Moshe Feiglin Speaks about Glenn Beck

[muman613]

I must say that I agree with what Moshe says about Glenn Beck and most of the non-Jewish zionists... But I also have to give Glenn Beck credit for standing up for the Jewish cause. We should not push him and his supporters away because they may be able to sway public opinion towards Israel and the Jewish people...

I myself have always felt that Christians who support Israel are doing so not because they feel that the Jews are right, or that helping Hashems people is what G-d wants.... But they help Israel because their faith tells them that Israel is important for the end-of-times 'prophecies' of the Christian bible. I still feel this way, and apparently Moshe Feiglin feels this way also...

But I also believe that non-Jews are essential to help Israel out in the field of 'world opinion'. I will not push them away and I will attempt to get them to understand the Jewish belief.


http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/145734

Feiglin Warns Against Glenn Beck’s ‘Heartwarming Crusade’
by Gil Ronen

Moshe Feiglin, head of the Jewish Leadership faction inside Likud, has come out swinging against media personality Glenn Beck following Beck’s visit to Israel this week and ahead of his August “Restoring Courage” event in Jerusalem.

Feiglin told readers of his weekly column that he had decided to turn down an invitation to a reception for Beck in eastern Jerusalem. Feiglin's sees hidden motives behind Beck's decision to hold a large rally benetah next to the southern side of the Mount.
 
“Beck is considered – quite justifiably so – as the best public defender of Israel, and especially the Israeli Right,” Feiglin acknowledged. “When one watches a well dressed, thoughtful and influential American who glues millions of viewers to the screen with explanations that Israel’s Right has already despaired of – one immediately feels great joy and pride. Glenn Beck is without doubt a great supporter of the Israeli cause.”
 
Beck’s speech before a Knesset committee Monday sounded like a page from the Jewish Leadership newsletter, Feiglin added. “But then Beck said the following words – 'I invite you to join us… your nation is my nation and your G-d is my G-d.'”
 
“Since Beck is not in a process of conversion to Judaism and since we already have experience with Christian lovers of Israel, we gathered that this quote from the Scroll of Ruth should not be understood in its original meaning of ‘I am joining you’ but that the real meaning of the words is apparently – ‘I am replacing you.’”
 
The Temple Mount is not a Christian site, explained Feiglin. “It is certainly not a Muslim one. Glenn Beck talks a lot about the need to say the truth. Well then, let us say it. The Temple Mount is solely the place of the Jewish Temple.”
 
“All nations who understand this are welcome to come to it (within the area that they are allowed to enter) and to pray to the G-d of Avraham, Yitzchak and Ya’akov. Esau and Yishmael have their own holy places – do not touch the Holies of Israel.”
 
Feiglin wrote that it is becoming clearer that Beck represents Christian “replacement theology” (“supersessionism”) that sees Christianity as the “New Israel,” seeks to bring “waves of Christian aliyah” to Israel and “use Jewish redemption as a jumping board for Christian redemption.”
 
Feiglin accused the Jewish and nationalist leaders who “flock” to Beck of inadvertently assisting “a very refined and heartwarming kind of modern crusade.”

(IsraelNationalNews.com)

[IsraelForever]

We should not push him and his supporters away because they may be able to sway public opinion towards Israel and the Jewish people...

This is 100% correct (IMHO).  Call me naive, but I love it when someone like Beck is such a big supporter of Israel even if his reasons aren't our reasons.  He's a friend of Israel and we need influential friends.

[briann]

Yes, Glenn and other conservative commentators HAVE made a difference.   

[muman613]

Moshe just wrote a piece for A7 which I repost here:

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Articles/Article.aspx/10408

Moshe Feiglin's Take on Beck
Tammuz 12, 5771, 14 July 11 11:57
by Moshe Feiglin

(Israelnationalnews.com) It was hot on Monday, but I took my jacket along, nevertheless, hanging it on a hook in my car. It was the start of a long day of meetings, the pinnacle of which was to be a reception that Glenn Beck was holding for an exclusive group of people in a Jerusalem apartment, and I wanted to look my official best.

 Beck is justifiably considered one of the best public relations people that Israel – and particularly the Israeli Right – has today. When you see an intelligent and articulate American gluing millions of Americans to their seats with the Israeli Right's case, making points that the Right dares not make, you immediately feel great pride and joy.

 Glenn Beck is surely a great lover of Israel. He is not an active missionary and is not establishing a dubious charity foundation here. He is a very popular broadcaster; his job is public relations – what could be better than that?

 But on Monday afternoon, I heard Glenn Beck speaking before the Immigration Committee in the Knesset. The main point of his message was that we must return to a policy of telling the people the truth. He called upon his listeners to attend an international event that he is organizing in support of Israel, to be held at the foot of the Southern Wall of the Temple Mount. Toward the end of his speech, Beck quoted the Scroll of Ruth:

 "I invite you to join us," said Beck. "Your nation is my nation and your G-d is my G-d."

I must admit that when a friendly non-Jew starts to quote the Bible, I get a bit nervous. It is not just the long history of anti-Semitism that has developed a genetic mutation in the noses of Jews, giving them great sensitivity to anything that smells of Christianity - but also my own personal experience with avowed lovers of Israel and the settlers who took great pains to mask their Christian motives.

As Glenn Beck is not in the process of conversion to Judaism, it is impossible to understand his quote from the Scroll of Ruth as meaning, "I am joining you." Apparently, the real meaning of his words is "I am replacing you."

A quick study of Glenn Beck's speeches before non-Israeli audiences and a simple internet search of his biography show that he is a believing Mormon who is motivated by a deep religious consciousness. In a live broadcast from the Temple Mount, Beck theatrically shows his audience how in that very place, Jesus turned over the tables of the Jewish money-changers who served the pilgrims to the Temple. He forgot to mention that with this act, that man created one of the most blatantly anti-Semitic Christian legends that lives on to this very day.

The problem is not Glenn Beck's beliefs. Beck is a good person who believes in what he is doing. The problem is that the most loyal Jewish public is giving him its support without thoroughly checking his message. They are unwittingly abetting a very gentle and heartwarming type of modern crusade. From a religious point of view, there is no difference between the Western Wall and the Southern Wall, where Beck's event is planned. They are both walls of the Mount of G-d's House. Would we allow a group of Christians to spread its message at the Western Wall?

As long as Glenn Beck and his friends support Israel from the outside, understanding that your nation is your nation and my nation is my nation; that your god is your god and my G-d is my G-d, all is well and good and it is important to cooperate with them. But when it turns out that the agenda is actually replacement theology; a theology that aims to bring waves of Christian aliyah here and to use the Jewish renaissance in Israel as a springboard to a Christian renaissance – I cannot lend it the legitimacy of Manhigut Yehudit.

Glenn Beck speaks a lot about our obligation to tell the truth, so let us do just that: The Temple Mount is the home of the Holy Temple of the Jews – exclusively. All the non-Jews who understand that are invited to come to the Temple Mount (in the area where they are permitted according to Jewish law) to pray to the Master of the Universe, the G-d of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Esau and Ishmael have their own holy places. Please honor our exclusive sovereignty over Jerusalem, including our spiritual sovereignty, just as we respect your spiritual sovereignty in your lands.

On Monday, my jacket remained in my car. And so did I.

[briann]

Its obvious Moshe made up his mind not to welcome Beck from the get go.  I don't think just because he says, 'your god is my god' means that Glenn is carelessly revealing his evil plans for a Christian take-over of Israel.

The truth is that Glenn knows that the Christians MUST support Israel and the Jews.  He knows that if Christians stray away from Israel, they stray away from righteousness; he is really on the same page as Chaim on this and many other issues.  And he also has said numerous times that the Jews are the chosen ones, and that Israel is a Jewish state and he wouldn't focus on this so much if he intends to start an inquisition. 

I find Moshe's attitudes very narrow-minded and disappointing.

[muman613]

I sure hope Mr. Feiglin is wrong... I have been thinking that Beck is a good thing..

[Dr. Dan]

But here is the problem with what feiglan says.  He assumes that jews should lead the way to free israel and he's right.  However with the vast amounts of self hating jews in power, jews like us need glen becks to make everyone aware.  I liken him to the persian king who ended the first diaspora. 

Fyi, christians who ulterior motives to support  israel do not scare me.

[briann]

But here is the problem with what feiglan says.  He assumes that jews should lead the way to free israel and he's right.  However with the vast amounts of self hating jews in power, jews like us need glen becks to make everyone aware.  I liken him to the persian king who ended the first diaspora.  

Fyi, christians who ulterior motives to support  israel do not scare me.

I have listened to Beck quite a lot, and I have never heard any insincerity at all.   He has spoken more about Jewish causes than any other conservative commentator, including all the Jewish ones combined.   He knows, like Chaim does, that Gentile support is very important.  NOT because Israel needs money or direction from Gentiles, but its important from a spiritual and moral standpoint.  Without this moral compass, gentiles may devolve into their dark age Nazi past and stray from righteousness.  They may fall back into the evil lies and propaganda of the past, and may support Islam and all enemies of the Jewish people.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Moshe is right on this one.    Beck says some great things and at times makes great arguments in favor of the Jewish people and Israel.   But we cannot afford to tolerate any replacement theology talk, even a tiny smidgeon.   It is a sickening disease, one intent on killing us (whether its through love or kindness does not matter - its goal is to destroy us).     You are welcome to celebrate us or ally with us, but Israel is for the Jews, and the Temple Mount is Jewish.    Anyone else there is a guest, plain and simple.

[briann]

Moshe is right on this one.    Beck says some great things and at times makes great arguments in favor of the Jewish people and Israel.   But we cannot afford to tolerate any replacement theology talk, even a tiny smidgeon.   It is a sickening disease, one intent on killing us (whether its through love or kindness does not matter - its goal is to destroy us).     You are welcome to celebrate us or ally with us, but Israel is for the Jews, and the Temple Mount is Jewish.    Anyone else there is a guest, plain and simple.

He is right about replacement theology as being bad and to be weary of it, but he is dead wrong about Beck and his motives, and he is unable to see past his own narrow view of things.  Beck has NEVER said he wants to be anything other than a guest.  He is not going there to set up a mission or a church or give sermons to jews about jesus, this is a completely baseless accusation from Moshe.  Moshe will never realize that there are many gentiles who have great reverence and respect for the chosen people who go to Israel, not to missionize, but to get closer to God, the chosen people, and YES, their messiah.

I know several gentiles, including Vito who have done the same.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

He is right about replacement theology as being bad and to be weary of it, but he is dead wrong about Beck and his motives, and he is unable to see past his own narrow view of things.  Beck has NEVER said he wants to be anything other than a guest. 

It's easy to dismiss someone else's point of view by calling it narrow, but why wouldn't a person, any person, see things from their own point of view?   Your statement "he is unable to see past his own narrow view of things" strikes me as very odd.   I also see my own view of things, as you see yours.   The question is, whose view is valid?    To me, Feiglin presents a valid point, and you have offered nothing to combat it.  Nothing at all.

He is not going there to set up a mission or a church or give sermons to jews about jesus, this is a completely baseless accusation from Moshe. 

I think it's actually a baseless accusation by you.
Moshe Feiglin said this in his article:  "He is not an active missionary and is not establishing a dubious charity foundation here"

And you're attributing something to feiglin that feiglin never said.

Now let me quote you things that Beck has said in promotion of his event at the Mount:


“They are going to attack the center of our faith, our common faith, and that is Jerusalem. And it won’t be with bullets or bombs. It will be with a two-state solution that cuts off Jerusalem, the old city, to the rest of the world.”

Nope, not a common faith, we have different faiths, and nope Jerusalem is not yours it's ours.    That must be made clear.   And it's a dangerous premise he is floating.   You are too focused on religion and messiahs and christianity to understand the point I am making and the point Feiglin is making.   Our (Jewish) so-called "religion" is a national existence.  And from the beginning of the existence of our restored commonwealth, from DAY ONE, it has been a constant battle against meddlers and outside forces who insist that Jerusalem somehow doesn't belong to us, it's really the pope's, it's really the muslims', it's really the universal man's, etc etc... And much of the Oslo trauma stems from this constant desire by other peoples to wrest away our capital (and our land) from us.   

NO, Glenn Beck, Jerusalem is NOT YOURS.   That is not an insult or personal affront.  That is simply a fact. 

Moshe will never realize that there are many gentiles who have great reverence and respect for the chosen people who go to Israel, not to missionize, but to get closer to G-d, the chosen people, and YES...

I think you're assuming a lot of things about Feiglin, but really you're making them up.   He is not "anti-gentile" if that's what you're implying.

[edu]

Moshe Feiglin works within the Likud Political Party. The Likud party that has given up the most land to the enemy than any other, Political Party.
Within the Likud party Moshe Feiglin, works with some individuals who have a quasi-Zionist ideology, but who do not believe in Orthodox Judaism, and some don't even believe our right to the land of Israel is based on the Bible.

Yet, Moshe Feiglin is willing to overlook these differences to advance his ideological cause.
If he is working together with secularists, some of them are not even Jewish, for example, there's a rightwing Druze, MK who is somewhat in alliance with Feiglin, why all of a sudden, is he upset about Glenn Beck?

Or am I missing something? Is there a bigger danger of being ideologically damaged by association with Glenn Beck than there is by being associated with Feiglin's friends?

My criticism of Feiglin is not to be considered an endorsement or a rejection of his tactics of working with those that deny Torah. Concerning this tactic I do not wish to comment on, at this point. My criticism of Feigllin, is what moral right does He have to speak out against an alliance with Glenn Beck.

[IsraeliGovtAreKapos]

Glenn Beck supported Rich Iott, a Nazi who was caught dressed up with a Nazi Waffen SS uniform. Glenn Beck is a Nazi piece of sub-human garbage. And Moshe Feiglin who betrayed Yigal Amir, Baruch Goldstein and supports Bibi and the Likud treacherous party is not a Tzadik either

[Dr. Dan]

Glenn Beck supported Rich Iott, a Nazi who was caught dressed up with a Nazi Waffen SS uniform. Glenn Beck is a Nazi piece of sub-human garbage. And Moshe Feiglin who betrayed Yigal Amir, Baruch Goldstein and supports Bibi and the Likud treacherous party is not a Tzadik either

Nobody is perfect like you, Ron.

[Dr. Dan]

No but really the gesture and support us appreciated.  It us up to the jewish people to redeem israel just like moses with He's help redeemed israel. There is more merit when a jew converted or non convert does this.

But still, the reality is that feiglin shouldn't be talking.  He has mistakingly joined likud a nazi self hating party.  I would believe someone like noam federman if he said something like this.

[mord]

Glenn Beck supported Rich Iott, a Nazi who was caught dressed up with a Nazi Waffen SS uniform. Glenn Beck is a Nazi piece of sub-human garbage. And Moshe Feiglin who betrayed Yigal Amir, Baruch Goldstein and supports Bibi and the Likud treacherous party is not a Tzadik either

True but his Jewish Friends and business partner said he's the least anti Jewish guy they know. He also has a long history of pro Jewish and pro Israel stances

[Muck DeFuslims]

Moshe Feiglin's Take on Beck
Tammuz 12, 5771, 14 July 11 11:57
by Moshe Feiglin

(Israelnationalnews.com) It was hot on Monday, but I took my jacket along, nevertheless, hanging it on a hook in my car. It was the start of a long day of meetings, the pinnacle of which was to be a reception that Glenn Beck was holding for an exclusive group of people in a Jerusalem apartment, and I wanted to look my official best. ....
On Monday, my jacket remained in my car. And so did I.

==========================================
"My jacket remained in my car. And so did I."

What the heck does that mean ?

Did Feiglin come to the conclusion he couldn't support Beck's rally while driving around and then decide not to attend the reception ?

If Feiglin was a real leader, he'd have attended the reception, explained his concerns to Beck, made his feelings known, got Beck's response and proceeded from there.

Instead we get this piece in A7 ?

Am I reading this wrong ?

Feiglin's heart is in the right place, but he really needs to re-evaluate his tactics. As a member of the 'exclusive group' invited to attend the reception at the apartment in Jerusalem, Feiglin had an opportunity and a responsibility to voice his concerns directly to Beck at that time.

Instead he chose to remain in his car with his jacket.

Puhlease.

Moshe claims he brought the jacket along because he wanted to look his 'official best'.

Well Moshe, your official best isn't looking too good to me.

[Rubystars]

Glenn Beck is not a Christian, he's a Mormon, and that cult believes in a completely different version of G-d than Christianity. It teaches arrogant men that they can become just like G-d and rule over their own planets. To me this is extremely evil.

I do think he genuinely supports Israel but I could be wrong on that, so in that sense what he says is a good thing. At least he tends to be a better influence on Americans with respect to that issue than someone like Obama anyway.

[Aces High]

Feiglin should shut his fat trap.   He doesn't have too much to say about the Arabs who infest Israel, but is a real big mouth  when it comes to Glen Beck.  That's because it's safe and easy to attack Beck.   Feiglin likes to hear himself talk.   Israel finally has an extremely influential media personality who is genuinely on Israel's side, and Feglin is gonna f.... everything up. 

[Dr. Dan]

Feiglin should shut his fat trap.   He doesn't have too much to say about the Arabs who infest Israel, but is a real big mouth  when it comes to Glen Beck.  That's because it's safe and easy to attack Beck.   Feiglin likes to hear himself talk.   Israel finally has an extremely influential media personality who is genuinely on Israel's side, and Feglin is gonna f.... everything up. 

Well said.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

As I tried to post at a7 (they do not accept or publish my comments there), there are a lot of glenn beck fanboys out there (including on this site) who are really worked up over all this but how about taking into consideration what feiglin says?   In terms of his projewish stance, is becks job to say "I'm pro israel" or is it to take into consideration what real Jewish people stand for and work with them from there?

The bottom line is, it cannot be said loudly enough:  jerusalem is JEWISH it is ours, not yours.  It is not xtian.  Feiglin is just the messenger so his ties to this group or that group or his personal life in any other respect is NOT relevant to the point he raises about glenn beck.

[Rubystars]

As I tried to post at a7 (they do not accept or publish my comments there), there are a lot of glenn beck fanboys out there (including on this site) who are really worked up over all this but how about taking into consideration what feiglin says?   In terms of his projewish stance, is becks job to say "I'm pro israel" or is it to take into consideration what real Jewish people stand for and work with them from there?

The bottom line is, it cannot be said loudly enough:  jerusalem is JEWISH it is ours, not yours.  It is not xtian.  Feiglin is just the messenger so his ties to this group or that group or his personal life in any other respect is NOT relevant to the point he raises about glenn beck.

The conundrum comes in that Jerusalem is considered to be a holy city by Christians too. You can be annoyed with this if you want to but it doesn't change it. Isn't it better for them to believe that way and yet support the Jewish ownership of Jerusalem than to believe that way and want to take it away from Jews like the Muslims do?

[cjd]

Its obvious Moshe made up his mind not to welcome Beck from the get go.  I don't think just because he says, 'your G-d is my G-d' means that Glenn is carelessly revealing his evil plans for a Christian take-over of Israel.

The truth is that Glenn knows that the Christians MUST support Israel and the Jews.  He knows that if Christians stray away from Israel, they stray away from righteousness; he is really on the same page as Chaim on this and many other issues.  And he also has said numerous times that the Jews are the chosen ones, and that Israel is a Jewish state and he wouldn't focus on this so much if he intends to start an inquisition. 

I find Moshe's attitudes very narrow-minded and disappointing.

I have followed Beck for the past few years and must say if he was pushing any replacement theology ideas they went clear over my head... Some days it almost seemed like he prepared his show with material taken from our forum... I think Beck sees Israel as the canary in the coal mine when it comes to muslims undermining non muslim countries... I personally think Feiglin is barking up the wrong tree for his own reasons when it comes to Beck however I won't labor the point... For most Christians visiting Israel its a chance to see what they consider the Holy Land... They know they are in a land the belongs to the Jewish people... I don't think there is even a question of this in most peoples mind who make the trip. Personally I think the problem is that Beck is generating just a bit too much PR for maintaining the Jewish State and only the Jewish State... I am not 100% sure where Feiglin comes down on this issue but I have an idea... That Idea tells me he would rather Beck stay quiet generate less public opinion on the issue back here in the U.S.A and sort of let events take their course over the next year or so.

[nessuno]

I must say that I agree with what Moshe says about Glenn Beck and most of the non-Jewish zionists... But I also have to give Glenn Beck credit for standing up for the Jewish cause. We should not push him and his supporters away because they may be able to sway public opinion towards Israel and the Jewish people...

I myself have always felt that Christians who support Israel are doing so not because they feel that the Jews are right, or that helping Hashems people is what G-d wants.... But they help Israel because their faith tells them that Israel is important for the end-of-times 'prophecies' of the Christian bible. I still feel this way, and apparently Moshe Feiglin feels this way also...

But I also believe that non-Jews are essential to help Israel out in the field of 'world opinion'. I will not push them away and I will attempt to get them to understand the Jewish belief.


http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/145734

Feiglin Warns Against Glenn Beck’s ‘Heartwarming Crusade’
by Gil Ronen

Moshe Feiglin, head of the Jewish Leadership faction inside Likud, has come out swinging against media personality Glenn Beck following Beck’s visit to Israel this week and ahead of his August “Restoring Courage” event in Jerusalem.

Feiglin told readers of his weekly column that he had decided to turn down an invitation to a reception for Beck in eastern Jerusalem. Feiglin's sees hidden motives behind Beck's decision to hold a large rally benetah next to the southern side of the Mount.
 
“Beck is considered – quite justifiably so – as the best public defender of Israel, and especially the Israeli Right,” Feiglin acknowledged. “When one watches a well dressed, thoughtful and influential American who glues millions of viewers to the screen with explanations that Israel’s Right has already despaired of – one immediately feels great joy and pride. Glenn Beck is without doubt a great supporter of the Israeli cause.”
 
Beck’s speech before a Knesset committee Monday sounded like a page from the Jewish Leadership newsletter, Feiglin added. “But then Beck said the following words – 'I invite you to join us… your nation is my nation and your G-d is my G-d.'”
 
“Since Beck is not in a process of conversion to Judaism and since we already have experience with Christian lovers of Israel, we gathered that this quote from the Scroll of Ruth should not be understood in its original meaning of ‘I am joining you’ but that the real meaning of the words is apparently – ‘I am replacing you.’”
 
The Temple Mount is not a Christian site, explained Feiglin. “It is certainly not a Muslim one. Glenn Beck talks a lot about the need to say the truth. Well then, let us say it. The Temple Mount is solely the place of the Jewish Temple.”
 
“All nations who understand this are welcome to come to it (within the area that they are allowed to enter) and to pray to the G-d of Avraham, Yitzchak and Ya’akov. Esau and Yishmael have their own holy places – do not touch the Holies of Israel.”
 
Feiglin wrote that it is becoming clearer that Beck represents Christian “replacement theology” (“supersessionism”) that sees Christianity as the “New Israel,” seeks to bring “waves of Christian aliyah” to Israel and “use Jewish redemption as a jumping board for Christian redemption.”
 
Feiglin accused the Jewish and nationalist leaders who “flock” to Beck of inadvertently assisting “a very refined and heartwarming kind of modern crusade.”

(IsraelNationalNews.com)

You seem to give much thought to the beliefs, and actions, of Christians.
Being that I am Christian,  one of the dreaded Roman Catholics, I can say with some authority...you are wrong more often than not.

You have done quite a bit, in an attempt, to 'push away' the Christian members of JTF.
So at least be honest about it.

I think Glen Beck is sincere.
He knows that Israel and America are in the same boat.
Sitting by and allowing Israel to be destroyed, is sitting by and allowing America to be destroyed.  He is religious and decent.  Why look for evil motives?  Ahhhh...he is the wrong religion. hmmmmmm....sound familiar.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

The conundrum comes in that Jerusalem is considered to be a holy city by Christians too. You can be annoyed with this if you want to but it doesn't change it. Isn't it better for them to believe that way and yet support the Jewish ownership of Jerusalem than to believe that way and want to take it away from Jews like the Muslims do?

Believing it's holy is fine.   Believing it belongs to anyone other than Jews in the Jewish homeland is not fine.  Believing the rightful ownership is anything other than jewish is not fine.

Otherwise any such Christian is simply repeating the mistaken deeds of the catholic church as from day 1 they used all of their political power and influence that they possibly could to wrest Jerusalem away from the Jews.  That effort to make Jerusalem "international" persists to this very day and it has taken the form of giving half that capital to the enemies of the Jewish people and making the holy cites run by international/foreign forces  (back to the days of the british mandate, let the pogroms begin).   And that is the result of any attitutde that says Jerusalem does not belong to the Jews.