Reply:All the Cohanim (Priests) are descendents of one Cohen

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

http://www.shofarusa.com/ (correction- FIRST  video- short)

 Thier was talk about this, so here's a short video on this subject.

  also on the site- information about-
A spectacular event - translated in English & Russian - with 18,000 people in one room, and millions LIVE around the world. Don't miss it!

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

No comment on what you said to Horselady?

[q_q_]

<snip>
 Thier was talk <snip>

IMPORTANT SPELLING CORRECTION.

You have made this mistake countless times. Please get this correct

There <---   ERE  , ERE at the end.

That is for when you are referring to something. Like Over There.    There is bob, There is time to do it. There was a man.


Their <--  EIR, EIR at the end, is used to say Belonging.
Their pet, their parents, their goldfish.

[takebackourtemple]

   I think they are descendants of Aaron. Aaron had created the golden calf, but he did so slowly in an attempt to delay the people as Moshe was coming down from the mountain. He initially asked people to give him their gold, thinking they were week minded and would not do so. Once they gave their gold, he was forced to construct the golden calf.

[q_q_]

   I think they are descendants of Aaron. Aaron had created the golden calf, but he did so slowly in an attempt to delay the people as Moshe was coming down from the mountain. He initially asked people to give him their gold, thinking they were week minded and would not do so. Once they gave their gold, he was forced to construct the golden calf.

You think kohanim are descendents of aharon?

<sarcasm>are you serious?</sarcasm>

;-)

are you nuts.

Who mentioned the golden calf that you bring it up?

[takebackourtemple]

You think kohanim are descendents of aharon?
Excuse my not being a torah scholar. Some respect would be nice. I am trying to learn. I wasn't sure if he was the direct ancestor or an ancestor of one. Kohanim are also descendants of Abraham.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_calf



Who mentioned the golden calf that you bring it up?
I was telling a story about him. One that I recently read at Bait Knesset.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kohen

[muman613]

Duh,

The Kohanim are by definition the descendants of Aaron, Moshes brother. Read the Torah more....

Heck, even wikipedia contains this information:

A kohen (or cohen, Hebrew כּהן, "priest", pl. כּהנִים, kohanim or cohanim) has a special status in Judaism. A kohen is a direct male descendant of the Biblical Aaron, brother of Moses. Another term for the descendants of Aaron are the Aaronites or Aaronids.

During the existence of the Temple in Jerusalem, kohanim performed specific duties vis-à-vis the daily and festival sacrificial offerings. The Kohen Gadol (High Priest) played a special role during the service of Yom Kippur. Today, kohanim retain a distinct personal status within Judaism and are still bound by special laws in Orthodox and, to a lesser extent, in Conservative Jewish communities.

muman613

[takebackourtemple]

   I'm not a Kohen and once again I'm not a torah scholar. In fact, this is something I learned that Aaron was the one they came from last Shabbat. I knew they had a common father, but for thought the father went back to one of Yacov's sons and didn't think that much about who it was. For all I was concerned, the Kohenim are priests and I am not. I am a Yisrael who gets the last Aliya. Please give me some slack. One of my goals of being here is to advance my torah knowledge.

[muman613]

No problem takebackourtemple. Every Jew has a portion in our forum. We all are learning new things every day. I returned to my faith after almost 20 years away. I have been studying Torah every day now for almost 5 years. There are many good resources on the web. Very good Rabbi videos and mp3. If you are interested I can give you the links.

muman613

[q_q_]

   I'm not a Kohen and once again I'm not a torah scholar. <snip>Kohenim <snip>Please give me some slack. One of my goals of being here is to advance my torah knowledge.

It's Kohen and Kohanim. 

If you spell it right (or even if you spell it wrongly)

you can put it into google. And find out.

The most basic articles on what a kohen is, would mention that Aharon was the first, and his descendents are kohanim.

It is a basic question answered absolutely everywhere and unavoidable.

And therefore, such an easily found thing on such a basic question doesn't need to be posted into this thread. It's good you found out though.

[q_q_]

I should add though.. reading the tenach in hebrew you would notice that the first person to be referred to as kohen, is malchitzedek. So, technically, Kohen means priest, not necessarily jewish.
And malchitzedek was before aharon.

But specifically, kohanim means aharon and his descendents.

When people say kohen, they always always mean aharon and his descendents.

I am not sure about he following, but
I think yehudi means something like praise G-d..
I think Ivri has its linguistic meaning - something like - other side or to cross. And its specific meaning of hebrew.

words can have thier most general meanings(perhaps aka linguistic meaning). specific meanings. and a halachic meaning.

like chillul hashem. Rabbi Kahane mentioned the term in Ezekiel ch 36. But I think we can only take it to mean a negative thing. Halachically the negative thing described there is not a halachic - chillul hashem. Halachically, a chillul hashem is when a jew commits a sin.  Not if we allow a gentile to commit an act that makes jews look weak and our G-d look powerless. Most rabbis would say it's bad but it's not a chillul hashem. The tenach there describes the exile as a chillul hashem.  Halachically though, a chillul hashem is something even more serious, a public sin, and we should die rather than commit it. It goes along with the 3 sins to die rather than commit.

[muman613]

I should add though.. reading the tenach in hebrew you would notice that the first person to be referred to as kohen, is malchitzedek. So, technically, Kohen means priest, not necessarily jewish.
And malchitzedek was before aharon.

But specifically, kohanim means aharon and his descendents.

When people say kohen, they always always mean aharon and his descendents.

I am not sure about he following, but
I think yehudi means something like praise G-d..
I think Ivri has its linguistic meaning - something like - other side or to cross. And its specific meaning of hebrew.

words can have thier most general meanings(perhaps aka linguistic meaning). specific meanings. and a halachic meaning.

like chillul hashem. Rabbi Kahane mentioned the term in Ezekiel ch 36. But I think we can only take it to mean a negative thing. Halachically the negative thing described there is not a halachic - chillul hashem. Halachically, a chillul hashem is when a jew commits a sin.  Not if we allow a gentile to commit an act that makes jews look weak and our G-d look powerless. Most rabbis would say it's bad but it's not a chillul hashem. The tenach there describes the exile as a chillul hashem.  Halachically though, a chillul hashem is something even more serious, a public sin, and we should die rather than commit it. It goes along with the 3 sins to die rather than commit.

q_q, you are correct... Chillul Hashem must be in public. Like if an orthodox Jew goes into MacDonalds wearing his TzitTzits and Tefillin and buys a Cheeseburger and eats it in front of everyone. This would be a Chillul Hashem, a desecration of the name of G-d. The 3 Sins no Jew should commit are 1) Idolatry 2) Sexual Immorality 3) Murder.

Why was the first Sanctuary destroyed? Because of three [evil] things which prevailed there: idolatry, immorality, bloodshed. (Yoma 9b)

http://www.aish.com/torahportion/moray/The_Three_Sins.asp
http://www.aish.com/literacy/concepts/Judaism_and_Martyrdom.asp

From Aish:
There are three cardinal sins which one may not transgress under any circumstances, even at the expense of one's life. They are: idolatry, murder and sexual crimes. Since these sins outweigh life because of their intrinsic severity, one must be martyred rather than transgress them under all circumstances, even in private and where no religious persecution is intended.

[q_q_]

I should add though.. reading the tenach in hebrew you would notice that the first person to be referred to as kohen, is malchitzedek. So, technically, Kohen means priest, not necessarily jewish.
And malchitzedek was before aharon.

But specifically, kohanim means aharon and his descendents.

When people say kohen, they always always mean aharon and his descendents.

I am not sure about he following, but
I think yehudi means something like praise G-d..
I think Ivri has its linguistic meaning - something like - other side or to cross. And its specific meaning of hebrew.

words can have thier most general meanings(perhaps aka linguistic meaning). specific meanings. and a halachic meaning.

like chillul hashem. Rabbi Kahane mentioned the term in Ezekiel ch 36. But I think we can only take it to mean a negative thing. Halachically the negative thing described there is not a halachic - chillul hashem. Halachically, a chillul hashem is when a jew commits a sin.  Not if we allow a gentile to commit an act that makes jews look weak and our G-d look powerless. Most rabbis would say it's bad but it's not a chillul hashem. The tenach there describes the exile as a chillul hashem.  Halachically though, a chillul hashem is something even more serious, a public sin, and we should die rather than commit it. It goes along with the 3 sins to die rather than commit.

q_q, you are correct... Chillul Hashem must be in public. Like if an orthodox Jew goes into MacDonalds wearing his TzitTzits and Tefillin and buys a Cheeseburger and eats it in front of everyone. This would be a Chillul Hashem, a desecration of the name of G-d. The 3 Sins no Jew should commit are 1) Idolatry 2) Sexual Immorality 3) Murder.

Why was the first Sanctuary destroyed? Because of three [evil] things which prevailed there: idolatry, immorality, bloodshed. (Yoma 9b)

http://www.aish.com/torahportion/moray/The_Three_Sins.asp
http://www.aish.com/literacy/concepts/Judaism_and_Martyrdom.asp

From Aish:
There are three cardinal sins which one may not transgress under any circumstances, even at the expense of one's life. They are: idolatry, murder and sexual crimes. Since these sins outweigh life because of their intrinsic severity, one must be martyred rather than transgress them under all circumstances, even in private and where no religious persecution is intended.

The 4

FOUR

things one must die rather than commit, are those 3 sins, and chillul hashem.

and chillul hashem applies to even the smallest custom.


Rabbi Kahane at camp sdei chemed. starts 14:17


If you haven't seen that one, it's a must. It' a class rabbi kahane gave to some religious youngsters of various ages , seems from around 12-16
It also gives great insight into rabbi kahane.  It's not like any press interview .  No oratory prowess. Just blunt talk. Everything from the torah, and with common sense and wisdom.

BTW, regarding chillul hashem, I am saying I think the halachic definition, according to rabbis I have asked anyway , is a sin a jew commits, in public.   The tenach uses the term more generally eg. ezekiel ch 36, as described. the nullifying of G-d's name from the world. Rabbi Kahane describes this definition in his bible lesson to noachides (should be on youtube). How jewish weakness is a chillul hashem, because the nations mock us and say "where is your G-d". the tenach describes the exile itself as a chillul hashem.  And so he reasons beautifully and so logically, Jewish strength, is a kiddush hashem. And G-d does it not for our sake, but for his sake. This also explains, as rabbi kahane says, how we can have redemption even with a state created or run by wicked people.  Moshiach will come, but it's a matter of when.

[Dr. Dan]

Don't think you can just become a Kohen out of the blue...so yeh...most likely all cohen's today are decendents of Aaron...

[takebackourtemple]

Don't think you can just become a Kohen out of the blue...so yeh...most likely all cohen's today are decendents of Aaron...

   What is interesting is that I once had a dream where I could choose the be a Cohen or a Levy and could even be a Cohen Gadol. The catch was that if I chose to be one, I would have to follow all the laws of whatever I chose. I feared that I could not do so and chose neither as a result. I know that you can't just choose to be one, but it sure would be an interesting choice to make.

[muman613]

Don't think you can just become a Kohen out of the blue...so yeh...most likely all cohen's today are decendents of Aaron...

   What is interesting is that I once had a dream where I could choose the be a Cohen or a Levy and could even be a Cohen Gadol. The catch was that if I chose to be one, I would have to follow all the laws of whatever I chose. I feared that I could not do so and chose neither as a result. I know that you can't just choose to be one, but it sure would be an interesting choice to make.

Hello,

I was just reading an article on aish which contains some of the information you were interested in.

Please check out this : http://www.aish.com/literacy/concepts/Tammuz_and_the_Forces_of_Nature.asp

It contains a little bit of the story of the Golden Calf.

muman613

Excerpt:
They gave into one of the worst illusions that we have; the illusion that the force of evil generated by sin is greater than the force of good that is generated by tshuvah (return to God). They, too, attributed too much force to the golden calf. They should have seen it as precious metal twisted into an interesting form that holds attraction to people who don't know better.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Don't think you can just become a Kohen out of the blue...so yeh...most likely all cohen's today are decendents of Aaron...

 Most are, but it could be that some aren't (expecially in the Bukharian/Persian communities) In the Bukharian community maybe 30% say they are Kohanim, which is hard to believe, so either 1 of 2 things happened, either the population that was taken there was from places that are heavily populated by Kohanim (Jerusalem or Hevron) or that many made it up or believe themselves to be when they are not.
 I myself was not told by my father (or uncles) that we are Kohanim, but I know someone (from my high school) who has the same last name to myself, said the same (blurry though) history of Great Grandfather and family (how they hid and ran away from the communist gov. and went to different cities, and how last name got changed) now that I know more like that my forefather was a great Rabbi, if I see him again I will ask him if we are the same family or not).  The point- he says that he is a Kohen while I dont, so either we both are Kohanim and I dont know it, or we are Yisrael and he doesn't know it, or we are different family.

[MassuhDGoodName]

This is true.

His name was Stanley.

Stanley Cohen.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

This is true.

His name was Stanley.

Stanley Cohen.

  who are you referring to?

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Don't think you can just become a Kohen out of the blue...so yeh...most likely all cohen's today are decendents of Aaron...

 Most are, but it could be that some aren't (expecially in the Bukharian/Persian communities) In the Bukharian community maybe 30% say they are Kohanim, which is hard to believe, so either 1 of 2 things happened, either the population that was taken there was from places that are heavily populated by Kohanim (Jerusalem or Hevron) or that many made it up or believe themselves to be when they are not.
 I myself was not told by my father (or uncles) that we are Kohanim, but I know someone (from my high school) who has the same last name to myself, said the same (blurry though) history of Great Grandfather and family (how they hid and ran away from the communist gov. and went to different cities, and how last name got changed) now that I know more like that my forefather was a great Rabbi, if I see him again I will ask him if we are the same family or not).  The point- he says that he is a Kohen while I dont, so either we both are Kohanim and I dont know it, or we are Yisrael and he doesn't know it, or we are different family.

Or you could have had similar situations and his great grandfather was a kohen, while yours wasn't (ie different families).

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Don't think you can just become a Kohen out of the blue...so yeh...most likely all cohen's today are decendents of Aaron...

 Most are, but it could be that some aren't (expecially in the Bukharian/Persian communities) In the Bukharian community maybe 30% say they are Kohanim, which is hard to believe, so either 1 of 2 things happened, either the population that was taken there was from places that are heavily populated by Kohanim (Jerusalem or Hevron) or that many made it up or believe themselves to be when they are not.
 I myself was not told by my father (or uncles) that we are Kohanim, but I know someone (from my high school) who has the same last name to myself, said the same (blurry though) history of Great Grandfather and family (how they hid and ran away from the communist gov. and went to different cities, and how last name got changed) now that I know more like that my forefather was a great Rabbi, if I see him again I will ask him if we are the same family or not).  The point- he says that he is a Kohen while I dont, so either we both are Kohanim and I dont know it, or we are Yisrael and he doesn't know it, or we are different family.

Or you could have had similar situations and his great grandfather was a kohen, while yours wasn't (ie different families).

 Yea I know, I wrote that as a possible situation (check in the end), also 1 correction* I would that that about 30% of Bukharians and maybe Persians too are Kohanim AND Leviim. (that's why in shuls to get ready for Birkat Kohanim takes a little longer then in Askenazi Shuls, or Kafkazi shuls (I think I heard that their are no Kohanim or very few Kohanim from Kafkaz). Also in my shul my Rabbi canceled all the Leviim from going and washing the hands of the Kohanim, now we have all the Kohanim being washed by 1 Levite where the position is alternated every week( their is 1 Levite incharge of who washes) and then they (the Kohanim) Bless the people.

[q_q_]

Don't think you can just become a Kohen out of the blue...so yeh...most likely all cohen's today are decendents of Aaron...

 Most are, but it could be that some aren't (expecially in the Bukharian/Persian communities) In the Bukharian community maybe 30% say they are Kohanim, which is hard to believe, so either 1 of 2 things happened, either the population that was taken there was from places that are heavily populated by Kohanim (Jerusalem or Hevron) or that many made it up or believe themselves to be when they are not.
 I myself was not told by my father (or uncles) that we are Kohanim, but I know someone (from my high school) who has the same last name to myself, said the same (blurry though) history of Great Grandfather and family (how they hid and ran away from the communist gov. and went to different cities, and how last name got changed) now that I know more like that my forefather was a great Rabbi, if I see him again I will ask him if we are the same family or not).  The point- he says that he is a Kohen while I dont, so either we both are Kohanim and I dont know it, or we are Yisrael and he doesn't know it, or we are different family.

Or you could have had similar situations and his great grandfather was a kohen, while yours wasn't (ie different families).

Obviously if Tzvi and this guy just happen to share a name, i.e. not a father's line great grandfather, then one cannot draw conclusions from the other as to whether they are kohanim.  And if one has no tradition of being a kohen, and the other has a tradition that hte is, it's likely that both are correct.


These expressions people have used,  "Different family" and great grandfather, are a bit ambiguous.  For example, one has 4 great grandfathers.

 
i'm not big on family trees.. so my reasoning may be at fault here, but I think it's fine.

The only father line that affects whether you are a kohen or not  is one line.  father, his father, his father e.t.c.

which is the same line that affects your tribe.

You are talking about a particular father line great grandather. Any other great grandfather is irrelevant to tribe and surname

So just sharing the same great grandfather is only relevant if that great grandfaher is father's line for both of you.

first cousins share a grandfather, (/parents are siblings)
but I only have the same tribe as the 1st cousins on my father's side.

second cousins share a great grandfather, (/the parents of second cousins are first cousins) but their tribe is determined by their father.  Who is likely not even a relation of yours.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Don't think you can just become a Kohen out of the blue...so yeh...most likely all cohen's today are decendents of Aaron...

 Most are, but it could be that some aren't (expecially in the Bukharian/Persian communities) In the Bukharian community maybe 30% say they are Kohanim, which is hard to believe, so either 1 of 2 things happened, either the population that was taken there was from places that are heavily populated by Kohanim (Jerusalem or Hevron) or that many made it up or believe themselves to be when they are not.
 I myself was not told by my father (or uncles) that we are Kohanim, but I know someone (from my high school) who has the same last name to myself, said the same (blurry though) history of Great Grandfather and family (how they hid and ran away from the communist gov. and went to different cities, and how last name got changed) now that I know more like that my forefather was a great Rabbi, if I see him again I will ask him if we are the same family or not).  The point- he says that he is a Kohen while I dont, so either we both are Kohanim and I dont know it, or we are Yisrael and he doesn't know it, or we are different family.

Or you could have had similar situations and his great grandfather was a kohen, while yours wasn't (ie different families).

Obviously if Tzvi and this guy just happen to share a name, i.e. not a father's line great grandfather, then one cannot draw conclusions from the other as to whether they are kohanim.  And if one has no tradition of being a kohen, and the other has a tradition that hte is, it's likely that both are correct.


These expressions people have used,  "Different family" and great grandfather, are a bit ambiguous.  For example, one has 4 great grandfathers.

 
i'm not big on family trees.. so my reasoning may be at fault here, but I think it's fine.

The only father line that affects whether you are a kohen or not  is one line.  father, his father, his father e.t.c.

which is the same line that affects your tribe.

You are talking about a particular father line great grandather. Any other great grandfather is irrelevant to tribe and surname

So just sharing the same great grandfather is only relevant if that great grandfaher is father's line for both of you.

first cousins share a grandfather, (/parents are siblings)
but I only have the same tribe as the 1st cousins on my father's side.

second cousins share a great grandfather, (/the parents of second cousins are first cousins) but their tribe is determined by their father.  Who is likely not even a relation of yours.

 I know, but the question only came up because we have the same last names. (so obviously we were talking about Fathers fathers father...

[q_q_]

<snip>
 I know, but the question only came up because we have the same last names. (so obviously we were talking about Fathers fathers father...

and when talking about different family, you -actually- meant not sharing the same father's father's father..  Alot of your family will not share the same father's father's father.. They are still your family, not a different family.

So your words were not specific, and even , in a sense, contradictory. So, bad language!