Israeli "reality show" star in love with Sudanese Muslim, hates Ashkenazim

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

When can Torah be forced without a Jewish state and a normal society?

   When we can do it. Its no problem and a great and praiseworthy thing. King Hezekia was a righteous King and he forced the nation to be Torah literate. Its also part of Sefer HaHinuch and other law books. Their is a Misswah to appoint Judges (in Torah) and to have police force. It says to have the police force to enforce the Torah laws and the decrees of the Shoftim (Judges).


 "Still, according to Rabbi Mizrachi, if someone is raised as a goy in public school or kibbutz, they have the status of a child stolen in a war, and can't be held accountable as Jews for what they're doing, because they don't know any better. "

 I don't think that that is what he says. Doesn't he say the opposite really?
   she is a journalist and she isn't that dumb. The fact that she choose that path is her choices and we don't believe in people like her having a great soul or whatever else.

[muman613]

Tag,

I believe LKZ is correct about a lot of the secular Jews today... They are considered as if they were kidnapped at birth by pirates or wolves...

It was a part of what I posted above concerning whether a Jew is still Jewish after he sins...

http://www.torah.org/learning/mlife/ch6law7b.html
As an interesting aside, the Talmud cannot even envisage Jews who know virtually nothing about Judaism -- who have never even *heard* of the Sabbath, holidays and dietary laws in any serious way. How can a Jew -- no matter where he lives and whom he was born to -- not even *know* that we don't eat seafood or open our stores on the Sabbath? The Talmud occasionally discusses such a case theoretically, referring to such a person as a "baby who was taken captive." Must have been someone who was kidnapped by pirates as an infant, to be whisked off to some exotic island in the South Pacific.

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

Tag,

I believe LKZ is correct about a lot of the secular Jews today... They are considered as if they were kidnapped at birth by pirates or wolves...

   We are talking about this beast and not other (or most) Jews today.

[muman613]

  We are talking about this beast and not other (or most) Jews today.

I do not know the specifics about this case. In general a Jew who has lost his way, and even may flirt with heresy and informing, can be considered as if they are not acting as a proper Jew because they were kidnapped at birth.

I believe that was the concept which LKZ was referring to.

I have stated repeatedly how I consider this case.

[muman613]

For the source of this 'captured by gentiles' idea see Talmud Mesechet Shabbos 68a...

http://halakhah.com/shabbath/shabbath_68.html

Rab and Samuel both maintain: Our Mishnah treats of a child who was taken captive among Gentiles, or a proselyte who became converted in the midst of Gentiles.23  But if one knew and subsequently forgot, he is liable [to a sin-offering] for every Sabbath.24  We learnt: HE WHO FORGETS THE ESSENTIAL LAW OF THE SABBATH: surely that implies that he knew [it] originally? — No: what is meant by HE WHO FORGETS THE ESSENTIAL LAW OF THE SABBATH? That the very existence of the Sabbath was unknown25  to him. But what if he knew and subsequently forgot; he is liable for every Sabbath? Then instead of teaching, HE WHO KNOWS THE ESSENTIAL LAW OF THE SABBATH AND PERFORMS MANY LABOURS ON MANY SABBATHS, INCURS A SIN-OFFERING ON ACCOUNT OF EACH SABBATH: let him teach, He who knew and subsequently forgot, and how much more so this one? — What is meant by, HE WHO KNOWS THE ESSENTIAL LAW OF THE SABBATH? That he who knew the essential law of the Sabbath and forgot it.



23] So that they never knew the laws of the Sabbath.
24] He is regarded as knowing the sanctity of the Sabbath but forgetting on each occasion that it is the Sabbath.
25] Lit., 'forgotten'.

And Tag and everyone else please be aware I am not talking about this particular case... I have said she falls into the category of informer/heretic... So she is on her own... She should be rebuked though by those who have the ability to change her... If possible.

[Israel Chai]

   When we can do it. Its no problem and a great and praiseworthy thing. King Hezekia was a righteous King and he forced the nation to be Torah literate. Its also part of Sefer HaHinuch and other law books. Their is a Misswah to appoint Judges (in Torah) and to have police force. It says to have the police force to enforce the Torah laws and the decrees of the Shoftim (Judges).


 "Still, according to Rabbi Mizrachi, if someone is raised as a goy in public school or kibbutz, they have the status of a child stolen in a war, and can't be held accountable as Jews for what they're doing, because they don't know any better. "

 I don't think that that is what he says. Doesn't he say the opposite really?
   she is a journalist and she isn't that dumb. The fact that she choose that path is her choices and we don't believe in people like her having a great soul or whatever else.

King Hezekia= there is a Jewish state. There's no Jewish state now.

Dude he said that like a hundred times. Is that Dana and her lackeys still poisoning you? I warned you to stay away from her, I remember when you went to debate her, all full of fire, and now I fear she's won, if it actually is a girl, she is very smart and unrighteous.

Anyways he did say once as you hear the truth you are held accountable, which is where my opinion that we can wish what Chaim and Stinks did on her if we know she's had an opportunity to be righteous comes from.

  We are talking about this beast and not other (or most) Jews today.

But my beautiful brother, we're not talking about her, it's the concept.

I do not know the specifics about this case. In general a Jew who has lost his way, and even may flirt with heresy and informing, can be considered as if they are not acting as a proper Jew because they were kidnapped at birth.

I believe that was the concept which LKZ was referring to.

I have stated repeatedly how I consider this case.

If she was brainwashed from birth and never heard the truth, then she falls under that category. If she was a Chassid and started saying this, I'd pray here and out loud that she be boiled alive in [censored].

And Tag and everyone else please be aware I am not talking about this particular case... I have said she falls into the category of informer/heretic... So she is on her own... She should be rebuked though by those who have the ability to change her... If possible.

Rebuked yes. Saying she has earned death, yes. Even for the biggest charitable man who doesn't keep shabbat, that's also allowed. Saying that if you take power you want to hang her is wrong. If Kahanists took power, she wouldn't have an ouga bouga to schlep with, or Arabs to lie to her and leftist traitors to teach her. Maybe she would be killed if Kahanists took power, but it's not her we're really talking about, it's people that go along with the "post-Zionism" and "international citizen" evil and filth that all Israel is being fed.

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

LKZ what do you mean by Dana? I wasn't saying something bad about R Mizrachi here. What does Dana have to do with it?

[Israel Chai]

LKZ what do you mean by Dana? I wasn't saying something bad about R Mizrachi here. What does Dana have to do with it?

From fb. You ended up talking with a lot of people in her little e-cult. She is devoted to attacking him, and has tried to spread that he doesn't say that a lot, when he did a million times.

[Every Jew AK47]

EJA44,

Ask yourself this question and try to answer it...

Why did Hashem allow Ishmael to live when he was dying of dehydration in the desert when he and his mother Hagar were thrown out of Avraham and Sarahs house? Hashem could have let him die there, he knew that in the future his children would be enemies of his beloved people Israel, yet he saved him...

The ways of Hashem are beyond our comprehension. We should curse those who fall within the parameters where such curses are warranted. But we should not allow our curses against Jews to become a matter of hatred.

I say again that her sin is great and her wickedness is condemnable... I curse her as a informer and heretic. But I do hold hope that she one day will rectify her sins.

Remember that everything that happens only happens because Hashem allows it to happen. We must follow the law of Hashem, and keep the Torah, and when we do we will destroy the evil.

As much as I respect your teachings, you do hog up the entire threads with the posts, perhaps a link woudl be better than just hijacking the entire thread..  I know you think by posting verse aafter verse you can shut up anybody who will challenge you..

I have attended the YOm Kippur service.. I suppose since its all about Teshuva, if I massacre and rape a child, its ok, since I am a Jew, right?  You interpret halacha according to your own liberal, modern mindset.  Modern Judaism is all about trying to rationalize the justice system of the Torah and explain why all these sensible rules are not applicable.  I don't buy it, even if it makes me a bad Jew.  Considering, you believe a Jew who leaves his religion and becomes a traitor, joins the Nazi party and becomes a top ranking general who helps the worst enemy of the Jews exterminate half the Jewish race and bring an end to the Jewish religion, well what can I say??    You are even worse than the worst of bleeding heart leftist liberal Jews in my eyes.  Even some of them would agree with me on this subject.

I think I have no more place in JTF, you guys claim to be very right-wing , vigilant and liberators of the Jewish people, but you are as leftist, self-hating bleeding-heart liberalish as many other deranged, self-loathing Jewish groups I meet.  Seriously, defending some filthy whore who marries a black Sudanese muslim and converts to Islam and then curses the entire Ashkenazi race of Jews.   Then, defending one of the highest ranking and notorious generals in Hitler's military, simply because, he had a Jewish mother, who he lied and claimed was raped by a gentile uncle to give birth to him.

I think Chaim is bold , vigilant and has walked the walk and sacrificed himself for the good of the Jewish people, but his forum is just gone to insanity.  This is why I am sick and tired of Jews and feel like leaving the Jewish community, altogether. . I cannot stand this insanity, this self-hatred and pampering and cuddling vile, evil and wicked people.   I can see by Chaim's posts , that he is sober-minded and has a clear understanding of the evilness that threatens the destruction of our people.  What is with the rest of you people with your heads up your rectum?

EJA44,

Bring some examples of those traitors who were executed and we can discuss what the teachings of the Talmud are.

Muman, you are like a Rabbi, in your knowledge, I am sad to see you now abusing such great knowledge you hold.  Rather , then challenging you as a layman, I will find another Rabbi who will champion my cause who can meet you on your own level.   

However, being a man who has some knowledge in the Bible, I will definitely take your challenge about posting verses from the Tanakh where it clearly shows the rewards for Jewish traitors, that is death!  Since, you challenged me, I will take you on this challenge!!

[muman613]

EJA44,

I am sorry you have come to this. I was a big supporter of you and I tried to help you. But you have no understanding of what being Jewish is.

I have never defended what is being done by this person. I have condemned it from the very beginning. Because of your failings you attribute things to me which I have not said. You say things which have no foundation because you feel you have the right to say such things. But you will learn that this is not the way Judaism works.

It is worthless for me to worry about your problems at this time. I hope and pray that some day you wake up from your delusions about what Judaism is and really study what it means to be a Jew. You and your false beliefs are what is wrong with the Jewish people. You are as bad as the reform for trying to make up your own Torah.

The students of Rabbi Akiva died because they did not respect each other. I attempted to respect you and what did I get, nothing but denigration from you (who denigrates himself regularly).

You are free to leave JTF because I am beginning to join those who think you came here to create problems. You put on a good act which had me almost fooled... But as I said, everyone who is born Jewish is Jewish for their life, and you too can take the initiative and do some learning.

[muman613]

Indeed the Torah brings that traitors to the king are executed. It is the law... But those executed are still Jewish... And they could have made teshuva until the day they died.

So please do bring your scriptural sources.

[muman613]

Who at JTF supported her or gave her words of encouragement here? Nobody... EJA44 you are making 'straw man' arguments as you were accused of previously.

LKZ and I do not curse her personally (and you take this as supporting her, which is a mistake on your part). I personally pray for the destruction of informers and heretics in my daily prayers. I said she falls in this category, but you want more... You think I am supporting her but in my opinion you are suffering some kind of delusion of reality.

Good luck in your life EJA44... You need to open your eyes a little to see the truth. I hope you have an enlightened Yom Kippur this year...

[Israel Chai]

As much as I respect your teachings, you do hog up the entire threads with the posts, perhaps a link woudl be better than just hijacking the entire thread..  I know you think by posting verse aafter verse you can shut up anybody who will challenge you..

I have attended the YOm Kippur service.. I suppose since its all about Teshuva, if I massacre and rape a child, its ok, since I am a Jew, right?  You interpret halacha according to your own liberal, modern mindset.  Modern Judaism is all about trying to rationalize the justice system of the Torah and explain why all these sensible rules are not applicable.  I don't buy it, even if it makes me a bad Jew.  Considering, you believe a Jew who leaves his religion and becomes a traitor, joins the Nazi party and becomes a top ranking general who helps the worst enemy of the Jews exterminate half the Jewish race and bring an end to the Jewish religion, well what can I say??    You are even worse than the worst of bleeding heart leftist liberal Jews in my eyes.  Even some of them would agree with me on this subject.

I think I have no more place in JTF, you guys claim to be very right-wing , vigilant and liberators of the Jewish people, but you are as leftist, self-hating bleeding-heart liberalish as many other deranged, self-loathing Jewish groups I meet.  Seriously, defending some filthy whore who marries a black Sudanese muslim and converts to Islam and then curses the entire Ashkenazi race of Jews.   Then, defending one of the highest ranking and notorious generals in Hitler's military, simply because, he had a Jewish mother, who he lied and claimed was raped by a gentile uncle to give birth to him.

I think Chaim is bold , vigilant and has walked the walk and sacrificed himself for the good of the Jewish people, but his forum is just gone to insanity.  This is why I am sick and tired of Jews and feel like leaving the Jewish community, altogether. . I cannot stand this insanity, this self-hatred and pampering and cuddling vile, evil and wicked people.   I can see by Chaim's posts , that he is sober-minded and has a clear understanding of the evilness that threatens the destruction of our people.  What is with the rest of you people with your heads up your rectum?
Muman, you are like a Rabbi, in your knowledge, I am sad to see you now abusing such great knowledge you hold.  Rather , then challenging you as a layman, I will find another Rabbi who will champion my cause who can meet you on your own level.   

However, being a man who has some knowledge in the Bible, I will definitely take your challenge about posting verses from the Tanakh where it clearly shows the rewards for Jewish traitors, that is death!  Since, you challenged me, I will take you on this challenge!!

Oi vey. Considering Muman brought an example before there even was a Torah, and I brought one during the Roman occupation... I keep trying to make you see that you're condemning yourself.

No one said the rules are not applicable. Muman called her a traitor, and if you see what I said with Tag, if there was a Jewish state, she'd be a crispy critter. Right now we have to merit to have a Jewish state, and Hashem will do the killing if we won't do the teshuva, but no one gave you permission to kill Jews, as sick as they may be.

Also, I'm back to where I was before, stop cursing the forum, and I can't in good conscience trust you. Loyalty is the only currency of any value, and if a conversation erodes it, there's no worth there.

Here's the big question: do you merit to make teshuva?

Also, Muman "hogging up the thread" with words of Torah saves the world. If you don't like it, scroll down.

[muman613]

I hate my enemies, those I am commanded to hate, with a passion.

There is a time to love and a time to hate, and the time to hate is when enemies are trying to kill us.

We curse those Jews who are informers (joining our enemies, such as the NK and the liberal left peace-now fools)... We curse those Jews who give ammunition to those trying to kill us (such as Tom Friedman of the NYT) and the J-street idiots who lure good Jews to give to organizations working to destroy the Jewish state.

But when it comes to asking Jews to curse a Jew it crosses a divide which not every Jew can cross. Even the judenrat had family which were ashamed of their relatives and prayed for their repentance. Every Jew today knows someone who has intermarriage in their family... It is a terrible thing that it happens but we all cannot curse it equally.

Not cursing someone is not supporting them or being merciful to them. They most certainly will get what is deserved to them, either by the hand of Hashem or otherwise. You don't understand this and you think by not cursing them we are supporting them. Please think about what you are saying.

[Every Jew AK47]

Indeed, Muman, you have made me your enemy today..  Sad, that it has to come to this..  Unfortunately, Jews like you will bring about the death of our race and I must fight you as I fight all the enemies of Am Yisrael.. Anybody, who stands by and defends a traitor is a traitor themselves!!

Muman, LKZ, Avraham Ben Noach, you are all enemies of the Jewish people and Israel and deserve nothing less than your share of misery.. 

It is you who I pray make teshuva before Hashem's justice is exacted upon you..

OH and I am not done yet.. I still have some verses to share from you from the Tanach , I am copying these from the Chabad website.

I Kings 2:23 - 2:25, Death of Adoniahu
23. And king Solomon swore by the Lord, saying, "God do so to me, and more also, if Adoniahu has (not) spoken this word with his life."       כג. וַיִּשָּׁבַע הַמֶּלֶךְ שְׁלֹמֹה בַּיהֹוָה לֵאמֹר כֹּה יַעֲשֶׂה לִּי אֱלֹהִים וְכֹה יוֹסִיף כִּי בְנַפְשׁוֹ דִּבֶּר אֲדֹנִיָּהוּ אֶת הַדָּבָר הַזֶּה:
24. And now, (as) the Lord lives, Who has established me, and set me on the throne of David, my father, and Who has made me a house, as He had promised, that Adoniahu shall be put to death this day.       כד. וְעַתָּה חַי יְהֹוָה אֲשֶׁר הֱכִינַנִי וַיּוֹשִׁיבַנִי עַל כִּסֵּא דָּוִד אָבִי וַאֲשֶׁר עָשָׂה לִי בַּיִת כַּאֲשֶׁר דִּבֵּר כִּי הַיּוֹם יוּמַת אֲדֹנִיָּהוּ:
25. And king Solomon sent by the hand of Benaiahu the son of Jehoida, and he fell upon him that he died.


Maybe, I will keep posting from the Tanach of how Hashem deals with traitors until you decide to ban me..

Rabbi Kahane is turning in his grave with self-hating Jewish scum like you people making a mockery of our race.  You are defenders of the Nazis and Muslim savages..


DEATH TO ALL TRAITORS!!! DEATH TO ALL JUDENRAT!!!!!

[muman613]

Get some rest EJA44, you are acting like a fool.

You make false accusations and do not represent the Torah in a respectful manner.

Are you going to curse me? You should be ashamed of yourself.

You have done nothing to help the Jewish people. You are an ingrate with nothing to back up your chutzpah. You hate your fellow Jews like an Amalekite and have absolutely zero Ahavat Yisroel. You don't even try, and you think people will take you seriously? For real?

I have no idea how old you are but you act like a child. You have no depth in your character and an obvious void of Jewish neshama. Chaim is a great man and I support him every day. I give to the forum and have brought a lot of good Torah here which you just dismiss. I suspect you do not care about the Torah but seek honor for yourself.

Hashem is the ultimate judge, and he hears the suffering of his servants.

King David was king of Israel and the Torah commands honor for the king. Those who rebel against the king are to be executed. What is your point about this?

[Israel Chai]

lol. Lucky for us G-d doesn't hear the prayers of those that don't know him. We should be worried, as even Moshe Rabbeinu, who Hashem lived was when the upserpers tried to take control. I'll will pray now that Hashem remembers your merits, including saving me, and does not hear the prayers of everyjew against you.

[muman613]

EJa44,

Go join the jihadis if you want to kill people. You sound like an islamic mamzer yelling 'allah akbar' as you massacre Jews.

You think you will get into heaven by doing that...

 

[Israel Chai]

I'm crying in prayer for you Muman, and you don't deserve this, may Hashem not hear the prayer of everyJew and remember your merits and shut out the hate against you and protect you, and may you not be punished or judged or suffer on account of everyjew.

[Every Jew AK47]

Get some rest EJA44, you are acting like a fool.

You make false accusations and do not represent the Torah in a respectful manner.

Yes, I am a fool and you are the wise man.. But, I will just make one more comment:

DEATH TO ALL TRAITORS!!! DEATH TO ALL JUDENRAT AND DEATH TO OUR ENEMIES!!


David orders Solomon to slay the Jewish traitor Joab, which Solomon had done:
I Kings 2:5 - 2:6
5. Moreover, you also know what Joab the son of Zeruiah did to me, (and) what he did to the two captains of the hosts of Israel, to Abner the son of Ner, and to Amasa the son of Jether, whom he slew, and shed the blood of war in peace and put the blood of war upon his girdle (that was) about his loins, and in his shoes that (were) on his feet.
6. And you shall do according to your wisdom, and do not let his hoary head go down to the grave in peace.

[Israel Chai]

David orders Solomon to slay the Jewish traitor Joab, which Solomon had done:
I Kings 2:5
5. Moreover, you also know what Joab the son of Zeruiah did to me, (and) what he did to the two captains of the hosts of Israel, to Abner the son of Ner, and to Amasa the son of Jether, whom he slew, and shed the blood of war in peace and put the blood of war upon his girdle (that was) about his loins, and in his shoes that (were) on his feet.

Thanks for the words of Torah. May we merit to have a Jewish state through mass-teshuva so wee can do this again.

[Every Jew AK47]

EJa44,

Go join the jihadis if you want to kill people. You sound like an islamic mamzer yelling 'allah akbar' as you massacre Jews.

You think you will get into heaven by doing that...

 

Or maybe I will yell Baruch Hashem!!!   I always said there is a lot of things we Jews can learn from the jihadis..  The Jihadis love people like you more than me..  They love the fact that they can screw and marry our women and that they face no retribution since they get a free ride, being Jewish.

[muman613]

Here is another long repost from Torah.org which discusses how Teshuva works concerning David and those who rebelled against him..

http://www.torah.org/learning/ravfrand/5765/kisavo.html

Rabbi Frand on Parshas Ki Savo

Selichos: It Pays to Be 'First In Line'

The opening poetic composition of the Motzaei Shabbos [Saturday night] Selichos liturgy (the very beginning the pre-Rosh Hashana Selichos) begins with the words "B'Motzaei Menucha Kidamnucha techila" [With the going out of (the day of) rest, we are first to greet you]. The Izbitzer Rebbe notes that the two words "Kidamnucha techila" [we are first to greet you] introduces the entire idea of Selichos.

Why, after all, do we say these penitential prayers 4 to 10 days before Rosh Hashanna? This is not, formally, the "High Holiday period," which technically begins on Rosh Hashanna and runs through Succos. What does Selichos accomplish in this period that is neither -- strictly speaking -- a period of either judgment or atonement?

The Izbitzer Rebbe explains that the idea behind Selichos is that the earlier we get started asking forgiveness from the Almighty, the more successful we will be. The Izbitzer Rebbe cites a proof to this idea from a Biblical incident.

Dovid HaMelech [King David] had a very tumultuous life. One of the indignities that he suffered was having his monarchy overthrown by his son, Avshalom. In one of the most pathetic chapters of the entire Tanach [Shmuel II 15], Dovid HaMelech had to leave Jerusalem with his family and entourage to flee from his son who took over the throne. In this moment of great personal tragedy, Shimee ben Gerah took the opportunity to add insult to injury. He laced into the King and bitterly cursed him. Shimee figured that at this point, Dovid HaMelech's kingship was ended. Shimee, who had a personal grudge against Dovid HaMelech, mercilessly cursed the fleeing monarch.

Dovid HaMelech eventually retook the monarchy and returned to Jerusalem. All the people who sided with the wrong side, and especially Shimee ben Gerah who had cursed the king, were fearful for their lives. In fact they were deserving of death, for in the times of the Biblical monarchy, one who rebelled against the king (mored b'Malchus) was deserving of the death penalty. The Rambam rules that the King can personally –- without trial -– execute such rebels.

Shimee ben Gerah knew that he was a 'dead man'. So what did he do? "Shimee son of Gera, the Benjamite who was from Bahurim, hastened and went down with the men of Yehudah to greet Dovid HaMelech." [Shmuel II 19:17] He reached the King and told him "...For your servant knows that I have sinned, and here I have come today, first among all the House of Yosef, to come down and greet my master the king." [Shmuel II 19:21].

Shimee emphasized that among the thousands of people who were asking Dovid HaMelech for mechila [forgiveness], he was one of the first. "I know I did wrong. I know I sinned against you. I know that I should lose my life for it. I apologize and I am sorry. I am not even going to wait in line to tell you this. I want to be the FIRST person that has the opportunity to express my remorse."

The Izbitzer Rebbe says that this exactly parallels what we are doing in our pre-Rosh HaShana Selichos.

Strictly speaking, one could wait until Rosh HaShannah to approach the Almighty with these requests. Theoretically, one could even wait until Yom Kippur. There are procrastinators in life –- such as the fellow who always files his (U.S.) income tax forms on the night of April 15th! The Jewish counterpart of the April 15th tax filers are those who wait until Neilah (the final Yom Kippur prayer) to make their sincere request to the Almighty for Forgiveness and for Mercy.

The difference is that the U.S. Internal Revenue Service (IRS) does not care if the tax forms are filed on February 1st or just before midnight on the 15th of April. As long as the envelope is post-marked by April 15th, it is all the same to the IRS. However, if one is wise enough and spiritually sensitive enough to try to "catch the Master of the Universe early" -- to be "first in line" -- that does make a difference! Even if one's sins are as incriminating as those of Shimee ben Gerah against Dovid HaMelech -– humiliating and abusing the king –- nevertheless it pays to be "first in line."

Shimee ben Gerah should have been a 'dead man'. But his haste to see the king paid off. Dovid HaMelech did not kill him. He did not even direct his son Shlomo [Solomon] to kill him. Why did this wicked person merit such merciful treatment? Shimee ben Gerah merited merciful treatment because he knew the secret of "coming first" to plea for his life.

This year, there are eighteen days between the start of Selichos (on the night following September 24th) and Yom Kippur (October 13th). One might ask -– why do we need to recite Selichos this Motzai Shabbos? What is the rush? We have plenty of time!

But there is significance to coming early. This tone of Selichos is set with the opening words of the first Selicha-poem recited on the Motzaei Shabbos when we begin to recite the first penitential prayers: "B'Motzaei Menucha kidamnucha techila." At the conclusion of resting, we are first in line to greet you.

It is all a matter of showing up early to sincerely say and demonstrate "I am sorry!" Let us be like Shimee ben Gerah regarding this one matter of showing up first, rather than waiting for the masses to come and present their requests for forgiveness.

[muman613]

EJA44,

You make suppositions you cannot substantiate. You act in a very devious and untruthful manner.

I do not tolerate any disrespect of Hashem or Israel or any Jew... You do not know me, and as it is turning out I do not want to know you. Stop making a fool of yourself.

[muman613]

Teshuva is incredible and it cannot be comprehended by those who have restricted minds.

But Teshuva is not condoning the wicked. I don't understand how EJA44 conflates the two ideas.

We condemn the wicked, we fight the evil and destroy it when it appears, but we do not harbor hate and revenge in our hearts. That is what the Torah teaches (see the mitzvah of rebuke)...

I am 100% in agreement with everything Rabbi Kahane said concerning our enemies. I am with him concerning the arabs and believe in a halachic Jewish state. My goal is to try to find what the sages of the Talmud and Tanakh say concerning applying the lessons to todays situation.