Author Topic: Shalom  (Read 5701 times)

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Offline Dan Ben Noah

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Shalom
« on: October 15, 2007, 12:26:24 AM »
Shalom
« Last Edit: June 20, 2016, 12:21:11 AM by Dan Ben Noah »
Jeremiah 16:19 O Lord, Who are my power and my strength and my refuge in the day of trouble, to You nations will come from the ends of the earth and say, "Only lies have our fathers handed down to us, emptiness in which there is nothing of any avail!

Zechariah 8:23 So said the Lord of Hosts: In those days, when ten men of all the languages of the nations shall take hold of the skirt of a Jewish man, saying, "Let us go with you, for we have heard that God is with you."

Offline decimos

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2007, 07:18:56 AM »
yes this is correct
And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken perversion against the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed thee out of the house of bondage, to draw thee aside out of the way which the LORD thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put away the evil from the midst of thee.Deuteronomy 13:5.

Offline Tzvi Ben Roshel1

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2007, 04:31:55 PM »
I'm not going to argue with a Rabbi, but that sounds like a stringency to me. This might have been true 3000 years ago, but I doubt there is any problem with slaughtering techniques these days for gentiles.

WHATT, the exact opposite. In America they put electricity threw animals and kill them that way. Its all factories and mass production. People who do it the old fashined way for example muslims at least kill the animals threw the neck. - I dont want to give muslims buisness but I think that gentiles should either only eat kosher (even regular Kosher not necessarily Glatt) or Halah meat.  Allthough maybe even NO for both of these groups- No to Hallal not to gove $ to muslims and no to regular kosher not to incourage butchers selling just regular Kosher and not Glatt. But its really up to them.
The Academy of Elijah taught, whoever studies the laws (of the Torah) every day, (he) is guaranteed to have a share in the World to Come.

‏119:139 צִמְּתַתְנִי קִנְאָתִי כִּישָׁכְחוּ דְבָרֶיךָ צָרָי
My zeal incenses me, for my adversaries have forgotten Your words.
‏119:141 צָעִיר אָנֹכִי וְנִבְזֶה פִּקֻּדֶיךָ, לֹא שָׁכָחְתִּי.
 I am young and despised; I have not forgotten Your precepts.

" A fool does not realize, and an unwise person does not understand this (i.e. the following:) When the wicked bloom like grass, and the evildoers blossom (i.e. when they seem extremly successful), it is to destroy them forever (i.e. they are rewarded for their few good deeds in this World, and they will have no portion in the World to Come!)

Please visit: (The Greatest lectures on Earth).
http://torahanytime.com/
http://www.torahanytime.com/Rabbi/Yossi_Mizrachi/
http://www.torahanytime.com/Rabbi/Zecharia_Wallerstein/

Offline q_q_

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2007, 09:58:24 PM »
The sanhedrin is a controversial thing.

The law is from the verse "flesh with its soul, its blood you shall not eat".
Nothing saying a noachide must keep kosher.

"it`s soul" is taken to mean "while it is alive".

The rabbis say not to eat a limb torn from a live animal.

http://asknoah.org/HTML%5Callowed_meat&blood.html

The guy that runs that site often visits Rabbi Yoel Schwartz with questions, he is an authority.

It says explicitly there that the law does not require them to eat kosher.  I guess they can be more stringent

Offline jdl4ever

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2007, 10:25:49 PM »
I think your observation is correct.  I would assume that most slaughterhouses don't cut up the animal while it is still alive, so you can assume that most non Kosher meat is fine.  But the only way to be 100% certain is to eat Kosher meet or Halal or to go to the plant and find out what is going on there or to kill the animal yourself.  Lobster is definitely forbidden to eat outside of your home since they boil it alive and that violates the commandment. 
« Last Edit: October 20, 2007, 10:28:20 PM by jdl4ever »
"Enough weeping and wailing; and the following of leaders & rabbis who are pygmies of little faith & less understanding."
"I believe very much in a nation beating their swords into plowshears but when my enemy has a sword I don't want a plowshear"
-Rabbi Meir Kahane Zs'l HYD

Offline jdl4ever

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2007, 10:38:35 PM »
Actually, I'm not so confident they cut up animals when they are dead anymore.  See http://www.ericsecho.org/investigation.htm .Also according to the slaughterhouses when the animal is jerking after it is killed, it doesn't count as being alive but in Judaism this counts as Gentiles eating from a live animal.
"Enough weeping and wailing; and the following of leaders & rabbis who are pygmies of little faith & less understanding."
"I believe very much in a nation beating their swords into plowshears but when my enemy has a sword I don't want a plowshear"
-Rabbi Meir Kahane Zs'l HYD

Offline Lubab

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2007, 04:07:07 PM »
It is known that many modern slaughterhouses will start cutting the meat after shocking the animal but while it is still alive. For this reason, Noahides should try to get kosher meat.
"It is not upon you to finish the work, nor are you free to desist from it." Rabbi Tarfon, Pirkei Avot.

Offline Uziyahu

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2007, 08:52:24 PM »
Eating only kosher meat is the safest way to observe the prohibition on blood. 

I personally do NOT subscribe to this interpretation that it has to do with eating the limb of a living animal.  I think that is a bit of "loosening of requirements" for non-Jews who might find eating kosher meat a bit too difficult.

Both early Christians (as evidenced by Acts 15) and Islam understood this prohibition to be against the consumption of meat with the blood still in it.  Islam is actually a Noachide-compliant religion, if you're reviewing the 7 basic laws.  It's their Jew-hatred and their lust for the Land that makes Islam out-of-line as a gentile religion.  Few religious Jews seem to have a problem with the idea that Mohammed might have been a prophet for Arabs, not for Jews.

Offline judeanoncapta

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2007, 11:21:07 PM »
Eating only kosher meat is the safest way to observe the prohibition on blood. 

I personally do NOT subscribe to this interpretation that it has to do with eating the limb of a living animal.  I think that is a bit of "loosening of requirements" for non-Jews who might find eating kosher meat a bit too difficult.

Both early Christians (as evidenced by Acts 15) and Islam understood this prohibition to be against the consumption of meat with the blood still in it.  Islam is actually a Noachide-compliant religion, if you're reviewing the 7 basic laws.  It's their Jew-hatred and their lust for the Land that makes Islam out-of-line as a gentile religion.  Few religious Jews seem to have a problem with the idea that Mohammed might have been a prophet for Arabs, not for Jews.

Mohammed, a Prophet for Arabs?

Well, I guess Bilaam was a prophet for Moabites.
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Offline Tzvi Ben Roshel1

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2007, 11:26:25 PM »
Bilam was actually a real prohet for the goyim, Mohammed wasn't a proohet, not even a false prophet, in all of the koran their isnt even 1 prophecy.
The Academy of Elijah taught, whoever studies the laws (of the Torah) every day, (he) is guaranteed to have a share in the World to Come.

‏119:139 צִמְּתַתְנִי קִנְאָתִי כִּישָׁכְחוּ דְבָרֶיךָ צָרָי
My zeal incenses me, for my adversaries have forgotten Your words.
‏119:141 צָעִיר אָנֹכִי וְנִבְזֶה פִּקֻּדֶיךָ, לֹא שָׁכָחְתִּי.
 I am young and despised; I have not forgotten Your precepts.

" A fool does not realize, and an unwise person does not understand this (i.e. the following:) When the wicked bloom like grass, and the evildoers blossom (i.e. when they seem extremly successful), it is to destroy them forever (i.e. they are rewarded for their few good deeds in this World, and they will have no portion in the World to Come!)

Please visit: (The Greatest lectures on Earth).
http://torahanytime.com/
http://www.torahanytime.com/Rabbi/Yossi_Mizrachi/
http://www.torahanytime.com/Rabbi/Zecharia_Wallerstein/

Offline Eliezer Ben Avraham

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2007, 11:30:29 PM »
Bilam was actually a real prohet for the goyim, Mohammed wasn't a proohet, not even a false prophet, in all of the koran their isnt even 1 prophecy.
Bilam blessed nations i thought, is that considered the same as prophesizing
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Offline judeanoncapta

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2007, 11:36:07 PM »
Bilam was actually a real prohet for the goyim, Mohammed wasn't a proohet, not even a false prophet, in all of the koran their isnt even 1 prophecy.

Not true, Mohammed predicted the end of the world in 500 years.

So he was atleast 900 years premature assuming the world ends today.
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Offline Tzvi Ben Roshel1

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2007, 11:50:16 PM »
Bilam was actually a real prohet for the goyim, Mohammed wasn't a proohet, not even a false prophet, in all of the koran their isnt even 1 prophecy.
Bilam blessed nations i thought, is that considered the same as prophesizing

He did a lot of things, its known that he was a prohet of the nations on the level of Moshe, partly becuase for the nations not to say that they didnt have a prophet, and if they did then they would be rightious like the Jews.
 Anyway I dont remember him blesing nations, he did bless Israel becuase G-d made him, but his real intentions were greed and evil towards them.
The Academy of Elijah taught, whoever studies the laws (of the Torah) every day, (he) is guaranteed to have a share in the World to Come.

‏119:139 צִמְּתַתְנִי קִנְאָתִי כִּישָׁכְחוּ דְבָרֶיךָ צָרָי
My zeal incenses me, for my adversaries have forgotten Your words.
‏119:141 צָעִיר אָנֹכִי וְנִבְזֶה פִּקֻּדֶיךָ, לֹא שָׁכָחְתִּי.
 I am young and despised; I have not forgotten Your precepts.

" A fool does not realize, and an unwise person does not understand this (i.e. the following:) When the wicked bloom like grass, and the evildoers blossom (i.e. when they seem extremly successful), it is to destroy them forever (i.e. they are rewarded for their few good deeds in this World, and they will have no portion in the World to Come!)

Please visit: (The Greatest lectures on Earth).
http://torahanytime.com/
http://www.torahanytime.com/Rabbi/Yossi_Mizrachi/
http://www.torahanytime.com/Rabbi/Zecharia_Wallerstein/

Offline Tzvi Ben Roshel1

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Re: The Limb of a Living Animal
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2007, 11:51:18 PM »
Bilam was actually a real prohet for the goyim, Mohammed wasn't a proohet, not even a false prophet, in all of the koran their isnt even 1 prophecy.

Not true, Mohammed predicted the end of the world in 500 years.

So he was atleast 900 years premature assuming the world ends today.

Lets be serious. I know your being sarcastic but maybe others wont understand and believe you by mistake.
The Academy of Elijah taught, whoever studies the laws (of the Torah) every day, (he) is guaranteed to have a share in the World to Come.

‏119:139 צִמְּתַתְנִי קִנְאָתִי כִּישָׁכְחוּ דְבָרֶיךָ צָרָי
My zeal incenses me, for my adversaries have forgotten Your words.
‏119:141 צָעִיר אָנֹכִי וְנִבְזֶה פִּקֻּדֶיךָ, לֹא שָׁכָחְתִּי.
 I am young and despised; I have not forgotten Your precepts.

" A fool does not realize, and an unwise person does not understand this (i.e. the following:) When the wicked bloom like grass, and the evildoers blossom (i.e. when they seem extremly successful), it is to destroy them forever (i.e. they are rewarded for their few good deeds in this World, and they will have no portion in the World to Come!)

Please visit: (The Greatest lectures on Earth).
http://torahanytime.com/
http://www.torahanytime.com/Rabbi/Yossi_Mizrachi/
http://www.torahanytime.com/Rabbi/Zecharia_Wallerstein/