Torah and Jewish Idea > Torah and Jewish Idea
Who is a Jew? - Some insight from Rebbetzen Chana Bracha Siegelbaum
Kahane-Was-Right BT:
Also interesting to note that Yiddish developed from multiple dialects of German several hundred years before the advent of 'standard German'.... So there will be differences and nuances involved, but still every linguist knows that yiddish is a Germanic language (even moreso than English, and nobody argues that English is not!), so khazar theories/fantasies need not intrude on the facts and distort science.
Kahane-Was-Right BT:
--- Quote from: Zelhar on August 13, 2009, 04:19:39 AM ---
--- Quote from: Dúnadan on August 12, 2009, 05:43:09 PM ---I don't have time to all of this, I never said Koestler proved it with genes. Answer me please, how's that Kostler literally means "The Khazar" and still is not descended from Khazars?
And you change what I said with the quotes. Quote the entire thing, you're confusing people.
And I never said that there weren't Jews in Europe before the Khazar kingdom, period.
--- End quote ---
Jews didn't have family name in the European fashion until, I think, the 18th century. When they did took family names, they were mostly German, Polish, and Russian names (or Hebrew names that were germanized etc.). I don't know how Kostler means Khazar, I think the word for Khazar is... Khazar. But anyway even if it is, this is a name which was given hundreds of years after there were Khazars. And as you can see for yourself Jewish family names have nothing to do with Khazars.
--- End quote ---
That is a good point, and very obvious one that I am surprised I missed. What a house of cards this guy has. I would like to know in what language exactly does kostler mean khazar. Certainly not in khazarian lol. But either way you are right, last names are an anachronism when it comes to studying cultural history and the history of the Jews. A very recent occurrance.
Ze'ev:
Khazaria will rise again!!!
YAAARGH!!! :laugh:
EagleEye:
Ashkenazi Jews are part Jewish, part European. Dunadan is exaggerating. If you look at the Y chromosome, it is Jewish. There is no doubt. The founding male ancestry of Ashkenazi Jewry is Jewish. BTW the Caucasoid race is not purely a European affair. Jews "look White" because Caucasian genetics exist outside of Europe.
But if you look at the MtDNA, many people argue that it may be European. This means that many of the founding mothers of Ashkenazi populations were not born Jewish but converted.
If you believe that these founding mothers converted under Orthodox Judiasm, they are as Jewish as Moses. Judaism isn't supposed to be racist.
EagleEye:
Another thing, at one point in history, it was the father, not the mother, who determined who was a Jew. For karaite Jews, they still go by the father. It's not accurate to say that Judaism was always transmitted by the mother. At one point in history, it was the father. Then the law changed. Orthodox and Conservative Jews go with the new law, and "reform Jews" (atheists really) go by either.
The law of return doesn't consider you a Jew if your father is a Jew. It allows you to return to Israel. But it still considers you a Gentile. You live as a Gentile among Jews. But you can convert if you really want to.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version