Torah and Jewish Idea > Torah and Jewish Idea

Intermarriage

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Benjamin_D:
I am against intermarriage, but would like to hear your thoughts about this.

I know Deuteronomy says "You shall not intermarry with them: do not give your daughters to their sons or take their daughters for your sons. For you will turn you children away from Me to worship other gods...."

But what are your thoughts on this? Moses married Tziporra, who was the daughter of a Midianite priest. Esther was married to a the non-Jewish King Ahashverus.

Comments, thoughts....

muman613:

--- Quote from: Benjamin_D on April 08, 2009, 07:50:28 PM ---I am against intermarriage, but would like to hear your thoughts about this.

I know Deuteronomy says "You shall not intermarry with them: do not give your daughters to their sons or take their daughters for your sons. For you will turn you children away from Me to worship other gods...."

But what are your thoughts on this? Moses married Tziporra, who was the daughter of a Midianite priest. Esther was married to a the non-Jewish King Ahashverus.

Comments, thoughts....

--- End quote ---

Shalom Benjamin_D,

You have raised a very interesting yet very sticky topic. Intermarriage is indeed forbidden to yidden as you have stated. In the case of Moshe it is very complex. Before Sinai it was not yet law and because of Yisros and Zipporahs conversion it was acceptable. You also realize some of the patriarchs did not obey the laws of sexual permission, as we know Lot and his daughters had relations as must have Noachs and Adams children.

In the case of Ester she was really married to Mordechai and it was told that she had remained Jewish in secret, still obeying Shabbat and the laws of Niddah. I believe she got away with being charming to king Ahashverus instead of having to 'do' anything with him. She knowingly sacrificed some of her neshama in order to save the Jewish people.

Having said all this it is very bad that we have intermarried. My family is ravaged by this plague and it angers me very much. We were brought up to believe that everyone is the same and why should we keep the promise of our ancestors. We are a special people and we should have not intermarried.

I hope that this plague stays away from all other Jews.

PS: Here is the story on Yisro, one of the greatest Righteous Gentiles the Torah tells.


--- Quote ---http://www.askmoses.com/en/article/241,2114529/Tzipporah.html

Tzipporah, Yithro's daughter, was famous for her fine character and beauty. In Midyan, where she lived with her father and six sisters, people often talked of Tzipporah's kindness and wisdom. Many were the princes who came to Yithro, seeking the hand of his daughter in marriage.

To all suitors Yithro had but one answer: "In my garden there grows a wonderful staff. If your Royal Highness will get it out of the ground, Tzipporah will be yours."

Eagerly the suitor would go into the garden and up to that wonderful staff glittering in the sun with a million colors and hues. His first attempt to pull the staff out of the ground would bring no results. Again and again he would try to pull at the staff with all his might, but of no avail. The staff simply could not be dislodged from the ground. Thus the princes came hopefully, and left abashed and mystified. Tzipporah would often go into the garden, admire the wonderful staff and wonder who her husband would be.

But how did this wonderful staff come to be there? Well, it is quite a story.

The staff was as old as the world itself. When G-d created the world, He created that wonderful staff out of pure sapphire. On it were engraved the Hebrew letters of G-d's Name, and ten other mysterious letters.

G-d gave this staff to Adam to walk with it in the Garden of Eden. Later it turned up in the hands of the pious Noah, and he passed it on to Shem.

Shem passed it on to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob treasured it greatly, and before Jacob died in Egypt, he gave it to Joseph. When Joseph died, Yithro, who was one of Pharaoh's chief counsellors, took it. Returning to Midyan, Yithro planted it in his garden, and there it stuck in the ground and nobody could get it out again.

When Moses fled from Egypt and finally found refuge in Midyan, in the house of Yithro, he took a walk in the garden and saw the Divine staff. He barely touched it, when the staff almost jumped out of the ground. There he was, holding that Divine staff, and he brought it into the house.

Yithro knew then that Moses was a G-dly man. He offered him to become his son-in-law, and Moses gladly agreed.

It was with this Divine staff that Moses later performed all the miracles in Egypt at G-d's command. With this staff, too, Moses split the Red Sea, and brought water out of the rock.

This Divine staff will turn up again in the hands of Messiah, a descendant of David, who will once again perform wonderful miracles with it at G-d's command, when the hour of Israel's complete Redemption will come.

From Talks and tales, by Kehot Publication Society. Available at www.kehotonline.com

--- End quote ---

muman613:
Q. The Torah calls Noah a righteous person, a tzaddik. Yet we read that he got drunk and exposed himself, and that something took place between him and one of his sons. What kind of a righteous person is this?

A. Ecclesiastes states flatly that "there is no righteous person in the world who does only good and does not sin" (7:20). Indeed, the Sages criticized Abraham, Jacob, Moses(1) and others, although their sins seem much less apparent than Noah's. The question to ask is, rather: what does a righteous person do after he sins? How does he respond?

Here the Torah is teaching a profound lesson. We can understand it by contrasting Noah's behavior with that of a much lesser figure: Lot, Abraham's nephew.

"Noah awoke from his wine and knew what his youngest son had done to him." One interpretation in the Talmud is that there had been a homosexual act.(2) There is a very similar story in Bereishit chapter 19. After the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, Lot and his two daughters found themselves alone in the mountains. "The elder daughter said to the younger, 'Let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, and bear children from our father.' That night they made their father drink wine, and the elder daughter came and lay with her father. He was unaware of her lying down or of her getting up" (19:31-33).

Noah was drunk, but afterwards when sober he knew what had taken place between him and his son. How did he know? He wanted to know. A righteous person-the Noah-type- sins, but he gets up the next morning and tells G-d, "I'm not perfect. I've done what I shouldn't have and I haven't done what I should." He admits his own failings.

Lot was also drunk. Lot, too, sinned in his drunkenness, but "he was unaware of her lying down or of her getting up." The pseudo-righteous person, the Lot-type, does not recognize his sins. He cannot face his failings. Self-awareness is a threat to him. And, since he denies he sinned, he sins again. Lot's elder daughter lay with him the first night- is it any wonder his younger daughter lay with him the next? (19:35).

Imagine a confrontation between Noah and Lot. Lot would say, "You, Noah, are hardly a tzaddik. Look at what you did when you were drunk. And what kind of son have you raised?" What could Noah answer? That Lot, too, slept with his daughters? Lot denies everything! After all, he lived over ten years with his illustrious uncle and must have learned much from him. Didn't G-d send angels to save him alone from the destruction of Sodom? Certainly, such a person has cause to think he is special- perhaps not quite on the level of Abraham, but head and shoulders above everyone else!

Rather, the greatness of Noah lies in that he knew what he did. That is why the Torah could say in spite of his drunkenness, "Noah was a righteous person, he was wholesome in his generations" (6:9).

Notes

1. Abraham, Nedarim 32a; Jacob, Bereishit Rabbah 75:11; Moses, Yalkut Shimoni (Va'etchanan) 314.

2. Sanhedrin 70a; cf. Vayikra 20:17 where to "see nakedness" means to sin sexually. An aggadic interpretation is that Ham castrated his father- in which case Noah certainly knew what had been done to him.

muman613:
http://www.askmoses.com/en/article/265,57328/If-Esther-married-a-non-Jewish-king-why-are-Jews-against-intermarriage.html

Rabbi Silberberg:Good morning and welcome to Askmoses! How can I help you?

Miriam: Good morning Rabbi. Maybe you can help me. I'm reading the Purim story and there is something which is bothering me. If Esther was Jewish and she married a non-Jewish king, why are so many Jews against intermarriage?

Rabbi Silberberg: You understand that Esther's relationship with Ahasuerus wasn't consensual? In fact, according to the Talmud, Esther was already a happily married woman; married to her cousin Mordechai.

Miriam: So Esther wasn't interested in winning the "beauty contest"? That's not the impression I got in Hebrew school...

Rabbi Silberberg: Absolutely not. The Megillah says that while all the other maidens spent twelve months beautifying themselves with ointments and cosmetics in preparation for their royal rendezvous, Esther requested no beautifying agents at all.

Rabbi Silberberg: Esther's personal life is the often forgotten sad side of the story of Purim. Indeed she brought salvation for all her brethren--which certainly brought her great satisfaction--but the salvation came at a steep price. Our righteous heroine languished in a pagan palace for years. Bear in mind the savagery and corruption which typified royal courts of old.

Miriam: I guess this teaches us that one person's liberty and success is often the result of another's sacrifice.

Rabbi Silberberg: exactly.

Miriam: Thanks, and have a happy Purim.

Rabbi Silberberg: You too :)

Benjamin_D:
Thanks for you input  :dance:

I like it.

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