The Egyptian that Moshe Killed - Would Not Father Future Converts

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

I believe the Rashi interpretation, and what the Medresh says about him using the divine name...

I do not believe the explanation you gave attributed to Rav Bar Hayim...

But Rabbi Bar Hayim didn't deny what Rashi said about it, nor did he deny that the midrash cited the use of the Divine Name.   He gave an explanation of those answers!     It's funny how you want to pit someone against Rashi when that someone is explaining what Rashi said.    Either you exhibit the worst kind of reading comprehension imaginable, or you purposely obfuscate.   Still haven't figured out which.

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

A question was raised concerning Rashi's view. How could Moshe have used special Divine names to kill the Egyptian, if he had only received prophecy at the burning bush later on?
One possible answer is that since Moshe's mother was granted permission by the daughter of Pharaoh to be Moshe's nursemaid; perhaps because of this, he retained some contact with his true family and found out through them about the special Divine names.
A 2nd possible explanation is that there are different levels of prophecy and Divine Inspiration.
Moshe only reached the higher level at the burning bush but had a low level of Divine Inspiration by the time he killed the Egyptian. The low level of Divine Inspiration gave him the knowledge that he needed to kill the Egyptian and see into the future concerning his descendants.

 Then if Yocheved or someone else known the name(s) why weren't they using it when they saw others afflicted and even killed? If you say its forbidden then what would have allowed Moshe to do soo then.
 2) Moshe's first Prophetic encounter at the burning Bush was a low level (I think I brought it up earlier). It wasn't even through and with Hashem directly but through an angel. And that is when he BEGAN (says soo Rambam in his Mereh) to work up in Prophecy up until he reached the highest level possible.

[edu]

Quote from Tag-MehirTzedek

Then if Yocheved or someone else known the name(s) why weren't they using it when they saw others afflicted and even killed? If you say its forbidden then what would have allowed Moshe to do soo then.

In Kol Hator, the disciples of the Vilna Gaon claimed they had received secret names of G-d to help them above natural means but were forbidden to use them except to prevent a desecration of G-d or to save the Yishuv in the land of Israel.
Maybe Moshe felt the situation in front of him was needed to prevent a desecration of G-d.
Possibility #2, I have heard that if people who are on too low a spiritual level use these names it can bring disaster upon the user. Moshe felt he was on the level to use them.
I heard a rumor that an important rabbi blamed his use of Divine names for a terror incident that befell his family. Since I don't have sufficient verification for the story I will not provide further details.
Possibility #3 According to Maharal's Gur Aryeh commentary on Rashi, in order for the Divine names to work against the Egyptian it had to be accompanied by some type of physical hitting of the Egyptian. The Divine name magnified the small weak hit into a powerful hit that was strong enough to kill the Egyptian. So according to Maharal even if other Jews had the knowledge of the Divine names, it wouldn't work for them as long as they were too scared to give the Egyptians even a weak hit.

[edu]

Quote from Rabbi Moshe Chayim Luzzatto's Derech Hashem as translated into English under the title the Way of G-d(page 199 in my edition)

It is obvious, however, that it is not appropriate for a commoner to make use of the King's scepter. Regarding this, our sages teach us, "He who makes use of the Crown will pass away". Things such as these are only permitted to holy individuals, who are close to G-d and attached to Him. Even such individuals, furthermore, only use these methods to sanctify G-d's name and do His will. Even though an unworthy person may not be prevented from attaining results if he follows the proper procedures, he can still be punished for his willful act.

[edu]

Regarding what  Tag-MehirTzedek said

2) Moshe's first Prophetic encounter at the burning Bush was a low level (I think I brought it up earlier). It wasn't even through and with Hashem directly but through an angel. And that is when he BEGAN (says soo Rambam in his Mereh) to work up in Prophecy up until he reached the highest level possible.

See Rabbi Moshe Chayim Luzzatto's Derech Hashem as translated into English under the title the Way of G-d, Section 3 Chapters 3,4,5 and you will see there are lower levels of Divine Inspiration than the level obtained by Moshe at the burning bush.

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

If Yocheved knew then her husband knew as well. He was one of 4 who never sinned in his life. Soo if he knew this name and the Egyptian enslavement itself was a Hillul Hashem then he surely would and should have used it.
 Also even back to Moshe, had he had this power he wouldn't have had to run away after striking (or using Divine name) the Egyptian dead.

[edu]

Quote from Tag-MehirTzedek

If Yocheved knew then her husband knew as well. He was one of 4 who never sinned in his life. Soo if he knew this name and the Egyptian enslavement itself was a Hillul Hashem then he surely would and should have used it.
 Also even back to Moshe, had he had this power he wouldn't have had to run away after striking (or using Divine name) the Egyptian dead.

Not everyone who is on a high spiritual level realizes he is on a high spiritual level. It could be Yocheved's husband didn't believe he was on the level of being worthy to use the Divine Names.
Or according to Maharal's take on Moshe, it could be that Yocheved's husband was too afraid to give Egyptians the weak hit in order to activate the power of the Divine Names.
Although there is room to argue about this, a possible support for the Maharal's view that a relatively weak hit was needed to activate the miracle is found in the Talmud's account in Brachot 54b regarding how Moshe killed Og the King of Bashan.
The Talmud seemingly portrays Og as the largest and strongest man in history and the hit that Moshe gave him (even with his weapon of war) in an ordinary situation would not have been enough to kill Og or even stop him. But G-d supplemented Moshe's hit with a miracle to make it do the job.

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

Edu- About Moshe and Og, its not literal at all. If you were to take it literal you would think him to be a giant, reaaaly big giant, but if you see the words of the sages and the deeper meaning behind all the measurements and statements you would appreciate the words of the sages a lot more. 

 If you can get a hold of this book and in the third chapter on "giants" you can see what all of it means and what it alludes to exactly.
http://www.amazon.com/Sacred-Monsters-Natan-Slifkin/dp/9652295817


 I think the same can be said to in regards to our case. We should understand something to be a Derash when it is a Derash and leave it at that. Live our lives on the level of Pshat instead of going through this whole pilpul of how Moshe would possibly strike someone in a way other then using his physical force available to him and strike him dead.

[edu]

Tag_MehirTzedek holds:

Edu- About Moshe and Og, its not literal at all. If you were to take it literal you would think him to be a giant, reaaaly big giant, but if you see the words of the sages and the deeper meaning behind all the measurements and statements you would appreciate the words of the sages a lot more. 

It seems the sages did think that Og was the largest and most powerful man in history.
See:
Brachot 54a

Our Rabbis taught: If one sees the place of the crossing of the Red Sea, or the fords of the Jordan,
or the fords of the streams of Arnon, or hail stones [abne elgabish] in the descent of Beth Horon, or
the stone which Og king of Bashan wanted to throw at Israel, or the stone on which Moses sat when
Joshua fought with Amalek, or [the pillar of salt of] Lot's wife, or the wall of Jericho which sank
into the ground, for all of these he should give thanksgiving and praise to the Almighty.

See Yoma page 80b Soncino Translation

When this came up for discussion, it came up in connection with ‘Og, king of Bashan’,1 so that Beth
Shammai will be found to take the severer view. — R. Zera asked a strong question: To what
difference is it due that, with regard to eating, the minimum of a date was fixed for every one,
whereas in the case of drinking each has [his minimum] in accord with his own [mouthful]? —
Abaye replied to him: Regarding2 food the Rabbis established that with [the quantity of] a date a
person may come to, but with a smaller quantity he will not come to; but with regard to drinking
[they have found] that a man will come to with the quantity of his own [mouthful], but not with less
than that. — R. Zera then asked another strong question: ‘All the world’ with a date and Og, the king
of Bashan, also with a date? — Abaye replied: The Rabbis have ascertained that [touching food] the
quantity [of a date] helps one to come to, but with a smaller quantity he will not come to; but,
whereas all the world [can come to] more so, Og, king of Bashan, [only] somewhat so.

Footnotes
(1) I.e., this teaching refers to the case of men as gigantic as Og, king of Bashan (Ber. 54b); in such cases Beth Shammai
will be found to have taken, as usual, the severer view. For according to that school the minimum incurring penalty for
any man is a fourth of a log, whereas according to the Hillelites it is for each according to his mouthful. According to
Beth Shammai, therefore, an ‘Og, king of Bashan’ would become culpable on drinking, what to him would be less than a
drop, whereas according to Beth Hillel he would incur penalty only when drinking the generous measure of his own
mouthful.
(2) Corrected according to Bah.

[muman613]

Og indeed was a giant, and he existed from pre-flood times... See Talmud Tractate Niddah 61a...

http://halakhah.com/niddah/niddah_61.html

And the Lord said unto Moses: Fear him not'.47  Consider: Sihon and Og were brothers, for a Master stated, 'Sihon and Og were the sons of Ahijah the son of Shamhazai',48  then why was it that he feared Og while he did not fear Sihon? R. Johanan citing R. Simeon b. Yohai replied: From the answer that was given49  to50  that righteous man51  you may understand what was in his mind.52  He thought: Peradventure the merit of our father Abraham will stand him53  by, for it is said, And there came one that had escaped, and told Abram the Hebrew,54  in connection with which R. Johanan explained: This refers to Og who escaped the fate of the generation of the flood.55


47 Num. XXI, 34.
48 One of the fallen angels referred to in Gen. VI, 2, 4 as 'sons of God' or 'Nephilim'.
49 By God.
50 Lit., 'of'.
51 Moses.
52 Lit., 'heart'.
53 Og.
54 Gen. XIV, 13.
55 Cf. Zeb. 113b.

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

Learn the Aggadot in depth. See also Rambam and others who explain what the terms mean. I already referenced one of he books where it can be found (the explanations)