Would you buy Cholent from an Amalekite?

[judeanoncapta]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parshas Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

[OdKahaneChai]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parashat Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

Everyone has Amalek in them. 

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

huh?

[jdl4ever]

He heee heeeee.  Yeah, in a previous speech my Rabbi said that in one of the places in the Torah where it says the Jews fought against their enemies in the desert, that they didn't physically fight but fought with Torah.  Some of these guys are crazy.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

If you really disagree with them, then dont go to them. Its not productive where you go to them, listin to what they say and then bad mouth about them here and other places (their is no gain in you writing this here on the forum).

[jdl4ever]

I think the opposite, that it serves a good purpose to expose the fools with the long beards and make fun of them so others won't be caught in their evil web of deceit. 

[judeanoncapta]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parashat Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

Everyone has Amalek in them. 

It was precisely the inability to understand the difference between pshat and drush that causes people to say things like the Satmars and, apparently you, do.

This is one of the biggest problems with Haredi education. People's heads are swimming in drush and they can't recognize pshat even if they trip over it.

Also the concept of "Ain hamikra Yotzei midei pshuto''(The Verse doesn't leave it's simple meaning) is completely incomprehensible to most people educated in Haredi schools.


And if you don't beleive me, ask a person educated in haredi schools to tell you over the story of Purim and you will quickly realize that they have no ability to distinguish between what is written in the Megillah and what is written in the Midrash.

[judeanoncapta]

That's like when Liberals say Jihad means an inner struggle, not holy war. I also heard people say that the blessing in The Amidah against malshinim is an inner struggle. I prefer the Kahanist approach to what Birkat HaMinim means.

But by fighting "the Amalek within us", it could also mean to fight the self-hating Jew. Remember when Ovadiah Yosef called Yossi Sarid Haman and said Yimach Shemo VeZichro about Sarid?

I agree with everything that Rav Ovadia said about Sarid.

The problem I have is that Shimon Peres is just as bad as Sarid if not worse because Peres is more influential and powerful and therefore has done more damage to Israel than Sarid. And yet, Peres was supported by Shas for the presidency under the direct command of rav Ovadia Yosef.

[OdKahaneChai]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parashat Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

Everyone has Amalek in them. 

It was precisely the inability to understand the difference between pshat and drush that causes people to say things like the Satmars and, apparently you, do.

This is one of the biggest problems with Haredi education. People's heads are swimming in drush and they can't recognize pshat even if they trip over it.

Also the concept of "Ain hamikra Yotzei midei pshuto''(The Verse doesn't leave it's simple meaning) is completely incomprehensible to most people educated in Haredi schools.


And if you don't beleive me, ask a person educated in haredi schools to tell you over the story of Purim and you will quickly realize that they have no ability to distinguish between what is written in the Megillah and what is written in the Midrash.

Unfortunately for you, though, the drosh is also correct.  And even you must acknowledge that today we do not know who Amalek is.

[judeanoncapta]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parashat Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

Everyone has Amalek in them. 

It was precisely the inability to understand the difference between pshat and drush that causes people to say things like the Satmars and, apparently you, do.

This is one of the biggest problems with Haredi education. People's heads are swimming in drush and they can't recognize pshat even if they trip over it.

Also the concept of "Ain hamikra Yotzei midei pshuto''(The Verse doesn't leave it's simple meaning) is completely incomprehensible to most people educated in Haredi schools.


And if you don't beleive me, ask a person educated in haredi schools to tell you over the story of Purim and you will quickly realize that they have no ability to distinguish between what is written in the Megillah and what is written in the Midrash.

Unfortunately for you, though, the drosh is also correct.  And even you must acknowledge that today we do not know who Amalek is.

I'm not doubting the correctness and depth and beauty of drush but I think that people submit it instead of pshat and that is very dangerous because it perverts Torah concepts as jdl4ever's Rabbi has clearly done.

[OdKahaneChai]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parashat Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

Everyone has Amalek in them. 

It was precisely the inability to understand the difference between pshat and drush that causes people to say things like the Satmars and, apparently you, do.

This is one of the biggest problems with Haredi education. People's heads are swimming in drush and they can't recognize pshat even if they trip over it.

Also the concept of "Ain hamikra Yotzei midei pshuto''(The Verse doesn't leave it's simple meaning) is completely incomprehensible to most people educated in Haredi schools.


And if you don't beleive me, ask a person educated in haredi schools to tell you over the story of Purim and you will quickly realize that they have no ability to distinguish between what is written in the Megillah and what is written in the Midrash.

Unfortunately for you, though, the drosh is also correct.  And even you must acknowledge that today we do not know who Amalek is.

Chaim has said that any nation that goes against The Jewish People has the status of Amalek. He used The Vilna Gaon and Rav Kook as sources.

But that's just silly.  The only remainder of Amalek after the story of Purim were Haman's grandchildren.  Are you telling me that all of today's arabs, nazis, black anti-semites, etc., come from them? 

You have to remember, the plishtim were some of the worst enemies of the Jewish people in history, but they were NOT Amalek.

[OdKahaneChai]

There is the concept of Amalek besides being descended from Amalek. Jew haters are spiritually Amalek even if not physically.

Why must you consider them "Amalek"?  There are evil people in the world who AREN'T Amalek...

[judeanoncapta]

There is the concept of Amalek besides being descended from Amalek. Jew haters are spiritually Amalek even if not physically.

Why must you consider them "Amalek"?  There are evil people in the world who AREN'T Amalek...

It's funny how you find it ridiculous to call someone who wishes to wipe the Jewish people off the face of the earth "Amalek."

And yet you find it completely normal to refer to a bad Character Trait or Doubts in Faith as "Amalek."

[OdKahaneChai]

There is the concept of Amalek besides being descended from Amalek. Jew haters are spiritually Amalek even if not physically.

Why must you consider them "Amalek"?  There are evil people in the world who AREN'T Amalek...

It's funny how you find it ridiculous to call someone who wishes to wipe the Jewish people off the face of the earth "Amalek."

And yet you find it completely normal to refer to a bad Character Trait or Doubts in Faith as "Amalek."

Amalek's objective was not to wipe out the Jewish people.  It was to cool them down from their spiritual high.

[judeanoncapta]

There is the concept of Amalek besides being descended from Amalek. Jew haters are spiritually Amalek even if not physically.

Why must you consider them "Amalek"?  There are evil people in the world who AREN'T Amalek...

It's funny how you find it ridiculous to call someone who wishes to wipe the Jewish people off the face of the earth "Amalek."

And yet you find it completely normal to refer to a bad Character Trait or Doubts in Faith as "Amalek."

Amalek's objective was not to wipe out the Jewish people.  It was to cool them down from their spiritual high.

Wow, man!!!!!!!!!

Far Out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OKC, you are so used to drush, you have no idea what pshat is.

According to you, Amalek just want to kill our chill.

You are actually quite amusing.

[OdKahaneChai]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parashat Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

Everyone has Amalek in them. 

It was precisely the inability to understand the difference between pshat and drush that causes people to say things like the Satmars and, apparently you, do.

This is one of the biggest problems with Haredi education. People's heads are swimming in drush and they can't recognize pshat even if they trip over it.

Also the concept of "Ain hamikra Yotzei midei pshuto''(The Verse doesn't leave it's simple meaning) is completely incomprehensible to most people educated in Haredi schools.


And if you don't beleive me, ask a person educated in haredi schools to tell you over the story of Purim and you will quickly realize that they have no ability to distinguish between what is written in the Megillah and what is written in the Midrash.

Unfortunately for you, though, the drosh is also correct.  And even you must acknowledge that today we do not know who Amalek is.

I'm not doubting the correctness and depth and beauty of drush but I think that people submit it instead of pshat and that is very dangerous because it perverts Torah concepts as jdl4ever's Rabbi has clearly done.

How has he perverted Torah concepts?

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

Actually Amaleks mission was a fight agains't G-d. In order to "get" G-d they attack Israel, who is associated with G-d.

[OdKahaneChai]

There is the concept of Amalek besides being descended from Amalek. Jew haters are spiritually Amalek even if not physically.

Why must you consider them "Amalek"?  There are evil people in the world who AREN'T Amalek...

It's funny how you find it ridiculous to call someone who wishes to wipe the Jewish people off the face of the earth "Amalek."

And yet you find it completely normal to refer to a bad Character Trait or Doubts in Faith as "Amalek."

Amalek's objective was not to wipe out the Jewish people.  It was to cool them down from their spiritual high.

Wow, man!!!!!!!!!

Far Out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OKC, you are so used to drush, you have no idea what pshat is.

According to you, Amalek just want to kill our chill.

You are actually quite amusing.

But not as amusing as your stoner reference... 

And if by "chill", you mean complete faith in and closeness with HaKodosh Boruch Hu, then yes, that's absolutely right. 

And you still haven't answered my question...

[judeanoncapta]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parashat Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

Everyone has Amalek in them. 

It was precisely the inability to understand the difference between pshat and drush that causes people to say things like the Satmars and, apparently you, do.

This is one of the biggest problems with Haredi education. People's heads are swimming in drush and they can't recognize pshat even if they trip over it.

Also the concept of "Ain hamikra Yotzei midei pshuto''(The Verse doesn't leave it's simple meaning) is completely incomprehensible to most people educated in Haredi schools.


And if you don't beleive me, ask a person educated in haredi schools to tell you over the story of Purim and you will quickly realize that they have no ability to distinguish between what is written in the Megillah and what is written in the Midrash.

Unfortunately for you, though, the drosh is also correct.  And even you must acknowledge that today we do not know who Amalek is.

I'm not doubting the correctness and depth and beauty of drush but I think that people submit it instead of pshat and that is very dangerous because it perverts Torah concepts as jdl4ever's Rabbi has clearly done.

How has he perverted Torah concepts?

By claiming that all of the references to fighting and wars in the Tanakh actually refer to spiritual not physical battles, that Rabbi was perverting Torah concepts to fit his view of the Torah as a Book of Ascetic Pacifism.

It is not.

[OdKahaneChai]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parashat Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

Everyone has Amalek in them. 

It was precisely the inability to understand the difference between pshat and drush that causes people to say things like the Satmars and, apparently you, do.

This is one of the biggest problems with Haredi education. People's heads are swimming in drush and they can't recognize pshat even if they trip over it.

Also the concept of "Ain hamikra Yotzei midei pshuto''(The Verse doesn't leave it's simple meaning) is completely incomprehensible to most people educated in Haredi schools.


And if you don't beleive me, ask a person educated in haredi schools to tell you over the story of Purim and you will quickly realize that they have no ability to distinguish between what is written in the Megillah and what is written in the Midrash.

Unfortunately for you, though, the drosh is also correct.  And even you must acknowledge that today we do not know who Amalek is.

I'm not doubting the correctness and depth and beauty of drush but I think that people submit it instead of pshat and that is very dangerous because it perverts Torah concepts as jdl4ever's Rabbi has clearly done.

How has he perverted Torah concepts?

By claiming that all of the references to fighting and wars in the Tanakh actually refer to spiritual not physical battles, that Rabbi was perverting Torah concepts to fit his view of the Torah as a Book of Ascetic Pacifism.

It is not.

When did THAT happen in the story?

Or are you just bringing up a midrash... 

[judeanoncapta]

I was just reading Jdl4ever's exasperation at this Satmar Rabbi very interesting non-literal interpretation of the commandment to wipe out Amalek.

I have to tell you this story about this Satmar guy very interesting non-literal interpretation of Who and What Amalek is.

On Friday, I went into this Satmar take out food store to get ready made food. Like Cholent, Kishke, Shnitzel, Gefilte Fish. Shabbos Food so that my wife can have a week off of cooking.

When I walked in, this Satmar guy said " Parashat Zachor!!!!!!!!!! Amalek!!!!!!!!!!!! I should merit to exterminate Amalek out of myself."

I said " What do you mean?"

He said "I have Amalek in me."

I said "You do?!?!?!"

He said "Yes."

Then I said "Then I'm not going to shop here."

Everyone has Amalek in them. 

It was precisely the inability to understand the difference between pshat and drush that causes people to say things like the Satmars and, apparently you, do.

This is one of the biggest problems with Haredi education. People's heads are swimming in drush and they can't recognize pshat even if they trip over it.

Also the concept of "Ain hamikra Yotzei midei pshuto''(The Verse doesn't leave it's simple meaning) is completely incomprehensible to most people educated in Haredi schools.


And if you don't beleive me, ask a person educated in haredi schools to tell you over the story of Purim and you will quickly realize that they have no ability to distinguish between what is written in the Megillah and what is written in the Midrash.

Unfortunately for you, though, the drosh is also correct.  And even you must acknowledge that today we do not know who Amalek is.

I'm not doubting the correctness and depth and beauty of drush but I think that people submit it instead of pshat and that is very dangerous because it perverts Torah concepts as jdl4ever's Rabbi has clearly done.

How has he perverted Torah concepts?

By claiming that all of the references to fighting and wars in the Tanakh actually refer to spiritual not physical battles, that Rabbi was perverting Torah concepts to fit his view of the Torah as a Book of Ascetic Pacifism.

It is not.

When did THAT happen in the story?

Or are you just bringing up a midrash... 

Read what jdl4ever wrote in the beginning as well as his followup comments.

[OdKahaneChai]

There is the concept of Amalek besides being descended from Amalek. Jew haters are spiritually Amalek even if not physically.

Why must you consider them "Amalek"?  There are evil people in the world who AREN'T Amalek...

It's funny how you find it ridiculous to call someone who wishes to wipe the Jewish people off the face of the earth "Amalek."

And yet you find it completely normal to refer to a bad Character Trait or Doubts in Faith as "Amalek."

Amalek's objective was not to wipe out the Jewish people.  It was to cool them down from their spiritual high.

Wow, man!!!!!!!!!

Far Out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OKC, you are so used to drush, you have no idea what pshat is.

According to you, Amalek just want to kill our chill.

You are actually quite amusing.

Maybe he means G-d sent Amalek to test us. I remember hearing the rabbi on Purim say something about Haman having a mission from G-d. He must have been evil and lost his free will just like Pharaoh. The reason Haman wanted to kill The Jews is because The Jews participated in Achashverosh's party with the stolen Temple vessels.

After the crossing of the Yam Suf, the Jews were on a spiritual "high" - which, despite judeanoncapita's hilarious quip, had nothing to do with Marijuana.  They had never been so connected with the HaKadosh Boruch Hu.

And not only that, but every single nation was terrified them. 

Except for Amalek.  Amalek came and said, "What are you talking about, "G-d."  This was all a big coincidence.  These Jews just got real lucky!  See, look what we can do to them!" 

And that was the goal of Amalek.  The intoduce Sofek, doubt (which is the same numerical value as Amalek).  And today, when we don't know who Amalek is anymore, that is the Amalek we need to obliterate.  The Sofek, the doubt.

[OdKahaneChai]

And that was the goal of Amalek.  The intoduce Sofek, doubt (which is the same numerical value as Amalek).  And today, when we don't know who Amalek is anymore, that is the Amalek we need to obliterate.  The Sofek, the doubt.

Then why did my rabbi mention Hamas in his Shabbat Zachor sermon? He's a black hat Litvish and put Right Wing politics into it.

And why did your Rabbi eat Chicken for lunch, instead of Fish?  I don't know...

I would at least need to see the context.  And I don't really know what the Litvish take on things is - I'm not one of them.  But  I would be highly surprised if he said that we can identify Hamas as Amalek.

[Tzvi Ben Roshel1]

And that was the goal of Amalek.  The intoduce Sofek, doubt (which is the same numerical value as Amalek).  And today, when we don't know who Amalek is anymore, that is the Amalek we need to obliterate.  The Sofek, the doubt.

Then why did my rabbi mention Hamas in his Shabbat Zachor sermon? He's a black hat Litvish and put Right Wing politics into it.

Their are many things and aspects/ points of view that we can learn and do from the lessons of the Torah. When with Amalik for example their are different lessons and applications that we can learn even for today, and this is Torah and that is Torah. One aspect if like OdKahane said, and another is destroying those who want to kill us (who according to some opinions becomes like Amalik).
 This rule is also for many other things, and sometimes it is influenced by the insight that a Rav can bring and the tradition, etc. For example drinking wine on Purim and not knowing the difference between "cursed in Haman and Blessed in Mordechi" - one point of view- the Kahanists would be to say that just as it is a mitzva to bless a Tzaddik like Mordechi, soo it is a mitzva to curse a Rasha, and sometimes we need wine that let the inward true self/ feelings come out and do the action.  From anothe rpoint of view one might say that in a way we can bless haman because if it wasn't for him we wouldn't have turned to G-d and have reached a close relationship because we thought we would have ben killed and we turned to Him, but about Mordechi, since he was a Tzaddik, we also turned to him, which took a little bit away from our connection to G-d.  
 And their are many many other insights, etc. But what needs to be done is to incorporate the Midrash without forgetting the Pshat. Doing both, expecially the Pshat, and then moving on to deeper insights and understandings, where really many of these things aren't necessecarily contradictions or arguments, but just deeper insights and lessons.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

After the crossing of the Yam Suf, the Jews were on a spiritual "high" - which, despite judeanoncapita's hilarious quip, had nothing to do with Marijuana.  They had never been so connected with the HaKadosh Boruch Hu.

And not only that, but every single nation was terrified them. 

Except for Amalek.  Amalek came and said, "What are you talking about, "G-d."  This was all a big coincidence.  These Jews just got real lucky!  See, look what we can do to them!" 

And that was the goal of Amalek.  The intoduce Sofek, doubt (which is the same numerical value as Amalek).  And today, when we don't know who Amalek is anymore, that is the Amalek we need to obliterate.  The Sofek, the doubt.

You cannot say that just because suffik and Amalek have the same gematria, that we can simply equate a doubt in faith or an imperfect character trait as Amalek (or inner Amalek) and that that is the only amalek left in the world.  The rabbis told us that we don't know WHO amalek is today, not that he doesn't exist.  Yes, Amalek has much to do with the concept of doubt in am yisrael and many commented on this in complex explanations, but what you say is so overly simplistic it sounds absurd and seems to contradict the simple meaning as judea is saying.