Author Topic: People threatening my life on youtube  (Read 3716 times)

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Offline White Israelite

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Re: People threatening my life on youtube
« Reply #25 on: August 07, 2008, 01:55:25 PM »
What about smokless powder??  ;)  It doesn't have the same velocity. Might have to pop em a few extra times.  

Hey, I think I see a market here. Kosher ammunition.

Majority of modern ammo uses Chorodite which if I recall is indeed smokeless. But firearms will still have muzzle flash from powder residue left on the barrel or the gases escaping the barrel.

Offline Shamgar

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Re: People threatening my life on youtube
« Reply #26 on: August 07, 2008, 02:01:15 PM »
Darn, I guess I will have to continue to work for a living.
Infidels fighting Obamazombies and Islamazombies in the wastelands of the former United States.

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Offline muman613

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Re: People threatening my life on youtube
« Reply #27 on: August 07, 2008, 02:05:51 PM »
White Israelite, report any threat to the police. If he physically attacks you and you have to take the guy out, you will be treated like a criminal and it will help to support your story. Also, if the police do anything, which is rarely, it will create a bunch of grief for the moron.

Good thing is you are in a CCW state. Always carry always. 

I was reading on another thread that some Jews would not carry a weapon on the Sabbath. I sure hope this is not true for any of our members. I guess we could always assign gentile bodyguards, I would give up a Saturday per month to protect a Jew.  O0

It depends on the rabbi, the problem is that when a weapon is fired, it creates a "fire" so that it would technically violate the sabbath, it's not actually forbidden to carry it however. And I believe the sabbath can be violated if your life is in danger, at least the rabbi I had spoken with had mentioned this.

White,

I am not a rabbi, but I beleive there will be a halachic issue when 'carrying' the object from a private domain to a public domain. This is true for all items. We are not allowed to carry an object from inside to outside a house. Aside from the issue of fire and carrying there is nothing especially forbidden about guns, at least according to my understanding.

muman613



If I recall, there was a quote that was mentioned on a verse in Torah to "always keep your sword at your side", wouldn't this be equivalent?

I do not believe that would justify violating Shabbat. The only justification which over-rides Shabbat observation, according to the sages and rabbis, is to save a life. If saving a life requires taking a life, then that is OK on Shabbat. The issue I am considering is if it is OK to 'CARRY' {A violation of one of the 39 Melachas of Shabbat} on Shabbat, not any other day.

All prohibitions on Shabbat and Yom Tov are based on the 39 categories of labor which was required to build the Mishkan {Tabernacle} in the desert. This is derived from the fact that the Commandment of Shabbat is mentioned right after the command to build the tabernacle.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Activities_prohibited_on_Shabbat

Meaning of "work"

Though melakhah is usually translated as "work" in English, the term does not correspond to the English definition of the term. But the Rabbis in ancient times still had to consider what, in practical terms, the term meant and what exactly was it that was prohibited to be done on the Sabbath.

The Rabbis noted Genesis 2:1-3:

    Heaven and earth, and all their components, were completed. With the seventh day, G-d finished all the work (melakhah) that He had done. He ceased on the seventh day from all the work (melakhah) that he had been doing. G-d blessed the seventh day, and he declared it to be holy, for it was on this day that G-d ceased from all the work (melakhah) that he had been creating to function.

Specifically, the Rabbis noted that the same term melakhah ("work") was used in both places, and that what G-d was "ceasing from" was "creating".

The Rabbis noted further the symmetry between Genesis 2:1-3 and Exodus 31. The first part of Exodus ch 31(Exodus 31:1-11) provides detailed instructions for the construction of the Tabernacle. Then immediately following these instructions, G-d reminds Moses about the importance of the Jewish Sabbath, quoted above. The Rabbis note that in the provisions relating to the Tabernacle the word melakhah is also used. The word is usually translated as "workmanship", which has a strong element of "creation" or "creativity".

From these common words (in the Hebrew original) and the juxtaposition of subject matter the rabbis of the Mishna derive a meaning as to which activities are prohibited to be done on the Sabbath day.

Genesis 2 is not pushed aside by the commandments to construct the Tabernacle. The classical rabbinical definition of what constitutes "work" or "activity" that must not be done, on pain of death (when there was a Sanhedrin), is depicted by the 39 categories of activity needed for the construction and use of the Tabernacle.
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Transferring between domains

Hebrew: מוציא מרשות לרשות

Chapters 1 and 11 of Talmud tractate Shabbat deals with the melachah of transferring from one domain to another, commonly called "carrying". The tractate distinguishes four domains: private, public, semi-public and an exempt area. It holds that the transfer of an article from a private to a public domain is Biblically forbidden; transferring an article between a semi-public to a private or public domain is Rabbinically prohibited; transferring of an article between an exempt area and any other domain is permissible; carrying an article four amos (about 1.7 m) may be forbidden in a public or semi-public domain and permitted in a private domain or exempt area; and carrying inside a private domain or between private domains may be permissible (see Eruv). For these purposes "transferring" means "removing and depositing", so that carrying an article out of a domain and returning to the same domain with it does not constitute transferring. This may fall into the category of "wearing".

The definition of public and private domain is related to its relative amount of enclosures, not on strict ownership.

According to traditional Jewish commentators,[5] this category of melachah (work) is mentioned in Exodus 16:29:

    "Let no man leave (go out) his place on the seventh day"

Likewise according to the Talmud,[6] the account of the man who was executed for gathering wood in Numbers 15:32 was because he violated this prohibition.

Also, Jeremiah explicitly mentions this prohibition.Jeremiah 17:21-22

See further: Chayei Adam Shabbos 47-56. See also: Eruv for carrying.

As you see, we derive what is prohibited from these 39 categories of work...

muman613
« Last Edit: August 07, 2008, 02:07:39 PM by muman613 »
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline White Israelite

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Re: People threatening my life on youtube
« Reply #28 on: August 07, 2008, 02:08:50 PM »
muman you bring up an interesting debate, Jews are most vulnerable on Sabbath because Neo Nazis know that they will not be using transport and this makes Jews a potential target. I know a few Jews who carry on sabbath but as you mentioned, if they are violating sabbath or not? What if firearms were kept at shul? Would this be allowed?

Offline muman613

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Re: People threatening my life on youtube
« Reply #29 on: August 07, 2008, 02:14:28 PM »
muman you bring up an interesting debate, Jews are most vulnerable on Sabbath because Neo Nazis know that they will not be using transport and this makes Jews a potential target. I know a few Jews who carry on sabbath but as you mentioned, if they are violating sabbath or not? What if firearms were kept at shul? Would this be allowed?

I am not a rabbi and my understanding is only through five years of studying with an Orthodox Rabbi. I would ask a competent rabbi about this one. I believe that protecting yourself is THE MOST IMPORTANT mitzvah of all, which is why Saving a Life {Pikuei Nefesh} over-rides all prohibitions on Shabbat. This is how, I believe, the IDF can defend Israel against our enemies even on Shabbat.

Thank you,
muman613

PS: Check out http://www.aish.com/literacy/concepts/Preservation_of_Life.asp
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With the exception of the three cardinal sins, one must violate any religious law to save a life, as the Torah states, "Keep My decrees and laws, since a person can [truly] live only by keeping them" (Leviticus 18:5) -- live by keeping them and not die by keeping them.

Although keeping the Sabbath is considered a foundation of our religion, it may be violated in any manner necessary to save a life. In such a case, it is a meritorious deed to violate the Sabbath, and one who hesitates is guilty of bloodshed.

Where the Sabbath is violated in a case of danger, it must be done by responsible adults, and not by children or non-Jews, even where possible. However, if it is possible to avoid violating the Sabbath without causing any delay, it is permissible to do so.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2008, 02:18:39 PM by muman613 »
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Jericho Missile

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Re: People threatening my life on youtube
« Reply #30 on: August 07, 2008, 04:43:19 PM »
Look, as long as your face is on video, I would carry, whether it was Shabbat or not.   99.99999999% nothing will happen, but just to play it safe.  Don't tell anyobody what town you live in either.  Don't make it that easy.

Offline White Israelite

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Re: People threatening my life on youtube
« Reply #31 on: August 07, 2008, 04:53:51 PM »
Look, as long as your face is on video, I would carry, whether it was Shabbat or not.   99.99999999% nothing will happen, but just to play it safe.  Don't tell anyobody what town you live in either.  Don't make it that easy.

My address is unlisted, people only know I live on the panhandle of Florida. Also I live in fairly rural area so it's pretty difficult to find me.

Offline muman613

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Re: People threatening my life on youtube
« Reply #32 on: August 07, 2008, 05:19:49 PM »
Look, as long as your face is on video, I would carry, whether it was Shabbat or not.   99.99999999% nothing will happen, but just to play it safe.  Don't tell anyobody what town you live in either.  Don't make it that easy.

Again, I dont know your situation so it would be wise to take whatever precautions you think necessary. I dont worry about myself even though my picture is out there. Way back in 1994 I was threatened and called a racist. I was actually threatened by a gun owner who thought I was pro gun control {which I was not}. I was called a racist because I didnt like gangster rap.

I live my life in the open and dont hide my feelings. I have been protected wherever I go and have never needed to use a gun. I have friends in the local SWAT team {actually a member of my minyan}. I thank Hashem each day for protecting me from the ways of the wicked and those who want to destroy me. I know there are people who would love to see me gone. But I dont fear them and in each confrontation I have ALWAYS been victorious. I believe it is because of my renewed zealous faith.

muman613
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14