Author Topic: Linux Users - Which Desktop Environment Do You Prefer ? (Read 2229 times)

Zelhar · « **on:** June 19, 2013, 03:30:39 PM »

I prefer KDE, which is good because I have been using OpenSUSE for quiet a while now and it is KDE-oriented. I find that KDE looks good and convenient to work with. My second choice would be Xfce because it is similar to KDE only somewhat uglier and leaner. Before I switched to SUSE I used to work with Kubuntu.

My first linux experience was with a Kanotix live CD (also a KDE edition) which I used on my old laptop when its hard drive died. I think I got used to KDE since then and have never liked the looks of GNOME ever since.

I find the new GNOME Shell interface unusable although never really gave it a real try.

muman613 · « **Reply #1 on:** June 19, 2013, 04:53:31 PM »

I am currently firmly in the Gnome camp...

My first Linux GUI experience was with early gnome... I briefly switched to KDE for a while but eventually I found KDE slightly slower and less stable than Gnome and I switched back...

Gnome is stable, and it is pretty standard for the Linux desktop (available out of the box for most Linux distros), and it has all the features I need at the time (Great Windows Manager support, multiple views, view switcher, etc.)..

muman613 · « **Reply #2 on:** June 19, 2013, 04:55:09 PM »

Most of my work involves the Commandline interface. I used Gnome-Terminal which is a very capable and customizable terminal...

Zelhar · « **Reply #3 on:** June 19, 2013, 05:14:06 PM »

You didn't have a problem getting used to the Gnome Shell ?

muman613 · « **Reply #4 on:** June 19, 2013, 05:17:50 PM »

Quote from: Zelhar on June 19, 2013, 05:14:06 PM

You didn't have a problem getting used to the Gnome Shell ?

I am not quite sure what problems you have with Gnome shell...

On my Ubuntu 10.04 work system (which I am currently using) I am running Gnome 2.30.2. Maybe the problem you are concerned with is only in Gnome 3. But I run Ubuntu 12.10 at home and it has the latest Gnome and Unity shell and I have not had any issues.

Admittedly I found the Unity shell a bit irritating but over time I have become accustomed to it.

Zelhar · « **Reply #5 on:** June 19, 2013, 05:32:39 PM »

Yes I especially dislike the Shell interface. When Unity had first came out it just didn't run on my computer which gave me another reason not to like it.

I like the "traditional" windows like taskbar with start like menu and system tray. On unity I am not sure what you have. I think there is a sidebar launcher or task bar and another bar that is by default on the upper edge. It seemed very inconvenient and also taking too much screen area.

Zelhar · « **Reply #6 on:** June 19, 2013, 06:13:58 PM »

Another thing is I think generally Qt based GUI looks better then GTK.

muman613 · « **Reply #7 on:** June 19, 2013, 07:34:47 PM »

Quote from: Zelhar on June 19, 2013, 06:13:58 PM

Another thing is I think generally Qt based GUI looks better then GTK.

Qt programs, and KDE programs can run just fine in Gnome also...

Some of our developers use KDevelop (The IDE {Integrated Development Environment} for KDE) and Kate (the KDE editor) from within the Gnome shell..

Israel Chai · « **Reply #8 on:** June 19, 2013, 08:19:02 PM »

do you know of a linux that is compatible with most programs?

muman613 · « **Reply #9 on:** June 19, 2013, 08:24:11 PM »

Quote from: Lethal Kahanist Zealot on June 19, 2013, 08:19:02 PM

do you know of a linux that is compatible with most programs?

What do you mean by this? Linux is compatible with all programs which are built for Linux.

If you want to run Windows apps on Linux there are two or more options:

1) Use WINE (The Windows Emulator) which supports many programs. I have actually run MS Word 2007 in WINE on Ubuntu 12.4...

2) Run Windows in a Virtual Machine... All Windows programs run in a VM with no issue.

But there are many, many apps for Linux and they are all mostly free... I still think OpenOffice (and the LibreOffice branch) are sufficient for most applications. I use LibreOffice at work and I work with documents created with MS Word (.doc & .docx) with no problem (unless the document uses a lot of tables and formatting)..

http://www.winehq.org/

Quote

About Wine
Wine (originally an acronym for "Wine Is Not an Emulator") is a compatibility layer capable of running Windows applications on several POSIX-compliant operating systems, such as Linux, Mac OSX, & BSD. Instead of simulating internal Windows logic like a virtual machine or emulator, Wine translates Windows API calls into POSIX calls on-the-fly, eliminating the performance and memory penalties of other methods and allowing you to cleanly integrate Windows applications into your desktop.

Wine began in 1993 under the initial coordination of Bob Amstadt as a way to support running Windows 3.1 programs on Linux. Very early on, leadership over Wine's development passed to Alexandre Julliard, who has managed the project ever since. Over the years, as the Windows API and applications have evolved to take advantage of new hardware and software, Wine has adapted to support new features, all while being ported to other OSes, becoming more stable, and providing a better user-experience.

An ambitious project by definition, work on Wine would steadily continue for 15 years before the program finally reached v1.0, the first stable release, in 2008. Several releases later, Wine is still under active development today, and although there is more work to be done, millions of people are estimated to use Wine to run their Windows software on the OS of their choice.

muman613 · « **Reply #10 on:** June 19, 2013, 08:46:56 PM »

I posted this example of the work I have done on the SMP Debugger and the target bring-up scripts I developed a few months ago.... Here you see the 'Compiz' effects of transparent windows, running my cross-platform debugger in a Windows XP Virtual Machine, bring-up of a target board and running a stream through the decoder...

muman613 · « **Reply #11 on:** June 19, 2013, 08:53:32 PM »

Some youtube demos of Compiz and Gnome:

White Israelite · « **Reply #12 on:** June 19, 2013, 10:10:05 PM »

I don't really use Linux for home often so I prefer terminal, most of my servers run on CentOS or FreeBSD. At home I run a modified version of Debian with gnome

Zelhar · « **Reply #13 on:** June 20, 2013, 04:54:07 AM »

Muman why don't you upgrade your work system ?

HiWarp · « **Reply #14 on:** June 20, 2013, 06:52:47 AM »

Because I'm a computer snob, I voted GUI is for dummies. Having said that, I use Gnome.

angryChineseKahanist · « **Reply #15 on:** June 20, 2013, 04:09:34 PM »

I use console only for headless servers and headed servers.

I use 1:xfce 2:kde 3:gnome for remote head for servers. Currently I'm testing a raspberry pi for a remote "head" and I'm using the default rasbian lxde.
xfce because its simpler. or X (xinit) by itself if I feel masochistic - you can't resize or move windows or at least you can only do it once.

I also use windows 7 as a desktop. sorry folks but I think win 7 is the most stable desktop. It hasn't crashed at all this year so far. I leave my win 7 machines on 24/7.

Zelhar · « **Reply #16 on:** June 20, 2013, 04:42:34 PM »

I think windows 7 is a fine OS but now it's in the end of life stage because 8 is out and 9 is probably a year or two away.

And of course it's not free, I am not talking only on expensive price, it's restrictive. For example if you bought a computer with preinstalled windows you are stuck with it you can't make a fresh new install. If you don't buy the expensive "ultimate" edition there are irritating restrictions like not being able to switch system language pack.

muman613 · « **Reply #17 on:** June 20, 2013, 04:51:00 PM »

Quote from: Zelhar on June 20, 2013, 04:54:07 AM

Muman why don't you upgrade your work system ?

Zelhar,

Good question. And I have a good answer...

In my department I manage a group of eight developers. It is important to support an operating system which is stable and has the latest security patches available for download. Ubuntu has what is called LTS (Long Term Support) which means that Cannonical ensures that a version of the OS is fully supported for 4 years. When I started here we were using Ubuntu 8.04 (LTS) but it expired several years ago and at the time Ubuntu 10.04 was the next LTS release. The 11 series of Ubuntu did not have a LTS release, and now version 12.x is available....

I must provide tools which run on the Ubuntu platform and it is easiest to support only one or two linux distros. I also build for CentOS and Fedora Core (which some developers use here) but I use a Virtual Machine in order to build those versions.

We will probably migrate to 12.04 eventually...

angryChineseKahanist · « **Reply #18 on:** June 20, 2013, 04:55:13 PM »

Quote from: Zelhar on June 20, 2013, 04:42:34 PM

I think windows 7 is a fine OS but now it's in the end of life stage because 8 is out and 9 is probably a year or two away.

And of course it's not free, I am not talking only on expensive price, it's restrictive. For example if you bought a computer with preinstalled windows you are stuck with it you can't make a fresh new install. If you don't buy the expensive "ultimate" edition there are irritating restrictions like not being able to switch system language pack.

I paid for an upgrade of win 7 pro 64/32bit - ISO downloads from microsoft. I did this because I've tried many distros of Linux and I just got sick of x windows crashing like a muslim cab driver. It crashes because of lack of video drivers. Its always a video issue - regardless of which version of linux. The Linux kernel of course never dies. When the screen goes black and the keyboard and mouse dies with it....I can still ssh in thru the network. Yes, its still alive which makes it great for headless servers.

as a desktop, I haven't found anything more stable and with so many video card driver support as windows.

muman613 · « **Reply #19 on:** June 20, 2013, 04:58:39 PM »

Quote from: angryChineseKahanist on June 20, 2013, 04:55:13 PM

I paid for an upgrade of win 7 pro 64/32bit - ISO downloads from microsoft. I did this because I've tried many distros of Linux and I just got sick of x windows crashing like a muslim cab driver. It crashes because of lack of video drivers. Its always a video issue - regardless of which version of linux. The Linux kernel of course never dies. When the screen goes black and the keyboard and mouse dies with it....I can still ssh in thru the network. Yes, its still alive which makes it great for headless servers.

as a desktop, I haven't found anything more stable and with so many video card driver support as windows.

Maybe you should get a new machine which a modern video card...

I have never had X crash on any of my Linux machines. I run 3 machines at home and am responsible for a cadre of 8 Ubuntu systems here at work and don't have any problems like you are experiencing.

The system I am writing on now is an Ubuntu 10.04 system from Dell with a Quadcore Intel and a nVidia graphics card. I leave my system on 24/7 and never (except when our office has network reconfiguration issues) have to reboot.

Have you ever looked into what is causing your crashes? I don't think it is due to X11 issues... X has been stable for me for many years.

muman613 · « **Reply #20 on:** June 20, 2013, 05:02:12 PM »

GeekFest 2013:::

System information report, generated by Sysinfo: 6/20/2013 2:01:17 PM
http://sourceforge.net/projects/gsysinfo

SYSTEM INFORMATION
   Running Ubuntu Linux, the Ubuntu 10.04 (lucid) release.
   GNOME: 2.30.2 (Ubuntu 2010-06-25)
   Kernel version: 2.6.32-47-generic (#109-Ubuntu SMP Tue May 7 02:02:22 UTC 2013)
   GCC: 4.4.3 (x86_64-linux-gnu)
   Xorg: unknown (11 April 2013 01:20:21PM) (11 April 2013 01:20:21PM)
   Hostname: muman-pc
   Uptime: 16 days 2 h 32 min

CPU INFORMATION
   GenuineIntel, Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q9400 @ 2.66GHz
   Number of CPUs: 4
   CPU clock currently at 2659.715 MHz with 3072 KB cache
   Numbering: family(6) model(23) stepping(10)
   Bogomips: 5319.43
   Flags: fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss ht tm pbe syscall nx lm constant_tsc arch_perfmon pebs bts rep_good aperfmperf pni dtes64 monitor ds_cpl vmx smx est tm2 ssse3 cx16 xtpr pdcm sse4_1 xsave lahf_lm tpr_shadow vnmi flexpriority

MEMORY INFORMATION
   Total memory: 3896 MB
   Total swap: 8189 MB

STORAGE INFORMATION
   SCSI device - scsi0
      Vendor: ATA
      Model: ST3160815AS
   SCSI device - scsi1
      Vendor: HL-DT-ST
      Model: DVD-ROM DH20N
   SCSI device - scsi4
      Vendor: Seagate
      Model: FA GoFlex Desk

HARDWARE INFORMATION
MOTHERBOARD
   Host bridge
      Intel Corporation 4 Series Chipset DRAM Controller (rev 03)
      Subsystem: Dell Device 0420
   PCI bridge(s)
      Intel Corporation 4 Series Chipset PCI Express Root Port (rev 03)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) PCI Express Port 1 (rev 02)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) PCI Express Port 2 (rev 02)
      Intel Corporation 82801 PCI Bridge (rev a2) (prog-if 01)
   USB controller(s)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) USB UHCI Controller #4 (rev 02)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) USB UHCI Controller #5 (rev 02)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) USB UHCI Controller #6 (rev 02)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) USB2 EHCI Controller #2 (rev 02) (prog-if 20)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) USB UHCI Controller #1 (rev 02)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) USB UHCI Controller #2 (rev 02)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) USB UHCI Controller #3 (rev 02)
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) USB2 EHCI Controller #1 (rev 02) (prog-if 20)
   ISA bridge
      Intel Corporation 82801JDO (ICH10DO) LPC Interface Controller (rev 02)
      Subsystem: Dell Device 0420
   IDE interface
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) 2-port SATA IDE Controller (rev 02) (prog-if 85 [Master SecO PriO])
      Subsystem: Dell Device 0420

GRAPHIC CARD
   VGA controller
      nVidia Corporation G98 [GeForce 8400 GS] (rev a1)
      Subsystem: eVga.com. Corp. Device c738

SOUND CARD
   Multimedia controller
      Intel Corporation 82801JD/DO (ICH10 Family) HD Audio Controller (rev 02)
      Subsystem: Dell Device 0420

NETWORK
   Ethernet controller
      Intel Corporation 82567LM-3 Gigabit Network Connection (rev 02)
      Subsystem: Dell Device 0276

NVIDIA GRAPHIC CARD INFORMATION
   Model name: GeForce 8400 GS
   Card Type: PCI-E 16x
   Video RAM: 512 MB
   GPU Frequency: 567 MHz
   Driver version: NVIDIA UNIX x86_64 Kernel Module 195.36.24 Thu Apr 22 19:10:14 PDT 2010

Zelhar · « **Reply #21 on:** June 20, 2013, 05:04:35 PM »

Quote from: angryChineseKahanist on June 20, 2013, 04:55:13 PM

I paid for an upgrade of win 7 pro 64/32bit - ISO downloads from microsoft. I did this because I've tried many distros of Linux and I just got sick of x windows crashing like a muslim cab driver. It crashes because of lack of video drivers. Its always a video issue - regardless of which version of linux. The Linux kernel of course never dies. When the screen goes black and the keyboard and mouse dies with it....I can still ssh in thru the network. Yes, its still alive which makes it great for headless servers.

as a desktop, I haven't found anything more stable and with so many video card driver support as windows.

I thought it was just my linux that freezes inexplicably sometimes. I also noticed with my openSUSE system that if it runs for days without restart then it gets slower and it uses too much RAM even when I close all opened programs. It just doesn't clean up the RAM efficiently. But since I made a fresh install this week it seems to work smoother.

muman613 · « **Reply #22 on:** June 20, 2013, 05:06:19 PM »

I can't believe you guys are having such problems. Our entire office here has been running Linux for ages and nobody has these kinds of problems.

It is the Windows crowd here at work who complain about things not working..

PS: There are things which sometimes don't work right out of the box, but require a bit of tweaking. I have resolved all the issues which I had with all Ubuntu systems. The last problem I had was with pairing some Blue-Tooth devices with my Ubuntu 12.10 system... Eventually I got it working by googling the problem...

angryChineseKahanist · « **Reply #23 on:** June 20, 2013, 05:09:10 PM »

when I tried running pure x desktops (keep in mind my desktops never sleep or even shut down the monitor) again 24/7 x server would mysteriously freeze or black out. Once again the kernel and the rest of the system remains alive and accessible via network/ssh. So its always a video crash.

Now what was running at the time of crash?

* mapped drives via samba
* firefox and adobe flash plugin with more than 10 tabs
* possibly java ( initiated by firefox )
* multiple xterms, kterms, etc...
* I forget which file browser probably dolphin
* various rdesktops, I forget which, probably krdp

So its pretty much a remote console.

muman613 · « **Reply #24 on:** June 20, 2013, 05:14:19 PM »

I would have worked to figure out what was happening ACK...

Here I run my system with 30 or more windows spread accross 2 screens and 4 workspaces (I am running dual-head here at work)...

I am running large compiles which eat up 20-50% of CPU usage and still have CPU power to spare. Are you sure you have sufficient memory? Swap space? Linux does get slow when it runs low on memory and it is always good to have a large memory swap space. My home machine has 32G of RAM and I have had no slow downs due to that, but my office machine with only 4G does from time to time slow down...

I am using my network quite a lot... I use SSH to log into two other machines I manage (running HTTP, FTP, CVS, and Git servers).

Anyway, Use what you need to use to get your work done...

I have sworn off Windows and have been happy with my Linux experience since 2001...

Poll

Which Desktop Environment Do You Prefer ?

Author Topic: Linux Users - Which Desktop Environment Do You Prefer ? (Read 2229 times)