Germany delivers 2 new excellent submarines to Israel

[Madmarv]

Not sure, the donations Germany contributes to Israel as a sympathy for the holocaust ... I heard its an annual contribution but not sure.

[Zelhar]

Nothing is free. There is something fishy or missing in this artical. Be wary

Germany donates to Israel a huge amount of money every year. Wouldn't surprise me to see them donating a submarine, or 2.

Do you mean the donations to "Peace Now" et. al ? Cause I am not aware of any other huge or modest donations coming from Germany.

He might mean foreign aid

Ditto, there is no foreign aid from Germany.

[Hyades]

Nothing is free. There is something fishy or missing in this artical. Be wary

Germany donates to Israel a huge amount of money every year. Wouldn't surprise me to see them donating a submarine, or 2.

Do you mean the donations to "Peace Now" et. al ? Cause I am not aware of any other huge or modest donations coming from Germany.

He might mean foreign aid

Ditto, there is no foreign aid from Germany.

OH YES! Israel is the main recepient of foreign aid from Germany! They get more than India or any African country. This is very much criticized by German leftist who call it "subvention of the imperialist war machinery"... Some of the aid is contributed also by goods such as military equipment etc...

[Zelhar]

Nothing is free. There is something fishy or missing in this artical. Be wary

Germany donates to Israel a huge amount of money every year. Wouldn't surprise me to see them donating a submarine, or 2.

Do you mean the donations to "Peace Now" et. al ? Cause I am not aware of any other huge or modest donations coming from Germany.

He might mean foreign aid

Ditto, there is no foreign aid from Germany.

OH YES! Israel is the main recepient of foreign aid from Germany! They get more than India or any African country. This is very much criticized by German leftist who call it "subvention of the imperialist war machinery"... Some of the aid is contributed also by goods such as military equipment etc...

Since you are so adamant, can you prove it ? Because Other than the Subs, I am not aware of any significant foreign aid, unless you call restitution payments to Nazi victims foreign aid.

[Cato]

Nothing is free. There is something fishy or missing in this artical. Be wary

Germany donates to Israel a huge amount of money every year. Wouldn't surprise me to see them donating a submarine, or 2.

Do you mean the donations to "Peace Now" et. al ? Cause I am not aware of any other huge or modest donations coming from Germany.

He might mean foreign aid

Ditto, there is no foreign aid from Germany.

OH YES! Israel is the main recepient of foreign aid from Germany! They get more than India or any African country. This is very much criticized by German leftist who call it "subvention of the imperialist war machinery"... Some of the aid is contributed also by goods such as military equipment etc...

Since you are so adamant, can you prove it ? Because Other than the Subs, I am not aware of any significant foreign aid, unless you call restitution payments to Nazi victims foreign aid.

I believe that the recent Tsunami was the first time India ever accepted foreign aid, so getting more aid than India is no big deal.

[Hyades]

Nothing is free. There is something fishy or missing in this artical. Be wary

Germany donates to Israel a huge amount of money every year. Wouldn't surprise me to see them donating a submarine, or 2.

Do you mean the donations to "Peace Now" et. al ? Cause I am not aware of any other huge or modest donations coming from Germany.

He might mean foreign aid

Ditto, there is no foreign aid from Germany.

OH YES! Israel is the main recepient of foreign aid from Germany! They get more than India or any African country. This is very much criticized by German leftist who call it "subvention of the imperialist war machinery"... Some of the aid is contributed also by goods such as military equipment etc...

Since you are so adamant, can you prove it ? Because Other than the Subs, I am not aware of any significant foreign aid, unless you call restitution payments to Nazi victims foreign aid.

I believe that the recent Tsunami was the first time India ever accepted foreign aid, so getting more aid than India is no big deal.

No big deal? India receives 64 million € each year as economic aid for decades now! This is no big deal for a country the size and population of India. But If you consider Israel getting more than that, so it IS a big deal!
This article btw. is about Merkel willing to suspend payments for India since it holds nuclear weapons. And because it grows at 10% per year... Aid for Pakistan has already been suspended and there is only aid payments from private institutions of the churches...
http://www.bz-berlin.de/archiv/streicht-merkel-indien-die-entwicklungshilfe-article185106.html

[Zelhar]

Nothing is free. There is something fishy or missing in this artical. Be wary

Germany donates to Israel a huge amount of money every year. Wouldn't surprise me to see them donating a submarine, or 2.

Do you mean the donations to "Peace Now" et. al ? Cause I am not aware of any other huge or modest donations coming from Germany.

He might mean foreign aid

Ditto, there is no foreign aid from Germany.

OH YES! Israel is the main recepient of foreign aid from Germany! They get more than India or any African country. This is very much criticized by German leftist who call it "subvention of the imperialist war machinery"... Some of the aid is contributed also by goods such as military equipment etc...

Since you are so adamant, can you prove it ? Because Other than the Subs, I am not aware of any significant foreign aid, unless you call restitution payments to Nazi victims foreign aid.

I believe that the recent Tsunami was the first time India ever accepted foreign aid, so getting more aid than India is no big deal.

No big deal? India receives 64 million € each year as economic aid for decades now! This is no big deal for a country the size and population of India. But If you consider Israel getting more than that, so it IS a big deal!
This article btw. is about Merkel willing to suspend payments for India since it holds nuclear weapons. And because it grows at 10% per year... Aid for Pakistan has already been suspended and there is only aid payments from private institutions of the churches...
http://www.bz-berlin.de/archiv/streicht-merkel-indien-die-entwicklungshilfe-article185106.html

I am still waiting for a figure regarding Israel...

BTW, the Israeli budget is over $90 billion.

[Hyades]

Just google and you will find SEVERAL articles about Israel getting military aid for free (or at least half of it). This has become common practice.
The only country apart from Israel to have this privilege is Turkey. But Turkey is a NATO member, so it is normal that they get such a support.
Not to mention the almost 5 billion US aid. As far as I know, the German aid for Israel is somewhat around 300 million Dollars per year.

[Zelhar]

Just google and you will find SEVERAL articles about Israel getting military aid for free (or at least half of it). This has become common practice.
The only country apart from Israel to have this privilege is Turkey. But Turkey is a NATO member, so it is normal that they get such a support.
Not to mention the almost 5 billion US aid. As far as I know, the German aid for Israel is somewhat around 300 million Dollars per year.

‎The US aid is more like 2.7-3 billion, It used to be greater though. I googled "German foreign aid Israel" and couldn't find much detail. But I am sure I would have read allot more about this issue had there been such a significant aid. The only major contribution I am aware of is the U-boats deal. Not to sound ungrateful, this deal is also a German self subsidizing of its own industry since over 90% or the funding is directed to German industry, plus the additional Israeli money for the 11/6 Uboats it pays for with her own money, and also giving this product its credibility.

Bottom line is 19/6 Uboats over 17 years amounts to far less than 300 million per year.

[Hyades]

Plus contributions to the Israeli retirement system, plus tanks, anti-rocket shields, installations for nuclear missiles launch ( I think that was the most controversal discussion here in Germany, since - and I think it is right - most people think there is NO country in the world which should be supported developing or launching nuclear weapons)...
In one year alone (2005) Germany delivered two boats to Israel which were at a price of 500 milion Dollars each, of which Germany paid 330 million, the rest was paid by Israelis and US loans.

[mord]

ISRAELI TROPHY ANTI TANK MISSLE SHIELD             http://www.defense-update.com/products/t/trophy.htm

[Hyades]

It is incredible that Israel delvers weapons to Turkey. Turkeys army allies more and more with Syria. I do not trust them!

[mord]

It is incredible that Israel delvers weapons to Turkey. Turkeys army allies more and more with Syria. I do not trust them!

I AGREE 100%

[Zelhar]

Plus contributions to the Israeli retirement system, plus tanks, anti-rocket shields, installations for nuclear missiles launch ( I think that was the most controversal discussion here in Germany, since - and I think it is right - most people think there is NO country in the world which should be supported developing or launching nuclear weapons)...
In one year alone (2005) Germany delivered two boats to Israel which were at a price of 500 milion Dollars each, of which Germany paid 330 million, the rest was paid by Israelis and US loans.

‎The retirement system (which BTW Israeli who joined it had to pay the dues) was part of the war reparations agreement.

Germany's MTU supplies tank engines to the Israeli Merkava tank at full price. Earlier this decade the Shröder's government withheld an already sign agreement because Israel launched the "protective shield" operation.

Regarding anti rocket shields- I believe Germany loaned a patriot missile battery during the Iraq war, is that what you mean ? Big deal indeed. 

"installations for nuclear missiles launch" I suppose You mean modifying the Uboats with additional 622mm launch tubes, well that's part of the Sub's deal.

The subs deal was signed in 2005 and the two subs are going to be delivered by 2010, so that's 330million over 4-5 years or a one time payment, 100% of which is reinvested in German economy.

[Hyades]

Okay, stay in your "they are all our enemies" understanding of everything and slap your friends in the face! The number of countries actually delivering weapons to Israel is minimal - whether paid or not! If in your understanding they are all your enemies, so why aren't you happy with Germany and other European countries becoming more Muslim. That wouldn't change anything then for Israel or the Jews. So you should perhaps support islamization of Europe!

[Zelhar]

Don't put words in my mouth ! I want to do business with countries and not to be regarded as a charity case.

[Hyades]

Don't put words in my mouth ! I want to do business with countries and not to be regarded as a charity case.

No one sees or would ever see Israel as a charity case!!!  Israel's doing a fantastic job in research and technology (although I think they share their technology with the wrong people like Turkey). And if Germany gives a firend's bonus, it has several reasons: Israel is the only democracy and partner in the ME. It surely has to be supported by any means. And Israel using German technology is for many countries a reference of quality. As everyone knows, Israel just has AAA technology in it's army for safety reasons. So it is also a good advertising. Since the US do often buy products that are found as good by Israel...

[Manch]

No one sees or would ever see Israel as a charity case!!!  Israel's doing a fantastic job in research and technology (although I think they share their technology with the wrong people like Turkey). And if Germany gives a firend's bonus, it has several reasons: Israel is the only democracy and partner in the ME. It surely has to be supported by any means. And Israel using German technology is for many countries a reference of quality. As everyone knows, Israel just has AAA technology in it's army for safety reasons. So it is also a good advertising. Since the US do often buy products that are found as good by Israel...

Hyades,
You are making excellent points! Here are my two cents on this matter:
1) Germany is the best partner Israel has in Europe, perhaps even better than US.
2) Israel is the best partner and friend for Germany in the ME, it actually saves not only Germany but the whole Western World by fighting, basically alone, against muslime hordes. Europeans, of course, have not recognized it yet. Any help to Israel is akin to Lend Lease offered by US to Allies.
3) Germany will never become a muslime country, no matter how hysterical we, on the right, are crying about it. G-d forbid from this nightmare!
4) Germany has a moral obligation to support Israel in order to prevent another Holocaust
5) German/Israel trade should be mutually beneficial - Germany should and does benefit just as much from economic and military cooperation with Israel.
6) Israel is fully capable to free its economy from foreign donations. If Germany does subsidize Israel at its own expense and against its own financial and political interests, I truly believe that this would actually hurt Israel. I do believe, however, that there is a great deal of its own industry subsidization going on when a German taxpayer pays for construction of subs by qualified German builders on German shipyards. It so often done in the business under various "pretenses" - subsidized agriculture, discounts, dealer pricing, "2 for one" sale, etc, etc. Car dealers do it very often as they make most of their money on service, not on selling new cars.
7) Most importantly, although completely missed by non-religious people, modern Germany will be blessed by G-d for doing its part in helping Israel to sustain muslime onslaught. Who knows,  perhaps German salvation from muslime scare lies in Jerusalem more than it does in Berlin?

[Christian Zionist]

Esther 4:14

   For if you(America) remain silent at this time, relief and deliverance for the Jews will arise from another place(Germany), but you and your father's family will perish. And who knows but that you have come to royal position for such a time as this?"

It seems the Germans have realized and repented from the evil things they had done to the Jews during holocaust.  France and Britain are not supplying military hardware to Israel anymore.   

Germany also absorbed thousands of Russian Jews and most of them have better living conditions now.

Germany would be the last country that would become muslim out of all European countries. 

Hopefully Israel uses them against the Iranians.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/israel/sub.htm

[wonga66]

Grossadmiral Karl Doenitz was the Nazi submarine supremo - a submarine force that sank 3000 Allied ships in WW2, and was Fuhrer of the Third Reich for one week after Hitler shot himself. Doenitz must be turning over on his roasting spit in Gehennom that his beloved Fatherland is giving away free U-Boats to of all people .....Der Juden!

[Hyades]

^^ He kills himself over and over again in hell! 

[Manch]

Grossadmiral Karl Doenitz was the Nazi submarine supremo - a submarine force that sank 3000 Allied ships in WW2, and was Fuhrer of the Third Reich for one week after Hitler shot himself. Doenitz must be turning over on his roasting spit in Gehennom that his beloved Fatherland is giving away free U-Boats to of all people .....Der Juden!

I disagree with part of your message. Garbage like sHitler and Doenitz would hate the Germany of today - it stands for everything they hated so much. The fact that it cooperates and helps Israel would be just another factor that these nazi vermin would despise.

Here is another fact that would make nazis turn in their graves - Nazi-descended Jews living in Israel.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/aug/06/judaism.secondworldwar

[✡ Hindu Zionist ॐ]

israel is self-capable of manufacturing its own submarines. Neither can german military technology beat israeli military technology.

Germany is neither pro-zionist nor anti-muslim. They are only for themself, always have been.

http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=107258&sectionid=3510210
Germany happy to accept Iranian favor.

nothing good can be expected from selfishness.

[Manch]

nothing good can be expected from selfishness.

These is a great wisdom! With all due respect, I do not agree, however, that Israel can or should build its own battle ships (including subs.) It is a small country and has to choose carefully where and how it engages its resources. Israel military is 100% to source such expensive platforms as subs to existing world leaders - Germany, France, US, Russia, Netherlands, etc.

[White Israelite]

nothing good can be expected from selfishness.

These is a great wisdom! With all due respect, I do not agree, however, that Israel can or should build its own battle ships (including subs.) It is a small country and has to choose carefully where and how it engages its resources. Israel military is 100% to source such expensive platforms as subs to existing world leaders - Germany, France, US, Russia, Netherlands, etc.

Not positive on subs but Israel did produce the Saar ships until Saar 5 which was outsourced to Mississippi for manufacture. The rest were sold to South Africa and Burma.