Alliances Started World War I, Not Nationalism

[Binyamin Yisrael]

The moron in charge of France thinks nationalism is dangerous. It was multinational alliances that started World War I. Just because one country went to war, all the others in the alliance joined. The US was nationalist and only joined in the last year of the war.

Trump is against things like NATO drawing the US into a war for no reason. Europe wants a continental army. If Russia attacks Ukraine, then that could make World War III.

Nationalism did start World War II but it was facist nationalism, not patriotic nationalism.

[Israel Chai]

Those alliances stopped endless war. You can point to many causes, boiling it down to one is a degradation of history. For WW2, I believe it was Rubystars that pointed out that Nationalists love their country and only want their country, commies want to take over the world for their ideology. Loving your country doesn't destroy it and others, putting an ideology above simple needs makes a complicated honor system to adhere to an ideology. "Where honor is complicated, life is cheap", which was the conclusion to a study why Japanese people and Saudi women commit suicide the most.

You can't give a single reason for either war, the most honest attempt I've seen went even broader and said "evil begins where empathy ends".

Marcon is just saying, "people that oppose me destroying France with Muslims want to destroy the world like Nazis they're worse". Ironically, we see the flip side of the evils from lack of empathy, if you have none and judge good people as monsters, you can do monstrous evils to them, and if you have none and judge monsters as good people, you can stand and support the most monstrous evils.

[Binyamin Yisrael]

Of course G-d was behind World War I. The point of the war was to get the Ottoman Muslims out of Israel. That and World War II eventually led to the creation of the State of Israel.

The former rabbi of my synagogue said that the reason the Vietnam War happened is that it caused social upheaval that contributed to the Ba'al Teshuvah movement.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

Nationalism did start World War II but it was fascist nationalism, not patriotic nationalism.

The true identity of a child as a Jew or a Gentile by birth is matrilineal. All other identities are secondary. Jewish nationalism is the only true nationalism because it is based on the Torah.

[Israel Chai]

The true identity of a child as a Jew or a Gentile by birth is matrilineal. All other identities are secondary. Jewish nationalism is the only true nationalism because it is based on the Torah.

I don't understand, please explain. For instance, Torah says who the father of the Chinese is, so the Chinese can be nationalist around that shared heritage. Jewish Nationalism is required by Torah, the only mandated Nationalism I know of, but I don't see how that Chinese guy is a fake nationalist.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

I don't understand, please explain. For instance, Torah says who the father of the Chinese is, so the Chinese can be nationalist around that shared heritage. Jewish Nationalism is required by Torah, the only mandated Nationalism I know of, but I don't see how that Chinese guy is a fake nationalist.

Please reread my post. I wrote that the true identity of a child as a Jew or a Gentile by birth is matrilineal. All other identities are secondary. There are no Chinese in Torah Law. Only Jews and Gentiles.

[Israel Chai]

Please reread my post. I wrote that the true identity of a child as a Jew or a Gentile by birth is matrilineal. All other identities are secondary. There are no Chinese in Torah Law. Only Jews and Gentiles.

The Gentiles still have 70 nations we would once sacrifice to Hashem in their merit, and someone can identify as their nation and it's real nationalism. Your point stands, but there are probably Chinese that are connected matrilinally (is that a word?) to their progenitors. They even get animals to represent their nations.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

The Gentiles still have 70 nations we would once sacrifice to Hashem in their merit, and someone can identify as their nation and it's real nationalism. Your point stands, but there are probably Chinese that are connected matrilinally (is that a word?) to their progenitors. They even get animals to represent their nations.

Personally, I see myself as a Gentile first and foremost. I have more in common with other Torah-observant Gentiles than with Croatian idolaters. 

I did some research. This might interest you: "Whether a person is born a Gentile (belonging to the 70 Biblical nations) or a Jew is the heritage that is passed down by the birth mother. The Biblical nation which a Gentile belongs to is passed down through the father. Throughout history, the 70 nations have become largely intermingled, and even those which stayed relatively isolated have apparently not retained a tradition of their ancient origins." https://asknoah.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=70 

[Israel Chai]

Personally, I see myself as a Gentile first and foremost. I have more in common with other Torah-observant Gentiles than with Croatian idolaters. 

I did some research. This might interest you: "Whether a person is born a Gentile (belonging to the 70 Biblical nations) or a Jew is the heritage that is passed down by the birth mother. The Biblical nation which a Gentile belongs to is passed down through the father. Throughout history, the 70 nations have become largely intermingled, and even those which stayed relatively isolated have apparently not retained a tradition of their ancient origins." https://asknoah.org/forum/showthread.php?tid=70

Bnei Noach have an elevated place, sort of transcends nations, but historically there will be less of you than Jews always. If you sit down and do the math, I think it's even harder to be a righteous gentile living in the world we do than a good Jew. So I'm not expecting a Bnei Noach nation soon.  Job could be considered one, and still we were afraid to go against the Caananites because he was living in there, the righteous protect the whole nation. Pretty sure a few of the seventy were mixed when we were still doing sacrifices but they look and act like them still, who here can say Ishmael changed? So you do share the national heritage with your neighbors, though morally you seem to be in another universe.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

Bnei Noach have an elevated place, sort of transcends nations, but historically there will be less of you than Jews always. If you sit down and do the math, I think it's even harder to be a righteous gentile living in the world we do than a good Jew. So I'm not expecting a Bnei Noach nation soon.  Job could be considered one, and still we were afraid to go against the Caananites because he was living in there, the righteous protect the whole nation. Pretty sure a few of the seventy were mixed when we were still doing sacrifices but they look and act like them still, who here can say Ishmael changed? So you do share the national heritage with your neighbors, though morally you seem to be in another universe.

Bnei Noach are Children of Noah, Gentiles, non-Jews. Obviously there are more Gentiles than Jews in the world. There are very few Pious of the Nations (Hassidei Umot Ha'Olom). Righteous Gentiles have challenges. Good Jews have challenges. Barukh HaShem we can work together.

[Israel Chai]

Bnei Noach are Children of Noah, Gentiles, non-Jews. Obviously there are more Gentiles than Jews in the world. There are very few Pious of the Nations (Hassidei Umot Ha'Olom). Righteous Gentiles have challenges. Good Jews have challenges. Barukh HaShem we can work together.

Sure we can and should be working together however possible, but just for the issue at hand, I see how Jewish nationalism is Torah mandated as you pointed out, but not how Chinese Nationalism is fake, it's voluntary though.

[Hrvatski Noahid]

Sure we can and should be working together however possible, but just for the issue at hand, I see how Jewish nationalism is Torah mandated as you pointed out, but not how Chinese Nationalism is fake, it's voluntary though.

I am happy with you having the last word in this discussion.

[Binyamin Yisrael]

Sure we can and should be working together however possible, but just for the issue at hand, I see how Jewish nationalism is Torah mandated as you pointed out, but not how Chinese Nationalism is fake, it's voluntary though.

Current Chinese nationalism is fake since they are Communists. I heard they put Chinese Muslims in reeducation camps recently. Although Islam is evil, they could do it against Chinese Jews too.

[Israel Chai]

Current Chinese nationalism is fake since they are Communists. I heard they put Chinese Muslims in reduation camps recently. Although Islam is evil, they could do it against Chinese Jews too.

Someone who wants to kill the commies and it's not important if they think a monarchy or democracy is better, but someone who loves China for China and wants to reclaim their heritage from the commies that are wiping it out and revising it weekly. Not someone who loves Chinese commie cop shows, which are basically like American cop shows, but closer to dystopian future sci fi ones.