Author Topic: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)  (Read 2825 times)

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Offline galileerat

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Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« on: July 16, 2009, 04:17:42 PM »
The Erev Rav (the Mixed Multitude) are nominal Jews who openly disavow Hashem and the Torah and sidewith/aid our enemies  eg Uri Avneri and Gush Shalom




Just as dangerous are those who are referred to in the Zohar as the Erev Ze'ir (the Mixed Minitude): nominally Orthodox Jews who keep all the mitzvot and who believe in Hashem, but who also side with/aid our enemies.



Witness the the latest antics of the Neturei Karta in Gaza!
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1100774.html



« Last Edit: July 16, 2009, 06:45:37 PM by galileerat »

Offline galileerat

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2009, 03:07:21 AM »
The Ari and the Vilna Gaon write that EVERYTHING to do with the Redemption depends on the war against the Erev Rav and ergo also the Erev Ze'ir i.e the sifting out of the dross in the Am Yisrael.

Rav Kahane perceived this when he had his "Swine of the Month" column in the Kahane Magazine.

Let's start with Yossi Sarid!




Offline Zelhar

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2009, 09:12:52 AM »
Maybe we could do a swine of the week ?

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #3 on: July 17, 2009, 11:17:09 AM »
The Ari and the Vilna Gaon write that EVERYTHING to do with the Redemption depends on the war against the Erev Rav and ergo also the Erev Ze'ir i.e the sifting out of the dross in the Am Yisrael.


The Ari and Vilna Gaon wrote about erev rav, but did they write also about "erev ze'ir" or is that you?   Did they say that, or is the "ergo" just your own addition?   Based on the way you write this, it makes it very difficult to tell what is your own writing and what you are citing...

Offline Lisa

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #4 on: July 17, 2009, 11:28:55 AM »
I never heard the term "ever ze'ir."  Can someone please elaborate?

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #5 on: July 17, 2009, 11:49:52 AM »
I never heard the term "ever ze'ir."  Can someone please elaborate?

I haven't either.

Moshe92

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« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 04:06:32 PM by Moshe92 »

Moshe92

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #7 on: July 17, 2009, 04:10:08 PM »
Here is a footnote from the article.

There are many levels of parallelism between the two "Erevs."   On the political front there is an important facet that can be observed although, at this point, it can only be presented as speculation. The year 1990 witnessed extraordinary political events not only in the world at large but also in Israel. After 42 years in power the Israeli government of the secular Zionist leaders - the Erev Rav - fell at the hands of the religious non-Zionist leaders. First, the recognized Sepharadi halachic authority R. Ovadia Yosef and his Shas party were the key pin that were instrumental in bringing down the Shamir led government. Then, R. Eliezer Shach, the Rosh Yeshivah of Ponavitch and acclaimed leader of the Lithuwanian Yeshivah world, and his Degel HaTorah party were handed the political reigns and wrought havoc throughout the secular Israeli community and abroad. This was following the totally unprecedented power granted to him (or to any other rabbinic leader to date) through the vast media coverage of a speech he delivered on the media's false assumption that his party was going to announce a significant change in political policy. This was followed by the world leader of Chassidic Jewry and acclaimed Tzaddik of the generation R. Menachem Mendel Schneerson, the Lubuvitzcher Rebbe, directing his representative in the Agudat Yisrael party not to join in a Perez led government. Only after Perez was assured of the support of all the members of Agudat Yisrael and only after his public proclamation that he was indeed going to form the next government, did the Lubavitcher Rebbe, in affect, pull the political carpet out from beneath Shimon Perez - the archetypal representative of the Erev Rav - and topple his dreams as well as most likely his career.
What is most amazing about this new phenomenon of religious political activism is that only a few years prior Shas and Degel HaTorah did not exist and Agudat Yisrael played a very low profile in the Kenesset. Furthermore, prior to this, these Torah leaders made repeated claims based upon their religious convictions that they did not want to be directly involved in a secular and anti-religious government (of the Erev Rav). Certainly, they made it clear that they did not want to be the ones responsible for making or breaking the government. Yet, as they entered the year 1990 the One Above threw the political ball into their courts and now, almost against their own will, they were drawn into the furnace of Israeli politics and granted the gift of unprecedented political control over the destiny of the Nation of Israel. Now, could there be a hidden pattern of the Trein Mesheecheen lying somewhere beneath these political events?
As the GRA explained above,one of the reasons the Erev Rav is called by that name is because it was during the period of the ascent of the sun during the the 6th hour of the day - the "Great Evening" - that the "mazal" of this collective group ascended and they gained power. The Erev Zeir, on the other hand, was that collective group of leaders whose "mazal" ascended afterwards and gained power only as the sun began setting - the "Lesser Evening." As explained in the introduction, according to the GRA each 1,000 year period is divided into 24 hours - one day. Thus, each "hour" is equal to 41 years and 8 months   From the rise of the sun on the "6th millennial day" (1740) to high noon (1990) 6 full "hours" have passed (41 years and 8 months times 6 equals exactly 250 years or a quarter of the millennia). The 6th hour itself began in 1948 and finished in 1990 precisely as Israel observed its 42nd year of independence . The symmetry now speaks for itself. It was only in 1948 as the ascent of the 6th hour played into their hands that the "New Erev Rav" of secular Zionism gained miraculous political control over the Land of Israel and its direction. And it was only in 1990 as the power of the 6th hour weakened and the period of the "Lesser Evening" gained ascendency that the "New Erev Zeir" - the religious leaders - emerged and were compelled to play their different although equally vital role in the final unfolding of the Divine Drama of the Trein Mesheecheen.

Offline muman613

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #8 on: July 17, 2009, 04:16:27 PM »
This line is essential:

It is essential to note in what context R. Hillel is using the well known rabbinic formula "In the Ikveta D'Meshicha truth will become diminished and Chutzpah-Arrogance will increase." This has always been used to refer to modern secularism and atheism as was the case above with the heresy of Sasson. Here, however, it is used to refer to the religious leaders themselves! Thus, we now have another important symmetry in the larger formula. This time it is two modes of Chutzpah - the "Greater Chutzpah" of the Erev Rav and the "Lesser Chutzpah" of the Erev Zeir.[376]

I found a blog post and an article that have to do with erev zeir.

http://keitzmeguleh.blogspot.com/2008/01/erev-rav-summary.html
http://www.chazonhatorah.org/the-time-of-our-simcha.htm


You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2009, 05:03:27 PM »
Here is a footnote from the article.

There are many levels of parallelism between the two "Erevs."   On the political front there is an important facet that can be observed although, at this point, it can only be presented as speculation. The year 1990 witnessed extraordinary political events not only in the world at large but also in Israel. After 42 years in power the Israeli government of the secular Zionist leaders - the Erev Rav - fell at the hands of the religious non-Zionist leaders. First, the recognized Sepharadi halachic authority R. Ovadia Yosef and his Shas party were the key pin that were instrumental in bringing down the Shamir led government. Then, R. Eliezer Shach, the Rosh Yeshivah of Ponavitch and acclaimed leader of the Lithuwanian Yeshivah world, and his Degel HaTorah party were handed the political reigns and wrought havoc throughout the secular Israeli community and abroad. This was following the totally unprecedented power granted to him (or to any other rabbinic leader to date) through the vast media coverage of a speech he delivered on the media's false assumption that his party was going to announce a significant change in political policy.

None of this makes any sense.  All this shows is that so-called "religious" leaders and parties allied themselves with the suicidal left more strongly.   For years Rav Shach was a supporter of the Labor party.   Here, they "took down" the Shamir govt.   Because of the fall of Shamir, we got Rabin!   This is just putting too much stock into speculative mystical hoo-ha.  This is basically saying that when supposedly religious Jews and organizations commit treason, it is basically "ok" because really G-d is in control of it and we are all flying on a magical geula train that will get to its stop no matter what.   Well guess what, the so-called leaders that are driving this train are blindfolded and stumbling drunk and the train is going off the tracks if we don't do anything! 

G-d didn't put us here to do nothing and just get dragged to geula like drugged zombies.

I'm not going to pay too much attention to this type of speculation.

Offline galileerat

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2009, 12:01:26 AM »
Hashem spoke to Moshe and called the Erev Rav "your people" ie the Mixed Multitude of Egyptian converts that you Moshe took out of Egypt, not Me.

The reason Moshe made such a fuss about the Erev Rav was that he was raised amongst them as a child: they were the best of Egypt and Moshe had a soft spot for them, feeling that there was an important spark of elevatable kedusha in them, as the Ari explains.

Indeed, amongst the Erev Rav of today e.g. Barak, Olmert, Sharon, even Peres, very occasionally they wince and mention Hashem and show just a hint of regret, and one gets a feeling that they may somehow yet redeem themselves and do some type of a teshuvah.

Yet always they persist and continue in their betrayal and back-stabbing of the true Am Yisrael.

The removal of any remaining spark of kedushah out of the Erev Rav, and then the discarding of the bulk of their klippah ie their elimination from the corpus of the Jewish People is the main task of the Moshiachs, according to the Gra! Most leaders and indeed most rabbis, according to the Divrei Chayim, will be of the Erev Rav in generation before the Moshiach!

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2009, 12:16:28 AM »

The removal of any remaining spark of kedushah out of the Erev Rav, and then the discarding of the bulk of their klippah ie their elimination from the corpus of the Jewish People is the main task of the Moshiachs (sic)

Right, you leave everything as the task of the moschiach and nothing for us to do.   A recipe of inaction is a recipe for disaster.   Hashem never asked us to be zombies who wait for someone else to solve our problems for us.

This train has derailed and the engineers are either blind or traitors.   We have to do everything we can to set matters straight.

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Erev Rav (Mixed Multitude) & Erev Ze'ir (Mixed Minitude)
« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2009, 02:18:25 AM »
Maybe we could do a swine of the week ?
Feminem.com (a site I was a major contributor to long before JTF) used to have a feature called "Faggot of the Month". It was mad funny.