Author Topic: Baal teshuva?  (Read 8258 times)

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Offline Tag-MehirTzedek

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #25 on: April 11, 2014, 05:30:59 PM »
I was Bar Mitzvahed in a Conservative Shul and they did not get me Tefillin. I remember I was given a Tanach and a Kiddush Cup (which I still have somewhere)...

 Usually the father get's the son Tefillin and not the shul (I wouldn't expect them to cover the big costs of it).
.   ד  עֹזְבֵי תוֹרָה, יְהַלְלוּ רָשָׁע;    וְשֹׁמְרֵי תוֹרָה, יִתְגָּרוּ בָם
4 They that forsake the law praise the wicked; but such as keep the law contend with them.

ה  אַנְשֵׁי-רָע, לֹא-יָבִינוּ מִשְׁפָּט;    וּמְבַקְשֵׁי יְהוָה, יָבִינוּ כֹל.   
5 Evil men understand not justice; but they that seek the LORD understand all things.

Offline Aliyah5

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #26 on: April 23, 2014, 08:36:24 AM »
stay away from mysticism and trust what you know. if u like guns and exercise stick with that, make honest money and don't get caught up in any jewish cults. they don't have them here but there are plenty in Israel and none of them are good.

Offline Israel Chai

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #27 on: April 23, 2014, 11:20:12 PM »
stay away from mysticism and trust what you know. if u like guns and exercise stick with that, make honest money and don't get caught up in any jewish cults. they don't have them here but there are plenty in Israel and none of them are good.

...such as?
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline muman613

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #28 on: April 24, 2014, 01:41:31 AM »
...such as?


I was thinking the same thing... Doesn't something seem a little fishy about this guy?
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline edu

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #29 on: April 24, 2014, 01:54:16 AM »
Mishna Brura in the first chapter says
משנה ברורה סימן א

וצריך האדם לקבוע לו עת ללמוד ספרי מוסר בכל יום ויום אם מעט ואם הרבה כי הגדול מחבירו יצרו גדול הימנו
And a person has to fix for himself a set time to learn from Mussar books every day, whether it be a small amount or a large amount, for he who is greater than his friend, also has a Yetzer [the urge to sin] that is bigger.

This is one definition of Mussar that I found at
http://www.aish.com/sp/pg/Path-of-the-Soul-1-Discovering-Mussar.html
Quote
Path of the Soul #1: Discovering Mussar
How to close the gap between the high ideals we hold in mind and the living truth of how we act in life.
by Dr. Alan Morinis         
This new series explores Mussar, a traditional Jewish spiritual discipline that offers sound guidance to help you cultivate the qualities of your soul. Rabbi Elya Lopian, a contemporary master, defines Mussar as "Making the heart feel what the intellect understands." Mussar's teachings and practices help us work a radical inner transformation by showing us how to close the gap between the high ideals we hold in mind and the living truth of how we act in life.
That's just what Mussar did for me. I discovered Mussar at a time when I badly needed its guidance. But first, a bit of background.
I haven't always taught Mussar. In my first career, I was an anthropologist, having received a doctorate from Oxford University, where I went on a Rhodes scholarship. My studies took me to India where I lived for three years, learning two Indian languages and studying with a yoga master and meditating in the Himalayas. I wrote books and published articles and eventually got a tenure-track job at a good university.
But the routines of university life did not satisfy my soul, and so I made a leap to making films. That work kept me for 15 years, always in the independent film community, where I developed and produced my own projects.
My film work crashed to an abrupt halt in 1997 when my company hit the skids. That's not such an uncommon occurrence in the tenuous project-by-project world of independent film, but my problems were actually not the typical ones that plague that insecure industry. What ultimately backfired on me were choices and decisions I myself had made. I hadn't been nearly as honest as I should have been or as I saw myself to be. I thought I was being practical and pragmatic, even effective. But one day what I can only call my crookedness caught up with me and I was brought face-to-face with a painful vision of who I had become at that time.
Confronting my dark side set off a crisis, though I didn't completely fall apart. In a strange way, I actually felt energized by my unmasking. I had suddenly been handed a very meaningful curriculum: my mission was to redo my life, from the inside out. My task was to make very real changes that would reach into the foundation of my deepest being
But where to get the guidance I so obviously needed? My own inner compass had clearly let me down, so I couldn't rely on that. Nor was I much of practising anything at that time. Though born a Jew, most of my life I lived as if I were only "Jewish on my parents' side" (to quote my friend and teacher Ram Dass, a.k.a. Richard Alpert). I was a lapsed yogi and an inactive meditator.
I started reading. I read books on Hassidism and Kabbalah. I read on the Jewish festivals and the teachings of the Torah. I read spiritual biographies. Then one day I happened on an article on Mussar as it erupted in 19th century Europe in the form known as the Mussar movement. Everything I read on Mussar spoke directly to my soul's longing for practical yet deeply transformative guidance.
The Mussar approach to living offered me two great things. One was that the rabbis who observed human life and recorded their findings developed a very acute understanding of our inner selves and how we function. Their map of the soul lined up very closely with my own experience and helped me understand the way my own life was going. And second, they had developed a discipline of transformative practices meant to help people like me and you adjust the specific inner traits that are stumbling blocks to living as the beautiful and luminous souls we all have the potential to be.
In my youth I had been drawn to the spiritual disciplines of the East. In Mussar I found a path of personal practice laid out and expressed in Jewish terms. In that encounter my soul came alive and I wanted to know and do more. I read everything I could find. Eventually, I sought a teacher and was fortunate to find a wise, compassionate, creative guide in Rabbi Yechiel Yitzchok Perr, Rosh Yeshiva of the Yeshiva of Far Rockaway on Long Island. My encounters with Rabbi Perr form the basis for my recent book,
What I have learned from Mussar is that each of us comes into life with a curriculum. We are free to ignore or even deny that curriculum, as the prophet Jonah tried to do, but we are wiser to embrace it, because it describes the path of growth our soul is meant to follow. The Mussar masters knew that, and the tools they have handed down to us are the best guidance the soul could ever want.
Their insights and teachings are what we will be exploring in this series. My prayer is that through this exploration, you will gain some new (and yet time-tested) insights and tools that will help you walk the path of your personal spiritual curriculum as it lies before you, embedded in your middot ha-nefesh, the traits of your soul.
The Way of the Soul
hrough the centuries the Mussar masters evolved an accurate, insightful map of the interior world that has at its center the soul. We're not so familiar with the soul today, but Mussar teaches that in our essential nature, each of us is a soul. If we do talk about soul at all, we are more likely to say we "have" a soul. But that way of putting it implies that the soul is somehow a possession or appendage of the "I."
Mussar sees it differently. Identity is not the main feature of our inner being, despite the ego's insistent and noisy protests to the contrary. The ego claims to be king, but I liken its true role to that of valet. When it is put firmly in that role, serving the soul of infinite depth as its master, our lives become aligned in a profound way we could hardly previously imagine. Each of us is a soul. That's who we are.
With only limited exceptions, everything that exists in our inner world is an aspect of soul, including personality, emotions, talents, desires, conscience, wisdom, and so on. Even the faculties we ordinarily assign to the "mind," like thought, logic, memory and forgetting, are features of the soul.
But not all facets of the soul are accessible to conscious thought. Well before Freud introduced the notion of the unconscious, the Mussar teachers were working with an understanding that there is a dark inner region that is the source of all that appears in the daylight of our lives. These interior dimensions of the soul live within us at depths that are not accessible to the rational mind.
The Mussar teachers speak of different aspects of soul but they insist that in reality, the soul is an undivided whole. Their template is holistic and sees no divide between heart and mind, emotions and intellect. All are faculties of the soul.
This topography of the inner life has been developed for a practical purpose. Mussar's goal is to help us transform so that the light of holiness shines more brightly into our lives and through us into the world. Making that journey of change is how we fulfil the promise and also the charge of the Torah, "kiddoshim tihiyu" – you shall be holy.
We don't have to go far to find the light of holiness we seek. All the holiness we could ever hope for already exists within us, at the core of the soul, called neshama. This deep inner kernel is inherently holy and pure and is the seat of the "image and likeness of God" in which we are created. The neshama cannot be tainted, not even by evil deeds. We acknowledge that reality in the daily liturgy when we recite, "God, the neshama you have given me is pure."
So what is it that blocks the light of our holy neshama from shining constantly in our lives and into the world? Mussar points here to another dimension of the soul called nefesh. While the neshama is always stainless, the nefesh is the dimension of the inner life that houses all our recognizable characteristics, named the middot ha'nefesh, the traits of the soul. The neshama is unchanging but in the nefesh we find traits that can be in or out of alignment in ways that can be helpful or obstructive.
Each of us has some inner traits that are perfectly aligned but we also have certain inner qualities that are not as refined as they could be. Maimonides says that each character trait that is out of alignment creates a veil that screens the light of holiness. It is these unbalanced soul-traits that obstruct the flow of inner light. These traits define our spiritual work.
The issue is never the inner qualities themselves – Mussar tells us that all human qualities, even anger, jealousy and desire, are not intrinsically "good" or "bad." It's when we have too much or too little of a trait that our spiritual problems arise. Everyone has some anger in his or her soul but only too much anger is a problem. Desire is natural and healthy, but lust is an excess of that soul-trait. And so on with all the traits.
The Mussar classic Orchos Tzaddikim was written in the 16th century but the people it describes are still with us today:
One man is wrathful and always angry, and another even-tempered and never angry. Or, if he is, it only very negligible over a period of many years. One man is exceedingly proud, and another exceedingly humble. One man is lustful, his lust never being sated, and another exceedingly pure-hearted not desiring even the few things that the body needs... One man afflicts himself with hunger and goes begging..., and another is wantonly extravagant with his money. And, along the same lines, the other traits are found, such as cheerfulness and depression, stinginess and generosity, cruelty and mercy, cowardliness and courage, and the like.
A soul-trait can be set at too high a level – like rage in the place of anger, and hatred in the place of judgment, or too low – like self-debasement in the place of humility, or indifference in the place of equanimity. A soul-trait that is out of alignment whether in excess or deficiency creates a veil in the nefesh that blocks the inner light of the neshama. Through introspection and self-examination each of us can identify the handful of traits that are operating as hindrances in our own inner lives, and thus we pinpoint the curriculum for our personal transformative work
Where does this route lead? Toward holiness, we are told, though that's a mysterious and ineffable notion. One thing I do know is that this can't mean that we all aspire to reform ourselves to come out looking and being identical, squeezing ourselves into a mould of ideal qualities. The goal of Mussar practice is not to take on pre-ordained characteristics, but to become the most refined, perfected, elevated version of the unique person you already are. To do that, we must first come to know and embrace our soul curriculum, which means tackling each one of our personal middot, traits, that hang as thick veils blocking the holy inner light from entering our lives.
© Alan Morinis

Offline muman613

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #30 on: April 24, 2014, 01:55:06 AM »
Aliyah5,

If you are being honest with us, I appreciate that and do not want to harbor antagonism toward you.

But as a Jew (and I am under the assumption you were born Jewish) I am obligated to rebuke you.

My advice for you is to cleanse your mind of moshiach (I know some people are wondering where I am going with this because I am a very pro-Moshiach guy).... But it is important in order to lose your questionable (under Jewish faith) beliefs.

Moshiach is not the central figure of Tanakh (as a matter of fact he is not directly discussed at all in the 5 books). Moshiach is not the person we 'believe in', nor must we speak about him or think about him (except for the general faith that he will some day arrive). But the Jewish people are granted the strength and the merit to prosper with divine help if only we follow the 'rules' as set down by the 613 commandments.

And I agree that we all cannot keep them all at this time. Indeed all men today are nowhere near the righteous levels we can achieve. It is written that a righteous man FALLS seven times in his life, and life is an up and down proposition. And we cannot always rely on miracles, or Moshiach showing up to save us.

Moshiach will come, that is not a question, but he may not arrive in our lifetime (but he can arrive tomorrow also). I do not rely on him, and even with all the problems of life I am sure that with my Torah knowledge I will be saved from the worst misfortunes. Bless Hashem I have been prosperous in my chosen work field, and miracles have occurred for me to be in the position I am in today. I count my blessings each day, and praise G-d for the goodness he has shown me.

But I struggle too, and with the help of my Torah study, my good deeds (charity, doing commandments, etc), and my davening (prayer) that my struggles are not random, and there is a reward at the day of judgment.

If you are willing to learn I will learn with you. I am always learning, I always try to spend 1 - 2 hours a day studying Torah. As a matter of fact I am going to post some more videos and articles on this weeks Torah portion in the Jewish section of the forum. Every Wednesday I post the Torah portion of the week.

I would enjoy your company to learn with...

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline muman613

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #31 on: April 24, 2014, 01:55:59 AM »
Mishna Brura in the first chapter says
משנה ברורה סימן א

וצריך האדם לקבוע לו עת ללמוד ספרי מוסר בכל יום ויום אם מעט ואם הרבה כי הגדול מחבירו יצרו גדול הימנו
And a person has to fix for himself a set time to learn from Mussar books every day, whether it be a small amount or a large amount, for he who is greater than his friend, also has a Yetzer [the urge to sin] that is bigger.

This is one definition of Mussar that I found at
http://www.aish.com/sp/pg/Path-of-the-Soul-1-Discovering-Mussar.html

Amazing Edu! I did not see your post as I was writing my post...

I do set aside 1 - 2 hours a day for Torah study...
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline muman613

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #32 on: April 24, 2014, 01:58:21 AM »
Tonight is the NINTH DAY of the Omer, which is One Week and Two Day...

We study the Wisdom of the Fathers during the 49 days of the Omer... This perek is especially relevant:



http://www.torah.org/learning/pirkei-avos/chapter1-15a.html?print=1

Pirkei Avos
The Song of the Soul
Chapter 1, Mishna 15(a)
By Rabbi Dovid Rosenfeld

"Shammai said: Make your Torah study fixed, say little and do much, and receive everyone with a cheerful countenance."

This mishna was authored by Shammai, the colleague of Hillel, author of the previous three mishnas (see earlier, Mishna 12). As we will see G-d willing in two weeks, Shammai is presented in the Talmud as a very different personality type from his colleague Hillel (Shabbos 31a), and many disputes arose between the students of these two great sages (see Talmud Sotah 47b). Even so, the Talmud attests that there was nothing but affection and camaraderie between the two camps (Yevamos 14b). In spite of their many differences, both in content and style, both camps realized the other was simply attempting to understand G-d's will to the best of its ability, and both teachers and students had nothing but respect and admiration for one another.

Shammai's first words of advice are that we make our Torah study "fixed". There are two closely-related explanations to this found in the commentators. Rashi (in one interpretation) explains that we must set aside fixed times daily for Torah study. Our study should not be when we "get around to it." We will learn later: "Do not say when I have free time I will learn, lest you not become free" (2:5).

In addition, our study should ideally not be at different times every day, whenever we can work it into our schedules. It should be "fixed", the given around which all other activities and obligations revolve. Regardless of how busy and sought-after you are the rest of your day, make at least some time every day fixed and interruption-free. Turn off your cell-phone, don't check your e-mail, and don't let the kids bother you. Chances are, you'll come to enjoy and look forward to your spiritual refuge from your otherwise hectic day. In reality, there are very few things in life which really cannot wait. (And, of course, for a *true* emergency everything else -- including Torah study -- does get pushed aside. Even so, the Talmud recommends that when this does occur, one make up the time later (see Eiruvin 65a).)

Lastly, the ideal time to set aside should be first thing in the morning, immediately after morning prayers (or breakfast) and before one gets caught up, mentally and emotionally, in his daily affairs (see Mishna Berura, 155:2).

Other commentators (Maimonides, Rabbeinu Yonah) understand "fixed" in a more conceptual sense. One should view his Torah study as the mainstay of his day, his most steady and permanent activity. All other obligations -- including earning a livelihood -- should be "happenstance" by comparison. They are performed only when necessary.

The Talmud tells us that the scholar Hillel used to work enough to earn a half-coin daily. Half of this he would use to support his family and the remaining half he would pay as entrance fee to the study hall (Yoma 35b). A single half-coin was all that was required for a man with Hillel's degree of faith. His family lived humbly, on rationed quantities, but they survived. (I imagine if a kid wanted an iPod or a pair of roller blades for his birthday, Hillel would have to chop a few extra logs. Or more likely they did without -- yet another lesson our generation would be wise to learn.) Regardless, Hillel's workday was not ongoing. He did not work -- nor earn -- as much as he could. He did the minimum required -- and he knew just how much that was. His work was limited and finite. His Torah study, however -- in more ways than one -- was infinite.

(Of course, measured labor would not get us as far nowadays with our home mortgages, utilities, school tuition, auto insurance, etc. Life is just not as simple as it once was. However, 9-5 does not have to mean every waking moment. Our Torah study can be fixed in its primacy if not its quantity.)

There is an important practical side to this. On the one hand we must study in order to know how to fulfill. (For this reason it is recommended that a person of limited time and/or ability concentrate on the study of the basic and the most critical: practical Jewish law (Mishna Berura 155:9)). We likewise begin our day with Torah study in order to dedicate our first efforts to G-d, putting all our remaining activities in their proper perspective. Torah study on this level may be viewed as a means -- a way of spiritually preparing ourselves for the daily tasks ahead.

It is important to recognize, however, that there is an entirely higher aspect to our obligation to study Torah, which we might call the inspirational. In the beginning of the Book of Joshua, when G-d instructs Joshua to enter and conquer the Land of Israel, He warns him before all to be diligent in Torah study: "You shall delve into it day and night" (1:8). This was not just a practical commandment -- to set aside a fixed period every morning, to learn in order to know how to do. This was a command to "delve" into the Torah -- to study, to examine, and to plumb its depths, and to do so day and night, without respite or concern for the hour.

Thus, on one level the Torah can be viewed simply as a how-to guide, as a practical means for living properly and rewardingly in this world. But in truth it is so much more. It is equally a means of leaving this world, of transcending the mundane in order to achieve an understanding of and a closeness to G-d. The Torah is G-d's wisdom. It is a work of the eternal and infinite, through which one is able to fathom G-d's knowledge and G-d Himself. We study when we are inspired to truly understand and connect to our G-d. And there is no "schedule" for inspiration. Torah study of this sort is not a "fixed" obligation. It is an ongoing challenge. Day, night, hot, cold, comfort, want, poverty: Nothing truly matters to the one who is searching -- who is searching for G-d. For he breaks free of the shackles of the finite -- the world of day and night -- in his endless quest for the truth. (Based in part on a lecture heard from R. Yitzchak Berkovits of Jerusalem.)

(This is reminiscent of the popular (if recent) custom to stay up all night studying Torah the eve of the holiday of Shavous (Pentecost), which commemorates our receiving the Torah at Mount Sinai. At times we go beyond all sense of normality and rationality in our search for the truth. The overwhelming excitement of receiving G-d's Torah inspires us to truly seek G-d, forgetting ourselves and everything around us in the process. At least one day a year we reawaken ourselves to this ideal.)

Thus, "inspirational" study is far loftier than the routine, daily study in which all of us are obligated. It is the stuff of which greatness is formed. It's interesting to note that yeshivas (rabbinical colleges) even today reflect to some degree this ideal. Torah there is generally not studied in the organized, curriculum-based fashion we are familiar with from other institutions of higher learning. Students are generally not given set study plans, nor are they graded based on an orderly series of examinations. They are given the freedom to apply their own ingenuity and creativity to the Talmud. They seek to understand G-d's word for themselves -- not to memorize information handed to them in order to pass a test or receive a diploma. (Needless to say, for actual rabbinic ordination -- authorizing a student to decide matters of Jewish law -- the student must in fact pass specific exams demonstrating his mastery of the material.) The students are given the tools to achieve their own unique understanding of the Torah -- and their own personal connection with G-d.

And in the process they become energized, infused with a vitality not found in students of any other discipline. Those of us who have experienced or observed Torah study in a yeshiva know that it involves loud, energetic debates, in which students are consumed with a passion for knowledge and the word of G-d.

(Years back when I was at my parents during an intercession from Ner Israel Rabbinical College, Baltimore, MD, I was studying with a neighbor and co-student. While studying a certain section of the Talmud, we became involved in a heated debate which I imagine lasted a good couple of minutes. (I couldn't possibly tell you today for how long or what it was about 25 years later -- we had such little flare-ups all the time, my dear friend and I.) After my friend left, my mother, who had heard the raised voices and loud back-and-forth, became very concerned. She kind of assumed I had just lost a close friend: "Did you get into an argument? Did your friend leave mad?"))

One other fascinating thought we'll touch upon briefly. When people are inspired, something happens to them: they sing. When you touch deep enough inside your soul, it sings out. It cries out its exhilaration in being able to sense and express itself, something it cannot often do beneath so many layers of flesh and earthiness. R. Noach Weinberg of Yeshiva Aish HaTorah has observed that when people study Torah, they often find themselves breaking out in spontaneous song -- something which has never happened to me reading a geometry book.

Further, each person has his own unique song. Every soul wants to express its own innermost praise and emotions, to one time in its existence sing its song. The entire nation of Israel burst out in spontaneous song and harmony at the Red Sea, and we will all do so again when the final redemption arrives. When that day comes, our souls will instinctively know their tune; all mankind will sing in unison -- in a harmony the likes of which has never before been heard on earth. At that time each of our songs will emerge -- and will unite into the final Song of Man. But until then, we achieve the faintest glimmer of this inspiration, this song of our souls, when we touch ourselves with the study of Torah.

Finally we conclude with our mishna -- which at last comes along to take the wind out of our ever-expanding sails. Regardless of the inspiration Torah study evokes -- and you can be certain Shammai knew of it far better than we -- Shammai reminds us of the "lower" obligation of Torah study. Torah study must be a "fixed" and daily obligation -- regardless of the inspiration we are or are not feeling at any given moment. We cannot only live for -- and wait for -- inspiration. Torah study is not only for our own exhilaration. It is also our obligation towards the Almighty. And only through both means will our souls truly be able to sing their song of both ecstasy and fulfillment.
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Aliyah5

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #33 on: April 24, 2014, 02:35:16 AM »
...such as?

basically all of it. most of the stuff that goes on in safed, kabalism, nanach, even branches of chasidism. worship of dead rabbis, visiting graves, paying people for blessings, charms etc...'holy' super-powered mikvahs, superstition. I would not want to discourage anyone from being a baal tshuva and living in the land of Israel but I would say from experience don't feel too guilty about your shortcomings in religion. As an american Jew you may know as much about the Jewish experience as venerated religious jews living in Israel. Take everything with a grain of salt.  Exercise, guns and honest income beats just about everything I heard preached by the mystical religious folk and their mystical religious texts in terms of getting what u want out of life. Yeah follow the 10 commandments and mitzvot if u can but most important take care of yourself and don't be swayed by opinions on observance. Many of the religious leaders are the blind leading the blind as far as I'm concerned. Also, if you are into guns and all that good stuff, go join the IDF before it's too late in terms of age. Start your petition today to get in if you are on the border age. You might actually meet nice people on your spiritual level, lead an exciting life and find a nice bashert.

Offline muman613

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #34 on: April 24, 2014, 02:52:58 AM »
basically all of it. most of the stuff that goes on in safed, kabalism, nanach, even branches of chasidism. worship of dead rabbis, visiting graves, paying people for blessings, charms etc...'holy' super-powered mikvahs, superstition. I would not want to discourage anyone from being a baal tshuva and living in the land of Israel but I would say from experience don't feel too guilty about your shortcomings in religion. As an american Jew you may know as much about the Jewish experience as venerated religious jews living in Israel. Take everything with a grain of salt.  Exercise, guns and honest income beats just about everything I heard preached by the mystical religious folk and their mystical religious texts in terms of getting what u want out of life. Yeah follow the 10 commandments and mitzvot if u can but most important take care of yourself and don't be swayed by opinions on observance. Many of the religious leaders are the blind leading the blind as far as I'm concerned. Also, if you are into guns and all that good stuff, go join the IDF before it's too late in terms of age. Start your petition today to get in if you are on the border age. You might actually meet nice people on your spiritual level, lead an exciting life and find a nice bashert.

You are very uninformed about Judaism, and that is very obvious.

Breslov and Chabad do not worship dead rabbis. That is your misunderstanding. I am very closely involved with Chabad, and know several rabbis very well, and I find your opinion disgraceful.

I am sorry you feel the way you do. Obviously you know everything you need to know in life, and even Hashem cannot help you. You are always free to make teshuva (if you are truly Jewish).

Let me just add a few more pasuks of Torah which explain where you are coming from:

http://www.torah.org/learning/pirkei-avos/chapter2-5b.html
http://www.shechem.org/torah/avot.html
Quote

Pirkie Avot Chapter 2
5. Hillel said: Do not separate yourself from the community; and do not trust in yourself until the day of your death. Do not judge your fellow until you are in his place. Do not say something that cannot be understood but will be understood in the end. Say not: When I have time I will study because you may never have the time.

http://www.tfdixie.com/parshat/shoftim/001.htm
Quote
Consider this verse in the book of Zechariah (4:6): "Not through armies and not through might, but through My spirit, says Hashem." There is an inherent tension between human strength and one's pure faith in Hashem. The extension of strength - whether physical, monetary, or vocal - is one's sense of self-sufficiency which may lead to arrogance and the eventual abandonment of Hashem and the Torah. In fact, the Torah itself warns us against this tendency: "You may [erroneously] say in your heart, 'My strength and the might of my hand made me this wealth'" (Deuteronomy 8:17).


Quote
15. Who led you through that great and awesome desert, [in which were] snakes, vipers and scorpions, and drought, where there was no water; who brought water for you out of solid rock,
16. Who fed you with manna in the desert, which your forefathers did not know, in order to afflict you and in order to test you, to benefit you in your end,
17. and you will say to yourself, "My strength and the might of my hand that has accumulated this wealth for me."
18. But you must remember the Lord your G-d, for it is He that gives you strength to make wealth, in order to establish His covenant which He swore to your forefathers, as it is this day.
19. And it will be, if you forget the Lord your G-d and follow other gods, and worship them, and prostrate yourself before them, I bear witness against you this day, that you will surely perish.

Judaism has never been just keeping the 10 commandments.... Judaism is a way of life, and you seem to be rejecting it. If it is your heritage you should embrace it but you, as everyone else, are free to do as you wish.

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline muman613

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #35 on: April 24, 2014, 02:58:15 AM »
I don't understand why you keep talking about guns, as if Judaism doesn't support our right to protect ourselves.


Quote
Also, if you are into guns and all that good stuff, go join the IDF before it's too late in terms of age.
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Tag-MehirTzedek

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #36 on: April 24, 2014, 11:46:14 AM »
Muman- where did he mention Breslov or Chabad?

 And guns doesn't have to do with spirituality nor Judaism. Yes one can own a gun if he/she chooses to, but it has nothing to do with the Torah and isn't relevant to the discussion.
.   ד  עֹזְבֵי תוֹרָה, יְהַלְלוּ רָשָׁע;    וְשֹׁמְרֵי תוֹרָה, יִתְגָּרוּ בָם
4 They that forsake the law praise the wicked; but such as keep the law contend with them.

ה  אַנְשֵׁי-רָע, לֹא-יָבִינוּ מִשְׁפָּט;    וּמְבַקְשֵׁי יְהוָה, יָבִינוּ כֹל.   
5 Evil men understand not justice; but they that seek the LORD understand all things.

Offline White Israelite

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #37 on: April 24, 2014, 01:11:59 PM »
I appreciate all the feedback guys, I've been feeling a lot more positive, I'm still trying to get in contact with chabad but I have some wonderful news, I now have off work on Friday and Saturday for the Shabbat, this was not possible before and I still feel horrible about it but it's a direction I am wanting to head towards.

I am ordering a JPS tanakh and I've been back in touch with some of my old jewish friends because I was embarrassed to talk about the situation due to what was going on, I rather not talk too much about it on the forum but I fell into depression and unfortunately many things happened that I regret and I've had a lot of support, I know Hashem is putting this in my heart and there's a lot I didn't know about the tanakh before because I just never really read it.

Muman I would be happy to see the Torah portions and readings.

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #38 on: April 24, 2014, 01:56:20 PM »
I appreciate all the feedback guys, I've been feeling a lot more positive, I'm still trying to get in contact with chabad but I have some wonderful news, I now have off work on Friday and Saturday for the Shabbat, this was not possible before and I still feel horrible about it but it's a direction I am wanting to head towards.

I am ordering a JPS tanakh and I've been back in touch with some of my old jewish friends because I was embarrassed to talk about the situation due to what was going on, I rather not talk too much about it on the forum but I fell into depression and unfortunately many things happened that I regret and I've had a lot of support, I know Hashem is putting this in my heart and there's a lot I didn't know about the tanakh before because I just never really read it.

Muman I would be happy to see the Torah portions and readings.
Waste of money get an Artscroll Tanach it is a better & more modern translation than JPS & the commentaries are from authentic Jewish sources unlike JPS.

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #39 on: April 24, 2014, 01:59:20 PM »
I haven't heard of art scroll I'll check it out, didn't the orthodox used to use jps?

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #40 on: April 24, 2014, 02:22:46 PM »
I haven't heard of art scroll I'll check it out, didn't the orthodox used to use jps?
Not that I know of.
Back in the day they were using Soncino from England but the translation is archaic & Art Scroll is much more of a modern translation.

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #41 on: April 24, 2014, 02:57:57 PM »
I use Artscroll Siddur and strongly recommend it...
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #42 on: April 24, 2014, 02:58:55 PM »
Muman- where did he mention Breslov or Chabad?

 And guns doesn't have to do with spirituality nor Judaism. Yes one can own a gun if he/she chooses to, but it has nothing to do with the Torah and isn't relevant to the discussion.

He did not mention them by name, but he talked about Jewish cults (worshipping dead rabbis, etc.)...

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #43 on: April 24, 2014, 03:03:36 PM »
Artscroll Siddur:



Artscroll Chumash:



You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Tag-MehirTzedek

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #44 on: April 24, 2014, 03:04:44 PM »
He did not mention them by name, but he talked about Jewish cults (worshipping dead rabbis, etc.)...

 :::D  So subconsciously at least your saying (or admitting) that they are cults or at least worship dead Rebbes and such!
.   ד  עֹזְבֵי תוֹרָה, יְהַלְלוּ רָשָׁע;    וְשֹׁמְרֵי תוֹרָה, יִתְגָּרוּ בָם
4 They that forsake the law praise the wicked; but such as keep the law contend with them.

ה  אַנְשֵׁי-רָע, לֹא-יָבִינוּ מִשְׁפָּט;    וּמְבַקְשֵׁי יְהוָה, יָבִינוּ כֹל.   
5 Evil men understand not justice; but they that seek the LORD understand all things.

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #45 on: April 24, 2014, 03:05:32 PM »
Yes Dan Ben Noah, the Artscroll does have a lot of extra commentary (which is helpful in understanding the deeper meaning and the opinions of the sages)... It also features prominently the Rashi commentary (in Rashiscript)..

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #46 on: April 24, 2014, 03:06:08 PM »
:::D  So subconsciously at least your saying (or admitting) that they are cults or at least worship dead Rebbes and such!

No, where do you get that BS from?

I am pointing out that many people wrongly assume things which they shouldn't because of ignorance.

Are you suggesting that they are? I sure hope not.

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Israel Chai

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #47 on: April 24, 2014, 03:09:11 PM »
basically all of it. most of the stuff that goes on in safed, kabalism, nanach, even branches of chasidism. worship of dead rabbis, visiting graves, paying people for blessings, charms etc...'holy' super-powered mikvahs, superstition. I would not want to discourage anyone from being a baal tshuva and living in the land of Israel but I would say from experience don't feel too guilty about your shortcomings in religion. As an american Jew you may know as much about the Jewish experience as venerated religious jews living in Israel. Take everything with a grain of salt.  Exercise, guns and honest income beats just about everything I heard preached by the mystical religious folk and their mystical religious texts in terms of getting what u want out of life. Yeah follow the 10 commandments and mitzvot if u can but most important take care of yourself and don't be swayed by opinions on observance. Many of the religious leaders are the blind leading the blind as far as I'm concerned. Also, if you are into guns and all that good stuff, go join the IDF before it's too late in terms of age. Start your petition today to get in if you are on the border age. You might actually meet nice people on your spiritual level, lead an exciting life and find a nice bashert.

Mitzvot if you can? At least the Na Nach guys keep it and aren't idolaters.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline muman613

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #48 on: April 24, 2014, 03:12:01 PM »
I believe I have posted this several times before... For those who did not read it please read it and lose the misconception that people are praying to dead rabbis...


http://www.torah.org/advanced/weekly-halacha/5760/shlach.html

VISITING GRAVES of TZADDIKIM: HOW and WHY?

The ancient minhag yisrael of visiting and davening at graves of tzaddikim during times of tribulation has many sources in Talmudic literature(1). Indeed, Shulchan Aruch records in several places that it is appropriate to do so on certain public fast days in general(2) and on Tishah B'av after midday in particular(3). Erev Rosh ha-Shanah, too, is a day when it has become customary to visit graves(4). But what is the reason for this? How does it help us(5)?

The Talmud(6) cites two explanations: 1) To serve as a reminder of man's immortality so that one repent while he still can; 2) To ask the dead to pray for mercy on our behalf. [A practical difference between these two reasons, says the Talmud, is whether or not it is appropriate to visit graves of non-Jews [when there are no Jewish graves near by] since even a non-Jew's grave reminds man of his immortality. Nowadays, however, when non-Jews mark their graves with religious symbols, it is no longer appropriate to visit non-Jewish graves even if there are no Jewish graves in the area(7).]

The second reason quoted in the Talmud - to ask the dead to pray for mercy on our behalf - demands clarification. Many people assume that this means that we are allowed to pray to the dead to ask them to help us. This is a serious mistake and strictly forbidden. One who prays with this intent transgresses the Biblical(8) command of "You shall not recognize the gods of others in my presence"(9). It may also be a violation of the Biblical(10) command against "one who consults the dead"(11).

If so, what does the Talmud mean when it says that we "ask the dead to beg for mercy on our behalf"? We find two schools of thought concerning this matter:

Some(12) hold that it means that it is permitted to speak directly to the dead to ask them to daven to Hashem on our behalf. This is similar to the prayers that we find throughout Selichos which are addressed to the malachim. Although the malachim - who are merely G-d's messengers - do not posses the ability to do anything of their own accord, still we may ask them to "deliver" our prayers to Hashem. So, too, it is permitted to address the dead directly and ask them to intercede on our behalf at the heavenly throne.

Others(13) strongly disagree and maintain that this, too, is strictly forbidden. In their opinion, addressing a dead person is a violation of "consulting the dead". What the Talmud means by "asking the dead to pray for mercy on our behalf" is that we daven directly to Hashem that in the merit of the dead He should have mercy on us. We visit the graves only to remind Hashem of the merits of the holy tazddikim who are interred there.

The practical halachah is as follows. Most of the classical poskim(14) rule in accordance with the second view. Mishnah Berurah(15) also clearly writes: We visit graves because a cemetery where tzaddikim are interred is a place where prayers are more readily answered. But one should not place his trust in the dead. He should just ask Hashem to have mercy on him in the merit of the tzaddikim who are interred here.

But other poskim rule that it is permitted to talk to the dead [or to angels] to intercede on our behalf. In a lengthy responsum, Minchas Elazar(16) proves from a host of sources throughout the Talmud and Zohar that not only is this permitted but it is a mitzvah to do so.

But as we said before, all opinions - without exception - agree that it is strictly forbidden to daven directly to a dead person [or to angel] so that they should help us. The most that is permitted [according to the lenient views] is to ask them to act as our emissaries to Hashem, so that Hashem will look favorably and mercifully upon us.

THE VISIT: PROPER CONDUCT

Upon entering a cemetery, the blessing of Asher yatzar eschem badin is recited(17). The full text is found in many siddurim. This blessing is recited only once within any thirty day period(18).

Before visiting at a grave, one should wash his hands(19).

Upon reaching the grave, one should place his left hand on the marker(20).

It is forbidden, though, to lean on it(21).

Within four amos [7-8 feet] of a grave(22):

The tzitzis strings should be concealed(23).

Levity, eating, drinking, greeting a friend or engaging in business is prohibited(24).

Learning, davening or reciting a blessing is prohibited(25). Many poskim, however, hold that it is permitted to recite Tehillim(26) or the burial Kaddish(27).

One should be careful not to step on any grave(28).

Before taking leave of a grave it is customary to put a stone or some grass on the marker(29).

The same grave should not be visited twice in one day(30).

Upon leaving the cemetery, it is customary to take some soil and grass from the ground and throw it over one's shoulder(31). There are many different reasons for this custom. On Shabbos, Yom Tov and Chol ha-Moed this may not be done(32).

After leaving a cemetery and before entering one's home(33) or another person's home(34), one should wash his hands three times from a vessel, alternating between the right and left hands(35). There are different customs concerning the method of washing(36): The water should drain into the ground and not collect in a puddle. After washing, any water that remains in the vessel is poured out. The vessel is turned upside down and placed on the ground, not handed to the next person(37). Some let their hands air dry and do not use a towel(38). Some wash their face as well(39).
FOOTNOTES

1 Yosef cried at his mother's grave before going to Egypt (Sefer ha-Yashar); Before being exiled, the Jewish people wept at Kever Rochel (Rashi, Vayechi 48:7); Kalev prayed at Meoras ha-Machpeilah before confronting the meraglim (Sotah 34b). See also Ta'anis 23b.

2 O.C. 579:3.

3 Rama O.C. 559:10.

4 Rama O.C. 581:4. Some go on Erev Yom Kippur as well (Rama O.C. 605:1) while others oppose going on that day; Elef ha-Magen 605:39 quoting Ya'avetz; Divrei Yoel 99:4.

5 Our discussion focuses on visiting graves on fast days and at other times of strife. Do not confuse this with the custom of visiting graves of parents and other relatives (on their yahrzeits and other occasions) whose primary purpose is to elevate the soul of the deceased and to give it "pleasure".

6 Ta'anis 16a.

7 Mishnah Berurah 579:14. See also Kaf ha-Chayim 559:81.

8 Shemos 20:3.

9 Sefer ha-Ikarim, mamar 2, quoted in Gesher ha-Chayim 2:26.

10 Shoftim 18:11.

11 Eliyohu Rabbah 581:4.

12 See Shalah (quoted by Elef ha-Magen 581:113), Pri Megadim O.C. 581:16 and M'haram Shick O.C. 293.

13 The source for this view among the Rishonim is Teshuvos R' Chaim Paltiel (quoted by the Bach and Shach Y.D. 179:15) and Maharil, Hilchos Ta'anis, (quoted by Be'er Heitev O.C. 581:17).

14 Including the Be'er Heitev, Chayei Adam, Mateh Efrayim and Kitzur Shulchan Aruch.

15 581:27.

16 1:68. See also Gesher ha-Chayim 2:26 and Minchas Yitzchak 8:53.

17 O.C. 224:12. This blessing is recited only at a burial plot that contains at least two graves.

18 Mishnah Berurah 224:17.

19 Mishnah Berurah 4:42.

20 Kitzur Shulchan Aruch 128:13. See there also for the text that should be recited at that time.

21 Shach Y.D. 363:3.

22 Note that according to the Arizal (quoted by Mishnah Berurah 559:41) one should never go within four amos of a grave [except at interment]. In Igeres ha-Gra he writes that one should never enter a cemetery at all, and especially not women. [It is commonly accepted that a woman who is a niddah does not go to a cemetery at all (Mishnah Berurah 88:7). Under extenuating circumstances a rav should be consulted; see Beis Baruch on Chayei Adam 3:38.]

23 Mishnah Berurah 23:3. Tefillin, too, must be concealed.

24 Y.D. 368:1; Rama Y.D. 343:2.

25 Y.D. 367:3; 368:1.

26 Birkei Yosef Y.D. 344:17.

27 Gesher ha-Chayim 1:16-4.

28 Taz Y.D. 363:1.

29 Be'er Heitev O.C. 224:8.

30 Mishnah Berurah 581:27.

31 Y.D. 376:4. Some do this only after an interment.

32 O.C. 547:12.

33 Kaf ha-Chayim 4:80.

34 Mishnah Berurah 4:43. It is permitted, however, to enter a shul or another public place before washing; Harav M. Feinstein (Moadei Yeshurun, pg. 58).

35 Mishnah Berurah 4:39.

36 Some of these customs do not have an halachic source; they are based on Cabalistic writings and customs.

37 R' Akiva Eiger (Y.D. 376:4). See Zichron Meir, pg. 450.

38 Several poskim write that this does not apply during the cold winter month when the hands will become chapped; see Kaf ha-Chayim 4:78.

39 Mishnah Berurah 4:42.
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline ChabadKahanist

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Re: Baal teshuva?
« Reply #49 on: April 25, 2014, 01:02:54 AM »
I use Artscroll Siddur and strongly recommend it...
Art Scroll siddur is good so is Kehot siddur(Chabad) & Koren.
I recommend any one of them.