JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Daniel on August 26, 2007, 09:51:33 AM
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I just received this email reply:
Thank you for writing in to Minister Avigdor Lieberman regarding Chaim Ben Pesach. As I am not familiar with this case, is there any further information/documentation you can forward me?
Sincerely,
Aron Shaviv
Foreign Affairs Advisor
Office of the Minister of Strategic Affairs
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This is good news. The above reply indicates that they are at least interested! I'm sure Jimmy can help with the info/documentation. Great work, Daniel.
Thanks.
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I just asked if anyone had gotten any replies on the original thread - nice to hear you did!
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That is really great news!
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I got no replies unfortunately. I think I wrote a good letter.
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I got no replies unfortunately. I think I wrote a good letter.
I haven't gotten any either -
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neither have i
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I asked Chaim how he would reply to the email which Daniel received from Lieberman's advisor.
First, let me state that Avigdor Lieberman is not just a Knesset member. He is the head of a major political party, Yisrael Beitenu (Israel Is Our Home). His party has 11 Knesset members. (The entire Knesset has a total of 120 members.) And Lieberman's party is an essential part of the current government coalition. Lieberman himself is also a Cabinet minister - he's the "Minister of Strategic Affairs". Lieberman and his party are all Russian Jewish immigrants who were able to go to Israel because of Chaim and the JDL. Although Lieberman will probably not intervene on Chaim's behalf, if by some miracle he would even respond positively in writing, this would be important to us.
Now here is how Chaim recommends that Daniel respond to the email from Lieberman's aide:
Mr. Aron Shaviv
Foreign Affairs Advisor
Office of the Minister of Strategic Affairs
Dear Mr. Shaviv:
Thank you for your reply to my letter on behalf of Chaim Ben Pesach.
Here is a brief review of some of the facts in Chaim's case:
1. Chaim's English name is Victor Vancier. However, as soon as he can make aliyah, he wishes to use his Hebrew name (Chaim Ben Pesach) as his legal name in Eretz Yisrael.
2. Chaim was the National Chairman of the Jewish Defense League (JDL), when the organization led the world-famous campaign to liberate Soviet Jewry. In order to publicize the desperate plight of our Jewish brothers and sisters behind the Iron Curtain, Chaim bombed Soviet diplomatic targets in the United States. These bombings did indeed put the issue of Soviet Jewry on the front pages of newspapers throughout the world, and made the Soviet Jewry struggle the number one story on American television and radio. Chaim only bombed empty buildings and empty parked Soviet diplomatic cars, because he did not intend to injure anyone. And in fact, no one was injured in any of the bombings which only caused property damage. In the most famous incident in the history of the Soviet Jewry struggle, Chaim also released tear gas at the Moiseyev Soviet ballet in Lincoln Center in New York. All of these incidents took place between 1984 and 1986.
3. Chaim was eventually arrested and convicted of committing these acts to save Soviet Jewry. Chaim spent five and a half years in the worst prisons in the United States as a result of his actions, and then was on probation or house arrest for an additional 12 years. After this punishment of seventeen and a half years either in prison or on probation and house arrest, Chaim decided to fulfill his lifelong dream of making aliyah in 1996.
4. Chaim flew to Israel and upon arriving at Ben Gurion Airport on July 22, 1996, he was immediately surrounded and arrested even though he never violated any Israeli law. Chaim was locked in a cell without any toilet for 24 hours, and then was expelled against his will from Eretz Yisrael. He was placed on a plane going back to the galut, back to the United States.
5. Chaim then applied for aliyah through the Jewish Agency in New York. His application for aliyah was rejected on March 27, 1997.
6. Chaim appealed the rejection by writing to the Interior Minister. In a letter dated September 25, 1997, Chaim was notified by the Interior Ministry that he would not even be allowed to visit Israel.
7. Chaim's actions on behalf of our brothers and sisters in the Soviet Union ended in 1986. Chaim has not violated any laws since 1986. He has been a law-abiding citizen for 21 years.
8. Chaim is now 50 years old. He has been prevented from making aliyah since 1996, for the past 11 years.
9. The Israeli government invited Yasser Arafat and 80,000 PLO-Fatah terrorists into Israel under the Oslo accords. But a 50 year old Jew who damaged Soviet property 21 years ago to save Russian Jews is not allowed to make aliyah?
10. Chaim speaks, reads and writes Hebrew fluently, and is ready to make aliyah immediately if given the chance.
11. Chaim will certainly be a law-abiding citizen in Israel.
Mr. Shaviv, please ask Minister Lieberman to help Chaim Ben Pesach make aliyah. Many people will be very grateful to you if you help in this humanitarian case. This case is a terrible injustice.
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I just copied and sent this to Aron Shaviv. Thanks.
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Thanks Daniel!
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Thanks Daniel!
You're quite welcome and glad to be of help. I hope it makes a difference.
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That's an amazingly good response!
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I just received this email from Aron Shaviv in response to the letter I sent from Jimmy's note:
Thank you for the information. I will discuss this issue with minister Lieberman.
Sincerely,
Aron Shaviv
Foreign Affairs Advisor
Office of the Minister of Strategic Affairs
Tel: +972 2 6547117
Fax: +972 2 6547101
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You know they lie
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You know they lie
"I will discuss this issue with minister Lieberman."= "I'll delete the email and block your email address as soon as possible"
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Probably or maybe if they get enough they'll take a look
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I got 4 back. Two of them said this:
The following message to <[email protected]> was undeliverable.
The reason for the problem:
Unknown address error Message from... rejected
based on blacklist - Please contact remove<at>walla.net.il stating your IP
address'
What does 'rejected based on blacklist' mean?
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I got 4 back. Two of them said this:
The following message to <[email protected]> was undeliverable.
The reason for the problem:
Unknown address error Message from... rejected
based on blacklist - Please contact remove<at>walla.net.il stating your IP
address'
What does 'rejected based on blacklist' mean?
What about the other 2?
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What does 'rejected based on blacklist' mean?
It means that your e-mail address is on walla's black list.
If you're on their black list it means that they think you are a spammer.
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I got 4 back. Two of them said this:
The following message to <[email protected]> was undeliverable.
The reason for the problem:
Unknown address error Message from... rejected
based on blacklist - Please contact remove<at>walla.net.il stating your IP
address'
What does 'rejected based on blacklist' mean?
What about the other 2?
One said this:
Your message
To: [email protected]
Subject: Jewish Hero
Sent: Tue, 28 Aug 2007 05:59:20 +0200
did not reach the following recipient(s):
[email protected] on Tue, 28 Aug 2007 07:04:36 +0200
The recipient name is not recognized
The MTS-ID of the original message is: c=us;a=
;p=knesset-israel;l=ZAVITAN0708280504QS0N97S1
MSEXCH:IMS:KNESSET-ISRAEL:KNESSET:ZAVITAN 0 (000C05A6) Unknown Recipient
The other said this:
Your message cannot be delivered to the following recipients:
Recipient address: [email protected]
Reason: Over quota
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You know they lie
"I will discuss this issue with minister Lieberman."= "I'll delete the email and block your email address as soon as possible"
Perhaps, but why would they bother replying at all if that is their attitude?
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Scriabin, you are not the only one who has not been able to send an email to Knesset members Livnat and Avraham. Many of our posters, including people on our Hebrew forum, have gotten the same message in regard to those two Knesset members. It seems that there is some problem sending emails to those two Knesset members for some reason.
As far as the "blacklist" message, I have no idea what that is. As far as I know, you are the only one who has gotten that message. I hope that most of your emails got through despite that.
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You know they lie
"I will discuss this issue with minister Lieberman."= "I'll delete the email and block your email address as soon as possible"
Perhaps, but why would they bother replying at all if that is their attitude?
I agree with Scriabin. We know what politicians are like, but let's not assume the worst. Even a political opportunist may decide that it is in his best interest to respond positively. At least, that's what we're hoping for, G-d willing.
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Scriabin, you are not the only one who has not been able to send an email to Knesset members Livnat and Avraham. Many of our posters, including people on our Hebrew forum, have gotten the same message in regard to those two Knesset members. It seems that there is some problem sending emails to those two Knesset members for some reason.
As far as the "blacklist" message, I have no idea what that is. As far as I know, you are the only one who has gotten that message. I hope that most of your emails got through despite that.
The problem with the first message is the email address is wrong. It is actually llivnat@knesset.gov.il. I caught this before sending the email and did not get a bounce.
As for the second one, I received the same message. It appears that the mailbox is full and you can't really do anything about that until the recipient cleans it out.
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I participate in a lot of email action alerts. Just about every single elected official has an automated reply message stating that they receive lots of messages every day and that they can't answer every single message or that it may take a while to reply. Many times, a few weeks later, I'll get some sort of form letter response from that official stating his/her position on the issue that I emailed about.
The fact that Aron Shaviv replied so quickly with personalized responses, I think that's a very positive sign. So yes, I think it's good to be a bit sceptical about whether or not they're taking our messages seriously. At the same time, I think we shouldn't be too cynical and should be somewhat optimistic by recognizing the good signs that have come of this so far.
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I got an error message regarding Limor Livnat's E-mail.
Your message
To: [email protected]; [email protected]
Subject: Chaim Ben Pesach
Sent: Wed, 29 Aug 2007 20:18:44 +0200
did not reach the following recipient(s):
[email protected] on Wed, 29 Aug 2007 21:24:15 +0200
The recipient name is not recognized
The MTS-ID of the original message is: c=us;a=
;p=knesset-israel;l=ZAVITAN0708291924QS0N0QXS
MSEXCH:IMS:KNESSET-ISRAEL:KNESSET:ZAVITAN 0 (000C05A6) Unknown
Recipient
I got the same response! It's Limor Livant he might be using some other email or have a block on it...
I haven't gotten any other responses back though... Has anybody received any feedback, besides Daniel?
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That could be it!!! We just misspelled the name... Good looking out Yacov!
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No not yet. I have done two sets of mailings one individually to each person and last night I use jeffguys program to sent another set. Nothing as of yet except I got that same email returned that Yacov did both times.
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Actually, it wasn't Jeffguy who misspelled Limor Livnat's name. Chaim sent Jeffguy the names. So apparently Chaim typed it incorrectly.
If Jeffguy could correct it on the Hebrew and the English email systems he set up, that would be great!
It should be: [email protected]
I just copied and pasted it from the official Knesset site, so it should be correct.
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To: [email protected]; [email protected]
Subject: Chaim Ben Pesach
Sent: Sun, 2 Sep 2007 21:13:33 +0200
did not reach the following recipient(s):
[email protected] on Sun, 2 Sep 2007 22:19:19 +0200
The recipient name is not recognized
The MTS-ID of the original message is: c=us;a=
;p=knesset-israel;l=ZAVITAN0709022019QS03A5BR
MSEXCH:IMS:KNESSET-ISRAEL:KNESSET:ZAVITAN 0 (000C05A6) Unknown
Recipient
mmm maybe i cant send from the UK.?
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well you spelled it wrong. livnat, not livant.
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I'm pretty sure it was misspelled.