhere. We don't have to agree on every topic, but a certain degree of respectability must be maintained. C.F.'s poll was improper, but it has brought a rather important issue into the forefront. I highly doubt Reform or Reconstructionist Jewish arguements against Israel would be held to the same level as the Satmar are allowed to get away with...

Personally, I think Satmar who openly preach this type of drek should be given the same treatment we delve out to the Shimon Peres, Norman Finklestein or Joe Liberman types. We all have squabbles and disagreements over issues, but i doubt any of us would condone their atricious behavior, the Satmar should be held to the same standards, instead of using their stance as "religious Jews" as a sheild against criticism.

I agree with you.

[mord]

I saw  a video that took place on shabbos the netura karta on the podium with moslems and the extreme leftist anti Israel group answer run by communist leslie kagan the communist.They don'nt even care about maaras eyim [how it appears]

[DownwithIslam]

I saw  a video that took place on shabbos the netura karta on the podium with moslems and the extreme leftist anti Israel group answer run by communist leslie kagan the communist.They don'nt even care about maaras eyim [how it appears]

Forget about Maris Ayin, these beasts openly say they want Israel dismantled. You know what that means. How could these satmar kikes even make an attempt to appear normal when their hate book "Vayoel Mashe" written by The Satmar "Rabbi" openly calls for Israel destruction. Defending Satmar is like defending Izlam.

[mord]

I saw  a video that took place on shabbos the netura karta on the podium with moslems and the extreme leftist anti Israel group answer run by communist leslie kagan the communist.They don'nt even care about maaras eyim [how it appears]

Forget about Maris Ayin, these beasts openly say they want Israel dismantled. You know what that means. How could these satmar kikes even make an attempt to appear normal when their hate book "Vayoel Mashe" written by The Satmar "Rabbi" openly calls for Israel destruction. Defending Satmar is like defending Izlam.

I agree but this just shows how they don'nt even care about Shabbos

[DownwithIslam]

They dont care about anything other than living in luxurious homes and trying to get their fellow jews killed.

[Rubystars]

I like CF and Down with Islam. I wish nobody would fight with anyone else if we're all on the same side.

[mord]

They dont care about anything other than living in luxurious homes and trying to get their fellow jews killed.

THIS IS TRUE ALTHOUGH I KNEW 2 PEOPLE FROM KIRYAT SANZ THAT JOINED THE ARMY .I THINK SANZ HAS SOME TIES TO THE SATMAR

[Archie]

I saw  a video that took place on shabbos the netura karta on the podium with moslems and the extreme leftist anti Israel group answer run by communist leslie kagan the communist.They don'nt even care about maaras eyim [how it appears]

I witnessed a small manifestion of NKs in Montreal in the summer of 2006.

I couldn't believe how WRONG these individuals were against their people.

It was a very sad spectacle. I'll never forget.

[mord]

YES THIS IS TRUE

[DownwithIslam]

I like CF and Down with Islam. I wish nobody would fight with anyone else if we're all on the same side.

We arent fighting at all. If this was a fight, I would stop posting in this thread for the sake of the movt. I am continuing to post because we are merely having a discussion about Satmar. I think that is perfectly legitimate. I do understand your concern though.