Faggot club attacked in Israel

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

The truth in matters sexual is often obscured.

The reality is that all youngsters of both sexes normally go through a brief homosexual phase during or prior to puberty. The point is that you have to prevent queers from influencing them at that stage.

I did not experience this but I guess I won't doubt that the phenomenon exists.  It is certainly not ALL youngsters, but maybe a good chunk (maybe majority maybe not). 

And while I did not experience any homosexuality or experimentation in my youth, I was in public school around girls, so I do wonder whether it is more common when sexes are separated and there are no girls to interact with and look at.   That's just a guess but I think it may cause more confusion as youngsters develop in puberty if they are separated from the opposite sex.

 I remember when I became attracted to girls in grade school, and part of that was the fact that I saw them in class and there's a certain mystique about them since you are accustomed to being friends with guys and that's a normal every day thing, but with the 'pretty girl' it was different...

I do agree that whatever extent to which this phenomenon occurs, it is important to keep the queer-promotion influences out of the picture at that point and let the guy grow into himself naturally without being pressured or "encouraged" to be gay by outside forces.

[muman613]

The truth in matters sexual is often obscured.

The reality is that all youngsters of both sexes normally go through a brief homosexual phase during or prior to puberty. The point is that you have to prevent queers from influencing them at that stage.

I did not experience this but I guess I won't doubt that the phenomenon exists.  It is certainly not ALL youngsters, but maybe a good chunk (maybe majority maybe not). 

And while I did not experience any homosexuality or experimentation in my youth, I was in public school around girls, so I do wonder whether it is more common when sexes are separated and there are no girls to interact with and look at.   That's just a guess but I think it may cause more confusion as youngsters develop in puberty if they are separated from the opposite sex.

 I remember when I became attracted to girls in grade school, and part of that was the fact that I saw them in class and there's a certain mystique about them since you are accustomed to being friends with guys and that's a normal every day thing, but with the 'pretty girl' it was different...

I do agree that whatever extent to which this phenomenon occurs, it is important to keep the queer-promotion influences out of the picture at that point and let the guy grow into himself naturally without being pressured or "encouraged" to be gay by outside forces.

I disagree with you... I went to school both in public school co-ed and to a boys private middle school. I find that there is more homosexuality in co-education classes.

I don't know if this is true today... This was 20 years ago...

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

The reality is that all youngsters of both sexes normally go through a brief homosexual phase during or prior to puberty. The point is that you have to prevent queers from influencing them at that stage.

I don't buy that. I never experienced that. I think that most people are capable of homosexuality (look at the ancient Greeks and Romans) if they are willing to allow themselves to become that depraved, but the idea that there is a homo stage that kids go through is BS. Even that self-hating, sex-obsessed nutcase Freud never thought such a thing.

[Dr. Dan]

I hate the way the news assumed some ultra orthodox jew caused this. It burns me up how they get away with this.

[Moshe92]

The truth in matters sexual is often obscured.

The reality is that all youngsters of both sexes normally go through a brief homosexual phase during or prior to puberty. The point is that you have to prevent queers from influencing them at that stage.

I did not experience this but I guess I won't doubt that the phenomenon exists.  It is certainly not ALL youngsters, but maybe a good chunk (maybe majority maybe not). 

And while I did not experience any homosexuality or experimentation in my youth, I was in public school around girls, so I do wonder whether it is more common when sexes are separated and there are no girls to interact with and look at.   That's just a guess but I think it may cause more confusion as youngsters develop in puberty if they are separated from the opposite sex.

 I remember when I became attracted to girls in grade school, and part of that was the fact that I saw them in class and there's a certain mystique about them since you are accustomed to being friends with guys and that's a normal every day thing, but with the 'pretty girl' it was different...

I do agree that whatever extent to which this phenomenon occurs, it is important to keep the queer-promotion influences out of the picture at that point and let the guy grow into himself naturally without being pressured or "encouraged" to be gay by outside forces.

I disagree with you... I went to school both in public school co-ed and to a boys private middle school. I find that there is more homosexuality in co-education classes.

I don't know if this is true today... This was 20 years ago...

I think that the amount of homosexuality at a school has most to do with the school's values. I go to a public high school in a very liberal city, and there are a lot of gay people at my school. The school encourages homosexuality. There are several school events having to do with gays. From first through eighth grade, I went to a "Conservative" Jewish school, and I don't remember there being any gays at that school. Even though it was Conservative, they at least didn't promote homosexuality the way they do at the public schools.

I also disagree with David. I started being attracted to girls in fifth grade, and I don't remember anybody I knew at that age acting in any way homosexual.

[Dr. Dan]

It was a gay counseling group that wanted to help gay teens to be proud of being gay...not gay teens to work on living a normal life and not act inappropriately with those of the same sex...

People here are right that homosexuality should not be promoted, but that also does not seem to be what that center was about.   From what I have read it was a place for people who already idenitified themselves with the gay movement to get counseling and help with their problems.   These people need help.   This wasn't a gay nightclub.   

And yes, the in-your-face gay activist point of view is abhorrent.   And that is all over the story here too.   Immediately the activists "take up arms" against Shas and the religious community and anyone else they can blame, it's like they don't even care about the guys who were killed, they just grasp for the political opportunism while it's still ripe.   These activists are making a big mistake.   And tragically it is causing people here to 'identify' with this murder due to their resentment of the gay agenda and now the gay agenda's association with this crime scene.   The murder could have been a jilted lover, a drug or mafia related incident, an angry relative, an arab, a person who is against gays...... could have been anything.   Either way, murder is wrong.    People here should not celebrate a murder.   Especially not one like this which advances the cause of the gay-agenda....

[Dr. Dan]

Believe me. If you ask a gay person if he wished he had a cure for being gay he would tear a new one for you.

There is no need to treat them with disdain. While it is who they are to be that way they're behavior is extremely inapprpriate and should be discouraged. There is no cure just like there is cure for men who are susceptible to sleep around or do other bad immoral things. One needs to be able to control their desires from certain temptations. The same are for men or women who have homosexual inclinations. With that being said I'm glad that homo club was attacked. Too bad it wasn't destroyed all together. The people in that club were proud about their inappropriate behavior.

Fyi a lot of movies in israel are pro gay or about accepting ones gay sexuality and acting on it instead of accepting their sexuality and supressing it

Dan, you hear all the time about gay people trying to change and failing, but what we are forgetting is that the vast, vast majority of gays never even try to control themselves. Most give into those desires (whether secretly or openly and proudly), and some of them actually deliberately choose to have sex with the same sex even though they are attracted to the opposite sex. The overwhelming majority of homosexuals don't resist it at all and should not be coddled.

Perhaps I can shed some light on this.  I know a handful of gay men.  Most of them are otherwise decent people and I want to get that straight.  There homosexual behavior is inappropriate just as are many other private sins normal men do such as masturbation, sleeping around, and even worse cheating on their spouses.  Sexual desire as well as the desire to not want to be lonely is only natural for men to feel...homosexual men fall under that category.  If this is the way they are, I can tell you that with most it is pretty much impossible to change them into hetero...it's like changing a hetero person into a homo...They find the man's shape to be attractive and the woman's unattractive which leads me to believe that there something going in their brain that is pathological. 

Nevertheless, every human being should avoid doing sinful things...and shouldn't go about proudly admitting to doing it like it's normal. 

[Manch]

I can not believe  that some of you would say that this criminal act was a good and decent thing!  Wake up people! I would appreciate if Chaim would comment on this so that we don't look like bunch of kooks! These were children, Jewish children that this animal was shooting at! Whether they were homo or not is immaterial! my take, if the shooter himself could have been gay or arab or crazy loon. I'd much more prefer that he would take his gun and a mask and go shoot at an arab wedding or funeral or something. Who among you are pre-destined not to have gay relatives, children, friends, colleagues, teachers? Why so much hatred toward your fellow human beings? If you think that they deserve punishment for being gay, then judge them, don't murder them! Chaim, please speak up!

[Dr. Dan]

I can not believe  that some of you would say that this criminal act was a good and decent thing!  Wake up people! I would appreciate if Chaim would comment on this so that we don't look like bunch of kooks! These were children, Jewish children that this animal was shooting at! Whether they were homo or not is immaterial! my take, if the shooter himself could have been gay or arab or crazy loon. I'd much more prefer that he would take his gun and a mask and go shoot at an arab wedding or funeral or something. Who among you are pre-destined not to have gay relatives, children, friends, colleagues, teachers? Why so much hatred toward your fellow human beings? If you think that they deserve punishment for being gay, then judge them, don't murder them! Chaim, please speak up!

I would agree to the point that I would never tell anyone to target innocent people who are gay to shoot them down...but as an incident that took place against those that promote homosexuality in the open, I couldn't careless just as if it were a muslim funeral or wedding. Maybe I'm wrong...it's my internet position...

[Manch]

I can not believe  that some of you would say that this criminal act was a good and decent thing!  Wake up people! I would appreciate if Chaim would comment on this so that we don't look like bunch of kooks! These were children, Jewish children that this animal was shooting at! Whether they were homo or not is immaterial! my take, if the shooter himself could have been gay or arab or crazy loon. I'd much more prefer that he would take his gun and a mask and go shoot at an arab wedding or funeral or something. Who among you are pre-destined not to have gay relatives, children, friends, colleagues, teachers? Why so much hatred toward your fellow human beings? If you think that they deserve punishment for being gay, then judge them, don't murder them! Chaim, please speak up!

I would agree to the point that I would never tell anyone to target innocent people who are gay to shoot them down...but as an incident that took place against those that promote homosexuality in the open, I couldn't careless just as if it were a muslim funeral or wedding. Maybe I'm wrong...it's my internet position...

Dear Doc, if it was muslimes who were targeted, I wouldn't remain impartial! I'd love it - they are the scum of the Earth!

[Dr. Dan]

I can not believe  that some of you would say that this criminal act was a good and decent thing!  Wake up people! I would appreciate if Chaim would comment on this so that we don't look like bunch of kooks! These were children, Jewish children that this animal was shooting at! Whether they were homo or not is immaterial! my take, if the shooter himself could have been gay or arab or crazy loon. I'd much more prefer that he would take his gun and a mask and go shoot at an arab wedding or funeral or something. Who among you are pre-destined not to have gay relatives, children, friends, colleagues, teachers? Why so much hatred toward your fellow human beings? If you think that they deserve punishment for being gay, then judge them, don't murder them! Chaim, please speak up!

I would agree to the point that I would never tell anyone to target innocent people who are gay to shoot them down...but as an incident that took place against those that promote homosexuality in the open, I couldn't careless just as if it were a muslim funeral or wedding. Maybe I'm wrong...it's my internet position...

Dear Doc, if it was muslimes who were targeted, I wouldn't remain impartial! I'd love it - they are the scum of the Earth!

and homosexuals who march proudly on a holy country encouraging more to be like them are scum as well.

[Manch]

and homosexuals who march proudly on a holy country encouraging more to be like them are scum as well.

I would call them sick, perverted people. Some of them are scum, no doubt about it. This is not an argument to kill them, right?

[Dr. Dan]

and homosexuals who march proudly on a holy country encouraging more to be like them are scum as well.

I would call them sick, perverted people. Some of them are scum, no doubt about it. This is not an argument to kill them, right?

I would call them sick perverted people..I wouldn't call out to target them...nor would i encourage it if someone I knew was plotting to do it.  However once something happens that it had already been done, I'm not saddened about it....Just like when gangbangers kill each other..or when muslims kill each other..I'm not saddened by it.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

I can not believe  that some of you would say that this criminal act was a good and decent thing!  Wake up people! I would appreciate if Chaim would comment on this so that we don't look like bunch of kooks! These were children, Jewish children that this animal was shooting at! Whether they were homo or not is immaterial! my take, if the shooter himself could have been gay or arab or crazy loon. I'd much more prefer that he would take his gun and a mask and go shoot at an arab wedding or funeral or something. Who among you are pre-destined not to have gay relatives, children, friends, colleagues, teachers? Why so much hatred toward your fellow human beings? If you think that they deserve punishment for being gay, then judge them, don't murder them! Chaim, please speak up!

I strongly agree with you.  Murder is murder.  These two people were murdered. 

I do resent the response to the attack by the media, the gay-activists, and the knesset members, who in their political opportunism used this tragedy to promote hatred against religious Jews and to promote the furtherance of the gay agenda in society.  It is inappropriate and I think it cheapens the whole thing, as they don't seem to concerned about the victims but instead ready to jump out and throw accusations around.

[Manch]

I would call them sick perverted people..I wouldn't call out to target them...nor would i encourage it if someone I knew was plotting to do it.  However once something happens that it had already been done, I'm not saddened about it....Just like when gangbangers kill each other..or when muslims kill each other..I'm not saddened by it.

Dr. Dan, I really disagree with you there.

Kahane-Was-Right BT, I am in 100% agreement with you! Here is protest/vigil in San Francisco. These feeble minds never commemorate deaths of other Jews, only when a "hate crime" is directed against their gay brethren, these scumbag "rabbis" feel energized to march!  
http://sfjcf.wordpress.com/2009/08/03/lgbt-shooting-vigil/

[Dr. Dan]

I would call them sick perverted people..I wouldn't call out to target them...nor would i encourage it if someone I knew was plotting to do it.  However once something happens that it had already been done, I'm not saddened about it....Just like when gangbangers kill each other..or when muslims kill each other..I'm not saddened by it.

Dr. Dan, I really disagree with you there.

Kahane-Was-Right BT, I am in 100% agreement with you! Here is protest/vigil in San Francisco. These feeble minds never commemorate deaths of other Jews, only when a "hate crime" is directed against their gay brethren, these scumbag "rabbis" feel energized to march!  
http://sfjcf.wordpress.com/2009/08/03/lgbt-shooting-vigil/

I think for this subject we should hear what the Jewish perspective is according to Chaim...why don't we find that out..maybe a good ask JTF question..

I'm not going to discount your opinion...but i would like to know what the proper feeling should be.

[GoIsraelGo!]

Ok it's my turn.

Madmarv, faggots are not born that way. I am so sick of hearing this excuse!
Now if a person is born with 2 sex organs then and only then would I accept their gender identity crisis. HOMOSEXUALITY is a PERVERSION that feeds upon itself just like jealousy for example, or a drug addiction. Fags choose to be fags because they are excited about it and don't give a hoot about what is right or wrong. All they care about is their sexual gratification and nothing else.

Now about Israels acceptance of fagness....who gave the self hating Nazi Jews the right to make G-d's land filthy?
Who the hell are these so called Jews that took Israel away from her people and gave it to muslims, fags and G-d knows who else?

I am glad there was an attack on that fag club. There should be an all out civil war in Israel to dispose of the Nazi Jewish Leaders and those who wish to make Israel dirty. I wish death upon those who think they can shove their sins into the faces of those who truly love G-d.
Trying to make people accept sodomy and fagness is NAZISM!

[Dr. Dan]

It remains to be see if some were born gay or developed gayness over time...I'm sure there is a combination of two things.

Ok it's my turn.

Madmarv, faggots are not born that way. I am so sick of hearing this excuse!
Now if a person is born with 2 sex organs then and only then would I accept their gender identity crisis. HOMOSEXUALITY is a PERVERSION that feeds upon itself just like jealousy for example, or a drug addiction. Fags choose to be fags because they are excited about it and don't give a hoot about what is right or wrong. All they care about is their sexual gratification and nothing else.

Now about Israels acceptance of fagness....who gave the self hating Nazi Jews the right to make G-d's land filthy?
Who the hell are these so called Jews that took Israel away from her people and gave it to muslims, fags and G-d knows who else?

I am glad there was an attack on that fag club. There should be an all out civil war in Israel to dispose of the Nazi Jewish Leaders and those who wish to make Israel dirty. I wish death upon those who think they can shove their sins into the faces of those who truly love G-d.
Trying to make people accept sodomy and fagness is NAZISM!

[Madmarv]

Ok it's my turn.

Madmarv, faggots are not born that way. I am so sick of hearing this excuse!
Now if a person is born with 2 sex organs then and only then would I accept their gender identity crisis. HOMOSEXUALITY is a PERVERSION that feeds upon itself just like jealousy for example, or a drug addiction. Fags choose to be fags because they are excited about it and don't give a hoot about what is right or wrong. All they care about is their sexual gratification and nothing else.

Now about Israels acceptance of fagness....who gave the self hating Nazi Jews the right to make G-d's land filthy?
Who the hell are these so called Jews that took Israel away from her people and gave it to muslims, fags and G-d knows who else?

I am glad there was an attack on that fag club. There should be an all out civil war in Israel to dispose of the Nazi Jewish Leaders and those who wish to make Israel dirty. I wish death upon those who think they can shove their sins into the faces of those who truly love G-d.
Trying to make people accept sodomy and fagness is NAZISM!

First, I hate how you relate everything opposes to jews or israel as NAZISM, its not. Sometimes its personal opinion nothing less, nothing more.

Second, you don't know for sure if people born like this or not, most probebly its both, and even if they don't get born with this, you have no right of accusing them of anything, except I would agree with you not to normalize this into the mainstream of any society, because its indeed something abnormal and should not be accepted "normally", however, that doesn't mean we should hate them or treat them like animals or UFOs, you have (neither anybody else) no idea how they become like this, you have no idea how to prevent it or make it go, then, you have no right of condemning them at all. Saying they choose to be like that is SO untrue, the so called "proud-gays" are probebly gays that was sick and tired of trying to be normal heterosexuals like others but they apparently failed. Your judgment is unfair, your claims are unfair, we DO know and acknowledge this abnormality, but you've got a wrong idea of how to handle it. Don't accept it, don't embrace it, however, understand it.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

Ok it's my turn.

Madmarv, faggots are not born that way. I am so sick of hearing this excuse! 

 
Doesn't justify murdering them, even if that is true.   

As to whether that is the case, I am not convinced that 100% of cases are either way.... I think, and this is only conjecture, that some ARE born with a certain inclination (not necessarily always "born gay" either, but with inclinations), while others are not and develop it due to environment.   It seems to me most likely that it is a mix, a spectrum, it's not black and white like the gay activists would have it, nor like their fundamentalist enemies would have it.

But either way, it doesn't justify murdering people.  Who gave license to do that?

Fags choose to be fags because they are excited about it and don't give a hoot about what is right or wrong. All they care about is their sexual gratification and nothing else. 

But this is not true for all of them.   There are people who are brought up religious, who develop feelings or identity issues and begin to think they are gay, or they are actually attracted to the same sex, and it bothers them because they know it's wrong.   They get counseling, try to hide it, etc.... Many of them try many things, some things work some things don't.   Some people can be helped and some can't.  There is an organization JONAH that specializes in trying to help these people get past their inclinations toward being gay.

Now about Israels acceptance of fagness....who gave the self hating Nazi Jews the right to make G-d's land filthy?
Who the hell are these so called Jews that took Israel away from her people and gave it to muslims, fags and G-d knows who else? 

Well no one agrees with that or likes that Israel's govt has empowered muslim nazi terrorists or that some elements in the govt try to create a culture that promotes hedonism and "gay culture" in society.   But their creating a favorable environment for expressions of homosexuality in certain parts of the country has nothing to do with the issue at hand.   It doesn't mean someone can go and blindly kill gay people.

I am glad there was an attack on that fag club. There should be an all out civil war in Israel to dispose of the Nazi Jewish Leaders and those who wish to make Israel dirty. I wish death upon those who think they can shove their sins into the faces of those who truly love G-d.
Trying to make people accept sodomy and fagness is NAZISM!

Jews (those who follow G-d's commandments) operate according to halacha, not according to whim.  Just because someone is evil or you don't like them, or they've done something bad, does not mean you can murder them.   There are only certain instances when one can kill another person - in self-defense, and that includes being at war with a group of people.   There is NOT a civil war among Jews right now, nor should there be.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

I don't think that they should be murdered, but they certainly should be locked up as a mental health danger to themselves/others. It is an abomination that the Chosen Nation tolerates this bizarre perversion. Maybe some of them are naturally more tempted to this, just like every human being by birth and nature is tempted by some sins more than others, but still, every single human being has free will and can choose to resist or indulge. The vast majority of homosexuals do not make any effort to fight their feelings.

[GoIsraelGo!]

I do understand it Marv. I understand that G-d forbids homosexuality and there is a reason for that.

If G-d wanted men to be together they would be able to produce children together.

Who has the right to demand I accept anything other than the truth?


I refuse to accept their lifestyle and I still stand by the fact it's a SIN and a PERVERSION!

there are extremely rare cases where a baby is born with 2 sex organs, then and only then I could understand a gender identity crisis or a desire to be with the same sex due to the birth defect.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

I refuse to accept their lifestyle and I still stand by the fact it's a SIN and a PERVERSION!

I don't think anyone here argued against that.   I sure didn't.

But we can't go around shooting up car thiefs, wife beaters, etc either....   Even if at times people might feel that they deserve it.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

The other thing to remember is that faggots are generally Jew-hating anti-Semites, including the Jewish ones. Every single queer in Israel marches for the Philistines.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

The other thing to remember is that faggots are generally Jew-hating anti-Semites, including the Jewish ones. Every single queer in Israel marches for the Philistines.

Not true.

There is a very rightwing patriotic Jew who posts on Arutz Sheva blogs (or at least he used to quite frequently), who was completely against the arabs and all land-for-peace deals, but he was not religious and considered himself a homosexual.   He also had his own blog.
It's only one example but it just goes to show that you can't make these kind of assumptions.    The 'activist' type gays are certainly more prone to anti-Israel and pro-Arab sentiment.   Rank-and-file gays who don't push their agenda and don't "march" everywhere: not necessarily.  The guy that used to post there also readily admitted that about gay-activists...