Why do Christians care about Jews?

[AsheDina]

From what I understand:
Born-again believers, in particular, believe they are grafted into the promises of G-d, and G-d can take that promise away, considering they are not the original root, but are being supported by it: Jewish people.

Anyway, here we go again, Christians dont get enough hatred from the Bolsheviks, but, now here is this thread.

Rabbi Kahane was LOVED and adored by Gentiles, even more than Jews, the same for David Ben Moshe and Chaim Ben Pesach, So, OBVIOUSLY they LOVE them, so- wtf is the deal here??

[✡ Hindu Zionist ॐ]

as a hindu, i have more affinity towards Judaism than Christianity. Of whatever i have seen of christianity in India, it hurt me. And i see how the same evangelists operate in Israel too, some even work to marry among jews.. to convert innocent jewish women. It is very easy to talk about Judeo-Christian unity, but this can go against the jewish people... A Jew needs to be a Jew and not Judeo-Chrisitan propogater. I'm sorry if my understanding is wrong?

Of whatever i know of the Jewish people in India. They have been deeply nationalists,great patriots, hard working.. and facing the same threat of what Hindus face. Indian Jews have retained their Indian-Sanskrit name. But Muslims and Christians in India have even changed to arabic or roman names. I have witness Indian Jews saying that Israel is their Fatherland, and India is their Motherland. Muslims do not belive in father-motherlands. While Indian Christians would prefer loving Mother Mary over our Mother Land. So much so for nationalism.

Yes as a Hindu,we shall work with the Jews in whatever way we can co-operate.

It does not matter if Jews condemn idol worshipping. Sikhs condemn idol worshipping too. But we have lived with love and respect with the Sikhs for centuries.

[Spectator]

as a hindu, i have more affinity towards Judaism than Christianity. Of whatever i have seen of christianity in India, it hurt me. And i see how the same evangelists operate in Israel too, some even work to marry among jews.. to convert innocent jewish women. It is very easy to talk about Judeo-Christian unity, but this can go against the jewish people... A Jew needs to be a Jew and not Judeo-Chrisitan propogater. I'm sorry if my understanding is wrong?

This is absolutely true. But the point is that OUR Christian members don't try to convert any Jew directly or indirectly. If so, there is no need to remind them that some of their co-believers do that. They shouldn't not feel suspected all the time.  They are our friends.

[Masha]

Well the wedge is toxic and in my opinion it has already taken its Toll. The guest numbers have not been that great and many of our gentile membership have had all they can take and have moved on. What is the point of animosity like this.

Well, I agree with you. There is a couple of Jewish members (I am not naming names) that have been making this forum inhospitable to Gentiles by their divisive posts and opinions.

By the way, closing this form for Shabbat (which didn't use to be the policy) doesn't help to make the atmosphere friendly and conducive to a Gentile-Jewish cooperation. This forum is ostensibly for Jews AND Gentiles. Gentiles are specifically not supposed to observe the Shabbat. There is no reason to close the forum so that half of the forum does not have a place to meet.

I have a strong belief that future victory can only be gained through building bridges between righteous Jews and Gentiles.

[Madmarv]

Well the wedge is toxic and in my opinion it has already taken its Toll. The guest numbers have not been that great and many of our gentile membership have had all they can take and have moved on. What is the point of animosity like this.

Well, I agree with you. There is a couple of Jewish members (I am not naming names) that have been making this forum inhospitable to Gentiles by their divisive posts and opinions.

By the way, closing this form for Shabbat (which didn't use to be the policy) doesn't help to make the atmosphere friendly and conducive to a Gentile-Jewish cooperation. This forum is ostensibly for Jews AND Gentiles. Gentiles are specifically not supposed to observe the Shabbat. There is no reason to close the forum so that half of the forum does not have a place to meet.

I have a strong belief that future victory can only be gained through building bridges between righteous Jews and Gentiles.

I agree on that, specially the last part.

[mord]

I agree also

[angryChineseKahanist]

Also, there are churches that have "Zion Fellowships".

[The One and Only Mo]

WHY THE HELL WOLD I TRY TO DO SOMETHING BAD?

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

I don't believe non-jews can be zionists (no offense to anyone) because this means that they believe that G-d have given Israel to the jews, and made it their homeland

Why can't a non-Jew believe that?     Is that not in the Bible?

[The One and Only Mo]

I think I have a right to know why Christians support a Jewish movement, and most of you answered my question. I thought I could ask ANY question on this forum and some of you proved yourselves too sensitive to answer an innocent, yet very important question. On top of that, you are accusing me of creating a "toxic" environment. Excuse me? Just because I want to know Christian motives for supporting JTF, all of a sudden, I'm a villain? How is it that I got some very nice answers which helped me learn more, and some other people answer me by accusing me of doing bad? One of the reasons I joined this forum was to learn, and I don't see how my question was anything more than educational, albeit for my own sake. I guess from now on I have to be more careful with what I ask because I'll always have to be afraid of offending somebody.

[Zelhar]

I don't understand why a non-Christian should tell Christians what their faith is or is not about.

[Spectator]

I guess from now on I have to be more careful with what I ask because I'll always have to be afraid of offending somebody.

We must always be careful with our words. We should think what to ask and how to ask. This is especially true for the international forum where people have different backgrounds and what is innoncent for the one can be offensive to the other.

[cjd]

Well the wedge is toxic and in my opinion it has already taken its Toll. The guest numbers have not been that great and many of our gentile membership have had all they can take and have moved on. What is the point of animosity like this.

Well, I agree with you. There is a couple of Jewish members (I am not naming names) that have been making this forum inhospitable to Gentiles by their divisive posts and opinions.

By the way, closing this form for Shabbat (which didn't use to be the policy) doesn't help to make the atmosphere friendly and conducive to a Gentile-Jewish cooperation. This forum is ostensibly for Jews AND Gentiles. Gentiles are specifically not supposed to observe the Shabbat. There is no reason to close the forum so that half of the forum does not have a place to meet.

I have a strong belief that future victory can only be gained through building bridges between righteous Jews and Gentiles.

Well ,yes the forum did remain open on Shabbat for the first year or so. I have always felt it is a mistake to completely shut the forum down during that time. However out of  respect to Chaim and our Jewish members that wish to see it closed I never said much about it. People should at least be able to read the forum if not post. The fact the the forum disappears on the two days that people for the most part can stay up late and spend time on the forum has cost us countless support. I also agree with the last sentence of your post. The way I see it its the only way anything can be accomplished. 

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

I think I have a right to know why Christians support a Jewish movement, and most of you answered my question. I thought I could ask ANY question on this forum and some of you proved yourselves too sensitive to answer an innocent, yet very important question. On top of that, you are accusing me of creating a "toxic" environment. Excuse me? Just because I want to know Christian motives for supporting JTF, all of a sudden, I'm a villain? How is it that I got some very nice answers which helped me learn more, and some other people answer me by accusing me of doing bad? One of the reasons I joined this forum was to learn, and I don't see how my question was anything more than educational, albeit for my own sake. I guess from now on I have to be more careful with what I ask because I'll always have to be afraid of offending somebody.

This is my impression, but I think the problem they are concerned about was less in your question and more in a response or two that you got.   For some reason there are certain people on the forum who seemingly act in an opportunist manner and always find ways to stress the religious differences between Judaism and Christianity (or at least one way of viewing Christianity, since you can't really present all its various viewpoints in one shot), whenever possible, in a let's say "not so positive" way.   And this was seen as one of those opportunities for whatever reason.    When the fact is, we all already know the differences (at least in general), and none of us is trying to blur those lines here.   So it is divisive when people go on the offensive like that.   Also there is a defensive posture in some response, along the lines of "you better not proselityze us" which many probably find insulting because everyone here already knows this org. does not allow proselytizing, and people here aren't interested in doing that in the first place.  

So I believe you when you say you were asking an honest question, and honestly I do not blame you, just because some people may take the opportunity to start antagonizing.    You can't control what other people write, and you can't censor yourself because someone 'might' hijack the thread.    

That being said, it is good to be careful about how you word things so as to unite people rather than drive people apart.

[~Hanna~]

I love G-d and G-d's people.  The G-d of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

I didn't have a problem with Mo's question. One or two responses bothered me.

[muman613]

If anyone is trying to infer that I spoke something which is not true then I must protest. Also what I wrote was in direct response to someones post who said that the NT and Christianity is completely compatible with Jewish Torah {which it is obviously not}...

We cannot pretend things which are not true. Scripture has clearly stated that the Jewish people will be elevated when we have complete faith and trust in Hashem, not when we accept help from the nations... It is VERY IMPORTANT that JTF remain closed in deference to Shabbat because it demonstrates the importance for a Jew to observe the Shabbat. Maybe a forum for non-Jews should be set up for their pro-Zionist movement. I think if we are the JEWISH TASK FORCE we should act Jewish. This is the only way I believe we will triumph in the end.

[muman613]

Here is the original post I made in this thread which appears people are upset about:


http://jtf.org/forum_english/index.php/topic,37845.msg380854.html#msg380854

Obviously I was stating the differences when someone had made a statement that there are no differences...

PS: If there were no differences why should a Jew be Jewish? Obviously our martyrs who died in the Inquisition died for a good reason..

I also have known Christians who openly say that Jews are going to Hell for not believing in their Diety... I have never said a Christian is going to suffer for not being Jewish... I find that whole theology very difficult to comprehend..

[cjd]

I didn't have a problem with Mo's question. One or two responses bothered me.

It's the instructor thats the problem not the student. Think about it!!

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

If anyone is trying to infer that I spoke something which is not true then I must protest. Also what I wrote was in direct response to someones post who said that the NT and Christianity is completely compatible with Jewish Torah {which it is obviously not}...

We cannot pretend things which are not true. Scripture has clearly stated that the Jewish people will be elevated when we have complete faith and trust in Hashem, not when we accept help from the nations... It is VERY IMPORTANT that JTF remain closed in deference to Shabbat because it demonstrates the importance for a Jew to observe the Shabbat. Maybe a forum for non-Jews should be set up for their pro-Zionist movement. I think if we are the JEWISH TASK FORCE we should act Jewish. This is the only way I believe we will triumph in the end.

*sigh* Here we go again, Muman. Again with this divisiveness.

Obviously Christians DO believe that the NT is compatible with Torah if we are biblical Zionists. I had every right to explain why I am a Zionist in response to the OP question.

Is it that hard for you to just leave things alone?

[muman613]

If anyone is trying to infer that I spoke something which is not true then I must protest. Also what I wrote was in direct response to someones post who said that the NT and Christianity is completely compatible with Jewish Torah {which it is obviously not}...

We cannot pretend things which are not true. Scripture has clearly stated that the Jewish people will be elevated when we have complete faith and trust in Hashem, not when we accept help from the nations... It is VERY IMPORTANT that JTF remain closed in deference to Shabbat because it demonstrates the importance for a Jew to observe the Shabbat. Maybe a forum for non-Jews should be set up for their pro-Zionist movement. I think if we are the JEWISH TASK FORCE we should act Jewish. This is the only way I believe we will triumph in the end.

*sigh* Here we go again, Muman. Again with this divisiveness.

Obviously Christians DO believe that the NT is compatible with Torah if we are biblical Zionists. I had every right to explain why I am a Zionist in response to the OP question.

Is it that hard for you to just leave things alone?

Ok... I am leaving it alone... I believe that Mo did not realize what he was doing and there should not be any bad feelings for him. I also am not trying to be divisive.

Please try to understand my position from the Jewish perspective..

[Rubystars]

When the fact is, we all already know the differences (at least in general), and none of us is trying to blur those lines here.   So it is divisive when people go on the offensive like that.   Also there is a defensive posture in some response, along the lines of "you better not proselityze us" which many probably find insulting because everyone here already knows this org. does not allow proselytizing, and people here aren't interested in doing that in the first place.  

You're a genius! I couldn't have said it better myself.

To answer the original question, I can only tell you how I feel about it. I believe the Bible when it says that we should bless Israel. I think the Jews do have promises that are made to them by God that were never nullified. I think it's important to acknowledge that curses will fall upon those who curse Israel and respond accordingly.

It makes me sad that Mo was implying he basically doesn't care what happens to Christians. Christians are being murdered and dying in various places in the world due to persecutions, and for him to have no empathy with that really does irritate me. That's what I got out of his post that said he would never join a movement to help non-Jews.

However, I'm not here to convert you to anything, I'm not here for selfish reasons. I believe Israel belongs to the Jewish people, and I admire the Jewish nation even though it is not my own nation. JTF will always focus primarily on Jewish needs and Jewish causes. I am not here primarily to help the USA or Gentiles in any fashion. I'm here to help Jewish people in Israel.

I want the Jewish settlers to win!

[Lisa]

It makes me sad that Mo was implying he basically doesn't care what happens to Christians. Christians are being murdered and dying in various places in the world due to persecutions, and for him to have no empathy with that really does irritate me. That's what I got out of his post that said he would never join a movement to help non-Jews.

I don't think Mo2388 meant to say that he doesn't care about bad things happening to Christians. 

[nessuno]

It makes me sad that Mo was implying he basically doesn't care what happens to Christians. Christians are being murdered and dying in various places in the world due to persecutions, and for him to have no empathy with that really does irritate me. That's what I got out of his post that said he would never join a movement to help non-Jews.

I don't think Mo2388 meant to say that he doesn't care about bad things happening to Christians. 

Yes, Lisa.  My issue with Mo and Muman goes to the fact that they have problem with the Christian members on this forum, most who have been here way before they arrived.  They can't deny what is quite obvious by the patterns in their posts.  I will never believe that Mo was just asking an innocent question and we all know that Muman has big issues with Christianity( and the fact that Christian live and breathe).

[muman613]

It makes me sad that Mo was implying he basically doesn't care what happens to Christians. Christians are being murdered and dying in various places in the world due to persecutions, and for him to have no empathy with that really does irritate me. That's what I got out of his post that said he would never join a movement to help non-Jews.

I don't think Mo2388 meant to say that he doesn't care about bad things happening to Christians. 

Yes, Lisa.  My issue with Mo and Muman goes to the fact that they have problem with the Christian members on this forum, most who have been here way before they arrived.  They can't deny what is quite obvious by the patterns in their posts.  I will never believe that Mo was just asking an innocent question and we all know that Muman has big issues with Christianity( and the fact that Christian live and breathe).

Bullcat,

This is entirely uncalled for... I did nothing to attack you, nor your religion. Are you serious in your accusation? This is certainly not true and you are blowing what I have said entirely out of proportion.

I said "Don't expect us to believe this stuff"... What is wrong with that? I also pointed out the areas where there are differences.

Your anger is misplaced. I help both Jews and Gentiles with my charity. I work with and respect many non-Jews... Do not make such accusations against me.