Dont ask Dont tell must contnue or gays must leave services

[muman613]

I think it is stupid that the armed services are considering repealing the don't ask don't tell policy. I think it is a good compromise, but of course the gay perverts don't see it that way... They want normal people to condone their deviant sexual behaviour. This is sick and I think it will lead to normal heterosexual people to avoid the army for fear of being sexually assaulted by another troop. I surely would never serve in an army where openly homosexual people fight. This is suicidal and will result in America being destroyed...
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/22/lawmakers-urge-obama-suspend-repeal-dont-ask-dont-tell/

[GoIsraelGo!]

Shalom Muman, I seriously doubt that obama will get away with his request to undo the don't ask don't tell policy of our military.
The generals are against homosexuality also, and will go out of their way to fight the gays on their outrageous demands.

Our troops should not be forced to accept homosexuality as normal.

Most gays are anti war ...so why on earth would they do this?
the answer is: Gays will have access to even more men in the Military.
It's not being done for love of Country, that is for sure.


                                                                   Shalom - Dox

[Yonah]

Homosexuals have been allowed in the IDF for quite a while, and it hasn't been a problem, and homosexuals have been serving in the US military for years, they just did it secretly. Removing the don't ask don't tell policy isn't going to lead to communal shower orgies, male pinups on airplanes or pandemic rape.

[Confederate Kahanist]

The military needs everyone they can get.  As long as they dont do any funny stuff there fine.

[muman613]

According to our Holy Torah it is an abomination for a man to sleep with another man. It is not 'OK' if it is done in private, it is just that we are not forced to punish them for their obvious rejection of the word of the G-d of Israel, the Master of the Universe. If we are to believe our Torah, we must know that we will not win the war if we accept this abomination.

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

I just don't understand the desire to flaunt your sexuality. It flies in the face of humility, modesty, and self-respect. I know gays, heck I live in San Francisco, and I know that there is something wrong with them. I read recently that there are many gays who 'believe in g-d'... What they believe in is a gay jesus, who fits their fantasies.

I have been one who does not advocate being mean or disrespectful of gays. I think that they should get help, try to understand what it is which makes them attracted to their own sex. I think that there are deep rooted issues which could be causing this behavior. But even if I don't oppress the gay, I do everything I can to prevent them from desecrating marriage, and from 'spreading the gay word' in the military.

Apparently this generation has missed the point and have become permissive... Yeah, "I know I nice gay guy and he even gives charity..." I know them too... But that does not make that lifestyle permissible.

[Geert Akbar]

Its because they want more legitimacy. I hate queers so much.

[Yonah]

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

The Six Day War was a fight for survival; Lebanon and Gaza were just hastily executed punitive expeditions. Were Israel again placed in mortal jeopardy, I believe it would once again triumph gloriously, whether or not there are a few gay people in the IDF.

Military service, for the most part, consists of mind numbing labor, the likes of which homosexuals in Israel ought not escape for reason of their sexual preferences alone. In the US, there are already a lot of gay people in the military, and few more would join if allowed. Removing the current policy wouldn't encourage gays to openly flaunt their sexuality, wear mesh shirts, etc... but would really only have the effect of protecting them from being discharged simply because they are gay.

[muman613]

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

The Six Day War was a fight for survival; Lebanon and Gaza were just hastily executed punitive expeditions. Were Israel again placed in mortal jeopardy, I believe it would once again triumph gloriously, whether or not there are a few gay people in the IDF.

Military service, for the most part, consists of mind numbing labor, the likes of which homosexuals in Israel ought not escape for reason of their sexual preferences alone. In the US, there are already a lot of gay people in the military, and few more would join if allowed. Removing the current policy wouldn't encourage gays to openly flaunt their sexuality, wear mesh shirts, etc... but would really only have the effect of protecting them from being discharged simply because they are gay.

You have already lost... You do not hear what I am saying. It is not good, from Hashems perspective, to have an army which sins flagrantly. But you obviously don't believe in Torah, and you have lost the battle by accepting instead of tolerating... This is a sad fact which will have great repurcussions.

[Yochai]

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

The Six Day War was a fight for survival; Lebanon and Gaza were just hastily executed punitive expeditions. Were Israel again placed in mortal jeopardy, I believe it would once again triumph gloriously, whether or not there are a few gay people in the IDF.

Military service, for the most part, consists of mind numbing labor, the likes of which homosexuals in Israel ought not escape for reason of their sexual preferences alone. In the US, there are already a lot of gay people in the military, and few more would join if allowed. Removing the current policy wouldn't encourage gays to openly flaunt their sexuality, wear mesh shirts, etc... but would really only have the effect of protecting them from being discharged simply because they are gay.

So how are straight men supposed to feel comfortable showering in front of homos?

[Yonah]

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

The Six Day War was a fight for survival; Lebanon and Gaza were just hastily executed punitive expeditions. Were Israel again placed in mortal jeopardy, I believe it would once again triumph gloriously, whether or not there are a few gay people in the IDF.

Military service, for the most part, consists of mind numbing labor, the likes of which homosexuals in Israel ought not escape for reason of their sexual preferences alone. In the US, there are already a lot of gay people in the military, and few more would join if allowed. Removing the current policy wouldn't encourage gays to openly flaunt their sexuality, wear mesh shirts, etc... but would really only have the effect of protecting them from being discharged simply because they are gay.

You have already lost... You do not hear what I am saying. It is not good, from Hashems perspective, to have an army which sins flagrantly. But you obviously don't believe in Torah, and you have lost the battle by accepting instead of tolerating... This is a sad fact which will have great repurcussions.

Where in the Torah does it say that homosexuals are not fit for military service?

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

The Six Day War was a fight for survival; Lebanon and Gaza were just hastily executed punitive expeditions. Were Israel again placed in mortal jeopardy, I believe it would once again triumph gloriously, whether or not there are a few gay people in the IDF.

Military service, for the most part, consists of mind numbing labor, the likes of which homosexuals in Israel ought not escape for reason of their sexual preferences alone. In the US, there are already a lot of gay people in the military, and few more would join if allowed. Removing the current policy wouldn't encourage gays to openly flaunt their sexuality, wear mesh shirts, etc... but would really only have the effect of protecting them from being discharged simply because they are gay.

So how are straight men supposed to feel comfortable showering in front of homos?

Frankly, I don't see how a straight man is supposed to feel comfortable showering in front of a bunch of guys. The Torah condemns public nakedness.

[Yochai]

Yes the Torah condemns it, but the U.S. army does not work by the rules of the Torah, nor do most of its members.

As for the Torah's view on homosexuals:
 
יג  וְאִישׁ, אֲשֶׁר יִשְׁכַּב אֶת-זָכָר מִשְׁכְּבֵי אִשָּׁה--תּוֹעֵבָה עָשׂוּ, שְׁנֵיהֶם; מוֹת יוּמָתוּ, דְּמֵיהֶם בָּם.

13 And if a man lie with mankind, as with womankind, both of them have committed abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. 

[muman613]

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

The Six Day War was a fight for survival; Lebanon and Gaza were just hastily executed punitive expeditions. Were Israel again placed in mortal jeopardy, I believe it would once again triumph gloriously, whether or not there are a few gay people in the IDF.

Military service, for the most part, consists of mind numbing labor, the likes of which homosexuals in Israel ought not escape for reason of their sexual preferences alone. In the US, there are already a lot of gay people in the military, and few more would join if allowed. Removing the current policy wouldn't encourage gays to openly flaunt their sexuality, wear mesh shirts, etc... but would really only have the effect of protecting them from being discharged simply because they are gay.

You have already lost... You do not hear what I am saying. It is not good, from Hashems perspective, to have an army which sins flagrantly. But you obviously don't believe in Torah, and you have lost the battle by accepting instead of tolerating... This is a sad fact which will have great repurcussions.

Where in the Torah does it say that homosexuals are not fit for military service?

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

The Six Day War was a fight for survival; Lebanon and Gaza were just hastily executed punitive expeditions. Were Israel again placed in mortal jeopardy, I believe it would once again triumph gloriously, whether or not there are a few gay people in the IDF.

Military service, for the most part, consists of mind numbing labor, the likes of which homosexuals in Israel ought not escape for reason of their sexual preferences alone. In the US, there are already a lot of gay people in the military, and few more would join if allowed. Removing the current policy wouldn't encourage gays to openly flaunt their sexuality, wear mesh shirts, etc... but would really only have the effect of protecting them from being discharged simply because they are gay.

So how are straight men supposed to feel comfortable showering in front of homos?

Frankly, I don't see how a straight man is supposed to feel comfortable showering in front of a bunch of guys. The Torah condemns public nakedness.

It is very clear in Torah that a fighting force must be free of sexual impurity.

See the Parasha of Ki Seitze which discusses the prohibition on homosexuality, right next to the laws of going to war. An army must be united, which is why cowards, newly weds, and people who have just bought a house are exempt from going to war {read the Parasha}. If there are homosexuals in the group it will cause division and an army which will not win. Israel will win if it has a moral code, the commandments of Hashem. Hashem has promised us that we will win.

When you go out and encamp against your foe, then you shall guard against anything evil… You shall designate a place outside the confines of the camp and go out there (to relieve yourself). And you shall include a spade among your weapons so that when you sit down out there (and relieve yourself) then you shall dig with it in order to cover over your excrement. This is because God your Lord walks in the midst of your camp, to save you and to defeat your enemies before you, and therefore your encampment shall be holy. Let He not see anything unseemly in your midst and distance Himself from you (23:10-15).

Here is RAMBAMS commentary on this portion:

It appears to me concerning this mitzva that the text seeks to warn us about the situation that is most likely to be characterized by transgression. It is a known fact that troops that go out to battle engage in the consumption of every abomination imaginable, they rob and act violently and are shameless, even in matters of sexual immorality and the commission of every offensive deed. Even the most upright of men by nature, dons a mantle of cruelty and rage when his forces prepare to engage the enemy, and therefore the Torah warns concerning these things that "you shall guard against anything evil" (23:10), for the plain sense of the phrase is to caution about every forbidden matter.

http://ohr.edu/tw/5755/devarim/kiseitze.tw

[Christian Zionist]

They can form a fag brigade to counter biological terrorism      

[Yonah]

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

The Six Day War was a fight for survival; Lebanon and Gaza were just hastily executed punitive expeditions. Were Israel again placed in mortal jeopardy, I believe it would once again triumph gloriously, whether or not there are a few gay people in the IDF.

Military service, for the most part, consists of mind numbing labor, the likes of which homosexuals in Israel ought not escape for reason of their sexual preferences alone. In the US, there are already a lot of gay people in the military, and few more would join if allowed. Removing the current policy wouldn't encourage gays to openly flaunt their sexuality, wear mesh shirts, etc... but would really only have the effect of protecting them from being discharged simply because they are gay.

You have already lost... You do not hear what I am saying. It is not good, from Hashems perspective, to have an army which sins flagrantly. But you obviously don't believe in Torah, and you have lost the battle by accepting instead of tolerating... This is a sad fact which will have great repurcussions.

Where in the Torah does it say that homosexuals are not fit for military service?

If people can be openly gay in the military it will lead to disaster for America. I also think this may be the reason that the IDF is no longer the great fighting force it was in years past. What happened to the Israel Defense Force which defeated many arab armys in 6 days? Lebanon was a disaster, and the last gaza operation was a complete failure. For every action, there is an opposite action, which is Hashem telling us that we have strayed very far from the goal he has for humanity.

The Six Day War was a fight for survival; Lebanon and Gaza were just hastily executed punitive expeditions. Were Israel again placed in mortal jeopardy, I believe it would once again triumph gloriously, whether or not there are a few gay people in the IDF.

Military service, for the most part, consists of mind numbing labor, the likes of which homosexuals in Israel ought not escape for reason of their sexual preferences alone. In the US, there are already a lot of gay people in the military, and few more would join if allowed. Removing the current policy wouldn't encourage gays to openly flaunt their sexuality, wear mesh shirts, etc... but would really only have the effect of protecting them from being discharged simply because they are gay.

So how are straight men supposed to feel comfortable showering in front of homos?

Frankly, I don't see how a straight man is supposed to feel comfortable showering in front of a bunch of guys. The Torah condemns public nakedness.

It is very clear in Torah that a fighting force must be free of sexual impurity.

See the Parasha of Ki Seitze which discusses the prohibition on homosexuality, right next to the laws of going to war. An army must be united, which is why cowards, newly weds, and people who have just bought a house are exempt from going to war {read the Parasha}. If there are homosexuals in the group it will cause division and an army which will not win. Israel will win if it has a moral code, the commandments of Hashem. Hashem has promised us that we will win.

When you go out and encamp against your foe, then you shall guard against anything evil… You shall designate a place outside the confines of the camp and go out there (to relieve yourself). And you shall include a spade among your weapons so that when you sit down out there (and relieve yourself) then you shall dig with it in order to cover over your excrement. This is because G-d your Lord walks in the midst of your camp, to save you and to defeat your enemies before you, and therefore your encampment shall be holy. Let He not see anything unseemly in your midst and distance Himself from you (23:10-15).

Here is RAMBAMS commentary on this portion:

It appears to me concerning this mitzva that the text seeks to warn us about the situation that is most likely to be characterized by transgression. It is a known fact that troops that go out to battle engage in the consumption of every abomination imaginable, they rob and act violently and are shameless, even in matters of sexual immorality and the commission of every offensive deed. Even the most upright of men by nature, dons a mantle of cruelty and rage when his forces prepare to engage the enemy, and therefore the Torah warns concerning these things that "you shall guard against anything evil" (23:10), for the plain sense of the phrase is to caution about every forbidden matter.

http://ohr.edu/tw/5755/devarim/kiseitze.tw

What is unseemly to Hashem? Homosexuals or homosexual acts? The portions of the Torah which condemn those who practice homosexuality also condemn other transgressors who are in no way denied military service. There are homosexuals who have never committed a homosexual act.

The proscription on gays in the military has little to do with the words of Hashem and far more to do with fear of homosexuals and historic attempts to quell the rampant homosexuality which erupted in military units in the days when the conscription of youths was widespread and sex (with women) before marriage far less common. These two factors explain the gayness of a number of Muslim armies.