Author Topic: BitTorrent seed farmer found guilty, faces 10 years in jail  (Read 4669 times)

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Offline White Israelite

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Re: BitTorrent seed farmer found guilty, faces 10 years in jail
« Reply #25 on: August 28, 2008, 04:11:14 PM »
Shame on all of you who support stealing. This is one of the prime mitzvahs of Torah "Though Shall Not Steal!"

No matter how many excuses you make for it, there is no excuse for stealing. I work in the software and entertainment business and I know how evil piracy is. If anyone here is engaged in this crime, please stay far, far away from me. I dont want to be near this kind of evil.

Most young kids are into self-gratification and will engage in any kind of pastime as long as they dont have to pay for it. Getting a free ride is all the rage. But the world doesnt work like that, you are not entitled to steal the work of others. And many will rationalize with the "Oh the studios make so much money!". Well that is because they spend a lot of money to make good content. Those who steal from them and then complain how bad the movie was is just like the person who complains how bad the food is, and then complains how small the portions are.

I am shocked how many people have no morals amongst people who claim to be so righteous. How can anyone make excuses for this kind of evil?

muman613


I don't think anyones defending piracy here, merely the fact that people are being prosecuted over little to no evidence (see my comments about the grandma who was charged with felony copyright infringement and didn't even have a computer).

Also the fact that our priorities are really screwed up thanks to the liberal agenda, why is it acceptable that someone downloading a movie gets 10 years in prison but a rapist/murderer or pedophile gets a plea bargain and their out and about serving less time?

Do I think a person should be punished for it? Sure, community service and fine to pay off the damages, but a federal felony in prison for 10 years of your life? People steal items in stores and get less time then that.

WhiteIsraelite,

Yes, there is not equity in justice. This is another issue... But there must be something done to prevent others from stealing. It would be nice if Justice was middah kaneged middah {measure for measure} but in this current world it is not. I have been lucky in the US Court system. Every time I have been charged with something serious, the charges are dropped or reduced. I have a good experience with American justice.

muman613


Do you support the idea of being able to download software/movies that are not sold in the United States (and never will be sold) because of lack of interest?

For example, there are Japanese video games I desire but the companies will not sell in the US, so we are required to download and burn them to disk and play them on the console, therefore is that legitimately stealing as a result because those companies do not provide their products and never have an intention to offer ther products in this country? Effectively, they wouldn't lose anything to begin with.

The same applies with tv shows, when you download a tv show, how is it any different than going to a friends house and recording it on a VCR tape? Is that stealing? Do you see where i'm coming from? Where is the line drawn?

Offline muman613

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Re: BitTorrent seed farmer found guilty, faces 10 years in jail
« Reply #26 on: August 28, 2008, 04:25:27 PM »
WhiteIsraelite,

I know of the problem you are referring. I too collect old apple II apps and it is still technically illegal to transfer the Apple ROM images. I believe that the laws are in need of inspection. I do believe we have the right to back up our software, for our own use. There is the fair use clause which allows people to record TV programs for their own viewing. Regarding obsolete software or programming which is not offered in other countries the laws become hard to define.

I believe the one who creates content or programming should retain the right on how that media should be accessed. But when I buy a CD or DVD I own it and should be able to rip it to my hard drive {I have 4Gigs of mp3 music I have ripped from my CDs}. I am within my rights because I have paid for the content.

I admit that the laws are not very well thought out at this time. I forsee that these laws will become more defined. I am not very happy with DRM {Digital Rights Management} because it will make life harder for those people who dont have any urge to steal.

muman613
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline White Israelite

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Re: BitTorrent seed farmer found guilty, faces 10 years in jail
« Reply #27 on: August 28, 2008, 05:24:00 PM »
WhiteIsraelite,

I know of the problem you are referring. I too collect old apple II apps and it is still technically illegal to transfer the Apple ROM images. I believe that the laws are in need of inspection. I do believe we have the right to back up our software, for our own use. There is the fair use clause which allows people to record TV programs for their own viewing. Regarding obsolete software or programming which is not offered in other countries the laws become hard to define.

I believe the one who creates content or programming should retain the right on how that media should be accessed. But when I buy a CD or DVD I own it and should be able to rip it to my hard drive {I have 4Gigs of mp3 music I have ripped from my CDs}. I am within my rights because I have paid for the content.

I admit that the laws are not very well thought out at this time. I forsee that these laws will become more defined. I am not very happy with DRM {Digital Rights Management} because it will make life harder for those people who dont have any urge to steal.

muman613


Right, in some cases I have downloaded movies as well that I had owned and already purchased but they were destroyed because the disc was scratched or I found it inconvenient having to travel with 50 dvd's so I would rather make a backup of them in xvid to my harddrive as they were only about 700 megabytes a file.

I can understand criminal prosecution for whoever stole the workprint version of the movie and released it and going after the release groups, but going after the end user is inconvenient and a waste of time and money, it's like cutting weeds instead of pulling them from the roots, they will just grow back.

I think the idea of the sentence was merely political and to create a "example" out of the person to cause people to fear downloading pirated movie releases.

In some cases, users have downloaded versions of movies or shows before their release or those that are unlikely to be released.

I will give you a perfect example, in the Anime community (Japanese Animation), many users will download tv shows not available in the US known as fansubs (they have Japanese language but users translate it and put in correct translation so the American crowd can understand the movie), as a result, this has sparked mass interest in a few niche titles and US companies have even licensed the shows and as a result, it increased the popularity and the sales of the actual product because people were able to "discover" them thanks to internet allowing rare niche titles to be downloaded even though they were not actually sold in the US. Case in example, some of the anime titles I have purchased and spent 100 dollars or so on a boxset I would have never bought had I not known about the show in the first place due to capturing my interest via fansubs. Some Japanese companies are cracking down on it and getting youtube to remove the shows even though some of the Japanese companies intent to only keep the shows in Japan as they fear there is not enough interest or cultural conflicts to allow these shows to be sold in the US.

The translation result of most series sold in the US has been more successful than a failure as fans are eager to support the licensers so that they bring more shows to the US.

It's the same with MP3's, I would have never known about some of the artists had I not known or heard some of their songs online.

There is positives and negatives to downloading, and i'm not trying to justify piracy, but in some cases, shows offered online (specifically television shows) have actually helped in many cases, you can read about fansubs here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fansub

Offline Ultra Requete

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Re: BitTorrent seed farmer found guilty, faces 10 years in jail
« Reply #28 on: August 31, 2008, 12:01:12 PM »
Stealing is stealing but I have impresion that copyright violation are only kind of felony which is seriusly enforced letely, plus bit torrents are tools for free exchange of the the free information which we here on JTF know how is "loved" by both goverments and big corporations... who're btw the bigest thiefs. ::)
plus technicly speaking borowing books, making back up copies of purchesed software  or  watching VHS recorded TV shows with friends is ilegal too, we're all criminals which is the true point of this laws.
Jeremiah 8:11-17

11 They dress the wound of my people as though it were not serious. Peace, peace, they say, when there is no peace.

12 Are they ashamed of their loathsome conduct? No, they have no shame at all; they do not even know how to blush. So they will fall among the fallen; they will be brought down when they are punished, says the LORD.

13 'I will take away their harvest, declares the LORD. There will be no grapes on the vine. There will be no figs on the tree, and their leaves will wither. What I have given them will be taken from them.'

14 Why are we sitting here? Gather together! Let us flee to the fortified cities and perish there! For the LORD our God has doomed us to perish and given us poisoned water to drink, because we have sinned against him.

15 We hoped for peace but no good has come, for a time of healing but there was only terror.

16 The snorting of the enemy's horses is heard from Dan; at the neighing of their stallions the whole land trembles. They have come to devour the land and everything in it, the city and all who live there.

17 See, I will send venomous snakes among you, vipers that cannot be charmed, and they will bite you, declares the LORD.

Love your Enemy
And Heap Burning Coals on his Head!!!
http://net-burst.net/revenge/love_and_wrath_of_God.htm

Offline muman613

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Re: BitTorrent seed farmer found guilty, faces 10 years in jail
« Reply #29 on: August 31, 2008, 12:51:31 PM »
Stealing is stealing but I have impresion that copyright violation are only kind of felony which is seriusly enforced letely, plus bit torrents are tools for free exchange of the the free information which we here on JTF know how is "loved" by both goverments and big corporations... who're btw the bigest thiefs. ::)
plus technicly speaking borowing books, making back up copies of purchesed software  or  watching VHS recorded TV shows with friends is ilegal too, we're all criminals which is the true point of this laws.
Ultra,

You are not correct... You have EVERY right protected by the law to make a backup of software and CD content. I just did a google search and every law in USA allows a person who LEGALLY bought software or CD/DVD to make a backup copy...

There is also the "Fair use" clause which allows people to use copyrighted  information...

Quote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use
Fair use is a doctrine in United States copyright law that allows limited use of copyrighted material without requiring permission from the rights holders, such as use for scholarship or review. It provides for the legal, non-licensed citation or incorporation of copyrighted material in another author's work under a four-factor balancing test. It is based on free speech rights provided by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. The term "fair use" is unique to the United States, and recently to Israel and the UK as well; a similar principle, fair dealing, exists in some other common law jurisdictions. Civil law jurisdictions have other limitations and exceptions to copyright.

United States trademark law also incorporates a "fair use" defense, which also stems from the First Amendment of the U.S. constitution.

I have no problem with the law. I buy my software LEGALLY and my CD/DVD content LEGALLY. And I have every right to backup my software and CD/DVD content...

What seems to be your problem with the law?

muman613
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14