JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: White Israelite on May 06, 2008, 09:09:51 AM
-
The video game Grand Theft Auto IV for the Xbox 360 and the Playstation 3 is a sandbox type of video game that allows you to pretty much do anything you want. I purchased the video game for the XBOX 360 in which you play as a character Niko Belic who is of Serbian background and moves to America for the "American dream", he quickly gets involved in a life of crime and is able to take missions from different people for money. The game is based in Liberty city which has been redesigned from previous interpretations to look much more similar to New York City. Many of the areas of the game are 100 percent replicas of real areas of New York including the statue of liberty.
The game alone is impressive from a graphical viewpoint and has already made a lot of noise and controversy as lawyers like Jack Thompson who has been trying to get the game banned and MADD (Mothers Against Drunk Driving) who are protesting the ability to be able to get drunk in the game and be allowed to operate a vehicle which gives you a blurry view simulating the ability of being intoxicated.
The game is one of the hottest selling out there in history making over 400 million dollars it's first day on sale alone, game production cost 100 million (more than many Hollywood movies)
While driving around in the game, I noticed Hasidic Jewish neighborhoods with men walking with all black outfits and black hats with a beard and hat and the peyot. I also noticed others wearing a Yarmulke sitting on benches and you have the ability to kill them or run them over with cars just like you have the ability to kill anyone (gang members, police, hookers, etc.)
There is even a mission in the game called "Late Checkout" which you work for a Italian man and are ordered to kill a Hasidic Jew involved in the diamond trade (a bit stereotypical no?)
The mission is available online on video to see for yourself.
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/grand-theft-auto-4-late-checkout-mission/744426168
I've played all Grand Theft Auto games in the past, and i'm curious if this was deliberate for controversy or not. Grand Theft Auto III was the first of it's kind to generate a large amount of controversy due to the graphical realism and upgrade in graphics with the ability to kill police officers and hookers which led to many parents refusing to allow their children to play the game. GTA Vice City had much controversy because there was a part where you had to kill Haitians and one of the lines was "kill those Haitian bastards."
Anyways, I find it rather bizzare why Jews in specific were added in the game to begin with? There are certainly other ethnic groups that live in New York City and there are muslims yet you don't see them in the game anywhere. What is your opinion about this? Personally it's left somewhat of a bad taste in my mouth. I know Take-2 and Rockstar games have never been politically correct to begin with, but it leaves me to wonder if you had the option to run over Muslims or kill them in the game how much outcry there would be? Comments?
-
My opinion: Obvious anti-semitism. The real thugs are the makers of the game.
-
That's what i'm trying to figure out is if it is considered deliberate anti-semitism or just in poor taste?
You do have the ability to kill Albanians (which you are ordered to in the beginning of the game), Russians, Irish, Italians, Blacks, Mexicans, and a few other groups.
At many points in the game, you work with the Irish mafia who has ties to the IRA including one mission where you rob a bank with IRA members, you work with the Russians, you work with the Italians, you work with corrupt police, drug dealers, etc.
it wouldn't surprise me if Take-2 (creators of the game) are trying to profit off of stereotypes or the controversy.
Theres even one mission where you are required to go to a internet cafe (in the game) and get a job and fill out a resume to plan a assassination of a lawyer who wants to ban guns and video games by the name of Tom Goldberg. You are required to purchase a suit and meet at his building in which you are required to assassinate him. It is never hinted he is a Jew but the last name pretty much gives it away and the fact he is a lawyer.
that video can be seen here
http://youtube.com/watch?v=q3frunSryp4&fmt=6
-
Meir,
Ask yourself if a righteous Jew or gentile would have developed this game in its present form, and I think you will have your answer.
-
The game is suppose to be controversial. I don't play video games, but I remember reading an article about it a few years ago when it first came out.
-
Even the video game producers are anti-semitic. What is going on here?!
-
The diamond trade thingy is a tip-off there.
But that game is just about killing everyone in site. Thats all it is. I'm sure there is something in it to offend everyone.
-
To be fair I think every single group has been targeted in this game in previous editions of GTA so I don't see how this is really anti-semitic.
-
To be fair I think every single group has been targeted in this game in previous editions of GTA so I don't see how this is really anti-semitic.
True, but I don't recall muslims or arabs ever being in the game.
-
Glen Beck has been reporting about how evil that game is .
-
The game is suppose to be controversial.
Then congratulations are in order. Its controversial.
The game is Orwellian to say the least. Everything is upside down. You play as a Serb who can murder anyone in sight, including religious Jews whom the Serbs saved in World War 2! Jews are "diamond merchants" which was undoubtedly at the request of Sharpton yimach shemo. You don't get to kill Arabs, 6 years after 9/11. You don't get to kill Muslims, 6 years after 9/11. This game is hopelessly evil. Games like these corrupt the minds of children who might have grown up to be good people. Instead, they are bombarded with this violence-glorifying game, and grow up to be dysfunctional members of society.
I think one of the first things the Christians need to take over in this country, and fast is the educational system. Popular culture like this game, left-wing parents, and the news media all erode the minds of our youth; there should be at least one bastion of morality in this country that everyone is exposed to.
-
Why would anyone want to play this drek game anyway?
-
Why would anyone want to play this drek game anyway?
Same reason people like to watch violent movies or listen to music, it's considered entertainment to them.
I bought the game merely because I grew up playing GTA and always had a blast doing the missions, just didn't think they were going to include Jews in it, they hadn't in the past. The games before, you were involved in killing corrupt people and other criminals (despite being a criminal yourself). As with all the GTA games, it's impossible to play without having to encounter the cops and kill them at some point. You don't have to kill Jews or Hookers though you have the option to just as in real life. However the one mission that is creating controversy involves a Jew who is a diamond merchant and you are required to kill him to progress in the game.
-
Meir,
Ask yourself if a righteous Jew or gentile would have developed this game in its present form, and I think you will have your answer.
rellikmilsum, you couldn't have summed up the situation better.
Hopefully, this so called game and the individual ( s ) who created it, will be exposed on a massive scale.
-
Meir,
Ask yourself if a righteous Jew or gentile would have developed this game in its present form, and I think you will have your answer.
rellikmilsum, you couldn't have summed up the situation better.
Hopefully, this so called game and the individual ( s ) who created it, will be exposed on a massive scale.
That's going to prove pretty difficult.
There was already a lot of controversy when GTA III was released in 2001 (first 3d version of it on the playstation 2) and Take-2 and Rockstar had to edit out several parts of the game before it was released (due to 9/11), the original cop cars resembled the New York police cars and there was a mission where you had to fly a plane into the Love Media towers which was removed due to what happened in NY. The ability to kill police and hookers sparked a lot of protests in 2001 but it still sold like hotcakes.
Even GTAIV which was released only a week ago had a record amount of sales, violence, sex, and criminal culture have a massive appeal not only in the US but around the world.
I personally think politicians are overreacting by calling it "murder simulators" however I don't think kids should be playing the games, however I will be damned if someone told me what my kids will be playing/watching , I think it's up to the parents to take care of their kids. I can understand a 16 year old playing games but some of the kids are as young as 7 playing these.
Likewise, you won't see Jews running around burning things or threatening to kill the game creators over including them in a game, but come a day you see muslims in a game, you never hear the end of it.
-
I used to play GTA a bit in 2000. You would get points for running over all
Hare Krishna in one go.
And of course part of the game was running from the police, stealing police cars, killing policeman. If you don't want to follow the mission
It was very cartoony..
there was no mission to kill them though!
I saw a newer version of GTA and was disgusted, I saw the guy you control, go to a beach and beat up a hot woman. Obviously the person controlling it did it, but it's very much a designed part of the game.
At least he is not killing him -because- he is a jew.. But because he is a diamond dealer or a bit of a gangster himself. The idea may have been inspired by the film Snatch.
-
I used to play GTA a bit in 2000. You would get points for running over all
Hare Krishna in one go.
And of course part of the game was running from the police, stealing police cars, killing policeman. If you don't want to follow the mission
It was very cartoony..
there was no mission to kill them though!
I saw a newer version of GTA and was disgusted, I saw the guy you control, go to a beach and beat up a hot woman. Obviously the person controlling it did it, but it's very much a designed part of the game.
At least he is not killing him -because- he is a jew.. But because he is a diamond dealer or a bit of a gangster himself. The idea may have been inspired by the film Snatch.
Right, hence the term Sandbox Game
A sandbox game (or a video game with an optional sandbox mode) is a video game with an open-ended and non-linear style of gameplay, or a reduced emphasis on structure. The sandbox analogy is used to describe this style of gaming because, as with a physical sandbox, the user is entertained by their ability to play creatively, boundless of artificial structural constraints. While these games may or may not have a story or over-arching mission structure, they are considered sandbox games for their ability to allow players to think outside of these goals.
you have complete creative freedom really to do what you want as you do in real life, you are not forced to required to kill hookers or Jews, what the controversy was over was the mission in specific. Also confronting police within the game is pretty difficult to avoid, like for example there is a bank mission where you end up robbing a bank and the police come and your pretty much forced to kill them. This has left a bad taste in some peoples mouth, especially because the police cars and even the slogans on the police cars in the game are identical to the real NYPD police cars.
Heres a NYPD cop car
(http://njpsac.org/images/photos/flipping_photos/Original%20Files/NYPD%20Radio.jpg)
heres the cop car in the game, looks pretty similar including the moto
(http://www.gtacartel.com/images/articles/vehicles/lcpd.jpg)
Bad picture but they look pretty identical
-
This is evil! >:(
-
I used to play GTA a bit in 2000. You would get points for running over all
Hare Krishna in one go.
And of course part of the game was running from the police, stealing police cars, killing policeman. If you don't want to follow the mission
It was very cartoony..
there was no mission to kill them though!
I saw a newer version of GTA and was disgusted, I saw the guy you control, go to a beach and beat up a hot woman. Obviously the person controlling it did it, but it's very much a designed part of the game.
At least he is not killing him -because- he is a jew.. But because he is a diamond dealer or a bit of a gangster himself. The idea may have been inspired by the film Snatch.
Right, hence the term Sandbox Game
A sandbox game (or a video game with an optional sandbox mode) is a video game with an open-ended and non-linear style of gameplay, or a reduced emphasis on structure. The sandbox analogy is used to describe this style of gaming because, as with a physical sandbox, the user is entertained by their ability to play creatively, boundless of artificial structural constraints. While these games may or may not have a story or over-arching mission structure, they are considered sandbox games for their ability to allow players to think outside of these goals.
you have complete creative freedom really to do what you want as you do in real life, you are not forced to required to kill hookers or Jews, what the controversy was over was the mission in specific. Also confronting police within the game is pretty difficult to avoid, like for example there is a bank mission where you end up robbing a bank and the police come and your pretty much forced to kill them. This has left a bad taste in some peoples mouth, especially because the police cars and even the slogans on the police cars in the game are identical to the real NYPD police cars.
Heres a NYPD cop car
(http://njpsac.org/images/photos/flipping_photos/Original%20Files/NYPD%20Radio.jpg)
heres the cop car in the game, looks pretty similar including the moto
(http://www.gtacartel.com/images/articles/vehicles/lcpd.jpg)
Bad picture but they look pretty identical
Not really.
The character you control is a bad ass,
the game is programmed for you to cause trouble.
They programmed in an option to kick and punch girls and for them to react in pain and so on.
They did not program any abilities to play a superman or batman like character, helping people. It would defeat the purpose of the game, as I said, he is a bad ass.
But your argument that it is boundless with no constraints and you can do what you want, (implying that you don't have to be bad) is nonsensical propaganda - no idea where you heard it, maybe from the makers. I doubt they believe that themselves. The title of the game is Grand Theft Auto, that should be a hint.
-
I used to play GTA a bit in 2000. You would get points for running over all
Hare Krishna in one go.
And of course part of the game was running from the police, stealing police cars, killing policeman. If you don't want to follow the mission
It was very cartoony..
there was no mission to kill them though!
I saw a newer version of GTA and was disgusted, I saw the guy you control, go to a beach and beat up a hot woman. Obviously the person controlling it did it, but it's very much a designed part of the game.
At least he is not killing him -because- he is a jew.. But because he is a diamond dealer or a bit of a gangster himself. The idea may have been inspired by the film Snatch.
Right, hence the term Sandbox Game
A sandbox game (or a video game with an optional sandbox mode) is a video game with an open-ended and non-linear style of gameplay, or a reduced emphasis on structure. The sandbox analogy is used to describe this style of gaming because, as with a physical sandbox, the user is entertained by their ability to play creatively, boundless of artificial structural constraints. While these games may or may not have a story or over-arching mission structure, they are considered sandbox games for their ability to allow players to think outside of these goals.
you have complete creative freedom really to do what you want as you do in real life, you are not forced to required to kill hookers or Jews, what the controversy was over was the mission in specific. Also confronting police within the game is pretty difficult to avoid, like for example there is a bank mission where you end up robbing a bank and the police come and your pretty much forced to kill them. This has left a bad taste in some peoples mouth, especially because the police cars and even the slogans on the police cars in the game are identical to the real NYPD police cars.
Heres a NYPD cop car
(http://njpsac.org/images/photos/flipping_photos/Original%20Files/NYPD%20Radio.jpg)
heres the cop car in the game, looks pretty similar including the moto
(http://www.gtacartel.com/images/articles/vehicles/lcpd.jpg)
Bad picture but they look pretty identical
Not really.
The character you control is a bad donkey,
the game is programmed for you to cause trouble.
They programmed in an option to kick and punch girls and for them to react in pain and so on.
They did not program any abilities to play a superman or batman like character, helping people. It would defeat the purpose of the game, as I said, he is a bad donkey.
But your argument that it is boundless with no constraints and you can do what you want, (implying that you don't have to be bad) is nonsensical propaganda - no idea where you heard it, maybe from the makers. I doubt they believe that themselves. The title of the game is Grand Theft Auto, that should be a hint.
Not defending the game, but the idea of it being a sandbox game does hold true. I'm not sure if being ultra realistic is necessarily a bad thing. You figure if you were running from the police in a car and you ended up hitting pedestrians in real life, they would die. It would be pretty difficult to have a realistic game if that wasn't included unless it were like gran turismo where citizens just jump out of the way if you come near them so your not able to hit them.
I think i'd be lying if there weren't times I laughed flying through a crowd of pedestrians and watched them go flying. Contrary to that, I know if I ended up doing that in reallife, I would feel pretty bad and know my life is screwed. Not sure how acceptable that is (entertainment), the Romans used to watch people kill each other for entertainment so it's hard to say from a religious standpoint of how acceptable it is.
Main reason I brought up the game was the fact that Jews were put in the game and it makes little sense why they were added. The fact that the environment is set on New York City could be one reason, but then why not include the other ethnic groups? To me, what i'm pointing out is it sounds like it was done deliberately. Heck even in the net cafe in the game, you can hear the Jews yelling "Oy Vey" so that is a clear indication they were intended to be in the game to cause shock value or what not.
And by all means, your right, the characters you play are not good people.
GTA III, you play as Claude who is a silent criminal involved in robbing banks and escapes from a police van as a prisoner and goes on to make money by committing crimes.
GTA Vice City, you play as some psychopath by the name of Tommy Vercetti in Miami
GTA San Andreas, you play as Carl Johnson, a black gangster who makes excuses for his life of crime.
And then of course GTA IV you play as Niko Bellic.
Niko Bellic is a fictional character in the Grand Theft Auto video game series. He is the main protagonist and playable character of Grand Theft Auto IV. Niko is revealed to be guilty of previous criminal acts in his life, such as murder and human trafficking. He wishes to begin a new life in Liberty City.
During the course of the story, Niko is looking for someone who betrayed his old army unit and will stop at nothing to find him, enlisting help from wherever he can. Niko is said to be between 5’11” and 6’2”, is 30 years of age, 190-200 lbs and is a Serbian veteran of the Bosnian War.[3] A recent video release by Rockstar concentrates on the character of Niko, revealing an almost regretful attitude towards his violent and 'angry' past, but acknowledging his talent managing in hostile environments. The scene closes with a parting thought, leaving the impression that Niko is concerned for the well-being of his soul.[4]
So yeah, the game is based around playing as people guilty of crimes, or criminals, just that you do have the option of what you want to do. I was merely pointing out that killing hookers and pedestrians was not the main focus of the game though you do have the option to as you would in real life if you were to take a car and run over them.
-
To be fair I think every single group has been targeted in this game in previous editions of GTA so I don't see how this is really anti-semitic.
So that makes it okay
-
To be fair I think every single group has been targeted in this game in previous editions of GTA so I don't see how this is really anti-semitic.
So that makes it okay
It's a very vulgar game, and it really does point out every group. If it singled out Jews specifically, that's one thing.. but every group is targeted in the game.
-
Why would anyone want to play this drek game anyway?
I dont play games. I cant stand anything but Jeopardy. These games are violent, but this takes the cake. Why is nobody stopping this? This is an outright affront.
-
And these games are focused to be sold to young people.
-
And these games are focused to be sold to young people.
It's rated Mature (17+) which is equivalent to a Rated R movie, but parents buy their kids the game without looking at the rating.
-
And these games are focused to be sold to young people.
It's rated Mature (17+) which is equivalent to a Rated R movie, but parents buy their kids the game without looking at the rating.
If they buy through online shopping it doesn't matter
-
And these games are focused to be sold to young people.
It's rated Mature (17+) which is equivalent to a Rated R movie, but parents buy their kids the game without looking at the rating.
If they buy through online shopping it doesn't matter
Still need a credit card, you need to be 18 to get a credit card.
-
I used to play GTA a bit in 2000. You would get points for running over all
Hare Krishna in one go.
And of course part of the game was running from the police, stealing police cars, killing policeman. If you don't want to follow the mission
It was very cartoony..
there was no mission to kill them though!
I saw a newer version of GTA and was disgusted, I saw the guy you control, go to a beach and beat up a hot woman. Obviously the person controlling it did it, but it's very much a designed part of the game.
At least he is not killing him -because- he is a jew.. But because he is a diamond dealer or a bit of a gangster himself. The idea may have been inspired by the film Snatch.
I do remember the original. Even though the original had slightly poor taste, it was cartoony and hadn't evolved to the evil game that it is now.
-
This is evil! >:(
No it is not. It is only a game which you do not have to play if it is not your cup of tea.
-
Why are you even wasting your time on this drek? Video games are not good for a person. They disrupt the soul and lead to increased violence. I know because I grew up when video games were peaceful. And now there is the ability to kill everyone in realistic graphics. This is not progress. This is absolute drek of the worst kind. Video pornography...
muman613
-
Why are you even wasting your time on this drek? Video games are not good for a person. They disrupt the soul and lead to increased violence. I know because I grew up when video games were peaceful. And now there is the ability to kill everyone in realistic graphics. This is not progress. This is absolute drek of the worst kind. Video pornography...
muman613
I own that Game and it has not made me more Violent
-
Why are you even wasting your time on this drek? Video games are not good for a person. They disrupt the soul and lead to increased violence. I know because I grew up when video games were peaceful. And now there is the ability to kill everyone in realistic graphics. This is not progress. This is absolute drek of the worst kind. Video pornography...
muman613
I own that Game and it has not made me more Violent
Just wait....
muman613
-
Why are you even wasting your time on this drek? Video games are not good for a person. They disrupt the soul and lead to increased violence. I know because I grew up when video games were peaceful. And now there is the ability to kill everyone in realistic graphics. This is not progress. This is absolute drek of the worst kind. Video pornography...
muman613
I own that Game and it has not made me more Violent
Just wait....
muman613
What do you mean just wait? I also play war games like WW2 games does that mean I want war?
-
Why are you even wasting your time on this drek? Video games are not good for a person. They disrupt the soul and lead to increased violence. I know because I grew up when video games were peaceful. And now there is the ability to kill everyone in realistic graphics. This is not progress. This is absolute drek of the worst kind. Video pornography...
muman613
I own that Game and it has not made me more Violent
Just wait....
muman613
What do you mean just wait? I also play war games like WW2 games does that mean I want war?
Shalom AmericanHero,
Everything we see, smell, hear, and do has an effect on us. Our senses are filled with death, dying, murder, and crime. Do you really think you are above being affected by the things you see and do? This is why Jews have Mitzvahs, which is a thing we do, which has spiritual repercussions. I dont want to argue about the actual repercussions which may happen because you play these games. But you should think about what you accept into your mind. Last Shabbat we learned to appoint guards at the gates of the city. This means that we should be guards of our own gates, our eyes, ears, and mouth. What we see, think, and do are in our control. When you release yourself to careless playing of games where you are a criminal, you are allowing criminal thoughts to enter your brain. The long term effects of these thoughts are not quite understood now. I will not play these crappy games because the person who publishes it wants to implant these subliminal messages into my brain. I will not allow them to desecrate my mind.
muman613
-
The game all together is in poor taste.
-
I don't know why someone bumped this thread as it's a few months old, anyways I grew up with violent video games and i've always been a peaceful person.
I grew up with Wolfenstein 3D (on the PC), Mortal Kombat, Doom, played Soldier Of Fortune, Half-Life, Postal, Quake, Duke Nukem, and plenty of other violent games as a kid and it never had an affect on me. I do have quite a high tolerance for violence but I certainly make logical decisions and know that killing/murder is wrong and that the only form of violence should be in self defense to protect your life or another persons.
-
I don't know why someone bumped this thread as it's a few months old, anyways I grew up with violent video games and i've always been a peaceful person.
I grew up with Wolfenstein 3D (on the PC), Mortal Kombat, Doom, played Soldier Of Fortune, Half-Life, Postal, Quake, Duke Nukem, and plenty of other violent games as a kid and it never had an affect on me. I do have quite a high tolerance for violence but I certainly make logical decisions and know that killing/murder is wrong and that the only form of violence should be in self defense to protect your life or another persons.
Doom was a great game
-
I don't know why someone bumped this thread as it's a few months old, anyways I grew up with violent video games and i've always been a peaceful person.
I grew up with Wolfenstein 3D (on the PC), Mortal Kombat, Doom, played Soldier Of Fortune, Half-Life, Postal, Quake, Duke Nukem, and plenty of other violent games as a kid and it never had an affect on me. I do have quite a high tolerance for violence but I certainly make logical decisions and know that killing/murder is wrong and that the only form of violence should be in self defense to protect your life or another persons.
Doom was a great game
It was actually my Grandpa (who was Jewish) that introduced me to Doom believe it or not, he had weird taste but he was big into collecting pin ball machines, slot machines and video games.
-
I don't know why someone bumped this thread as it's a few months old, anyways I grew up with violent video games and i've always been a peaceful person.
I grew up with Wolfenstein 3D (on the PC), Mortal Kombat, Doom, played Soldier Of Fortune, Half-Life, Postal, Quake, Duke Nukem, and plenty of other violent games as a kid and it never had an affect on me. I do have quite a high tolerance for violence but I certainly make logical decisions and know that killing/murder is wrong and that the only form of violence should be in self defense to protect your life or another persons.
Doom was a great game
It was actually my Grandpa (who was Jewish) that introduced me to Doom believe it or not, he had weird taste but he was big into collecting pin ball machines, slot machines and video games.
You got a cool Grandfather O0
-
I don't know why someone bumped this thread as it's a few months old, anyways I grew up with violent video games and i've always been a peaceful person.
I grew up with Wolfenstein 3D (on the PC), Mortal Kombat, Doom, played Soldier Of Fortune, Half-Life, Postal, Quake, Duke Nukem, and plenty of other violent games as a kid and it never had an affect on me. I do have quite a high tolerance for violence but I certainly make logical decisions and know that killing/murder is wrong and that the only form of violence should be in self defense to protect your life or another persons.
Doom was a great game
It was actually my Grandpa (who was Jewish) that introduced me to Doom believe it or not, he had weird taste but he was big into collecting pin ball machines, slot machines and video games.
You got a cool Grandfather O0
He's passed away now, but you could say he was definitely a very strange Jew, we was very wealthy and a successful business man, and he was a bit of a redneck too, had a farm he went to every year and preferred to stay isolated from other people. My uncles were the same, they all live out in the stick in isolated communities where houses are very spread out.
-
I don't know why someone bumped this thread as it's a few months old, anyways I grew up with violent video games and i've always been a peaceful person.
I grew up with Wolfenstein 3D (on the PC), Mortal Kombat, Doom, played Soldier Of Fortune, Half-Life, Postal, Quake, Duke Nukem, and plenty of other violent games as a kid and it never had an affect on me. I do have quite a high tolerance for violence but I certainly make logical decisions and know that killing/murder is wrong and that the only form of violence should be in self defense to protect your life or another persons.
Doom was a great game
It was actually my Grandpa (who was Jewish) that introduced me to Doom believe it or not, he had weird taste but he was big into collecting pin ball machines, slot machines and video games.
Yes,
And I play Quake III and Doom... I am not saying it makes you a violent person. I am simply saying that everything we do affects who we are as a person. The more sick and perverted games we play, the more sick and perverted we may become. Nobody is responsible for what you do beside yourself. So many people are influenced by the media that it becomes a constant drone of "I only did what I saw on TV, or in the video games!"... It is not a 1 to 1 corellation, but over time peoples sensibilities are altered by the mass media. Heck, look at how acceptable homosexual behavior is... Dont you think it is because the media keeps saying it is OK?
muman613
-
I don't know why someone bumped this thread as it's a few months old, anyways I grew up with violent video games and i've always been a peaceful person.
I grew up with Wolfenstein 3D (on the PC), Mortal Kombat, Doom, played Soldier Of Fortune, Half-Life, Postal, Quake, Duke Nukem, and plenty of other violent games as a kid and it never had an affect on me. I do have quite a high tolerance for violence but I certainly make logical decisions and know that killing/murder is wrong and that the only form of violence should be in self defense to protect your life or another persons.
Doom was a great game
It was actually my Grandpa (who was Jewish) that introduced me to Doom believe it or not, he had weird taste but he was big into collecting pin ball machines, slot machines and video games.
Yes,
And I play Quake III and Doom... I am not saying it makes you a violent person. I am simply saying that everything we do affects who we are as a person. The more sick and perverted games we play, the more sick and perverted we may become. Nobody is responsible for what you do beside yourself. So many people are influenced by the media that it becomes a constant drone of "I only did what I saw on TV, or in the video games!"... It is not a 1 to 1 corellation, but over time peoples sensibilities are altered by the mass media. Heck, look at how acceptable homosexual behavior is... Dont you think it is because the media keeps saying it is OK?
muman613
muman613
muman613
I think violence and sexual behavior are very different subjects in America. While violence seems to be the acceptable norm in the majority of society here in this country, sex is not. I remember my mother had a conversation saying "I'd rather my sons see a womens natural body than someone getting their brains blown out", it was actually the opposite for us although in a decent righteous society, I don't think any would really be acceptable in any form except in the private of ones own home.
In Europe however, it appears that it's quite the opposite.
I'm not opposed to violence per say within video games or movies as I think that's a individuals choice on how they perceive violence, regulation of content for "family values" is equivalent to a nanny state, it reminds me of how democrats want to regulate and tax everything. Unfortunately both parties are now responsible for that.
I think it is up to the parents to decide what their kids watch or play and not the governments.
I fail to see why video games get such a horrible rep compared to movies, it doesn't help that an insane lawyer (Jack Thompson) has been on a crusade to ban such video games with lack of evidence that video games are the cause of violence such as Columbine and other various school shootings (I think that's more of a mental illness issue than video games and guns).
Some may say that video games put you in the role of the person behind the gun and is a "murder simulator" but I think it's no different than any other form of entertainment, some video games may even have consequences for certain activies, for example in the Call Of Duty series, you play as the allies in World War II and you have missions to fight against the Nazis (nearly perfectly recreated to the real battles), while it's possible to shoot your teammates, the game ends and you are forced to restart, and you are not able to play as the Axis/Nazis.
I can understand where your coming from with a game like Grand Theft Auto and Homosexuality that because you are given those options in the game, it may promote it, but I think that the majority of these people saying "Grand Theft Auto made me do it" are using it as a safety net and hopes of a plea bargain more than anything, I doubt if the game existed that these type of crimes would be any less than they are. It's kind of like the cases we hear where a women murders her kids and claims God told her to do it so she can get a plea bargain.
-
Shalom,
While it is true that parents are ultimately responsible for the deeds of their children, our own Mrs Sarah Palin is a prime example of the limitations of this. Society IS responsible for the youth. This is a TORAH concept. Our Society should be designed as a safe place for the children to grow. We shouldnt have to protect them from bad things. A Torah society would not allow any of this drek to be pedaled to the youth. Because we are so lost in the haze of our own sin it is hard to know what is the correct course at this time.
I grew up with all the drek and I look at the reasons which I deviated from the path which was laid out for me. I had to go off the path, a long far and hard way, before I did my teshuva. Do I blame society? No, I blame myself. But if it were not for the society telling me that taking drugs and losing myself was cool, I dont know if I would have gone that route. Believe me, my life was laid out for me, from growing up, to going to college, etc. But I rebelled against my parents. I dont know if it is because of the society, but I know it didn't help.
I was born in the 60s and somehow the 60s became the Age of Enlightenment. Now I cant turn on TV without seeing the media glorifying the drug-taking, free-sex of the 60s. I am sick of it and turn it off because the 60s are not all it is cracked up to be.
I cant wait till we return to the ways of righteousness and faith in Hashem. May it come soon!
muman613
-
However, it is a free country (for now) and the game should NOT be banned!
-
However, it is a free country (for now) and the game should NOT be banned!
I believe it is a sad fact that in our system freedom means freedom to do anything we want. When we study Freedom during Passover we learn that Freedom comes with responsibilities.
muman613
-
However, it is a free country (for now) and the game should NOT be banned!
I believe it is a sad fact that in our system freedom means freedom to do anything we want. When we study Freedom during Passover we learn that Freedom comes with responsibilities.
muman613
Isn't that what this country was founded on? I don't know about you but I wouldn't want to live in a theocracy. I think freedom of choice is what encourages people to learn, but when they are forced, then that is when they rebel against the system.
-
Shalom,
While it is true that parents are ultimately responsible for the deeds of their children, our own Mrs Sarah Palin is a prime example of the limitations of this. Society IS responsible for the youth. This is a TORAH concept. Our Society should be designed as a safe place for the children to grow. We shouldnt have to protect them from bad things. A Torah society would not allow any of this drek to be pedaled to the youth. Because we are so lost in the haze of our own sin it is hard to know what is the correct course at this time.
I grew up with all the drek and I look at the reasons which I deviated from the path which was laid out for me. I had to go off the path, a long far and hard way, before I did my teshuva. Do I blame society? No, I blame myself. But if it were not for the society telling me that taking drugs and losing myself was cool, I dont know if I would have gone that route. Believe me, my life was laid out for me, from growing up, to going to college, etc. But I rebelled against my parents. I dont know if it is because of the society, but I know it didn't help.
I was born in the 60s and somehow the 60s became the Age of Enlightenment. Now I cant turn on TV without seeing the media glorifying the drug-taking, free-sex of the 60s. I am sick of it and turn it off because the 60s are not all it is cracked up to be.
I cant wait till we return to the ways of righteousness and faith in Hashem. May it come soon!
muman613
I really don't watch any tv, While I do have a video tuner card which I watch Discovery specials time to time and I still watch UFC events, that's all I watch. The rest I don't even bother with, but I am aware of how screwed up stuff that is broadcasted on tv is.
-
The video game Grand Theft Auto IV for the Xbox 360 and the Playstation 3 is a sandbox type of video game that allows you to pretty much do anything you want. I purchased the video game for the XBOX 360 in which you play as a character Niko Belic who is of Serbian background and moves to America for the "American dream", he quickly gets involved in a life of crime and is able to take missions from different people for money. The game is based in Liberty city which has been redesigned from previous interpretations to look much more similar to New York City. Many of the areas of the game are 100 percent replicas of real areas of New York including the statue of liberty.
The game alone is impressive from a graphical viewpoint and has already made a lot of noise and controversy as lawyers like Jack Thompson who has been trying to get the game banned and MADD (Mothers Against Drunk Driving) who are protesting the ability to be able to get drunk in the game and be allowed to operate a vehicle which gives you a blurry view simulating the ability of being intoxicated.
The game is one of the hottest selling out there in history making over 400 million dollars it's first day on sale alone, game production cost 100 million (more than many Hollywood movies)
While driving around in the game, I noticed Hasidic Jewish neighborhoods with men walking with all black outfits and black hats with a beard and hat and the peyot. I also noticed others wearing a Yarmulke sitting on benches and you have the ability to kill them or run them over with cars just like you have the ability to kill anyone (gang members, police, hookers, etc.)
There is even a mission in the game called "Late Checkout" which you work for a Italian man and are ordered to kill a Hasidic Jew involved in the diamond trade (a bit stereotypical no?)
The mission is available online on video to see for yourself.
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/grand-theft-auto-4-late-checkout-mission/744426168
I've played all Grand Theft Auto games in the past, and i'm curious if this was deliberate for controversy or not. Grand Theft Auto III was the first of it's kind to generate a large amount of controversy due to the graphical realism and upgrade in graphics with the ability to kill police officers and hookers which led to many parents refusing to allow their children to play the game. GTA Vice City had much controversy because there was a part where you had to kill Haitians and one of the lines was "kill those Haitian bastards."
Anyways, I find it rather bizzare why Jews in specific were added in the game to begin with? There are certainly other ethnic groups that live in New York City and there are muslims yet you don't see them in the game anywhere. What is your opinion about this? Personally it's left somewhat of a bad taste in my mouth. I know Take-2 and Rockstar games have never been politically correct to begin with, but it leaves me to wonder if you had the option to run over Muslims or kill them in the game how much outcry there would be? Comments?
I think you make a lot of valid points. First off these games are very off color. It seems to me they are made to offend everyone and that is why these games sell so well. They are like the forbidden fruit. From the nature of these games it wouldn't suprise me if in future games they did have missions where you kill Muslims. Of course like the Haitians the Muslims will be outraged and demand the game banned, but in my opinion, again this is why people will want to "check it out", making this game industry millions.
-
The video game Grand Theft Auto IV for the Xbox 360 and the Playstation 3 is a sandbox type of video game that allows you to pretty much do anything you want. I purchased the video game for the XBOX 360 in which you play as a character Niko Belic who is of Serbian background and moves to America for the "American dream", he quickly gets involved in a life of crime and is able to take missions from different people for money. The game is based in Liberty city which has been redesigned from previous interpretations to look much more similar to New York City. Many of the areas of the game are 100 percent replicas of real areas of New York including the statue of liberty.
The game alone is impressive from a graphical viewpoint and has already made a lot of noise and controversy as lawyers like Jack Thompson who has been trying to get the game banned and MADD (Mothers Against Drunk Driving) who are protesting the ability to be able to get drunk in the game and be allowed to operate a vehicle which gives you a blurry view simulating the ability of being intoxicated.
The game is one of the hottest selling out there in history making over 400 million dollars it's first day on sale alone, game production cost 100 million (more than many Hollywood movies)
While driving around in the game, I noticed Hasidic Jewish neighborhoods with men walking with all black outfits and black hats with a beard and hat and the peyot. I also noticed others wearing a Yarmulke sitting on benches and you have the ability to kill them or run them over with cars just like you have the ability to kill anyone (gang members, police, hookers, etc.)
There is even a mission in the game called "Late Checkout" which you work for a Italian man and are ordered to kill a Hasidic Jew involved in the diamond trade (a bit stereotypical no?)
The mission is available online on video to see for yourself.
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/grand-theft-auto-4-late-checkout-mission/744426168
I've played all Grand Theft Auto games in the past, and i'm curious if this was deliberate for controversy or not. Grand Theft Auto III was the first of it's kind to generate a large amount of controversy due to the graphical realism and upgrade in graphics with the ability to kill police officers and hookers which led to many parents refusing to allow their children to play the game. GTA Vice City had much controversy because there was a part where you had to kill Haitians and one of the lines was "kill those Haitian bastards."
Anyways, I find it rather bizzare why Jews in specific were added in the game to begin with? There are certainly other ethnic groups that live in New York City and there are muslims yet you don't see them in the game anywhere. What is your opinion about this? Personally it's left somewhat of a bad taste in my mouth. I know Take-2 and Rockstar games have never been politically correct to begin with, but it leaves me to wonder if you had the option to run over Muslims or kill them in the game how much outcry there would be? Comments?
I think you make a lot of valid points. First off these games are very off color. It seems to me they are made to offend everyone and that is why these games sell so well. They are like the forbidden fruit. From the nature of these games it wouldn't suprise me if in future games they did have missions where you kill Muslims. Of course like the Haitians the Muslims will be outraged and demand the game banned, but in my opinion, again this is why people will want to "check it out", making this game industry millions.
That's why I love Call Of Duty 4 ;D
It is told from the perspectives of a United States Marine and British SAS operative, and is set in multiple locations, including the Middle East, Azerbaijan, Russia, and Prypiat, Ukraine.
You get to kill Russian nationalists and Muslims.
-
Shalom,
While it is true that parents are ultimately responsible for the deeds of their children, our own Mrs Sarah Palin is a prime example of the limitations of this. Society IS responsible for the youth. This is a TORAH concept. Our Society should be designed as a safe place for the children to grow. We shouldnt have to protect them from bad things. A Torah society would not allow any of this drek to be pedaled to the youth. Because we are so lost in the haze of our own sin it is hard to know what is the correct course at this time.
I grew up with all the drek and I look at the reasons which I deviated from the path which was laid out for me. I had to go off the path, a long far and hard way, before I did my teshuva. Do I blame society? No, I blame myself. But if it were not for the society telling me that taking drugs and losing myself was cool, I dont know if I would have gone that route. Believe me, my life was laid out for me, from growing up, to going to college, etc. But I rebelled against my parents. I dont know if it is because of the society, but I know it didn't help.
I was born in the 60s and somehow the 60s became the Age of Enlightenment. Now I cant turn on TV without seeing the media glorifying the drug-taking, free-sex of the 60s. I am sick of it and turn it off because the 60s are not all it is cracked up to be.
I cant wait till we return to the ways of righteousness and faith in Hashem. May it come soon!
muman613
Muman,
You are very right on all accounts. People do NEED to know that with freedoms come responsibility, which people dont care about anymore at all. Yes, the new VP is a prime example. Everything is 'ok' now, I am lost here, like in space, or a time machine, I dont really 'get' any of this. Recently I have stood for this very thing, and got landblasted and sabotaged so terribly, I just sunk into a couple day depression, because the attack came from people that I 'thought' were in the right & "FRIENDS" evident now, they are not.
Things were just not accepted when we were kids, and they shouldnt be now, we were not confined, nor 'un-free' we were actually MORE free than now. Now if you talk about RIGHTEOUS things, you will have hell to pay. But if you are for 'wrong' everything is good, and you are swell. If you stand for the right, they call you 'self-righteous' when you know you are really not that way. I am lately mixed up and very confused over all of this, since everything we have heard taught by David & Chaim, was always morally strong and correct, it is almost as if everything they said, Gone with the wind. I dont know about everyone else, but I CANNOT just 'give in' to all of this, it is flat out against EVERYTHING I believe.
BTW: These videos are ABOMINABLE, I read all about this a few mos back.
-
Shalom,
While it is true that parents are ultimately responsible for the deeds of their children, our own Mrs Sarah Palin is a prime example of the limitations of this. Society IS responsible for the youth. This is a TORAH concept. Our Society should be designed as a safe place for the children to grow. We shouldnt have to protect them from bad things. A Torah society would not allow any of this drek to be pedaled to the youth. Because we are so lost in the haze of our own sin it is hard to know what is the correct course at this time.
I grew up with all the drek and I look at the reasons which I deviated from the path which was laid out for me. I had to go off the path, a long far and hard way, before I did my teshuva. Do I blame society? No, I blame myself. But if it were not for the society telling me that taking drugs and losing myself was cool, I dont know if I would have gone that route. Believe me, my life was laid out for me, from growing up, to going to college, etc. But I rebelled against my parents. I dont know if it is because of the society, but I know it didn't help.
I was born in the 60s and somehow the 60s became the Age of Enlightenment. Now I cant turn on TV without seeing the media glorifying the drug-taking, free-sex of the 60s. I am sick of it and turn it off because the 60s are not all it is cracked up to be.
I cant wait till we return to the ways of righteousness and faith in Hashem. May it come soon!
muman613
Muman,
You are very right on all accounts. People do NEED to know that with freedoms come responsibility, which people dont care about anymore at all. Yes, the new VP is a prime example. Everything is 'ok' now, I am lost here, like in space, or a time machine, I dont really 'get' any of this. Recently I have stood for this very thing, and got landblasted and sabotaged so terribly, I just sunk into a couple day depression, because the attack came from people that I 'thought' were in the right & "FRIENDS" evident now, they are not.
Things were just not accepted when we were kids, and they shouldnt be now, we were not confined, nor 'un-free' we were actually MORE free than now. Now if you talk about RIGHTEOUS things, you will have hell to pay. But if you are for 'wrong' everything is good, and you are swell. If you stand for the right, they call you 'self-righteous' when you know you are really not that way. I am lately mixed up and very confused over all of this, since everything we have heard taught by David & Chaim, was always morally strong and correct, it is almost as if everything they said, Gone with the wind. I dont know about everyone else, but I CANNOT just 'give in' to all of this, it is flat out against EVERYTHING I believe. Oh also, my mother and grandmother were so danged strict that it was never an option to rebel.
BTW: These videos are ABOMINABLE, I read all about this a few mos back.
-
I believe it is a sad fact that in our system freedom means freedom to do anything we want. When we study Freedom during Passover we learn that Freedom comes with responsibilities.
muman613
Yes, but American citizens need to have the responsible judgement to not purchase these violent video games.
-
I own GTA4 and it's true that there are Jews in the game. But I don't think that game is antisemitic. There are no missions to "kill" Jews. I specially like the map (Liberty City/ {New York City}) and its graphic. You can do more than in GTA San Andreas.
-
I own GTA4 and it's true that there are Jews in the game. But I don't think that game is antisemitic. There are no missions to "kill" Jews. I specially like the map (Liberty City/ {New York City}) and its graphic. You can do more than in GTA San Andreas.
Do more what? Crime?
-
Ummm You do see Muslims. You HAVE to kill Albanians in one mission!
So don't feel like the Jews are being singled out.
-
I own GTA4 and it's true that there are Jews in the game. But I don't think that game is antisemitic. There are no missions to "kill" Jews. I specially like the map (Liberty City/ {New York City}) and its graphic. You can do more than in GTA San Andreas.
Do more what? Crime?
It's more realistic. You can pick up stones and so on. Of course it is an "criminal" game but I think it's more tactic and a kind of "second life".
-
I own GTA4 and it's true that there are Jews in the game. But I don't think that game is antisemitic. There are no missions to "kill" Jews. I specially like the map (Liberty City/ {New York City}) and its graphic. You can do more than in GTA San Andreas.
Do more what? Crime?
It's more realistic. You can pick up stones and so on. Of course it is an "criminal" game but I think it's more tactic and a kind of "second life".
I only play one video game every night... It is called Nexuiz and it is a First Person Shooter type game in the mold of Quake III. The only 'crime' involved involves shooting opponents to death with a variety of modern weapons including Rocket Launchers, Machine Guns, laser guns, and others... I look at it as target practice which improves my hand-2-eye co-ordination... But I don't like games where you must engage in crime like prostitution, theft, or murder... According to Jewish belief it is wrong to think about crime, because it will lead to commiting crime. I think this is one reason so many young people today feel no shame cheating, stealing cds and dvds, and even posting immodest photos of themselves on facebook.
http://www.alientrap.org/nexuiz/
http://www.neveh.org/ciner/parsha58/shoftim.html
http://www.torah.org/learning/olas-shabbos/5762/tzav.html
Thus, he explains, it is specifically with regard to the Olah offering that "learning its laws is as good as bringing one." Since the purpose of the Olah was to atone for impure thoughts, it is befitting that purifying one's thoughts through Torah study should stand in its stead. But for a korban whose purpose was to atone for having actually transgressed a specific sin, perhaps studying and "thinking" about it's laws is not enough. In other words: For sins of thought, it is enough to repent in one's mind. For sins of deed, one must go further...
The whole idea of a thought-sin seems almost foreign to one living in Western society. After all, what I think is no one's business but my own. We acknowledge that it is wrong to sin: The challenge of being human is to overcome one's desires and do what's right, even if we'd prefer otherwise. But thinking about sin? As long as I don't follow through, no harm done. No?
"Do not stray after your thoughts, and after your eyes..." (Bamidbar/Numbers 15:39) While present day's free-to-be attitude dictates that it's okay to think about, and talk about, and joke about sin as much as we want, as long as we know our limitations, the Torah sees things differently. "The eyes and the heart," say our Sages, "are the two 'agents' of sin: The eyes see, and the heart desires, until one ultimately goes ahead and sins. (Rashi, ibid.)"
In fact, talking about sin, and thinking about sinning, is just a devious form of acclimatization to sin. Once we've toyed with the idea long enough, and we've spoken about it with others, even in jest, it no longer seems as foreign as it once might have to take the next step - to go ahead and do it.
I will not go into details, but if you give the matter some thought, you will see that society has gone one step further. They have taken the most evil and immoral sins, and created a lexicon whereby sin no longer sounds so bad at all. Using a subtle turn-of-phrase, one can easily avoid "calling a spade a spade." Call a pig "Artiodactlya suiformes suidae sus scrofa" (it's scientific name), and it just doesn't sound like a pig anymore.