Author Topic: Was Herod a righteous or evil person?  (Read 702 times)

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Offline White Israelite

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Was Herod a righteous or evil person?
« on: December 05, 2010, 05:02:22 PM »
I'm not 100 percent positive about Herods period as I am still studying but from what i've gathered, there are mixed views on Herod, some state he was not Jewish, others state that he was partially of Nabataean descent from mothers line, Jewish by fathers.

From what i've gathered, he built the second temple (Herods Temple), and was a architect, also involved in the advanced Caesarea Maritima and Masada fortress. Other than that, I know little of him but what made him righteous or evil? Did he appease the Romans or was he pro Jewish?


Offline mord

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Re: Was Herod a righteous or evil person?
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2010, 05:28:18 PM »
not a good person
Thy destroyers and they that make thee waste shall go forth of thee.  Isaiah 49:17

 
Shot at 2010-01-03

Offline muman613

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Re: Was Herod a righteous or evil person?
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2010, 06:19:33 PM »
A lot has been written on Herod...

Here is an article from Aish.com :



http://www.aish.com/jl/h/48942446.html

Herod, the Great (not to be confused with Herod Antipas who came later) is one of the most important characters in Jewish history. He was ambitious, cruel and paranoid to be sure, but, nevertheless, he remains a very significant person in the terms of understanding this period of Roman domination of the Jewish people.

Herod first leadership role was as governor of the Galilee, a position granted to him by his father, Antipater. Early on in his career he demonstrates his brutality by ruthlessly crushing a revolt in the Galilee.

The background to Herod's rise to power is the Roman civil war that will transform Rome from a republic into and empire ruled by the Caesars or emperors. In 44BCE Julius Caesar is murdered by Brutus and Cassius who are in turn defeated by Anthony and Octavian in 42 BCE. The Battle of Actium in 31 BCE, is the final showdown between Octaviun and Anthony. Octaviun emerged as the unrivaled victor, changing his name to Augustus and becoming the first Roman emperor.

Herod had originally sided with Anthony but switches allegiance at the last minute and backs Octavian. His last minute support for Octavian earns him Augustus's confirmation as King of Israel.

Herod will reigned as king of Judea from 37 BCE until his death in 4 BCE, a very long reign of 33 years, and in many ways a good period in terms of development of the country and social stability.

Part of the reason for the stability was that during this time, the Romans took a backseat role in the day-to-day life of the Jews.

The general Roman attitude was one of tolerance, meaning Jews were granted exemptions from the official Roman state religion. A very interesting point to remember is that religion and state went together in all empires in the ancient world, and more so in Rome than almost anywhere because Rome also practiced emperor worship ― that is, the Romans deified their emperors posthumously.

Linking state and religion gave the rulers added legitimacy, obviously. The connection between temporal power and spiritual power gave them complete control over the physical existence and spiritual existence of their subjects. (Later, we are going to see the Catholic Church doing the same thing in Medieval Europe.)

While accepting the state religion was a vital part of Roman identity and loyalty to the state, the Romans were also pragmatists. They had learned by the Greek experience that Jews could not be forced to worship idols. And they saw for themselves that the Jews were not like other pagan peoples ― they were not going to conform. So the Romans granted the Jews an official status of being exempt from Roman state religion.

On the one hand, it was a very smart and very tolerant policy. On the other hand, with that policy also went a punitive tax specifically for the Jews called fiscus Judaicus. You want to be exempt from the state religion? Okay, so long as you pay for the privilege.

So, it might have happened that the Jews simply paid the tax and did their own thing. But it didn't go as smoothly as that (as we shall see).

Trade, Devlopment and Contruction

Herod's rule was characterized by a period of unprecedented growth and construction, thanks in large part to Herod's amiable relationship with Rome and his obsession with massive and elaborate construction projects

Herod had Rome's complete support in administering a very important territory which included several major trade routes. Everything moved through Judea, which was sort of like the great way-station for the incense trade coming from Yemen up the Arabian Peninsula and going out to the Mediterranean.

Additionally, this was one of the most agriculturally productive pieces of land in the Middle East famous for its olive oil (which was used as a main source of light, and not just for cooking), for its dates (the chief sweetener in the times before sugar), and for its wine.

Herod used the huge profits from trade and money acquired through the crushing taxes he placed upon his subjects to undertake a series of mammoth building projects ― some of the most magnificent in the world.

As a matter of fact if they hadn't closed the list of the wonders of the ancient world before his time, Herod would probably have added three more to list. Almost all archeologists and students of architecture of the ancient world appreciate that he was one of the greatest builders of all human history.

He built relentlessly ― cities, palaces and fortresses, some of which still stand:

    * the fortresses at Masada, Antonia and Herodium
    * the port city of Caesarea
    * the huge edifice at the top of the Cave of the Patriarchs in Hebron
    * the massive fortifications around Jerusalem as well as three towers at the entrance to the city (the remains of which are today erroneously named the Tower of David) and much more

At Herodium, in an incredible feat of engineering ― Herod built an artificial mountain and, on top of it, a huge palace. Unfortunately, this palace was destroyed in 70 CE during the Great Revolt.

He built another fortress, Masada, on top of a mesa, a rock plateau, in the desert. Complete with all the creature comforts in the desert, Masada had an incredible water supply system that fed gardens for growing agricultural staples and three bathhouses (Masada is open to tourists today and a sight to behold.)

The port city of Caesarea deserves special mention ― not only because it was a center of trade and the Roman administrative capitol of Judea and one of the largest ports in the Empire, but because it became a symbol in Jewish eyes of everything that was pagan, Roman, and antithetical to Judaism. Here Herod created an amazing artificial port (one of the two largest in the Empire), put in a beautiful amphitheater, a hippodrome for chariot races (like in the movie Ben Hur, bath houses, and a huge temple dedicated to the Roman god-emperor, Augustus Caesar. (You can visit today the excavations of Caesarea Maritina and they are most impressive.)

Herod's Temple

The most ambitious of Herod's projects was the re-building of the Temple, which was almost certainly an attempt to gain popularity among his subjects who, he knew, held him in contempt and also to make amends for his cruelty toward the rabbis.

It took 10,000 men ten years just to build the retaining walls around the Temple Mount (on top of which the Muslim shrine, the Dome of the Rock, stands today). The Western Wall (formerly known as the Wailing Wall) is merely part of that 500-meter-long retaining wall that was designed to hold a huge man-made platform that could accommodate twenty four football fields. When it was completed, it was the world's largest functioning religious site and until today it remains the largest man-made platform in the world.
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Herod's Persecutions

Herod's persecutions were infamous and they even extended to his own family.

Herod, knowing that his Jewish credentials were suspect, had married Miriam ― the granddaughter of Hyrcanus and therefore a Hasmonean princess ― largely to gain legitimacy among the Jewish people. But he also loved her madly. As Josephus relates:

    Of the five children which Herod had by Miriam, two of them were daughters and three were sons. The youngest of these sons was educated in Rome and died there but the two eldest he treated as those of royal blood on account of the nobility of their mother and because they were not born until he was king. But what was stronger than all this was his love he bore for Miriam which inflamed him every day to a great degree.

The problem was that Miriam hated him as much as he loved her, largely because of what he had done to her brother, Aristobulus.

Herod had made Aristobulus High Priest at the age of 17, and watched with trepidation as the young man became hugely popular. This was not surprising as Aristobulus was a Hasmonean with a legitimate right to be High Priest ― a genuine Jew and a genuine cohen.

But this threatened Herod too much and he had him drowned.

Indeed, Herod later became jealous of his own sons for the same reason and had them murdered as well.

And he even had his own wife murdered in a fit of jealousy. Josephus again:

    His passion also made him stark mad and leaping out of his bed he ran around the palace in a wild manner. His sister Salome took the opportunity also to slander Miriam and to confirm his suspicions about Joseph [Miriam's alleged lover]. Then out of his ungovernable jealousy and rage he commanded both of them to be killed immediately. But as soon as his passion was over he repented of what he had done and as soon as his anger was worn off his affections were kindled again... Indeed, the flame of his desires for her was so hard that he could not think she was dead but he would appear under his disorders to speak to her as if she were still alive... (Antiquities 15.7.4,5)

Not a stable man to say the least. Even Augustus said of him: "It is better to be Herod's dog than one of his children."

Herod's paranoia, his interference with the Temple hierarchy, and his dedication to the Hellenization of the Jewish people all contributed to the growing discontent that would erupt in a revolt against Rome some 70 years after his death.
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As you can see, Herod was both a great and tragic figure...

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Was Herod a righteous or evil person?
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2010, 06:25:24 PM »
Evil

Offline Zelhar

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Re: Was Herod a righteous or evil person?
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2010, 02:07:39 AM »
He was so evil that the rabbis set the day of his decease (I believe it is 7th of Adar) as a national holiday.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2010, 08:20:28 AM by Zelhar »

Offline Rubystars

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Re: Was Herod a righteous or evil person?
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2010, 06:18:59 AM »
He was a homicidal maniac

Offline White Israelite

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Re: Was Herod a righteous or evil person?
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2010, 06:02:05 PM »
What do you think of the recent discovery of his tomb? Should Herod be considered forgotten and his architecture despised? Or should he be remembered in any form?

Offline muman613

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Re: Was Herod a righteous or evil person?
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2010, 06:03:00 PM »
What do you think of the recent discovery of his tomb? Should Herod be considered forgotten and his architecture despised? Or should he be remembered in any form?

I think he is remembered... Just as every aspect of Jewish history is remembered...

http://www.ou.org/torah/tt/5765/reeh65/mikdash.htm



King Herod "the Great" (40-4 B.C.E.)

The distinguished historian Doron Mendles wrote, "On the whole, Herod's Hellenistic side comes much more to the fore than his Jewish one, and the attempts of some scholars to emphasize his Jewish facets have not been very successful. Later Jewish tradition thoroughly denigrated him (except for his initiative in building the Temple), which shows that in the mind of many Jews, he never was really "king of the Jews." His rule was backed by the Greeks settled in Eretz Yisrael by Alexander the Great and his Ptolemaic and the Seleucids successors, his army of mercenaries - which was largely though not completely - non Jewish, his network of military strongholds, superficially Judaized Edomites, his Diaspora connections and the threat of Roman intervention on his behalf. With the exception of a few sycophants, the indigenous Jewish population detested him. The founder of many pagan cities, Herod strengthened the Greco-Roman element in Eretz Yisrael thereby tightening the Roman grip on the land. As much as possible, he relied up on the friendship and support of non-Jews. His confidant was the Spartan adventurer Eurycles, his generals were non-Jews, probably Roman. He appointed numerous Hellenized eunuchs - anathema to Jews - to important administrative positions in his government; other positions were given to members of his own family or fellow Edomites. His Kohanim Gedolim came from priestly families in Bavel or Alexandria and therefore they had no local power base. (The only one of Herod's Kohanim Gedolim - he appointed and dismissed seven of them - who came from Eretz Yisrael held office for one day!) The noted historian F.E. Peters notes, "Seen through Jewish eyes, Herod's measures appear as harsh and oppressive as those of Antiochus Epiphanes, and indeed, the two men operated from similar premises. Like Epiphanes and… the Romans, Herod equated Hellenism with economic prosperity. He attempted to spread Hellenism…by a magnificent building program, and as Augustus prided himself on the restorations of temples belonging to local religious cults, so Herod embarked on the rebuilding on a grandiose scale of the temple of Jerusalem." Even the Sages who hated Herod admitted, "He who has not seen the temple of Herod has never seen a beautiful building.'" (Baba Batra 4a).

Known in history as a master builder, Herod "was… the most barbarous of tyrants who ever sat on a throne. He had slain men innumerable, and the lot of those which survived made them envy those who were slain. He not only tortured his subjects individually but oppressed entire cities …" (Wars II 6:2). Hearing of Herod's butchery of his family members, the Emperor Augustus (no milksop himself) commented, "It would be better to be Herod's pig than his son." For all the external splendor of his regime, he was well aware that the Jewish inhabitants of Eretz Yisrael despised him as the "Edomite slave". Josephus describes patriots who were hidden in the caves. "A certain aged Galilean… had seven sons and when they obeyed Herod's command and left their cave, he (Herod) stood at the entrance and killed them one by one; and when Herod held out his hand to the old man and promised not to punish him, the old man only reviled Herod for his Edomite origin and threw himself over the precipice" (Wars 1:15/6). The horror generated by Herod's reign of terror against his Jewish subjects is all too redolent in the Gemara's narration of how Herod came to refurbish the Beit HaMikdash. Herod wanted to know, "Who are they who teach, 'From the midst of thy brethren thou shalt set up a king over thee" (D’varim 17:15)? The Sages! He therefore arose and killed all the Sages, sparing however Baba ben Buta, that he take might council of him. He placed on his head a garland of hedgehog bristles and blinded him. One day (Herod) came and sat before him and said, 'See what this wicked slave does… I want you to curse him. Baba ben Buta replied, "…Even in your thoughts, you should not curse a king" (Kohelet 10:20). Said Herod, "But this is no king." He replied, "Even he only be a rich man, it is written. 'And in your bed chamber, do not curse the rich'" (ibid.) …Continuing his entrapping efforts, "Herod replied, 'This applies only to one who acts as one of 'thy people'. (The Sage) replied, 'I am afraid of him." But Herod replied, 'We are alone, there is only the two of us.' He replied, 'For a bird of the heaven shall carry the voice and that which has wings shall tell the matter' (ibid.). Herod then said, 'I am Herod. Had I known that the Sages were so circumspect, I would not have killed them. Now tell me what amends I can make." Baba ben Buta told him that since he "extinguished" the light of the world by killing the Sages, he should "attend to the light of the world" - and restore the Beit HaMikdash - of which it is written, "And all the nations will become enlightened by it…." (Yeshiyahu 2:2). For once Herod was as good as his word. In consultation with the Kohanim, he refurbished the Mikdash without disturbing the Divine Avoda.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2010, 06:13:08 PM by muman613 »
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14