Many more Ethiopians to come?

[galileerat]

Interior Minister Eli Yishai of Shas wants to re-start the open-ended immigration of more Ethiopians to Israel http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1102551.html

The only one's keen on bringing yet more Ethiopians to Israel is the Shas Party (who Chaim calls "the most unbelievably evil party in Israel") under its leader R.Ovadiya Yosef (who Chaim calls "demented"), together with a few extreme leftist Israelis, backed by "bleeding-heart" liberal Americans.

Yossi Sarid of Meretz actually advocated bringing over a million Ethiopians immediately in the 90s! Although an Ethiopian black, once he's undergone geirus and keeps to Judaism, changes from being a somewhat Judaised negro to Halachically a full Jew, the connection of the next batch of Falash Mura, with the potential of vast hordes to follow them, is just too tenuous: "By bringing the Ethiopians over, we haven't done any favors for us, nor for them" (Natan Sharansky, then immigration minister).

R.Moshe Feinstein ruled that the Falashas had the status of "sofek yehudi" who required giyur l'kula; all poskim rule that the Xtianised Falashmuras have the status of complete goyim who require giyur l'chumra.

As with all groups, some become "israelified' criminals, drugs being a big problem with the Ethiopian youth, plus many family murders every year; others become tzaddikim and do their duty eg

Ethiopians generally make good soldiers



Doron Mehereta, yeshivah student, slain in Mercaz Harav massacre



Whe Falashas or Falshmuras move in to an Israeli neighborhood, just like the Jews in the US when blacks move in, most Israelis, especially Ashkenazi chillonim ones, flee!

[Ulli]

Imo you should welcome anybody of this group, who accepts to convert.

You will need every man in the future and this people have traditionally a high birthrate as well as a traditional connection to Judaism.

[Rightist2]

As far as I know, most of these Ethiopians support Right-wing parties in Isael such as Likud. Also its the LEFT-WING parties that oppose Ethiopian immigration, in particular the Labor party. This is because once the Ethiopians land they understand full what muslims are about and vote for the parties that take the strongest stance against the Arab monkeys. In Ethiopia the Christians are under constant attack from aggressive muslim hordes such as the Somalis. The late Rabbi Meir Kahane supported Ethiopian emigration.

Lastly, Natan Sharansky and his Russians can talk all they like. I saw a programme on TV recently where they showed Russian jews involved in lots of crime in Israel. Many Russians are in gangs and recently there was a neo-Nazi gang running around in Israel attacking Haredim and others. Many of the Russians arent even real Jews anyways as maybe their grandfather was a non-practicing Jew etc. Natan and the Russians hate the Ethiopians because they must compete with them for the welfare handouts.

The solution to the bad behaviour of the Russians and Ethiopians is to stop all welfare handouts and say to them "GET A JOB YOU LAZY PEOPLE!!!".
Ethiopian youth must be taught with a firm hand to not gather on the streets in gangs and to REJECT black American ghetto urban degenerate counter culture! Those that cant abide by the rules should be given a one way ticket to Addis Ababa. Either you live in a first world country and behave, or you go back to the hell that is sub-saharan Africa. Im sure the Ethiopians would choose wisely when given this choice.   
 

[Spectator]

The only one's keen on bringing yet more Ethiopians to Israel is the Shas Party (who Chaim calls "the most unbelievably evil party in Israel") under its leader R.Ovadiya Yosef (who Chaim calls "demented"), together with a few extreme leftist Israelis, backed by "bleeding-heart" liberal Americans.

I've never heard that Chaim called Rabbi Ovadiya Yosef "demented". On the contrary, he said that Rabbi Ovadiya is a true Torah scholar and while we may disagree with him, we must not insult him.

[Spectator]

As in case with "Russians", some "Ethiopians" in Israel  are Jewish while others are not. The difference is that it is very easy to determine whether a "Russian" is Jewish, while in case of Ethiopians it is not as easy.

I intentionally write these groups in quotes because some Israelis fail to understand that this denomination is nothing but a cultural background and not ethnicity. This leads to the lack of ability to differentiate between Jews from Russia and ethnic Russians.

[Spectator]

Lastly, Natan Sharansky and his Russians can talk all they like. I saw a programme on TV recently where they showed Russian jews involved in lots of crime in Israel. Many Russians are in gangs and recently there was a neo-Nazi gang running around in Israel attacking Haredim and others. Many of the Russians arent even real Jews anyways as maybe their grandfather was a non-practicing Jew etc. Natan and the Russians hate the Ethiopians because they must compete with them for the welfare handouts.

You have a very primitive and biased opinion about Russian Jews in Israel.

Of course there are "Russian" criminals but the majority of criminals in Israel are native Israelis and Arabs.

It is true that 300.000 out of 1.100.000 "Russians" in Israel are not Jewish. This is the fault of Israeli leftist elite that wants to bring as many non-Jews from all over the world to "have more people in the army" and to challenge the higher birthrate of the religious Israeli Jews. I think the Law of Return is very bad for Israel and should be fixed in such a way that it won't threaten Jewish character of the State of Israel. You must learn to differentiate between Jews from Russia and ethinic Russians.

As for your statement about "Russians competing for welfare", it is the complete rubbish. Most "Russians", including non-Jews, are educated and hardworking people. Considerable part of Israeli hi-tech workers and engineers were born in the former USSR or are their children. 

[Zelhar]

‎The real Ethiopian Jews have repeatedly appealed not to bring in these imposters. What basically happened is, there is a refugee camp that remains operational 17 years after the last true Jews have been brought into Israel. Every time this camp is emptied it is immediate filled up with a new batch of imposters. I can give you several good reasons why we should stop bringing these people:

1. They are "converting" as a group of people not as individuals. In fact they live in Israel as an Ethiopian tribe and do not integrate.
2. If they have any Jewish background- it is over five generations in the past. Since they left Judaism they participated, in some occasions more zealously then the gentiles, in persecuting the Jews who kept their faith.
3. It costs over 1,000,000 shekels to the Israeli government just to get one such family settled in Israel. Free housing, free pensions, free health care (and as you can imagine AIDS is much more common among them), free welfare, subsidized incomes. All this just to get them settled as a poor economically dependent population for ages to come. It is economically sdmarter to pay them money not to come. WE could prpbably feed all the hunger stricken people in Ethiopia with the budget costs of 50,000 falash murah.
4. With all the above it is certain that they are not true converts to Judaism but free riders on the Israeli tax payer.

[Rightist2]

‎The real Ethiopian Jews have repeatedly appealed not to bring in these imposters. What basically happened is, there is a refugee camp that remains operational 17 years after the last true Jews have been brought into Israel. Every time this camp is emptied it is immediate filled up with a new batch of imposters. I can give you several good reasons why we should stop bringing these people:

1. They are "converting" as a group of people not as individuals. In fact they live in Israel as an Ethiopian tribe and do not integrate.
2. If they have any Jewish background- it is over five generations in the past. Since they left Judaism they participated, in some occasions more zealously then the gentiles, in persecuting the Jews who kept their faith.
3. It costs over 1,000,000 shekels to the Israeli government just to get one such family settled in Israel. Free housing, free pensions, free health care (and as you can imagine AIDS is much more common among them), free welfare, subsidized incomes. All this just to get them settled as a poor economically dependent population for ages to come. It is economically sdmarter to pay them money not to come. WE could prpbably feed all the hunger stricken people in Ethiopia with the budget costs of 50,000 falash murah.
4. With all the above it is certain that they are not true converts to Judaism but free riders on the Israeli tax payer.

Oh I see. I did wonder how there were yet more Ethiopians to come because so many have been airlifted already as it is. Anyone genuinely in need would have left Ethiopia long ago. Only SCAMS and FRAUDS remain there. Then now its time for Israel to stand up and say NO MORE of these FRAUDS!! Too many blacks will lower the IQ of Israel anyways and that can never be a good thing for any nation.

[Rightist2]

Lastly, Natan Sharansky and his Russians can talk all they like. I saw a programme on TV recently where they showed Russian jews involved in lots of crime in Israel. Many Russians are in gangs and recently there was a neo-Nazi gang running around in Israel attacking Haredim and others. Many of the Russians arent even real Jews anyways as maybe their grandfather was a non-practicing Jew etc. Natan and the Russians hate the Ethiopians because they must compete with them for the welfare handouts.

You have a very primitive and biased opinion about Russian Jews in Israel.

Of course there are "Russian" criminals but the majority of criminals in Israel are native Israelis and Arabs.

It is true that 300.000 out of 1.100.000 "Russians" in Israel are not Jewish. This is the fault of Israeli leftist elite that wants to bring as many non-Jews from all over the world to "have more people in the army" and to challenge the higher birthrate of the religious Israeli Jews. I think the Law of Return is very bad for Israel and should be fixed in such a way that it won't threaten Jewish character of the State of Israel. You must learn to differentiate between Jews from Russia and ethinic Russians.

As for your statement about "Russians competing for welfare", it is the complete rubbish. Most "Russians", including non-Jews, are educated and hardworking people. Considerable part of Israeli hi-tech workers and engineers were born in the former USSR or are their children. 

Dont take my words out of context. I notice you only select the paragraph about the Russians. My paragraph was quite disparaging about the Ethiopians bad behaviour as anyone can plainly see. I dont see how I was harsher on the Russians. It just makes me sick that they would form a neo-Nazi gang. You cannot paper over this fact. It was in the news worldwide and the whole world knows that these Russian 'Jews' formed a neo-Nazi gang. I saw the video of them kicking a Haredim in the head. I have seen footage of these neo-Nazi gangs attacking people in Russia and its no different from blacks and their gangs attacking people in the street. This is evil! So Natan Sharansky should condemn that bad behaviour first and foremost and im not sure he has. I may be wrong though?

With regards to the Russians in IT sector I was unaware of that, its great if they are making that contribution to Israel. Non-muslim nations need all the technical know-how possible to keep the quranimals at bay.

[Spectator]

Lastly, Natan Sharansky and his Russians can talk all they like. I saw a programme on TV recently where they showed Russian jews involved in lots of crime in Israel. Many Russians are in gangs and recently there was a neo-Nazi gang running around in Israel attacking Haredim and others. Many of the Russians arent even real Jews anyways as maybe their grandfather was a non-practicing Jew etc. Natan and the Russians hate the Ethiopians because they must compete with them for the welfare handouts.

You have a very primitive and biased opinion about Russian Jews in Israel.

Of course there are "Russian" criminals but the majority of criminals in Israel are native Israelis and Arabs.

It is true that 300.000 out of 1.100.000 "Russians" in Israel are not Jewish. This is the fault of Israeli leftist elite that wants to bring as many non-Jews from all over the world to "have more people in the army" and to challenge the higher birthrate of the religious Israeli Jews. I think the Law of Return is very bad for Israel and should be fixed in such a way that it won't threaten Jewish character of the State of Israel. You must learn to differentiate between Jews from Russia and ethinic Russians.

As for your statement about "Russians competing for welfare", it is the complete rubbish. Most "Russians", including non-Jews, are educated and hardworking people. Considerable part of Israeli hi-tech workers and engineers were born in the former USSR or are their children. 

Dont take my words out of context. I notice you only select the paragraph about the Russians. My paragraph was quite disparaging about the Ethiopians bad behaviour as anyone can plainly see. I dont see how I was harsher on the Russians. It just makes me sick that they would form a neo-Nazi gang. You cannot paper over this fact. It was in the news worldwide and the whole world knows that these Russian 'Jews' formed a neo-Nazi gang. I saw the video of them kicking a Haredim in the head. I have seen footage of these neo-Nazi gangs attacking people in Russia and its no different from blacks and their gangs attacking people in the street. This is evil! So Natan Sharansky should condemn that bad behaviour first and foremost and im not sure he has. I may be wrong though?

With regards to the Russians in IT sector I was unaware of that, its great if they are making that contribution to Israel. Non-muslim nations need all the technical know-how possible to keep the quranimals at bay.

I selected the only the paragraph about "Russians" because that's the point I disagree with you. You started talking about one group and automatically transferred some of its problems to another without thinking if this transition is correct. Also, you said that "Russians" are lazy people and "compete for welfare handouts" which is absolutely not true and is an insult to 1/7 of all Israeli Jews. I am Israeli Jew born in the former USSR, I am a sofware engineer and many my "Russian" friends work in this field too.

You say you are equally harsh on both Russians and Ethiopians. You should not be equally harsh, you should be objective. And to be objective you need to be competent in the field you are talking about.

That neo-Nazi gang was formed by ethnic Russians who have nothing to do with the Jews. If those people lived in Russia, they would beat and humiliate Jews there, as their comrades do. But they happened to grow in Israel, becuase Israeli leftist governments wanted to bring as many non-Jews to Israel as possible to undermine its Jewish character. Even Nazis are suitable for this.

Also, notice that the punishment these Nazis get is very mild. In fact, they all should be sentenced to long prison terms in harsh Russian-style conditions and then deported from Israel. There also should be a honest investigation of the Russian neo-Nazi activity in Israel (which is intentionally ignored by police) and all involved thrown out of Israel.
 
I don't think Sharansky has more obligation to condemn these bastards than any other Israeli politician. There is NOTHING in common between him and them but the fact they both speak Russian.

[Rightist2]

Lastly, Natan Sharansky and his Russians can talk all they like. I saw a programme on TV recently where they showed Russian jews involved in lots of crime in Israel. Many Russians are in gangs and recently there was a neo-Nazi gang running around in Israel attacking Haredim and others. Many of the Russians arent even real Jews anyways as maybe their grandfather was a non-practicing Jew etc. Natan and the Russians hate the Ethiopians because they must compete with them for the welfare handouts.

You have a very primitive and biased opinion about Russian Jews in Israel.

Of course there are "Russian" criminals but the majority of criminals in Israel are native Israelis and Arabs.

It is true that 300.000 out of 1.100.000 "Russians" in Israel are not Jewish. This is the fault of Israeli leftist elite that wants to bring as many non-Jews from all over the world to "have more people in the army" and to challenge the higher birthrate of the religious Israeli Jews. I think the Law of Return is very bad for Israel and should be fixed in such a way that it won't threaten Jewish character of the State of Israel. You must learn to differentiate between Jews from Russia and ethinic Russians.

As for your statement about "Russians competing for welfare", it is the complete rubbish. Most "Russians", including non-Jews, are educated and hardworking people. Considerable part of Israeli hi-tech workers and engineers were born in the former USSR or are their children. 

Dont take my words out of context. I notice you only select the paragraph about the Russians. My paragraph was quite disparaging about the Ethiopians bad behaviour as anyone can plainly see. I dont see how I was harsher on the Russians. It just makes me sick that they would form a neo-Nazi gang. You cannot paper over this fact. It was in the news worldwide and the whole world knows that these Russian 'Jews' formed a neo-Nazi gang. I saw the video of them kicking a Haredim in the head. I have seen footage of these neo-Nazi gangs attacking people in Russia and its no different from blacks and their gangs attacking people in the street. This is evil! So Natan Sharansky should condemn that bad behaviour first and foremost and im not sure he has. I may be wrong though?

With regards to the Russians in IT sector I was unaware of that, its great if they are making that contribution to Israel. Non-muslim nations need all the technical know-how possible to keep the quranimals at bay.

I selected the only the paragraph about "Russians" because that's the point I disagree with you. You started talking about one group and automatically transferred some of its problems to another without thinking if this transition is correct. Also, you said that "Russians" are lazy people and "compete for welfare handouts" which is absolutely not true and is an insult to 1/7 of all Israeli Jews. I am Israeli Jew born in the former USSR, I am a sofware engineer and many my "Russian" friends work in this field too.

You say you are equally harsh on both Russians and Ethiopians. You should not be equally harsh, you should be objective. And to be objective you need to be competent in the field you are talking about.

That neo-Nazi gang was formed by ethnic Russians who have nothing to do with the Jews. If those people lived in Russia, they would beat and humiliate Jews there, as their comrades do. But they happened to grow in Israel, becuase Israeli leftist governments wanted to bring as many non-Jews to Israel as possible to undermine its Jewish character. Even Nazis are suitable for this.

Also, notice that the punishment these Nazis get is very mild. In fact, they all should be sentenced to long prison terms in harsh Russian-style conditions and then deported from Israel. There also should be a honest investigation of the Russian neo-Nazi activity in Israel (which is intentionally ignored by police) and all involved thrown out of Israel.
 
I don't think Sharansky has more obligation to condemn these bastards than any other Israeli politician. There is NOTHING in common between him and them but the fact they both speak Russian.

Now your make far more sense. I agree with your points spectator.  Also its good to know you are in IT. Your skills are vital. Its nice to meet you. 

[Spectator]

Nice to meet you too

[Moshe92]

When did Chaim say that Rav Yosef is demented? I think galileerat is just making that up.

[IsraeliGovtAreKapos]

The Israeli government would even search for Osama Bin Laden in order to get more people to join IDF, like it did with wanna be Jews from USSR.

[galileerat]

If you want, I'll upload the audioclip, made c2001, with Yosef ben Meir.

When did Chaim say that Rav Yosef is demented? I think galileerat is just making that up.

[Moshe92]

If you want, I'll upload the audioclip, made c2001, with Yosef ben Meir.

When did Chaim say that Rav Yosef is demented? I think galileerat is just making that up.

OK. I would like to hear what he said in context. Maybe what he said made sense in context. Anyway, Chaim says now that we should disagree with Rav Yosef respectfully.

[galileerat]

Here's the downloadable audioclip of Chaim berating Shas and Ovadia Yosef http://www.webfilehost.com/?mode=viewupload&id=4161616

On it Chaim says:

"There's something that's just is so evil: Shas! That unbelievably evil party in Israel. The head of Shas, Ovadia Yosef, whose real name is Ovadiya Kesef, which means 'Ovadia Money', this degenerate who's the spiritual leader of Shas, he speaks bububububu! You can't understand a word he's saying, and I'm a fluent Hebrew speaker. He mumbles like a moron, he's completely insane, he's senile, he's insane, he goes rambling off and they say 'Oh! the profound words of our leader!'"

[muman613]

The man is a Torah scholar, recognized by many of todays Gedolim. It is true that his understanding has modified over time I think it is wrong to condemn him because his halachic knowledge exceeds every one of us here...

I don't want to re-ignite this argument but it is wrong to speak such negativity against a recognized gedolim of Klal Yisroel. His recognition as a Torah sage is across the Jewish spectrum, from Ashkenazim, to Sefaradim, to Chassidim. I will say that he has made some questionable decisions but I will not join in lashon hara...

PS: Here is a halachic discussion which involves decisions of Rav Yosef...

http://www.yutorah.org/lectures/lecture.cfm/735842/Rabbi_Chaim_Jachter/Restaurants_Serving_Meat_During_the_Nine_Days

[Moshe92]

The man is a Torah scholar, recognized by many of todays Gedolim. It is true that his understanding has modified over time I think it is wrong to condemn him because his halachic knowledge exceeds every one of us here...

I don't want to re-ignite this argument but it is wrong to speak such negativity against a recognized gedolim of Klal Yisroel. His recognition as a Torah sage is across the Jewish spectrum, from Ashkenazim, to Sefaradim, to Chassidim. I will say that he has made some questionable decisions but I will not join in lashon hara...

PS: Here is a halachic discussion which involves decisions of Rav Yosef...

http://www.yutorah.org/lectures/lecture.cfm/735842/Rabbi_Chaim_Jachter/Restaurants_Serving_Meat_During_the_Nine_Days

It's fine to respectfully disagree with some of what he says, but we definitely shouldn't insult him since he is a gadol.

[galileerat]

"Before the Moshiach, most rabbis will be of the Erev Rav" (Divrei Chayim".

Shame to tell, but if R.Yosef had ordered Shas (then headed by Aryeh Deri) not to have been part of the government, Oslo and all its sequellae would never have happened.

R.Ovadiya Yosef's ruling, together with that of R.Shach's, that giving up parts of Israel to the Arabs in exchange for "peace" is Halachically permitted, is so antithetical to Kahanism, that Chaim's comments are understandable!

Yosef opposed the 2005 Hitnatkut, but only because he wasn't needed in the government. If Shas had been, they also would not have made a fuss, just like UTJ didn't.

The Haredi politicians are driven by the desire for getting government money, not for themselves, but for their mosdos and  institutions.

The 10,000 knitted kipot Jews in Gaza, just like the 300,000 knitted kipot Jews on the West Bank are viewed as not being part of their camp and not Haredim, and are thus expendable: they just don't count or figure.

But now that there is an increasing number of Haredim living over the "Green Line", their policy may have to change. Though if enough billlions of shekels are put their way, they can yet be bought.

 

[Spectator]

Here's the downloadable audioclip of Chaim berating Shas and Ovadia Yosef http://www.webfilehost.com/?mode=viewupload&id=4161616

On it Chaim says:

"There's something that's just is so evil: Shas! That unbelievably evil party in Israel. The head of Shas, Ovadia Yosef, whose real name is Ovadiya Kesef, which means 'Ovadia Money', this degenerate who's the spiritual leader of Shas, he speaks bububububu! You can't understand a word he's saying, and I'm a fluent Hebrew speaker. He mumbles like a moron, he's completely insane, he's senile, he's insane, he goes rambling off and they say 'Oh! the profound words of our leader!'"

I don't think it's Chaim speaking. The voice in the clip sounds different. That's a fraud, as you always do.
You are here to sow strife.

[Spectator]

The 10,000 knitted kipot Jews in Gaza, just like the 300,000 knitted kipot Jews on the West Bank are viewed as not being part of their camp and not Haredim, and are thus expendable: they just don't count or figure.
 

Nonsense. 100.000 out of 300.000 Jews in Judea and Samaria are Haredim.

And why do you call Judea and Samaria "West Bank"? True Israeli patriots will never use the newspeak terms invented by our enemies.

[galileerat]

If you think that's not Chaim's voice, you should make an appointment to see an audiometrist.

Here's the whole clip including Yosef ben Meir's interjections:
http://www.webfilehost.com/?mode=viewupload&id=7600268

I don't think it's Chaim speaking. The voice in the clip sounds different.

[galileerat]

One thing we will never call them is "shtachim" or "The Territories".

Was the term "West Bank" invented by our enemies? A river has an east and a west bank: שתי גדות לירדן זו שלנו זו גם כן  - "Both sides of the Jordan belong to us" (Beitar song).

So what do you call the East Bank in parlance with Anglos: "Ever haYarden"? "Soon-to-be-liberated-so-called Jordan"?  "Reuven, Gad and Manashe"?!

And why do you call Judea and Samaria "West Bank"? True Israeli patriots will never use the newspeak terms invented by our enemies.

[Spectator]

One thing we will never call them is "shtachim" or "The Territories".

Was the term "West Bank" invented by our enemies? A river has an east and a west bank: שתי גדות לירדן זו שלנו זו גם כן  - "Both sides of the Jordan belong to us" (Beitar song).

So what do you call the East Bank in parlance with Anglos: "Ever haYarden"? "Soon-to-be-liberated-so-called Jordan"?  "Reuven, Gad and Manashe"?!

And why do you call Judea and Samaria "West Bank"? True Israeli patriots will never use the newspeak terms invented by our enemies.

Stop the demagogy. When you said "West Bank", you didn't mention all of the Western Land of Israel.

You applied the term "West Bank" to Judea and Samaria only, just like our enemies do. And that's at the time when our enemies want to expel the Jews from this crucial region. What a shame!