"Vast Majority" of Israelis Support Kuntar Release--How Sick Can A Nation Be?

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

And although it's painful to say this about fellow Jews, those that do support his release will get what they deserve, and won't warrant any sympathy when the worst happens.

Amen to that. This is what I have said all along. Sadly the majority of Israelis are acting like kapos right now. The reasons/motivations why do not matter. G-d will judge this atrocity (the miscarriage of justice that is taking place right now).

I know that a lot of people do not like this rhetoric, but so be it. This is a time when we need to be in-your-face and offensive to average Israelis/Jews. They need to get the message that this is a terrible abomination.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Dude, dude, dude. Chill out. I realized that my wording was poor and I edited it. Are you now going to disagree that most of Judaism has been hijacked by the left?

As for the body of your argument, we addressed this many, many times. The poll on Ynet never said "live soldiers" in it. It said "kidnapped soldiers". We went around and around and around this on many instances. No, the poll did not explicitly say "bodies", but it was taken when Olmert announced this deal and that the soldiers were probably dead.

Just today they have said that one of the two may be returned alive.   My point was that the people were in general in a shroud of complete uncertainty over the fate of the soldiers and many thought they *might be alive.  The way the poll was worded or reported seemed to me very clear that it ran on a presumption that a deal could "free" the soldiers.  Thus it ran on a presumption as if the soldiers were alive.  Not that the poll was saying one way or the other, but running on the hypothetical presumption, 'what would you do.' sort of question.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

 If you disagree with the poll's results, wording, or motives, send Ynet an email--don't get mad at me for reporting it, verbatim, with the link.

But CF, I was not mad at you for reporting it.   Why would I be?   I disagreed strongly with your INTERPRETATION that you based on that article and the conclusion you drew from it.   Which was, shall we say, a bit... derogatory.   And I put out some thoughts on why that report may not be the end-all and be-all of Israeli public opinion, but you were staunch in your view that "all Israelis hate themselves, are weak, pathetic, and perverse"    -  I strongly disagree and find this attitude insulting.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

KWRBT, we won't get anywhere by pretending that we don't have any work ahead cut out for us. Chaim is making progress by the day with Israel's youth, and public opinion today is far more tolerant of Kahanism today than it was just two years ago, but most Israelis still are self-hating. If you honestly do not believe that, and feel that all Israeli Jews are rightists who are just jumping at the chance to vote for a Kahanist prime minister this instant, then why spend any time at all trying to make us a mass movement?

Maybe you don't understand exactly the complexity of this movement.   But I would advise you to watch Chaim's videos more closely and listen to what he is saying.  The elites who run the country, the self-hating leftists who have hijacked all the institutions, DO NOT represent the public at large.  (and don't give me nonsense about "but they elected them."  that banana republic is not a democratic state).     It is not "public opinion" that is necessarily intolerant to Kahanist ideas, but it is the establishment that is.  The ideas have appeal, and we strive to spread the ideas, because the general Israeli public is not scum, and so when they are exposed to the truth, they will be receptive to it.   The label "Kahane" has a stigma attached to it thanks to the brainwashing, but the ideas themselves MAKE SENSE.   And we can also break that stigma in time. 

The establishment has brainwashed the public to a degree to think negatively of something that might be 'kahanist' whether they know what that means or not.   It is not that we are going and convincing someone, hey your leftist ideas are wrong and silly, now become Kahanist.   It's exposing people to an alternative that they've likely never heard.   The right really offers no alternative in Israel.  All they do is criticize the left.  Presenting an alternative is key.   You're into polls CF.  Well I have seen in polls that the vast majority of Jews in Israel have completely lost faith in their "elected representatives" and the people running the state.  There is a certain void developing where the people can see through these crooks and know that the olmerts will only bring treachery.  The govt has lost the faith and trust of the public.

ANd by virtue of the fact that the Kahanist message is a universal message that can reach all Jews who are NOT self hating, they will naturally migrate toward these ideas and toward the truth.   If the majority of the Israeli public was truly self-hating like you claim, then our work is hopeless, chas veshalom.   You are not going to "convert" someone from piss now to be a Kahanist.   Do you think CF that you can walk into Olmert's office, show him some Chaim ben Pesach videos and some writings of Rabbi Kahane and he's going to say "WOW CF, you were right all along, what was I thinking, I should really change. "  LOL   But you can easily inform an otherwise righteous Jew who doesn't know any better or has never been exposed to Kahanist views, or thinks there isn't an alternative, or is fed up with the phony politicians, fed up with bowing to terrorists, or even one who has been accustomed to being capitulationist, show why this is not Jewish identity/behavior, you can easily inform him with proper information and truth, and he can strive for something greater than he has been allowed by his society and Israeli establishment to strive for or even think of.    That person will find truth in our ideas. 

You seem to say that the majority of Israelis are peace now traitorous self-haters but at the same time you somehow think we are transforming these same people into "tolerant of Kahanism"   - This is fantasy land.



And No I did not and am not saying that the public is majority "rightists" jumping to vote for a Kahanist prime minister this instant.  I am saying that many have traditional values, many are proud Jews, served in the army, want to defeat the enemy, want a proud existence, want a Jewish state of some kind, not a state of all peoples, etc.  Are tired of arab terror, are tired of phony politicians and being lied to, etc.  Presented with the true Kahanist message, because it has truth and Jewish values built into it, these people will find it appealing in many ways because they have the Jewish spark.   THe peace now types are beyond help.  They are actual traitors.   G-d forbid if the whole population was like that CF, but that you think that shows you do not understand Israelis and that you are too quick to judge unfavorably.   If the Kahanist message is appealing to the youth in Israel and if those ideas gain popularity, it shows that the people were genuine and decent in the first place, despite possibly being misguided.  Otherwise it would be impossible.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Please look at the thread that I just made. I think it will go a long way in addressing your concerns.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Just today they have said that one of the two may be returned alive.   My point was that the people were in general in a shroud of complete uncertainty over the fate of the soldiers and many thought they *might* be alive.

KWRBT, I didn't say that I personally knew or even thought that they were dead. I certainly would not trust anything Hezbollah or Olmert are saying. Still, the fact is that Olmert claimed at the time that he was announcing this evil deal that they were probably dead. The poll simply stated "kidnapped soldiers" and made no mention of what their status is. Since the poll was taken when it was publicly announced that they were likely dead, I do assume that the respondents assumed that they were.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

The poll simply stated "kidnapped soldiers" and made no mention of what their status is. Since the poll was taken when it was publicly announced that they were likely dead, I do assume that the respondents assumed that they were.

No the poll said

Sixty percent of the Israeli Jewish public supports the prisoner exchange deal Israel signed with Hizbullah in an effort to free kidnapped IDF soldiers Eldad Regev and Ehud Goldwasser, even though...

You cannot "free" a dead body.  You can free a live captive soldier.  Therefore This Poll Asked a Question Assuming that The Soldiers were Alive and Could be Freed.   But I'm tired of arguing about this point.   And also, I still obviously disagree with anyone voting yes to that question.

[Muck DeFuslims]

CF says: "Sadly the majority of Israelis are acting like kapos right now. The reasons/motivations why do not matter. G-d will judge this atrocity (the miscarriage of justice that is taking place right now)."


They're not acting like kapos. They're acting like sheep.

It's hard for me to believe that a majority of Israelis support Kuntar's release. However, even if this is the case, those that don't support freeing the vile child murderer should be taking to the streets and having demonstrations that border on riots to protest this perverse act.

But I guess that's easy for me to say from America.

I'm pretty sure most Israelis were opposed to abandoning Gaza. But this happened and the opposition was crushed.

Amona was more vigorously defended, but the result was the same.

The suicidal appeasers, leftists, and the gestapo like police agencies running the show in Israel apparently have a much stronger stranglehold on the sane Israelis than we can imagine from our vantage here in America. This is not to say that a substantial segment of Israel's population isn't nuts, but it's also obvious that the sane Israelis with instincts of self preservation have been totally brow beaten into subjugation by their leftist masters.

The question becomes what can happen to change this sad reality and whether such change can come fast enough to save the nation.

One thing is certain, Israel will not survive for long if it continues on it's present suicidal course of freeing mass murdering terrorists, surrendering land, and appeasing and negotiating with enemies dedicated to her destruction.

The Kuntar release--and the lack of effective opposition to it-- is not only an indictment of Israeli society and morality, but also a symptom of the general malaise of pandering and appeasement exhibited by the West towards an implacable Islamic enemy.

Israel and America are heading for a disaster of unimaginable proportions unless things change.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

No the poll said

Sixty percent of the Israeli Jewish public supports the prisoner exchange deal Israel signed with Hizbullah in an effort to free kidnapped IDF soldiers Eldad Regev and Ehud Goldwasser, even though...

You cannot "free" a dead body.  You can free a live captive soldier.  Therefore This Poll Asked a Question Assuming that The Soldiers were Alive and Could be Freed.   But I'm tired of arguing about this point.   And also, I still obviously disagree with anyone voting yes to that question.

I never represented the poll as being worded in any other way. I quoted it exactly just like you did. Yes, for the record, a body can be "freed", if it is being held against the will of the family, and a proper burial for it is desired. So yes--it could very well mean a dead body.

(And I too do disagree with voting "yes" to this under any circumstance, even if the soldiers were alive. Everybody knows that you must not negotiate with terrorists.)

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

I'm pretty sure most Israelis were opposed to abandoning Gaza.

According to polls at the time, they were not opposed to it. According to polls taken a year later, in August, 2006, with the humiliating defeat by Hezbollah fresh in their minds, most Israelis had changed their minds or at least were no longer sure. But I have not seen any recent polls about Gaza on any Israeli news site.

But this happened and the opposition was crushed.

The problem was that the Israeli right (a) was afraid of going to jail and being tortured (and indeed, those things did happen to the few resisters) and (b) the Israeli right was deceived into going along with the completely useless nonviolent "passive resistance" that was promoted by the stooges of the Yesha Council.

If the Israeli wakes up, and all who are opposed to these treasonous policies fight against it with their bodies, then our side will win. It is pretty difficult to torture and imprison 30 or 40% of the Israeli population. Even if the majority of Israel is self-hating or goes along with self-hatred right now (which is absolutely true), the majority of self-hating Jews will not have the stomach to physically fight 30% of the public. These are people who want to be prosperous and undisturbed. They will not sacrifice their lives to stop our movement if we respond to the Israeli Nazi army and police in kind.

[Muck DeFuslims]

I'm pretty sure most Israelis were opposed to abandoning Gaza.

According to polls at the time, they were not opposed to it. According to polls taken a year later, in August, 2006, with the humiliating defeat by Hezbollah fresh in their minds, most Israelis had changed their minds or at least were no longer sure. But I have not seen any recent polls about Gaza on any Israeli news site.

This is a good example of why any poll results published by the bolshevik Israeli media should be taken with a grain of salt.

If you recall, when Sharon ran against Mitzna, one of the primary issues was the fate of Gaza's Jewish communities. Mitzna planned to abandon some of them. Sharon was strongly opposed to eliminating any of them. Sharon resoundingly defeated Mitzna, due in large part to this stance. So I think it's safe to say the majority of Israelis were opposed to the Gaza retreat.

Amazingly, immediately after being elected, Sharon did a complete 180 and vowed to completely eliminate the Jewish presence in Gaza under the guise of 'disengagement'.

So which should we believe...Sharon's election victory based in large part to his 'maintain Israeli presence in Gaza' stance or the polls showing Israelis in favor of 'disengagement' ? I don't know. But I definitely don't trust any poll results published by leftist rags like Haaretz.

[Ulli]

Just today they have said that one of the two may be returned alive.   My point was that the people were in general in a shroud of complete uncertainty over the fate of the soldiers and many thought they *might* be alive.

KWRBT, I didn't say that I personally knew or even thought that they were dead. I certainly would not trust anything Hezbollah or Olmert are saying. Still, the fact is that Olmert claimed at the time that he was announcing this evil deal that they were probably dead. The poll simply stated "kidnapped soldiers" and made no mention of what their status is. Since the poll was taken when it was publicly announced that they were likely dead, I do assume that the respondents assumed that they were.

The fact that they were dead was reported in "Spiegel-Online" before weeks. The Spiegel knows it, because the German gouvernment was behind the deal. They interfered between Olmert and Nasrallah.

The man who lead the negotiations was "Gerhard C." a BND officer called "Mr. Hisbollah".

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/0,1518,566171,00.html


Here is one article where is mentioned that the two soldiers were dead (29.6.2008):

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/0,1518,562814,00.html

Behind all this was, as usually Frank Walter Steinmeier alias "The Muzzie Colloborator"

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

The German government and the vast majority of the German people (yes, a far greater percentage than the part of the Israeli public is self-hating) is fanatically pro-Hezbollah and pro-anyone who wants to annihilate Israel.

My only question now is that I'd really like to know what fraction of the Israeli population thinks that the Germans intervening "on their behalf" is a good idea. 

[Manch]

These are people who want to be prosperous and undisturbed. They will not sacrifice their lives to stop our movement if we respond to the Israeli Nazi army and police in kind.

CF, I object your calling IDF an Israeli NAzi army - you loose credibility when you use such hyperbole. IDF is a people army and represent the society. You wouldn't call Israeli society as Nazi society, would you?

[~Hanna~]

I feel that we should all be praying for Israel now, more than we ever have before....Israel need's our prayers, her leader's (really) need our prayers, her Military need our prayers (the beloved IDF) and her people need our prayers.

Even if we don't agree with anything the current leadership may or may not be doing over there, we are still told to pray for our leaders and for everyone in authority.......prayer changes things, prayer is the key.....to real change, .......we can always fight and whine and complain, but praying will actually do more good.....

 

 

What the hell is wrong with Israel? How fast do they want to commit suicide. I guess its not fast enoughfor them.