christians and the torah

[mosquewatch]

decimos,

Let me help ya out a bit, while I'm a bit calm. Let's have the Military kill the mujahadin, then bicker about what Jews and Christians believe in.

[ftf]

Chakma613, just as JTF is against people trying to convert Jews, we are also against Jews telling Christians and others, either directly, or via implication that their religion is idolatery (sp?) or that it's wrong in any way. 

For the purpose of this movement, we work with people whose religious beliefs do not always match our own.  That's life.  Decimos seems geniunely interested in our movement.  So I don't think it's appropriate to scare him away by bickering about what is and is not idol worship. 

In other words, if you want to continue pontificating about how Christianity is idol worship, or how no one is allowed to have differing opinions than your beloved rabbis, do so elsewhere. 

Consider this your first and only warning!

On the surface, your idea is a good one. However, I canot allow you to spread sheker about torah. You stated that xtianity is not avodah zarah, and I had to correct you, this is my responsibility, and indeed mitzvah. I see nothing wrong with what I said - had you not told the poster in question what tyou told him about xtianity, I would not have said anything.

As you have not desisted, I feel compelled to answer you.

You say that my faith Christianity is idol worship. And yet, I ahve no idols, no pictures or statues or any other physical objects that I bow to. I have but one God that I serve, the God of Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. Now, I believe that God has three components to him, just like a tree has roots trunk and branches and is yet one tree, God as the creator of all things (including trees) can surely be more complex than a tree, can he not?

decimos: If you have any questions about Christianity please contact me with the pm feature.

[chakma613]

Chakma613,

Chaim Ben Pesach, the owner of this forum, would never in million years tell a Christian that his religion is considered Avoda Zara.  He would very politely explain that Jews are not allowed to believe in the Trinity, and that it should not stop all of us from working together.  Therefore I stand my initial response. 

So if you have a problem with that, you are free to start your own forum, and or blog. 

You have yet to answer why you blatantly told a fallacy about Judaism, with full knowledge of our beliefs. You have yet to answer my question as to why you told this person a fallacy.

[newman]

As you have not desisted, I feel compelled to answer you.

You say that my faith Christianity is idol worship. And yet, I ahve no idols, no pictures or statues or any other physical objects that I bow to. I have but one G-d that I serve, the G-d of Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. Now, I believe that G-d has three components to him, just like a tree has roots trunk and branches and is yet one tree, G-d as the creator of all things (including trees) can surely be more complex than a tree, can he not?

decimos: If you have any questions about Christianity please contact me with the pm feature.

Here he goes again with his heresy-by-stealth!!!

[chakma613]

Chakma613, just as JTF is against people trying to convert Jews, we are also against Jews telling Christians and others, either directly, or via implication that their religion is idolatery (sp?) or that it's wrong in any way. 

For the purpose of this movement, we work with people whose religious beliefs do not always match our own.  That's life.  Decimos seems geniunely interested in our movement.  So I don't think it's appropriate to scare him away by bickering about what is and is not idol worship. 

In other words, if you want to continue pontificating about how Christianity is idol worship, or how no one is allowed to have differing opinions than your beloved rabbis, do so elsewhere. 

Consider this your first and only warning!

On the surface, your idea is a good one. However, I canot allow you to spread sheker about torah. You stated that xtianity is not avodah zarah, and I had to correct you, this is my responsibility, and indeed mitzvah. I see nothing wrong with what I said - had you not told the poster in question what tyou told him about xtianity, I would not have said anything.

As you have not desisted, I feel compelled to answer you.

You say that my faith Christianity is idol worship. And yet, I ahve no idols, no pictures or statues or any other physical objects that I bow to. I have but one G-d that I serve, the G-d of Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. Now, I believe that G-d has three components to him, just like a tree has roots trunk and branches and is yet one tree, G-d as the creator of all things (including trees) can surely be more complex than a tree, can he not?

decimos: If you have any questions about Christianity please contact me with the pm feature.

Your statement is in contrast to our authority rambam(mainmonides), who rules something QUITE different. You are comparing G-d to a tree - you have clearly been taken in by polytheistic thought, as th8is is the oldest and most primitive argument made for polytheism, to say that G-d is made up of many parts cv's.

[Lisa]

Chakma613, you have been nothing but trouble, ever since you started responding to my posts.

So don't let the door hit you on the way out. 

You are banned!

[chakma613]

As you have not desisted, I feel compelled to answer you.

You say that my faith Christianity is idol worship. And yet, I ahve no idols, no pictures or statues or any other physical objects that I bow to. I have but one G-d that I serve, the G-d of Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. Now, I believe that G-d has three components to him, just like a tree has roots trunk and branches and is yet one tree, G-d as the creator of all things (including trees) can surely be more complex than a tree, can he not?

decimos: If you have any questions about Christianity please contact me with the pm feature.

Here he goes again with his heresy-by-stealth!!!

Idol worship is far more than just worshiping a physical entity. Avodah Zarah consists of worshiping any detity, physical or otherwise, other than Hashem. He does not understand this, but I am not caling him an idolater, because of a complex halacha that I will not explain now.

[decimos]

i understand what you are saying.but every journey has a first step,mine has started i need to be prepared physically and spiritually for the road.theres an old British Army saying  "preparation prevents piss poor performance" and while i too rejoice in every muhj getting slotted.wars are sometimes one thru knowledge, know your enemy.lets face it Islam is all about subjugation and enforced law, religious law.if that law is wrong i know this because i have understood what is right,my free will tells me that.sometimes you have to understand a thing to defeat a thing.and i say this to you with all due respect.

[ftf]

Chakma613, just as JTF is against people trying to convert Jews, we are also against Jews telling Christians and others, either directly, or via implication that their religion is idolatery (sp?) or that it's wrong in any way. 

For the purpose of this movement, we work with people whose religious beliefs do not always match our own.  That's life.  Decimos seems geniunely interested in our movement.  So I don't think it's appropriate to scare him away by bickering about what is and is not idol worship. 

In other words, if you want to continue pontificating about how Christianity is idol worship, or how no one is allowed to have differing opinions than your beloved rabbis, do so elsewhere. 

Consider this your first and only warning!

On the surface, your idea is a good one. However, I canot allow you to spread sheker about torah. You stated that xtianity is not avodah zarah, and I had to correct you, this is my responsibility, and indeed mitzvah. I see nothing wrong with what I said - had you not told the poster in question what tyou told him about xtianity, I would not have said anything.

As you have not desisted, I feel compelled to answer you.

You say that my faith Christianity is idol worship. And yet, I ahve no idols, no pictures or statues or any other physical objects that I bow to. I have but one G-d that I serve, the G-d of Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. Now, I believe that G-d has three components to him, just like a tree has roots trunk and branches and is yet one tree, G-d as the creator of all things (including trees) can surely be more complex than a tree, can he not?

decimos: If you have any questions about Christianity please contact me with the pm feature.

Your statement is in contrast to our authority rambam(mainmonides), who rules something QUITE different. You are comparing G-d to a tree - you have clearly been taken in by polytheistic thought, as th8is is the oldest and most primitive argument made for polytheism, to say that G-d is made up of many parts cv's.

Are you telling me God cannot be more complex than a tree? If you want an example in the Torah of God being shown as a trinity, try Genesis chapter 18 verse 1.

I hold myself to no authority but that of God, the rambam were men, not God.

Also, ignore newman's comments about me he decided to hate me a long time ago, and will criticise anything I do or say as a matter of principle.

[newman]

Chakma613, you have been nothing but trouble, ever since you started responding to my posts.

So don't let the door hit you on the way out. 

You are banned!

Good one, Lisa!

Boot a religious Jew out but keep a christian missionary!!!

Great idea!

(sarcasm off)

[Lisa]

Newman, you might want to check out my thread on Rabbi Ovadia Yossef, and Chaimfan's thread on polygamy before you rush to judgement.

[ftf]

Chakma613, just as JTF is against people trying to convert Jews, we are also against Jews telling Christians and others, either directly, or via implication that their religion is idolatery (sp?) or that it's wrong in any way. 

For the purpose of this movement, we work with people whose religious beliefs do not always match our own.  That's life.  Decimos seems geniunely interested in our movement.  So I don't think it's appropriate to scare him away by bickering about what is and is not idol worship. 

In other words, if you want to continue pontificating about how Christianity is idol worship, or how no one is allowed to have differing opinions than your beloved rabbis, do so elsewhere. 

Consider this your first and only warning!

On the surface, your idea is a good one. However, I canot allow you to spread sheker about torah. You stated that xtianity is not avodah zarah, and I had to correct you, this is my responsibility, and indeed mitzvah. I see nothing wrong with what I said - had you not told the poster in question what tyou told him about xtianity, I would not have said anything.

As you have not desisted, I feel compelled to answer you.

You say that my faith Christianity is idol worship. And yet, I ahve no idols, no pictures or statues or any other physical objects that I bow to. I have but one G-d that I serve, the G-d of Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. Now, I believe that G-d has three components to him, just like a tree has roots trunk and branches and is yet one tree, G-d as the creator of all things (including trees) can surely be more complex than a tree, can he not?

decimos: If you have any questions about Christianity please contact me with the pm feature.

FTF,

Missionizing is not permitted on this forum.

I was not preaching, (I do not recoginise the word missionizing), I was merely responding to the attack he launched against my faith.

Lisa: I really don't think you should have banned chakma613.

[newman]

Chakma613, just as JTF is against people trying to convert Jews, we are also against Jews telling Christians and others, either directly, or via implication that their religion is idolatery (sp?) or that it's wrong in any way. 

For the purpose of this movement, we work with people whose religious beliefs do not always match our own.  That's life.  Decimos seems geniunely interested in our movement.  So I don't think it's appropriate to scare him away by bickering about what is and is not idol worship. 

In other words, if you want to continue pontificating about how Christianity is idol worship, or how no one is allowed to have differing opinions than your beloved rabbis, do so elsewhere. 

Consider this your first and only warning!

On the surface, your idea is a good one. However, I canot allow you to spread sheker about torah. You stated that xtianity is not avodah zarah, and I had to correct you, this is my responsibility, and indeed mitzvah. I see nothing wrong with what I said - had you not told the poster in question what tyou told him about xtianity, I would not have said anything.

As you have not desisted, I feel compelled to answer you.

You say that my faith Christianity is idol worship. And yet, I ahve no idols, no pictures or statues or any other physical objects that I bow to. I have but one G-d that I serve, the G-d of Abraham and Isaac and Jacob. Now, I believe that G-d has three components to him, just like a tree has roots trunk and branches and is yet one tree, G-d as the creator of all things (including trees) can surely be more complex than a tree, can he not?

decimos: If you have any questions about Christianity please contact me with the pm feature.

FTF,

Missionizing is not permitted on this forum.

(I do not recoginise the word missionizing)

Because you're an unrepentent missionary who thinks it's your right to attempt to spiritually murder the Children of Israel.

[ftf]

A missionary is one who preaches to non-christians, the verb is preach not missionise. (note that missionise is not in the dictionary...)

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Newman, chill out. FTF is doing nothing of the sort. I agree with your viewpoints more than his most of the time but I will stand up for my fellow Christian here. Actually, it's not even about that. He is not doing the things you are accusing him of, regardless of his faith.

[decimos]

guys i didnt mean for all this to start.i just wanted to no more about jewish religous observence an Rabbi kahane

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Come on guys, does anybody REALLY think that this Chakma fellow wasn't a troll?

He is most likely Adam613, but even if not, he is clearly aping the views of Bnei Elim and Revava. We don't need garbage like this on the board.

Lisa was 100% right and it is a shame he was not banned sooner, like last night when he was committing the abominable sin of deifying a human (Rabbi Ovadia Yosef).

[newman]

Newman, chill out. FTF is doing nothing of the sort. I agree with your viewpoints more than his most of the time but I will stand up for my fellow Christian here. Actually, it's not even about that. He is not doing the things you are accusing him of, regardless of his faith.

BALONEY!

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Lisa: I really don't think you should have banned chakma613.

FTF, he was flaming our faith. You often speak out in defense of Christianity here, and this piece of dreck was desecrating us.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Newman, you are getting a little over-the-top in these supposed defenses of Jews. They are starting to look insincere. Nobody was missionizing.

[ftf]

Lisa: I really don't think you should have banned chakma613.

FTF, he was flaming our faith. You often speak out in defense of Christianity here, and this piece of dreck was desecrating us.

The beliefs he was stating are shared by a large proportion of the members of this forum, sure there's a rule against stating them, but that doesn't change the fact that they hold them.

Regarding newman, he's also on a different forum that I'm a member of, all the posts of his that I've seen there have contained criticism of Christianity, to him our faith is dirt and to say it is anything but is a grievous crime.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

FTF, you knock it off too. Most forum members DO NOT attack Christianity.

[Dexter]

Some Jews, espaciely the orthodox jews do believe Christianety is Avoda Zara of idols .

[newman]

Newman, you are getting a little over-the-top in these supposed defenses of Jews. They are starting to look insincere. Nobody was missionizing.

He has shouted his (supposed) right to missionise to Jews since the Allen-t affair and NEVER recanted publicly.

He also missionises by stealth on this forum by demanding Jews adhere to un-Jewish, anti-Torah christian principles like 'loving their enemies'

[ftf]

FTF, you knock it off too. Most forum members DO NOT attack Christianity.

No, but they do belive that it is wrong.

Newman, looking at: http://www.jewfaq.org/613.htm

Number 53, Jews are to love strangers.
Number 31, Jews are not to take revenge.
Number 32, Jews are not to bear a grudge.

That pretty much covers the ideas which I have suggested are good, I have never commanded anyone to hold any of my beliefs (including the three I have there stated) though.