Completely disgusted.

[Bannedfan]

Everybody,

It is said that the greatest judge of a character is how a man is treated while he is down. The last two days have proven to be a veritable treasure trove of data in regards to this forum. I won't name names unless absolutely necessary, but everybody knows who they are.

I was going to await Chaim's judgment on me, but my disgust at some of the mischaracterizations and darn near complete lies being perpetuated against me by certain individuals who absolutely should know better reached a boiling-point threshhold and I believe I have every right to defend myself from wanton tarring.

1: F-bomb: Yes, this was absolutely true and Jeffguy warned me about it, and I apologized and duly stopped. This was a poor and indefensible choice on my part and I did not defend it once, and for this to be used as ammunition against me when the matter was dealt with long ago is nothing less than backstabbing.

2: "Missionizing"?!? As said before, I would not name names unless absolutely obligatory and unavoidable. A: When Sarah was a MUSLIM and PUBLICLY VOICED wanting to leave her faith, yes, I did send her a series of messages about Christianity. She told me she did not like this and shortly thereafter Yacov posted a warning against missionizing. Needless to say, I stopped immediately. The matter has been dead for close to three months. B: RationalThought sent me a long series of questions about Christianity, and I did my best to answer them. After a while I mostly stopped--not because I did not like to reply or talk about my faith, but because the volume and frequency of his PMs to me exceeded my ability to answer them in a quality manner.

At no point was I ever warned by anybody about so-called "missionizing", and this is a complete and utter lie being used to slander and destroy my standing with Chaim and the rest of the forum.

3: Fruit of thy Loins: I disapproved of the way Allen handled the banning and very publicly voiced it. Then Chaim let it be known he must be banned and I made a thread, which is still here, apologizing to Allen and letting it be known I accept without reservation Chaim's judgment. How this was a violation of the rules is beyond me.

4: Rabbi Ovadia Yosef: Again, Chaim told me to stop attacking him and I did.

If I deserve to be banned for my recent posts, which are clearly NOT calls for members to rape Muslims, so be it. I will completely respect Chaim if he decides I should be banned for this incident with no complaint or bitterness of any form. However, I will lash out against treacherous backstabs and blindsides against me. It is profoundly hypocritical for members to suddenly and unanimously declare that I am evil and reprehensible (with me unable to defend myself) for comments made about Muslims and then turn around and level attacks against me that I am pretty certain also violate the rules of the forum.

BANNEDFAN

[DownwithIslam]

Chaimfan I really respect you and I hope they let you back on. Post a question to Chaim and when he supports you, they will then have to let you back on.

[Trumpeldor]

I support you, 100% Chaimfan. You are being treated like pure DREK and, you, of all people, deserve better. You are owed an immediate reinstatement and an apology.

My gut tells me Chaim will agree.

[DownwithIslam]

The same people who want you banned would love to welcome shvartzas and muslims onto this forum. Chaim said before he likes you and that is all that matters.

[Bannedfan]

I don't have the conceit to assume Chaim will automatically side with me because of my screenname or past postings. If he decides I should be banned, I will not protest because he is the president of JTF and he has the wisdom and right to make all decisions for us.

[DownwithIslam]

He has said he supports you completely before. I am sure nothing has changed. You will see for yourself this week. I already posted a question so why don't you go ahead and quickly add yours in.

[Trumpeldor]

I don't have the conceit to assume Chaim will automatically side with me because of my screenname or past postings. If he decides I should be banned, I will not protest because he is the president of JTF and he has the wisdom and right to make all decisions for us.

Worst case scenario, he will likely keep you banned for one week, so as not to undermine the admins. He will probably admonish them behind the scenes because the circumstances surrounding your banning were laughable. I have exposed them in many threads.

http://jtf.org/forum_english/index.php?topic=4792.0
http://jtf.org/forum_english/index.php?topic=4775.0
http://jtf.org/forum_english/index.php?topic=4777.0

[Bannedfan]

Guys, I do appreciate that you are supporting me, but this is not about arguing for reinstatement. This is about defending myself from vicious character attacks that are completely undeserved. If I deserve a banning, it should be about what I said right now and not ancient history or complete fabrications.

[Trumpeldor]

If I deserve a banning, it should be about what I said right now and not ancient history or complete fabrications.

That is what I have been harping on.

[DownwithIslam]

I like the Idea that you came on with a new name. Everyone who has been banned unecessarily should do the same.

[Manch]

I want to see you back. I don't understand why you were banned. You can't wrong evil people. I hope you'll be reinstated very soon and you will forget this incident.

[Trumpeldor]

Bannedfan was banned.

I hope you email him.

[cosmokramer]

Why was chaimfan banned? I cant come on here as much because I have a new job.

[Maccabi]

I support Chaimfan to be allowed on the forum but I agree he should have gotten a warning on the posts.
Besides, who would want to rape Arab Muslim Nazi women?
(If that is indeed what he said...I haven't reviewed the post in question)

I think anytime there is the question of a ban, a vote should be posted in the moderator's forum.

The thread should quote the offending posts in question, state an argument why they should be banned, and have the options

A: Ignore
B: Warning
C: Ban
D: Can't decide, defer to Chaim

Each moderator must vote and make a comment.

The vote should be held for maybe 72 hours (which should be enough time for most moderators to check), at which time the ban (or a just a warning) should go into effect.

If there are an equal number of votes for any choice, Chaim should decide.
And, Chaim can override any decision at any time.

In the case of long-time, loyal members like chaimfan (maybe people with over 250 posts), he should be able to see the complaint lodged against him and make at least 1 response. (because his response here is a good example of how another side of the story can change opinion)

In certain cases, such as blatant nazi trolls, we should change the poster's status to 'guest', but continue the voting out to 3 days so that all mods can vote.

Of course, if all mods have voted before 72 hours, then the ban can go into effect immediately.


I think the goal should be to set up a voting democracy among the moderators. 
However, it should be understood that this board is not a democracy...That the purpose of the vote is only to save Chaim the time of reviewing posts and deciding for himself because he is too busy.

[DownwithIslam]

Mackab thank you for supporting Chaimfan. Your idea sounds very good. I don't believe anyone other than Yacov or jimmy should be allowed to make immediate decisions.

[Trumpeldor]

I support Chaimfan to be allowed on the forum but I agree he should have gotten a warning on the posts.
Besides, who would want to rape Arab Muslim Nazi women?
(If that is indeed what he said...I haven't reviewed the post in question)

I think anytime there is the question of a ban, a vote should be posted in the moderator's forum.

The thread should quote the offending posts in question, state an argument why they should be banned, and have the options

A: Ignore
B: Warning
C: Ban
D: Can't decide, defer to Chaim

Each moderator must vote and make a comment.

The vote should be held for maybe 72 hours (which should be enough time for most moderators to check), at which time the ban (or a just a warning) should go into effect.

If there are an equal number of votes for any choice, Chaim should decide.
And, Chaim can override any decision at any time.

In the case of long-time, loyal members like chaimfan (maybe people with over 250 posts), he should be able to see the complaint lodged against him and make at least 1 response. (because his response here is a good example of how another side of the story can change opinion)

In certain cases, such as blatant nazi trolls, we should change the poster's status to 'guest', but continue the voting out to 3 days so that all mods can vote.

Of course, if all mods have voted before 72 hours, then the ban can go into effect immediately.


I think the goal should be to set up a voting democracy among the moderators. 
However, it should be understood that this board is not a democracy...That the purpose of the vote is only to save Chaim the time of reviewing posts and deciding for himself because he is too busy.

I agree with most of the sentiments expressed in this thread. Special considerations should have been made in the case of Chaimfan.

[Maccabi]

Thanks.

I think Yacov and Jimmy should be allowed to make immediate decisions (This will be useful in the event of nazi-trolls), but should probably not override cases that have gone to vote.

I also think that they should sometimes delete entire threads, even if they are 10 pages.

For example, I am tired of seeing the 'meet the mandingos' thread.

If I could figure out how to use my admin feature to blot out the entire thread, I probably would.

Some of these old threads need to be pruned because with 1 post, they are brought back to the front page.

[Dr. Dan]

I don't have the conceit to assume Chaim will automatically side with me because of my screenname or past postings. If he decides I should be banned, I will not protest because he is the president of JTF and he has the wisdom and right to make all decisions for us.

I agree with you.  I think Chaim Ben Pesach shoudl make the ultimate decision..

And my apologies if you felt I instigated comments out of you which offended those that banned you.

Whatever happens, I hope it works out for the best.

[TheCoon]

I think this whole affair is more along the lines of bringing the maturity level of the forum. Some people think that not advocating mass killing of arabs or blacks means we want to be overrun by muslim terrorist and black Jew-haters. That's a total lack of maturity and reasoning. If we want to be taken seriously as a movement we need to present ideas that are logical and in a manner that defeats other ideas. The strength of Kahanist ideology is in its reasoning and logic.

Rabbi Kahane never advocated mass killings or rapes. Those who do and claim to be Kahanist are doing a disservice.

[mord]

Well some moslems need a good hanging .Rape is'nt my thing besides most moslem women are ugly 

[ftf]

JeffGuy was appointed as an administrator, therefore he too has authority to ban someone instantly.

[Dr. Dan]

Well some moslems need a good hanging .Rape is'nt my thing besides most moslem women are ugly 

On a separate note, Mord, I disagree with hangings because of the potential of displaying a dead body. I dont' care even if it were Hitler who was hung...Every human body is made in Gd's image and to stare at it is a disrespect to Gd..it is a type of disecration of Gd.  I think death by a shooting squad or lethal injection makes the most sense. As soon as someone is dead, their body is covered, washed, and buried immediately.

[Dominater96]

Well some moslems need a good hanging .Rape is'nt my thing besides most moslem women are ugly 

On a separate note, Mord, I disagree with hangings because of the potential of displaying a dead body. I dont' care even if it were Hitler who was hung...Every human body is made in Gd's image and to stare at it is a disrespect to Gd..it is a type of disecration of Gd.  I think death by a shooting squad or lethal injection makes the most sense. As soon as someone is dead, their body is covered, washed, and buried immediately.

The torah calls for hanging some enemys. Display is something different.