Torah and Jewish Idea > Torah and Jewish Idea
Shalom
muman613:
Here this article from Aish.com discusses the technique I referred to called Rabbinic/Talmudic Exegesis...
--- Quote ---http://www.aish.com/sp/ph/Why_You_Dont_Understand_the_Bible.html
In fact, later Bible scholars such as Robert Alter and R. N. Whybray held that the text was more a unified whole than not. Alter in particular expressed remorse that these earlier critics did not take the classical Jewish approach more seriously. Why? Because to the Talmudic scholar, the Torah's repetitions, multiple Divine names, textual divergences and variations of language and style contain a wealth of information. To treat them as mere editorial mishaps is nothing less than tragic. It stands to reason that the Jewish sages of antiquity and the subsequent elucidators, with their assumption of Divine authorship (and thus a unified text), deep familiarity with the material and hundreds of years of crowd-sourced scholarship under their belts, were in the best position to interpret and comprehend these documents.
The text of the Torah is coded in multiple ways. Those with a trained eye intuitively sense in these passages an invitation to delve deeper. An extra or missing word or variant spelling, for example, act both as a marker and specialized tool to reveal information. For instance, through their numerical values, a variant spelling for the only round object that is mentioned twice in the Book of Kings is used to derive Pi. There are tens of thousands of these units of information. Each one is sourced in the Five Books of Moses or the later writings and the process of extracting them is known as the Oral Law. There are 13 rules that govern this exegesis and without them (and the classical commentaries) the book is exceedingly opaque.
Additionally, without the oral tradition to explain them, what are we to make of commandments such as "slaughter the animal in the way that I have shown you" with no hint as to how that is to be done? What does it mean to "guard the Sabbath and keep it holy?" There are penalties for not doing it right but no description as to how to do it. How exactly are parents supposed to be "honored," and in a practical sense what constitutes "loving one's fellow as oneself?"
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muman613:
--- Quote from: Dan Ben Noah on May 16, 2012, 03:44:02 AM ---But in the case of melachot it is very logical because the text clearly associates melachot with creative works. The context supports this method that the Sages used. Furthermore, these forbidden melachot were recognized as binding by the Sanhedrin, which was the official high authority on Jewish law which the Torah itself tells Jews to obey. This has no connection to later developments such as kabbala which extrapolates itself back onto the Tanach in ways that don't make sense in the context of the passage, and the Zohar was never recognized as binding by an official Sanhedrin. The fact that authentic Torah principles aren't always laid out explicitly in the Tanach is not an excuse to paint things into it that aren't there.
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The fact is that Kabbalah and the Zohar are recognized by most Jews as authentic Judaism. This includes great sages and those who establish Halacha. I don't quite understand why you are on some crusade against authentic Jewish belief. I assume it is because you are a neophyte.
Study more and learn. I don't want to argue with you about this. If you would like to tell me exactly what it is you don't 'like' about Kabbalah and what you think it says which is against the Torah? I just don't understand where you are coming from. Again it has to be that you don't really know what you are talking about.
Zelhar:
Dan, when you suggest preposterous things like the "vatican plant" conspiracy theory, it only makes you a promoter of a fantasy fraud, which is per your own testimony the sort of things you want to weed out.
HaRambam didn't suggested made up fantasies to rule out kabbalah so take an example from him.
muman613:
--- Quote from: Dan Ben Noah on May 16, 2012, 04:01:42 AM ---The fact that something is recognized by most Jews doesn't mean it's authentic Judaism. The determining factor that makes something binding on all Jews is the Sanhedrin recognizing it. As in the days of Elijah, the majority of people were going after evil but only Elijah and his immediate followers did not bow to Baal. As Rabbi Kahane said, in every generation there are always a few who understand--always understand, even if you are among the few. The Zohar, as modern rabbis are pointing out more and more (such as Rabbi Qafih and Rabbi Bar-Hayim), is a forgery. It was forged by Moshe De Leon who apparently could not sell it if it had his own name on it.
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Dan,
Kabbalah consists of more than just Zohar. And it is very impossible, and improbable, that just the publication of the Zohar would change the view of Judaism. The Rabbis had been learning and teaching Kabbalah for long before the publication of the Zohar and this is why it was accepted.
You are entitled to your opinion but I don't think your view will succeed. The Jewish faith has lived because of the enlightenment which is contained in the secrets of the Torah.
I am certainly aware of the theories about the sources for Zohar and while there may be issues concerning it, the basic stories of Zohar are consistent with the Kabbalah.
muman613:
--- Quote from: Dan Ben Noah on May 16, 2012, 04:33:35 AM ---I'm not promoting it unless I say it is true. This I don't know whether it is true or not but I've already weeded out Isaac Luria regardless of whether he's a Vatican plant or not based on other principles.
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Oh yes, you 'weeded out' Isaac Luria.... Lol!
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