what is the goal of JTF?

[Mizrahi 4 LIFE]

I'm not putting down this forum in anyway. I would just like to know what does JTF want to do?

[muman613]

I'm not putting down this forum in anyway. I would just like to know what does JTF want to do?

What do you think it is?

1st Jewish Rule : Always answer a question with another question!

[Mizrahi 4 LIFE]

What do you think it is?

1st Jewish Rule : Always answer a question with another question!

I'm not sure to be honest. it looks like a bunch of people posting various different news and articles from other sites. mostly the same type of information.

what i want this to be? in the days of JDL with Rabbi Kahane ZTL as its leader. posting information about Obama and Israel is not going to attract people. IMPACT is. I thought JTF was a new version of JDL but only now with better resources.

[muman613]

I'm not sure to be honest. it looks like a bunch of people posting various different news and articles from other sites. mostly the same type of information.

what i want this to be? in the days of JDL with Rabbi Kahane ZTL as its leader. posting information about Obama and Israel is not going to attract people. IMPACT is. I thought JTF was a new version of JDL but only now with better resources.

Well I will not speak 'For JTF' but I will explain my opinion.

I believe that Chaim is leading a group which has the goal of affecting public opinion amongst Jews and Gentiles that the political system in Israel needs to change. I believe that there is this hope that soon Chaim may be able to run for office in Israel, of course after repealing those laws which have been passed which prohibit this at this time. The goal is to establish a Kahanist or Kach like party which will strongly defend Israel.

How this will be accomplished I don't know except for the hope that through altering public opinion, throuhh Youtube videos and through media coverage, that an evolution to right-wing Jewish thought in Israel will occur. It is also hoped that there will be a movement in the direction of religious zionism. We support the settlers in Judea and Samaria because that is a front in the battle which religious zionists are fighting. We believe the entire land is Jewish land and should not be sacrificed in the name of so-called peace.

JTFs mission, In my opinion, is to affect American politics in a way which would be advantageous to Israel. Which is one reason Chaim has said that Israel should not be reliant on support from America. This is one aspect of JTF policy which I agree to an extent, but I also believe that America should in its own best interest, be supportive of Israel.


But this is just the tip of my explanation of what I think JTF is.

I only have some suggestions which I will discuss with the appropriate parties concerning how we can accomplish some of these goals.

PS: I don't believe at this time JTF intends to be a replacement for the original JDL.

[Mizrahi 4 LIFE]

Well I will not speak 'For JTF' but I will explain my opinion.

I believe that Chaim is leading a group which has the goal of affecting public opinion amongst Jews and Gentiles that the political system in Israel needs to change. I believe that there is this hope that soon Chaim may be able to run for office in Israel, of course after repealing those laws which have been passed which prohibit this at this time. The goal is to establish a Kahanist or Kach like party which will strongly defend Israel.

How this will be accomplished I don't know except for the hope that through altering public opinion, throuhh Youtube videos and through media coverage, that an evolution to right-wing Jewish thought in Israel will occur. It is also hoped that there will be a movement in the direction of religious zionism. We support the settlers in Judea and Samaria because that is a front in the battle which religious zionists are fighting. We believe the entire land is Jewish land and should not be sacrificed in the name of so-called peace.

JTFs mission, In my opinion, is to affect American politics in a way which would be advantageous to Israel. Which is one reason Chaim has said that Israel should not be reliant on support from America. This is one aspect of JTF policy which I agree to an extent, but I also believe that America should in its own best interest, be supportive of Israel.


But this is just the tip of my explanation of what I think JTF is.

I only have some suggestions which I will discuss with the appropriate parties concerning how we can accomplish some of these goals.

PS: I don't believe at this time JTF intends to be a replacement for the original JDL.

with all due respect i don't see in anyway JTF has done any of these things you mentioned. Nor do i believe will do. JTF MUST make some crucial changes and a BIG mark and an IMPACT. how many years has JTF been around? what has it done?

[muman613]

with all due respect i don't see in anyway JTF has done any of these things you mentioned. Nor do i believe will do. JTF MUST make some crucial changes and a BIG mark and an IMPACT. how many years has JTF been around? what has it done?

I would wait for an 'official' response from Chaim. Do not take my words as anything other than my opinion.

If you have good suggestions I am sure someone will listen.

[Mizrahi 4 LIFE]

I would wait for an 'official' response from Chaim. Do not take my words as anything other than my opinion.

If you have good suggestions I am sure someone will listen.

I do but i doubt JTF will listen most of these people think I'm sympathizing with Muslims or that i hate Ashkenazi Jews.

[muman613]

I do but i doubt JTF will listen most of these people think I'm sympathizing with Muslims or that i hate Ashkenazi Jews.

Well sometimes it seems like you don't have the appropriate anger at them for what they have done and are doing to the Jewish people. I consider islam to be one of the greatest threats to humanity at this time, greater than asteroids and climate change combined.

Ever since the introduction of mohamuds cultlike religion the Jews have been persecuted. I think it is wonderful you have had good relations with them. I too know people from all around the world and most, even the muslim and arab ones are often basically 'good people'. But I don't discuss politics with them and I certainly don't socialize with them.

[Mizrahi 4 LIFE]

Well sometimes it seems like you don't have the appropriate anger at them for what they have done and are doing to the Jewish people. I consider islam to be one of the greatest threats to humanity at this time, greater than asteroids and climate change combined.

Ever since the introduction of mohamuds cultlike religion the Jews have been persecuted. I think it is wonderful you have had good relations with them. I too know people from all around the world and most, even the muslim and arab ones are often basically 'good people'. But I don't discuss politics with them and I certainly don't socialize with them.

Islam 1500 years old that converted other nations by the sword.
Christianity 2000 years old that converted other nations by other means.

Islam has been a threat  to the Jews
Christianity also has been a threat to the Jews.

fact is we (Jews) have gone though literal HELL from both groups especially by the Christians. like i said before not all Christians as well as Muslims don't hate the Jews.

[cjd]

Islam 1500 years old that converted other nations by the sword.
Christianity 2000 years old that converted other nations by other means.

Islam has been a threat  to the Jews
Christianity also has been a threat to the Jews.

fact is we (Jews) have gone though literal HELL from both groups especially by the Christians. like i said before not all Christians as well as Muslims don't hate the Jews.

What sort of mixed message is being sent here?

[Mizrahi 4 LIFE]

What sort of mixed message is being sent here?

message is clear we (Jews) can't trust anyone but our own brothers & sisters & of course Hashem. other people Muslims, Christians, and other groups of people I don't see much help from them but like i have said not all of them are bad and amongst them are truly good people who support the Jews.

[Aces High]

message is clear we (Jews) can't trust anyone but our own brothers & sisters & of course Hashem. other people Muslims, Christians, and other groups of people I don't see much help from them but like i have said not all of them are bad and amongst them are truly good people who support the Jews.

There are great Christians on this forum, why chase them away?  If you keep talking like this they will leave.

[muman613]

message is clear we (Jews) can't trust anyone but our own brothers & sisters & of course Hashem. other people Muslims, Christians, and other groups of people I don't see much help from them but like i have said not all of them are bad and amongst them are truly good people who support the Jews.

Yes JTF clearly works with non-Jews and I support that. But it is not that we rely on them and not on Hashem. Hashem has sent many agents in this world to help us.

[cjd]

message is clear we (Jews) can't trust anyone but our own brothers & sisters & of course Hashem. other people Muslims, Christians, and other groups of people I don't see much help from them but like i have said not all of them are bad and amongst them are truly good people who support the Jews.

Well your brothers and sisters should include the liberal Jews which you were so quick to toss under the bus... I have a problem when people compare muslims with other groups... When Christians start bombing Israel and strapping bombs on their backs in the land of Israel I may see things differently. I don't get a good feeling when I read back through your posts... It seems like you are looking for a flash point here on the forum.

[Mizrahi 4 LIFE]

There are great Christians on this forum, why chase them away?  If you keep talking like this they will leave.

I said among the gentiles there are good and decent people if they support Israel/Jews they are good.

[Mizrahi 4 LIFE]

Well your brothers and sisters should include the liberal Jews which you were so quick to toss under the bus... I have a problem when people compare muslims with other groups... When Christians start bombing Israel and strapping bombs on their backs in the land of Israel I may see things differently. I don't get a good feeling when I read back through your posts... It seems like you are looking for a flash point here on the forum.

for me the Inquisition, Blood Libels, Pogroms, Holocaust is worse than the bombings.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Well your brothers and sisters should include the liberal Jews which you were so quick to toss under the bus... I have a problem when people compare muslims with other groups... When Christians start bombing Israel and strapping bombs on their backs in the land of Israel I may see things differently. I don't get a good feeling when I read back through your posts... It seems like you are looking for a flash point here on the forum.

I hear your point actually  BUT, it is worth noting that the PFLP was a Christian Arab terrorist group which murdered many Jews in Israel.   

[briann]

Islam 1500 years old that converted other nations by the sword.
Christianity 2000 years old that converted other nations by other means.

Islam has been a threat  to the Jews
Christianity also has been a threat to the Jews.

fact is we (Jews) have gone though literal HELL from both groups especially by the Christians. like i said before not all Christians as well as Muslims don't hate the Jews.

Can you say TROLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Yaakov Mendel]

Listen, Mizrahi, if you want to criticize us in a constructive way, because you support our ideas and you want us to succeed, we are very happy to hear you. But where are your innovative ideas, your detailed suggestions of improvements ? I can't see them anywhere. On the other hand, if you're here to disparage us, to defend Muslims and to antagonize our great Christian members by saying they are no better than Muslims to help us, then you are not welcome, you act just like a troll. If you can't see the difference between the frantically antisemitic Muslim leaders and Christian leaders such as Michelle Bachmann or Mike Huckabee, then you're a complete moron and a danger to the Jewish people. We're not talking about the Crusades or the Inquisition, we are concerned about the survival of Israel and the Western world in the 21st century.

[Dr. Dan]

[ :dance:quote author=Mizrahi 4 LIFE link=topic=56032.msg509450#msg509450 date=1309115818]
I'm not sure to be honest. it looks like a bunch of people posting various different news and articles from other sites. mostly the same type of information.

what i want this to be? in the days of JDL with Rabbi Kahane ZTL as its leader. posting information about Obama and Israel is not going to attract people. IMPACT is. I thought JTF was a new version of JDL but only now with better resources.
[/quote]

I think you know the goal of jtf.  To help the heroic Jewish settlers with humanitarian needs and to also become a mass movement.  We are a law abiding organization.  Doing things like the jdl used to do would be counter productive. If you are looking for action join the idf and fight the front lines and hunt down terrorists.

[jbeige]

message is clear we (Jews) can't trust anyone but our own brothers & sisters & of course Hashem. other people Muslims, Christians, and other groups of people I don't see much help from them but like i have said not all of them are bad and amongst them are truly good people who support the Jews.

It seems like your kind of thinking is isolating the Jewish people from the rest of the world, I think if and when the Jewish people start isolating themselves from the rest of the world they will be seen as weak and weakness is not what the true Jewish people are.

[jbeige]

message is clear we (Jews) can't trust anyone but our own brothers & sisters & of course Hashem. other people Muslims, Christians, and other groups of people I don't see much help from them but like i have said not all of them are bad and amongst them are truly good people who support the Jews.

So you think the Jewish people that support obama and the democrats that don't care if Israel survives are good?, Do you trust them?

[muman613]

It seems like your kind of thinking is isolating the Jewish people from the rest of the world, I think if and when the Jewish people start isolating themselves from the rest of the world they will be seen as weak and weakness is not what the true Jewish people are.

I dont know what you mean by this post...

Jewish people 'start' isolating themselves? The Jewish people have ALWAYS been isolated and none of the nations has been a friend to the Jew or Israel. The closest thing to a friendly nation has been America, and even then the relationship has been a rocky one.

The Torah clearly tells the Jewish people to be a nation unto itself. We will not be reckoned amongst all the nations, we are a nation alone, and a holy people to G-d himself.

It is very dangerous to tell Jews that they need to rely on outside nations. The only thing the Jewish nation needs to rely on is Hashems promise...

http://www.torah.org/learning/kolhakollel/5764/balak.html

Ba'alam's first blessing declared, "Behold! It is a nation that will dwell in solitude and not be reckoned among the nations." (Bamidbar/Numbers 23:9) Is this, indeed, a blessing? Dwelling in solitude does not sound like a good plight. Further, if this is the reversal of the curse, then the curse would have been that we dwell with other peoples and be reckoned among other nations. This does not sound like a terrible curse.

Rabbi Michel Twerski (1) expounds that the Hebrew for "reckoned" - yis'chashav - can also be translated as "calculate". Thus, the verse is concluding that the Jewish Nation "will not calculate based on other nations." The Children of Israel were blessed that they will not determine their success with a relative standard comparing them to the contemporary ideals of other nations. Rather, their accomplishments will be held to an objective standard set for them by G-d as enumerated in the Torah. G-d created in man the ability to achieve immeasurable levels of spirituality. However, this can only be pursued if his goals are rooted in the Divine. If he allows himself comfort by merely surpassing the achievements of another human being, he squanders the potential greatness that would have taken him inestimably closer to G-d. This is the curse that Ba'alam attempted to send the Jewish people: relative greatness.

Thus, solitude is a blessing. Not unlike the athlete who trains in a secluded location that facilitates a focus on his preparation and growth, so, too, the nation that actively fosters and builds its G-d consciousness desires an environment that assists that development.

http://www.njop.org/html/Balak5770-2010.html

Even in his first prophecy, Bilaam acknowledges that he is powerless to curse Israel, declaring in Numbers 23:8: “Mah eh’kov, loh ka’boh Kayl; ooh’mah ehz’ohm, loh zah’ahm Hashem,” How can I curse, if G-d has not cursed? How can I be angry, if G-d is not angry? Bilaam then discloses that he is helpless against Israel. After all, from their very origins, due to their loyalty to their forebears, the people of Israel are as firmly established as the rocks and the hills. Bilaam then famously exclaims, Numbers 23:9: “Hen ahm l’vah’dahd yish’kohn, ooh’vah’goyim loh yit’chah’shav,” Behold, a nation that dwells alone, and is not reckoned among other nations.

There are those who interpret this verse to mean that the Jewish people are never counted among the traditional number of 70 nations. There are 70 nations and the nation of Israel. According to tradition, while each of the 70 nations has its own angelic guide, the Jewish people are under the exclusive dominion of G-d. Therefore, it is inconceivable that any curse can have impact upon them.

Rashi (Rabbi Shlomo Yitzchaki, 1040-1105, foremost commentator on the Bible) maintains that the phrase, “Israel is not reckoned among the nations,” means that, in the final judgment, Israel will not be annihilated along with the other nations. The Netziv (R' Naftali Zvi Yehudah Berlin, author of Ha’amek Davar, 1817-1893) explains that when the Jewish people do not assimilate with the nations among whom they dwell, they will dwell in peace and with honor. However, if they do mix with the nations, they will lose all respect and dignity.

The prophecy of Bilaam declaring that the Jewish people are a breed apart, has proven to be a very accurate portrayal of the Jewish people throughout its history, for better or for worse. It is as if the world is divided in two factions: the Jewish people and the non-Jewish people. One, a tiny group--the other, the overwhelming numbers of humankind.

PS: That said, those nations that want to help the Jews are welcome to do so, and they are considered Righteous Gentiles and certainly they have a place in Olam Haba {The World to Come}...

[Lisa]

You guys, I see from his profile that M4L was banned. 

[Dr. Dan]

You guys, I see from his profile that M4L was banned. 

Yes. Obviously a troll