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Offline Israel Chai

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I heard that the final straw for the flood was because people stole from another

That was the first straw in the decree. Since everything everyone had was stolen, they wouldn't care when Hashem took it from them, and therefore no punishment could make them do teshuva. As a result it was decreed that the world would be destroyed. They morally deteriorated, having no deterrent for sin, and the decree for their destruction was signed for those crimes. There's a gemarra source, but I'm not sure if I'm bad at remembering those or not making the proper effort for me, not in terms of my intelligence but I enjoy Torah so much I remember it, sources remembering it requires effort for me.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline Israel Chai

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In addition to the positive obligation to have modest thoughts, a Gentile who thought about idol worship is punished by Heaven for his evil thoughts according to Tractate Kiddushin 39b and Tosafot there. There are other examples.

So like we go on about "we do 613 and you only have 7" but really you're at least at 500 or so too.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Online Hrvatski Noahid

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So like we go on about "we do 613 and you only have 7" but really you're at least at 500 or so too.

The fact that the Noahide commandments are broad categories doesn't mean there are more than 7. Each Noahide obligation is part of the 7 commandments. The 613 Jewish commandments have their details and the 7 Noahide commandments have their details.
Gentiles are obligated to fulfill the Seven Noahide Commandments because they are the eternal command of God, transmitted through Moses our teacher in the Torah. The main and best book on details of Noahide observance is "The Divine Code" by Rabbi Moshe Weiner.

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Offline Israel Chai

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The fact that the Noahide commandments are broad categories doesn't mean there are more than 7. Each Noahide obligation is part of the 7 commandments. The 613 Jewish commandments have their details and the 7 Noahide commandments have their details.

Eh I guess. I started getting into the details of certain mitzvot like davening and was like "i have almost never come close to doing this right", and like the details on which blessing I make on which food based on a million different factors and was like "literally less than 10 people alive do this right".

The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline Israel Chai

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So maybe the evidence is with you and I'm not remembering Rabbi Mizrachi's position right possibly. It says that the thought is worse than the sin with immodesty, because the sin is one time say 8 rounds x30min-1hour and it's over, the thought can go on and on for years. If it is forbidden to do the act, it is, then the thought is forbidden too. I know from painful experience that every blessing has an equal opposite curse if you refuse it, so if it is a blessing for Noachides to be modest, it is, then it brings an equal opposite curse to a life of love and children to be immodest. Even if we G-d forbid forget all the laws, it is enormously in one's self-interest to keep one's thoughts clean.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline Dr. Dan

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So like we go on about "we do 613 and you only have 7" but really you're at least at 500 or so too.

Remember. The Torah is really just the cliff notes for the oral law.

So is the 7 Noahide laws. 7 categories which include etc
If someone says something bad about you, say something nice about them. That way, both of you would be lying.

In your heart you know WE are right and in your guts you know THEY are nuts!

"Science without religion is lame; Religion without science is blind."  - Albert Einstein

Offline Dr. Dan

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So maybe the evidence is with you and I'm not remembering Rabbi Mizrachi's position right possibly. It says that the thought is worse than the sin with immodesty, because the sin is one time say 8 rounds x30min-1hour and it's over, the thought can go on and on for years. If it is forbidden to do the act, it is, then the thought is forbidden too. I know from painful experience that every blessing has an equal opposite curse if you refuse it, so if it is a blessing for Noachides to be modest, it is, then it brings an equal opposite curse to a life of love and children to be immodest. Even if we G-d forbid forget all the laws, it is enormously in one's self-interest to keep one's thoughts clean.

While God can see into our thoughts I have never know thoughts to be more sinful than the actual behavior. Thoughts can lead to sins but it’s a great victory against the evil inclination when after a thought one avoids the sin.

One should not put himself in that situation to have bad thoughts and try to battle against HaSatan
If someone says something bad about you, say something nice about them. That way, both of you would be lying.

In your heart you know WE are right and in your guts you know THEY are nuts!

"Science without religion is lame; Religion without science is blind."  - Albert Einstein

Offline Israel Chai

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While God can see into our thoughts I have never know thoughts to be more sinful than the actual behavior. Thoughts can lead to sins but it’s a great victory against the evil inclination when after a thought one avoids the sin.

One should not put himself in that situation to have bad thoughts and try to battle against HaSatan

It fits in with the central premise of the Jewish Idea that the purpose of the mizvot is to remove your ego. The sin you do one time, it's over you can make teshuva, the thought can consume you until you are a depraved individual completely. I heard a retort from a Chabad Rabbi that doing this can create a baby, if it's with a non-Jewish girl then it's a baby that's physically but not spiritually yours, a married woman a mamzer with a life of suffering ahead of him. Still, all it proves is the same thing in the first place, more damage to the world, but less damage to you, imo.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Online Hrvatski Noahid

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Eh I guess. I started getting into the details of certain mitzvot like davening and was like "i have almost never come close to doing this right", and like the details on which blessing I make on which food based on a million different factors and was like "literally less than 10 people alive do this right".

So maybe the evidence is with you and I'm not remembering Rabbi Mizrachi's position right possibly. It says that the thought is worse than the sin with immodesty, because the sin is one time say 8 rounds x30min-1hour and it's over, the thought can go on and on for years. If it is forbidden to do the act, it is, then the thought is forbidden too. I know from painful experience that every blessing has an equal opposite curse if you refuse it, so if it is a blessing for Noachides to be modest, it is, then it brings an equal opposite curse to a life of love and children to be immodest. Even if we G-d forbid forget all the laws, it is enormously in one's self-interest to keep one's thoughts clean.

Gentile prayers and blessings are voluntary. What you wrote is a good example of the Torah Law for Jews being more restrictive.

Gentiles are especially forbidden to desire or lust after another man's wife because it can lead to the sin of adultery, which is also related to theft. 
Gentiles are obligated to fulfill the Seven Noahide Commandments because they are the eternal command of God, transmitted through Moses our teacher in the Torah. The main and best book on details of Noahide observance is "The Divine Code" by Rabbi Moshe Weiner.

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Online Hrvatski Noahid

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Remember. The Torah is really just the cliff notes for the oral law.

So is the 7 Noahide laws. 7 categories which include etc

Exactly. The Gentile world opposes the Oral Torah because it explains the practical details of the commandments.
Gentiles are obligated to fulfill the Seven Noahide Commandments because they are the eternal command of God, transmitted through Moses our teacher in the Torah. The main and best book on details of Noahide observance is "The Divine Code" by Rabbi Moshe Weiner.

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Offline Israel Chai

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Exactly. The Gentile world opposes the Oral Torah because it explains the practical details of the commandments.

They oppose the written Torah to the point of corrupting it to serve their agendas. Jews and our allies have generally faced opposition. Makes things really interesting.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline Noachide

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« Last Edit: February 27, 2020, 03:49:57 AM by Noachide »

Offline Noachide

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There are some issues when I post url. I get a blank space instead of link.

Offline Israel Chai

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I was thinking something. Tell me if I'm anywhere with this. Rabbi Reuven among others says spilling seed is murder. If you have immodest thoughts, this causes dreams in the night where you waste seed. Is wasting seed through a dream accidental murder? We know we call it accidental murder and not accidental killing because you should have been more careful, and now city of refuge for you. If so, having immodest thoughts can be considered like walking up a ladder that you know is faulty.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline Dr. Dan

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I was thinking something. Tell me if I'm anywhere with this. Rabbi Reuven among others says spilling seed is murder. If you have immodest thoughts, this causes dreams in the night where you waste seed. Is wasting seed through a dream accidental murder? We know we call it accidental murder and not accidental killing because you should have been more careful, and now city of refuge for you. If so, having immodest thoughts can be considered like walking up a ladder that you know is faulty.

At a very high spiritual level, yes. I still have a tough time with rabbi Reuven’s mussar on this subject. But the fault is with me and not the mussar.
If someone says something bad about you, say something nice about them. That way, both of you would be lying.

In your heart you know WE are right and in your guts you know THEY are nuts!

"Science without religion is lame; Religion without science is blind."  - Albert Einstein

Offline Israel Chai

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At a very high spiritual level, yes. I still have a tough time with rabbi Reuven’s mussar on this subject. But the fault is with me and not the mussar.

There are many others who say the same thing, on video a few too. For someone who was sexually active growing up, it feels like you are burning alive 24/7 and doesn't go away, but B"H I was built very hard. I generally don't trust any single guy saying he can do this if he doesn't work out alot and is super buff, it wouldn't be possible to maintain sanity if I wasn't using my strength 24/7.

The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline Israel Chai

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And cancel what I said about Noachide laws being just as hard. You know how many things I have to know just to pee? You can't be holding anything, you can't walk around, you definitely can't hold your member, I can't think Torah for sure or any thoughts, just focus on the feeling in my internal organs, can't push it out, you have to super relax it out, and you always have to use a little paper after for a quick wipe. By a long shot the most humbling experience of my life to re-potty train myself, you freeking wet the floor like a five year old and want to just die.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline Dr. Dan

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There are many others who say the same thing, on video a few too. For someone who was sexually active growing up, it feels like you are burning alive 24/7 and doesn't go away, but B"H I was built very hard. I generally don't trust any single guy saying he can do this if he doesn't work out alot and is super buff, it wouldn't be possible to maintain sanity if I wasn't using my strength 24/7.

The only chance one has is if he is constantly in Torah and not around women except his wife.
If someone says something bad about you, say something nice about them. That way, both of you would be lying.

In your heart you know WE are right and in your guts you know THEY are nuts!

"Science without religion is lame; Religion without science is blind."  - Albert Einstein

Offline Israel Chai

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The only chance one has is if he is constantly in Torah and not around women except his wife.

No weak person can last a week of nights. If he has a wife it's not an issue, or shouldn't be, I'm speaking of singles.  The pain is too great. You must have great physical strength to resist. Even that isn't enough sometimes to me, but the cult I grew up in said it was good and you should do it. We'd read stories the cult leader wrote about his nanny masturbating him in bed to help him sleep and that it was good. I am still furious that little me was tricked by those freak bags, and sometimes I draw on my reserves of rage that anyone could deceive me to help me not do it.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Offline Joe Gutfeld

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Spielberg isn't exactly popular on this page anyway.  He doesn't even practice judism at all.

Online Hrvatski Noahid

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I was thinking something. Tell me if I'm anywhere with this. Rabbi Reuven among others says spilling seed is murder. If you have immodest thoughts, this causes dreams in the night where you waste seed. Is wasting seed through a dream accidental murder? We know we call it accidental murder and not accidental killing because you should have been more careful, and now city of refuge for you. If so, having immodest thoughts can be considered like walking up a ladder that you know is faulty.

It is close to a deliberate transgression.
Gentiles are obligated to fulfill the Seven Noahide Commandments because they are the eternal command of God, transmitted through Moses our teacher in the Torah. The main and best book on details of Noahide observance is "The Divine Code" by Rabbi Moshe Weiner.

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Offline Israel Chai

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It is close to a deliberate transgression.

So it's like sabotaging the ladder before you walk on it in your opinion?
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Online Hrvatski Noahid

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There are many others who say the same thing, on video a few too. For someone who was sexually active growing up, it feels like you are burning alive 24/7 and doesn't go away, but B"H I was built very hard. I generally don't trust any single guy saying he can do this if he doesn't work out alot and is super buff, it wouldn't be possible to maintain sanity if I wasn't using my strength 24/7.

I prefer intellectual and financial pursuits. I don't have the time to think about women.
Gentiles are obligated to fulfill the Seven Noahide Commandments because they are the eternal command of God, transmitted through Moses our teacher in the Torah. The main and best book on details of Noahide observance is "The Divine Code" by Rabbi Moshe Weiner.

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Offline Israel Chai

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I prefer intellectual and financial pursuits. I don't have the time to think about women.

There's always time for an addiction, and it is one. If your brain doesn't automatically go there based on anything or nothing, it's because you made an effort at some point to keep it in a good place. You can see it from kids undergoing puberty, before they can understand the implications of their actions it will always be the first thing they think of in every situation.
The fear of the L-rd is the beginning of knowledge

Online Hrvatski Noahid

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There's always time for an addiction, and it is one. If your brain doesn't automatically go there based on anything or nothing, it's because you made an effort at some point to keep it in a good place. You can see it from kids undergoing puberty, before they can understand the implications of their actions it will always be the first thing they think of in every situation.

Learning that anyone who spills semen wastefully is compared to a murderer was a shock, but it is what it is. Luckily I have you to talk to.   
« Last Edit: January 18, 2022, 09:04:58 AM by Hrvatski Noahid »
Gentiles are obligated to fulfill the Seven Noahide Commandments because they are the eternal command of God, transmitted through Moses our teacher in the Torah. The main and best book on details of Noahide observance is "The Divine Code" by Rabbi Moshe Weiner.

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