Kahanist Singles > Jewish Singles
Pre-Marital sex. What is your take??
Scriabin:
This subject is boring.
Tzvi Ben Roshel1:
--- Quote from: Yacov Menashe Ben Rachamim on June 15, 2008, 12:39:44 AM ---
--- Quote from: Tzvi Ben Roshel on June 15, 2008, 12:32:06 AM ---
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on June 15, 2008, 12:22:40 AM ---Yeah, I see what you're saying. ANd I'm familiar somewhat with the similar cases to what happened with Rabbi Yosef. People saying that phrase as a joke is not a joking matter. At all.
--- End quote ---
Thats the problem with people in todays society. Everything is a joke for them. People do not realise the seriousness of their actions, and how one "joke" can affect a persons life in this world and the worlds to come. That case by the way had nothing to do with them having any physical contact, but even with a few words, the girl almost fell in the category where she would not be alowed to get married halahicaly (which in Israel means at all), unless she would give the guy a HUGG amount of money, or possibly this would lead to murder since having him dead would free her, or a number of many other problems, and this is just a few words, how much more soo having physical relations.
Thats why Jews should be educated in this field, and also all of the Torah so to make life soo much easier for themselves, their children , etc.
--- End quote ---
Did she participate in the joke or did the man just say Harei At... to her without her approval? Was she even his girlfriend? And why would she have to give him money? A Jewish man has to pay his wife to divorce her, not the other way around.
--- End quote ---
She participated obviously, and took it. ;D imagine if her consent wouldn't matter, any guy could just come up to any girl and force her to marry him :P .
I dont know if they were boyfriend girlfriend.
Yea, but in this case he wasn't alowing her to get divorced, and luckily for her their was only one kosher (defined by being Shomer Shabb-t in Halacha) witness. And he was just saying no I will not divorce you, unless you pay me X amount of money, and if not you cant ever marry another man.
Normaly yes, but not always. It depends on the contract- "Ketuva" that they have. And also if she follows it correctly. For example if the husband decides to move to Israel and she refuses, he is alowed to divorce her without the Ketuva $. Or another example- if she disobays the Torah law, for example she dresses immodestly where other men see her, technicaly she also forfeits her rights. And another case- if she decides that the $ she makes, she is incharge of and not her husband, then the husband does not have to support her, nor if they are seperated does he have to give the $ written down and agreed in the Ketuva. (But its the wifes choice on whether the $ she makes belongs to her husband, and he has to support her, or if she is financialy independent, but he does not owe her anything financially during and after mariage.) and their are many many other examples.
Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks:
--- Quote from: Gruzinit on June 13, 2008, 03:53:51 AM ---When my mother was 16-years-old, she was forced into an arranged marriage. The marraige was horrid from the start, and within a year my mother got a divorce.
After her divorce, some me in the local village thought that just because she was a divorcee, it meant she was a whore. When men did approach her, they made it obvious that they solely wanted sex, and had no intention of courting her or considering her for marriage, they wanted a young virgine bride for that. To say she was devastated would be an understatement, it angers me beyond belief remembering the pain in my mother's voice as she told how men thought she was worthless, when she has more dignity and grace than all of them combined.
My mother suffered and was subjected to cruelty for what, a membrane of skin? I'm not saying people should have sex with numerous partners, I truly believ in abstinence, but if a man could not love me because over something as petty as that, then i doubt he is much of a man at all.
--- End quote ---
Gruzinit, truly this is a revolting and sickening anecdote. These people, who treated your mother like they did, are as far as I am concerned plain and simple rodefs--no better than the Muslims. They deserve to burn in hell forever if they do not truly repent of their ways. At the same time, overwhelmingly most virginity/promiscuity debates in the West do not fall within those extreme circumstances. Average people who have sex outside of marriage or who divorce do so entirely out of their own fickleness and flippancy, and they should be judged--if they do not repent and stop living that way.
Gruzinit:
--- Quote from: Yacov Menashe Ben Rachamim on June 15, 2008, 01:56:06 AM ---Gruzinit's mother was innocent because she has sex in marriage. Any woman who had sex in marriage and got divorced is innocent, no matter how young she was and what the circumstances of the marriage were.
--- End quote ---
My mother's innocence wasn't a matter to these people. They and their families considered her as damaged goods.
DownwithIslam:
--- Quote from: Gruzinit on June 13, 2008, 03:53:51 AM ---
--- Quote from: DownwithIslam on June 13, 2008, 02:01:41 AM ---
--- Quote from: Rubystars on June 13, 2008, 01:41:14 AM ---Not to get too graphic but you can't know for sure whether someone is a virgin or not simply based on a certain thing being intact or not. It can be broken in many nonsexual ways.
When I hear of the price that "non virgins" have to pay in Arab countries, I always think of a young virgin girl having sex with her husband for the first time, the first man she's ever had sex with, maybe even someone she loves, and everything going suddenly, horrible wrong, with him accusing her of not being a virgin (wrongly) because there's no "blood on the sheets" and no intact you-know-what when he does you know what.
--- End quote ---
I agree with you rubystars. This whole idea is not something I am comfortable with. How could someone throw his bride out simply because she was not a virgin? I am sure these types of marriages won't last anyways as he clearly couldn't give a damn about her.
--- End quote ---
When my mother was 16-years-old, she was forced into an arranged marriage. The marraige was horrid from the start, and within a year my mother got a divorce.
After her divorce, some me in the local village thought that just because she was a divorcee, it meant she was a whore. When men did approach her, they made it obvious that they solely wanted sex, and had no intention of courting her or considering her for marriage, they wanted a young virgine bride for that. To say she was devastated would be an understatement, it angers me beyond belief remembering the pain in my mother's voice as she told how men thought she was worthless, when she has more dignity and grace than all of them combined.
My mother suffered and was subjected to cruelty for what, a membrane of skin? I'm not saying people should have sex with numerous partners, I truly believ in abstinence, but if a man could not love me because over something as petty as that, then i doubt he is much of a man at all.
--- End quote ---
I agree with you. This is what I was trying to bring in my few posts in this thread.
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