Rabbis Refuse to Be Questioned by police about book justifying killing muslims

[nuchsh]

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/139031

[Ari Ben-Canaan]

Rabbi Dov Lior’s office said: "The Rabbi will not cooperate with the persecution and the political investigation – the Holy Torah is not up for questioning. At any time and especially during wartime, the morals of the Torah and its leadership should be the 'moral code' of the IDF and of the entire legal system. The attempt to prevent rabbis from expressing Torah-based opinions using fear and intimidation is severe and will not succeed. Our entire right for existence in our country right now – is only because of our holy Torah.”

Truth. 

Is there an English version of "The Torah of the King" available?  Sounds like a great book.

[muman613]

I don't think the book is about killing muslims.

As the article says it is concerned with the Halacha of when a Jew can kill a non-Jew {any non-Jew, not just muslims}... This is a topic which has been debated over the years by the Rabbis....

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

God bless these rabbis!

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

I thought that all Amalek is not just legal to kill, but that Jews are commanded to kill it.

[muman613]

I thought that all Amalek is not just legal to kill, but that Jews are commanded to kill it.

This book is not about Amalek... It is supposed to touch on topics which include when a Jew is allowed to kill non-Jews... Not every enemy of the Jewish people is called Amalek.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

The book is about the Torah's instructions for warfare with an enemy nation (non-Jewish, obviously).  The rabbi simply explains the Torah's opinion.   The secular establishment is shocked and scared witless over what the Torah says about conduct of warfare, especially because it directly contradicts their "purity of arms" nonsense for which they currently get our soldiers killed.  The Torah stresses the protection of the Jewish soldiers and Jewish people in warfare, NOT the protection of enemy population, whether so-called "civilian," combatant, terrorist, or anything else.  The preservation of the lives of the soldier's come first (Gee, what a surprise, the Torah espouses common sense).   

So they have tried to "ban" and "prosecute" publishing the Torah's opinion.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

We know how the Bolshevik Nazis of the Israeli government feel about this. My question is what it will take for the people to wake up.

A ferocious five-year intifada that resulted in most Israelis knowing someone who got blown to smithereens, a brutal war by Hezbollah, and nonstop rocket strikes ever since from every Fakestinian terror group around have failed to shake Israelis of their ridiculous Hellenized "moral outrage" over the specter of dead Moolie "civilians". I know that the people are brainwashed by their government and schools and media but gee whiz, at what point does common sense kick in?

What do you think will do it, KWRBT?

[MassuhDGoodName]

When it comes to governance, Israel must truly rate on the low end of the scale, among places like Papua New Guinea and Haiti.

Any fool knows that to publicly "ban" a book and arrest its author, giving both author and book worldwide publicity, serves only to increase the public's desire to read the book.

Had Israeli authorities totally ignored the book and its author, we here most likely would have never known anything about it and we probably wouldn't have cared.

Mark Twain was once quoted as saying that if he could just get one more novel banned in Boston, as was done to Huckleberry Finn, he would be able to retire in comfort.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Now just wait, the kiddie-porn wankers over at Analfront will hear of this and say "You see! The Talmud tells Jews to kill non-Jews!!!"
 

Nazi fudgestuffers are so predictable. I bet they will read this very thread; they are obsessed with JTF and Jews. Jews are their only reason for living (besides little boys). If they got their wish and every last Jew vanished from the planet tomorrow, they would fall into a massive depressive funk.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

We know how the Bolshevik Nazis of the Israeli government feel about this. My question is what it will take for the people to wake up.

A ferocious five-year intifada that resulted in most Israelis knowing someone who got blown to smithereens, a brutal war by Hezbollah, and nonstop rocket strikes ever since from every Fakestinian terror group around have failed to shake Israelis of their ridiculous Hellenized "moral outrage" over the specter of dead Moolie "civilians". I know that the people are brainwashed by their government and schools and media but gee whiz, at what point does common sense kick in?

What do you think will do it, KWRBT?

I really don't know.  The masses may never get it.  But even if most people do get it, they are really powerless to change anything.

It's possible a small core of heroic people can force the hand of the elites and the public won't have a choice, just like they don't now.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

The public does have a choice, unfortunately. It may not really be one but officially Israel is a democracy, and mass participation is what the national life hangs on. Let's pretend (highly unlikely but one can dream) that a small junta takes over the IDF and begins plans to remove the Arabs. The vast majority of soldiers would refuse to cooperate (if you thought the several hundred "refuseniks" that refused to serve during the intifada were bad, that will be nothing), and as soon as the public got wind of it, through whatever means that they did (even assuming that this military coup shut down the Bolshevik media), there would be outrage and civil disobedience on a scale that dwarfs any of the kapo left's protests today--and it wouldn't just be the kapo left, it would be pretty much every dumb, brainwashed Israeli citizen that doesn't know any better, and quite a few of those that do too.

You and I both know exactly the mentality that would exist--expelling all the Arabs by force would be "exactly the same as what the Nazis did and what the Arab states did in 1948 and we are being no better than they are" and other such k*ke tripe. Israelis and Jews are already extremely leery of what the Nazi world thinks of them, and they would recoil in horror at the idea of what the worldwide Nazi media constantly claims about them "finally coming true". With every Israeli schoolchild indoctrinated in this filth from preschool through graduate school, it would be pretty impossible to break. The Bolshevik establishment was able to convince the Israeli public that the Samir Kuntar release was a good idea, that the owners of the lawfully purchased Peace House and their supporters were "religious extremists", and that HaRav Meir Kahane (zecher tzaddik livracha) was a national disgrace (back when the banning happened; I know attitudes are changing now). Like I said earlier, if watching friends/loved ones get obliterated and mutilated for an entire decade can't break this insane mindset, I don't know what can. I don't see how Hayamin can take power until this lunatic stranglehold of pity for the Amalekite enemy is softened somehow.

If you have any suggestions on how this can begin, on a small scale or otherwise (and until we get millions of dollars, it will have to be a small scale), I (and Chaim) are all ears.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

The public does have a choice, unfortunately. It may not really be one but officially Israel is a democracy, 

And in your democracy when all the Jewish parties follow the same Oslo paradigm no matter what they promise before elections, the leftwing is left and the rightwing is really left, and the far-left supreme court, media, police, etc control everything with a suicidal oligarchy that will not allow change no matter how people vote, what choice do people have?

 

Let's pretend (highly unlikely but one can dream) that a small junta takes over the IDF and begins plans to remove the Arabs. The vast majority of soldiers would refuse to cooperate (if you thought the several hundred "refuseniks" that refused to serve during the intifada were bad, that will be nothing),

   Let the objectors refuse while the rest carry out the deed.   You don't need the entire army to do it, only the willing, and you do it one step at a time.   I think you will be surprised at how many willingly and voluntarily participate in such a missive.   No matter what the media says, by and large, Israelis hate the arab enemy.

and as soon as the public got wind of it, through whatever means that they did (even assuming that this military coup shut down the Bolshevik media), there would be outrage and civil disobedience 

What did "civil disobedience" ever accomplish in Israel?  Can you tell me that?  Their 'riots' and 'rallies' will soon die down as people go back to work and resign themselves to fate.   As always.

If you have any suggestions on how this can begin, on a small scale or otherwise (and until we get millions of dollars, it will have to be a small scale), I (and Chaim) are all ears.

Personally, I don't have the answers.   However, I think that virtualjudah.wordpress.com is probably a good starting-off point, and he offers plenty of ideas.

[briann]

Now just wait, the kiddie-porn wankers over at Analfront will hear of this and say "You see! The Talmud tells Jews to kill non-Jews!!!"
 

Nazi fudgestuffers are so predictable. I bet they will read this very thread; they are obsessed with JTF and Jews. Jews are their only reason for living (besides little boys). If they got their wish and every last Jew vanished from the planet tomorrow, they would fall into a massive depressive funk.

Yeah, I was thinking the same.  Im sure much of the Muslim world is using this as propoganda as well.  But to that I say.... Who cares what those pedophiles think.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

And in your democracy when all the Jewish parties follow the same Oslo paradigm no matter what they promise before elections, the leftwing is left and the rightwing is really left, and the far-left supreme court, media, police, etc control everything with a suicidal oligarchy that will not allow change no matter how people vote, what choice do people have?

Like I said, at some point there should be common sense. At some point you can't hide the obvious. It doesn't matter how long Haaretz and Ynet and Walla say the Arabs are such great people--if people all around you are getting blown up and shot by them, you know the truth. Other nations whose regimes are just as odious do not have the public constantly following along like sheeple. Shahist Iran was even more controlling and oppressive than Bolshevik Israel, and had even fewer options for change in it, but that didn't stop the people from all rising up, overthrowing him, and establishing an Islamic Nazi dictatorship in its stead. If the Israeli people would unite and make clear that they aren't standing for this crap anymore, I just don't see the kapos in power having the balls to massacre the entire country. They only attack people who are too small/outnumbered to fight back. They would grovel before the people and do whatever they wanted to stay in power.

Let the objectors refuse while the rest carry out the deed.   You don't need the entire army to do it, only the willing, and you do it one step at a time.  I think you will be surprised at how many willingly and voluntarily participate in such a missive.   No matter what the media says, by and large, Israelis hate the arab enemy.

I just hope there would be enough of them to do it. Yes the Arabs are no match for determined and pissed-off Jewish soldiers, but the number of them against the Arabs, in this case, would be pretty darn small. As for the second point, while you are correct that according to polls most Israelis know that the Arabs want to kill them all, and want to see them leave voluntarily or with financial compensation, those same polls also show that most Israelis feel that the Fakestinians have "legitimate historical claims and rights". So, go figure. They are very brainwashed to feel that their Amalek foes have "rights" even if they know that they want to murder them.

What did "civil disobedience" ever accomplish in Israel?  Can you tell me that?  Their 'riots' and 'rallies' will soon die down as people go back to work and resign themselves to fate.   As always.

Look at the Histadrut and its massive disruptions... they get what they want every time. I don't know if these hypothetical demonstrations would be as organized and effective, but think about it--if every single Israeli cop, soldier, and public worker refuses to have anything to do with a transfer order, it won't happen. You see the same insane mentality to a certain extent here in the American Southwest, where some wackjob cops have said that they would refuse to enforce Proposition 187/SB1070 (against illegal aliens). If there is zero public confidence/cooperation with a regime, it will cease to exist, plain and simple.

Personally, I don't have the answers.   However, I think that virtualjudah.wordpress.com is probably a good starting-off point, and he offers plenty of ideas.

Hmm, I will have to check that out.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

And in your democracy when all the Jewish parties follow the same Oslo paradigm no matter what they promise before elections, the leftwing is left and the rightwing is really left, and the far-left supreme court, media, police, etc control everything with a suicidal oligarchy that will not allow change no matter how people vote, what choice do people have?

Like I said, at some point there should be common sense. At some point you can't hide the obvious. It doesn't matter how long Haaretz and Ynet and Walla say the Arabs are such great people--if people all around you are getting blown up and shot by them, you know the truth. Other nations whose regimes are just as odious do not have the public constantly following along like sheeple. Shahist Iran was even more controlling and oppressive than Bolshevik Israel, and had even fewer options for change in it, but that didn't stop the people from all rising up, overthrowing him, and establishing an Islamic Nazi dictatorship in its stead. If the Israeli people would unite and make clear that they aren't standing for this crap anymore, I just don't see the kapos in power having the balls to massacre the entire country. They only attack people who are too small/outnumbered to fight back. They would grovel before the people and do whatever they wanted to stay in power.   

If the Israelis love arabs as much as you claim, Rabbi Kahane would never have gained nearly the amount of support he did.

[MassuhDGoodName]

Re:  "If you have any suggestions on how this can begin, on a small scale or otherwise (and until we get millions of dollars, it will have to be a small scale), I (and Chaim) are all ears. "

 >> If you want to stage a successful revolt, regardless of your political position, then the only way you can possibly succeed is to thoroughly study the revolts of recent history which actually did succeed. <<

And, you are wasting your time, and have no chance whatsoever at succeeding, until and unless you understand the following facts:

- Contrary to the views of some who refuse to accept it; there are "unseen powers" behind the throne (examples:  international brokers and bankers, military industrialists, oil industrialists, and major corporations), which "call all the shots" and control the visible heads of state "elected" to western governments.

Obama, Netanyahu, and all the rest we see and hear from daily are merely puppets on a string who follow orders from higher powers in exchange for being allowed the privelages and perquisites of executive power.

-  In addition, the major media networks of the world are also controlled by these very same money interests mentioned above.

Sometimes they merely report daily events, but they are always at the ready to print on command the "storyline" handed to them by their government intelligence agencies and other power brokers:

These "storylines" create public acceptance and agreement with government policies, and influence the average man and woman in the streets to accept one or another point of view.

-  Therefore:   HE WHO CONTROLS THE NATION'S MEDIA AS WELL AS CONTROLS THE NATION'S CURRENCY IS THE ACTUAL MAKER OF FOREIGN AND DOMESTIC POLICY FOR THAT COUNTRY.

 - Result:  Your vote is a mostly meaningless gesture allowing you to believe that "your vote counts", "the people have spoken", "change has come", etc. so that all will go back to work, pay taxes to support the bums who won the election, and then you remain free to grumble and complain again about how "nothing ever really changes" until the next election when you delude yourself into believing that "we'll throw these bums out and replace them with ...".

- What this actually means:

- It is possible to stage a successful revolt, but only if you are either a) able to secure the backing of the money powers behind the throne, or b) willing to kill the money powers behind the throne and replace them with your own.

- And either way, without full and total control of the media of a nation, your revolt is doomed at the start to be unraveled and undone before it has even had a chance to succeed.

Therefore:

Such demonstrations of discontent as "protests", letter writing campaigns to your elected representatives, and boycotts, are all just huge jokes to those who actually control countries, and these masters guffaw out loud at how childish and easily duped most people seem to be. 

Your true masters are actually delighted when they see that their peons actually believe that their protests and "grass roots activism" have the power to change the policies of their leadership.

This is because as long as the "little people" believe they can affect change, the more they prove that they're blind to the real source of their problems needing to be addressed.

And I reiterate:  That "real source of power" are a) those who control the nation's currency and b) those who control the nation's media - those whom "the people" do not believe to exist.

Case in point:  The Iranian Revolution.
===============================

- Iranians did not by themselves stage a popular revolt and overthrow their Shah.

It was the Western powers in collusion with each other which aided, assisted and saw to it that America's and Israel's ally was forced into exile and replaced with the Ayatollah Khomeini.

And where was Ayatollah Khomeini during the period leading up to and during this "popular revolt" ?
 
Answer:  He had left Iran, having been exiled for treason, and was living in Paris, France, as the "guest" of the French Government, and under the full protection of the French Government.

Leading up to and throughout this entire fiasco, the Western media day and night broadcast propaganda condemning the Shah as a murderer, a tyrant, a "devil", a torturer, a dictator, and  denounced the Shah's westernization and modernization of Iran.

CBS, ABC, and NBC were all praising and glorifying the Ayatollah Khomeini, supported Iran's "popular revolution", and welcoming "the man of G-d's" plan for an "Islamic Republic of Iran"!

Barbara Walters and the other media talking heads fought with each other to be first in telling the American people that "The Shi'ia aren't like the other Muslims!" - "The ayatollahs are liberal and will create a beautiful democracy!"

It was President Jimmy Carter who then publicly called for the Shah to step down, demanded the Royal Family be exiled to Egypt, and called for the "gentle, peace-loving, holy man" - The Ayatollah Khomeini - "the peoples' democratic choice" - be flown first class back to Teheran to a "Hero's Welcome".
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Re:  "If you have any suggestions on how this can begin, on a small scale or otherwise (and until we get millions of dollars, it will have to be a small scale), I (and Chaim) are all ears. "

 >> If you want to stage a successful revolt, regardless of your political position, then the only way you can possibly succeed is to thoroughly study the revolts of recent history which actually did succeed. <<

And, you are wasting your time, and have no chance whatsoever at succeeding, until and unless you understand the following facts:

- Contrary to the views of some who refuse to accept it; there are "unseen powers" behind the throne (examples:  international brokers and bankers, military industrialists, oil industrialists, and major corporations), which "call all the shots" and control the visible heads of state "elected" to western governments.


Obama, Netanyahu, and all the rest we see and hear from daily are merely puppets on a string who follow orders from higher powers in exchange for being allowed the privelages and perquisites of executive power.

I think you should have kept reading instead of stopping at that sentence.  It's quite clear that the makers of that site understand these factors and consider them in their discussions.  The site is vast.  I would advise treating it in depth and not superficially with one solitary blog-post/article or even worse with one sentence.

-  In addition, the major media networks of the world are also controlled by these very same money interests mentioned above. 

etc etc.

- Result:  Your vote is a mostly meaningless gesture allowing you to believe that "your vote counts", "the people have spoken", "change has come", etc. so that all will go back to work, pay taxes to support the bums who won the election, and then you remain free to grumble and complain again about how "nothing ever really changes" until the next election when you delude yourself into believing that "we'll throw these bums out and replace them with ...".

This point is also addressed and from what I have read, the maker(s) of that site certainly do not disagree with what you said right here.   So once again, I would advise to keep reading.

- What this actually means:

- It is possible to stage a successful revolt, but only if you are either a) able to secure the backing of the money powers behind the throne, or b) willing to kill the money powers behind the throne and replace them with your own. [/b]

- And either way, without full and total control of the media of a nation, your revolt is doomed at the start to be unraveled and undone before it has even had a chance to succeed. [/b]

They quite clearly disagree with you here, and you should examine their reasons for disagreeing and why they do not accept these premises.

Therefore:

Such demonstrations of discontent as "protests", letter writing campaigns to your elected representatives, and boycotts, are all just huge jokes to those who actually control countries, and these masters guffaw out loud at how childish and easily duped most people seem to be.   etc etc

Right, all reiteration of previous point.  And none of these things are what the virtual judah site advocates.  They do NOT advocate meaningless protests, rallies and letter writing.

They assert that the "origin ribbon" approach is what got the Gush Katif residents expelled.

And I reiterate:  That "real source of power" are a) those who control the nation's currency and b) those who control the nation's media - those whom "the people" do not believe to exist. 

There are other ways to assert control and seize power or seize political gain.

Can I ask you, did the PLO control the Israeli currency?  Did the PLO control Israeli media?

Did Hamas control the Israeli currency?   Did Hamas control Israeli media?

Yet they are today political/revolutionary forces to be reckoned with.

And even if you assert that the Iranian revolution was a massive conspiracy with full western backing, there are plenty of examples of other revolutions which were not and yet had success.   Not that I totally accept the conspiracy formulation for the Iranian revolution, but even granting you that point.

[MassuhDGoodName]

Kahane-Was-Right BT, as usual you bluster and BS without once addressing a single issue.

Being a smart-a s s who thinks you can belittle others here on the forum does nothing but guarantee this movement's failure.

You call the following a response to my reply:

"should have kept reading instead of stopping at that sentence.  It's quite clear that the makers of that site understand these factors and consider them in their discussions.  The site is vast.  I would advise treating it in depth and not superficially with one solitary blog-post/article or even worse with one sentence." ?

Might work great back in your high school full of shaved head idiots, but it pulls no sway here.

There was, and is, no "site" ever under discussion in anything I have yet written, and for you to say "etc. etc..." as a reply only proves you are a political midget with little if any education.

You offer aren't the solution because you ARE the problem.

And I could care less if Chaim thinks you're wonderful because you serve as his running dog lackey.

[muman613]

Kahane-Was-Right BT, as usual you bluster and BS without once addressing a single issue.

Being a smart-a s s who thinks you can belittle others here on the forum does nothing but guarantee this movement's failure.

You call the following a response to my reply:

"should have kept reading instead of stopping at that sentence.  It's quite clear that the makers of that site understand these factors and consider them in their discussions.  The site is vast.  I would advise treating it in depth and not superficially with one solitary blog-post/article or even worse with one sentence." ?

Might work great back in your high school full of shaved head idiots, but it pulls no sway here.

There was, and is, no "site" ever under discussion in anything I have yet written, and for you to say "etc. etc..." as a reply only proves you are a political midget with little if any education.

You offer aren't the solution because you ARE the problem.

And I could care less if Chaim thinks you're wonderful because you serve as his running dog lackey.

Massuh,

You appear to be making this a personal issue. I did not think it was until you put it out there... I dont think the KWRBT was attacking you or your opinion, just attempting to argue about it... Do you think there is something personal in his attempt to explain his counter-opinion to yours?

[MassuhDGoodName]

Re: "Do you think there is something personal in his attempt to explain his counter-opinion to yours? "

I don't think -- I KNOW.

And there is no counter explanation -- it's all bluster unrelated to the post.

I am slow to anger, and under control, but now I'm pissed off.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Kahane-Was-Right BT, as usual you bluster and BS without once addressing a single issue.

Being a smart-a s s who thinks you can belittle others here on the forum does nothing but guarantee this movement's failure. 

Excuse me?  Did I belittle someone?

Show me where I did that with quotes.  Oh.  You can't.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

There was, and is, no "site" ever under discussion in anything I have yet written, and for you to say "etc. etc..." as a reply only proves you are a political midget with little if any education.   

It appears I may have made a mistake.  That is possible, you know.  I don't understand why you became so hostile.

When you wrote: "If you want to stage a successful revolt, regardless of your political position, then the only way you can possibly succeed is to thoroughly study the revolts of recent history which actually did succeed."

I thought you were quoting from the site I recommended to Brennanfan in a previous post in this thread because that is precisely an argument that they make there.   You wrote it in a format which suggested it was being quoted from somewhere (the italics and the << >> formatting ), so I naturally assumed it was from that site since they make that same argument.   I thought what followed was supposed to be a refutation of that point based on the notion that only with full control of money and media can it be achieved.   So my post was based on that mistaken thought where I was merely pointing out that I don't think full control of money and media is needed to do so.   No need to get hostile like a teenage school-girl.

For your information, saying "etc etc" was my way of quoting you  without listing out all of the text but by shortening it and adding that because I felt that all of it made the same point.   So to show I was truncating your quote, I wrote etc etc...   It has nothing to do with level of education, but if you want to say I'm uneducated because that makes you feel better about yourself, yeah I'm illiterate and you're a college professor, congratulations.  That adds what to the discussion?   To demonize me as "uneducated" (oh horror of horrors, a Jew without a phD!)

  You offer aren't the solution because you ARE the problem. 

I'm THE problem?  And what problem would that be?   I'm quite flattered.  It's one thing to be called A PROBLEM, but to be labeled as the problem takes some kind of achievement.   Enlighten us all with why I'm the problem.

And I could care less if Chaim thinks you're wonderful because you serve as his running dog lackey. 

Why bring Chaim into this?   Does supporting JTF mean I'm a "running dog lackey?"   In what way am I serving as any such thing?   What's so different about what you do here?   You also post comments to the forum.   

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Re: "Do you think there is something personal in his attempt to explain his counter-opinion to yours? "

I don't think -- I KNOW.   

Oh, really?  What was personal about any thing I wrote here? 

I made an honest mistake.  Simple as that.

 

And there is no counter explanation -- it's all bluster unrelated to the post.

I am slow to anger, and under control, but now I'm pissed off.

It's very obvious that you're pissed off, yet no one knows why.  When people get pissed off for no reason, it's a sign that something is wrong.   You perceive some kind of slight against you, yet my post was based on a misunderstanding.   Why fly off the handle?   

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Aside from the entire site I mentioned being devoted to precisely the point you made, this particular post makes that point a little more explicitly and in direct form.  So just to show you from where my misunderstanding stemmed, I cite the following

http://virtualjudah.wordpress.com/self-liberation-101-lesson-3-the-long-march-to-victory/

That is, since you are so convinced my post was "personal," I'm providing you with the evidence behind my claim that it wasn't, since I'm sure in a state of being pissed off you're not going to believe me.