Moshe Feiglin Speaks about Glenn Beck

[HiWarp]

Mormonism is not a good religion AT ALL in my opinion. Its only merit is that it's relatively peaceful to outsiders (they ring people's doorbells, but don't blow themselves up with suicide vests when people answer the door or anything horrible like that) but I have never heard him personally advocate for a two state solution. Your quotation from him would show that he is against it, and really that's enough right now as far as helping Israel. If there is no two state solution, the ownership of Jerusalem will be the Jews by default, not the Mormon church. If he starts doing so then of course we should stand against him.

My impression of Glenn Beck as an individual is generally a good one even if I think his religion is kooky at best.

My impression of Glenn Beck is also generally good, but, I have to question anyone who is duped into converting to Mormonism. Your description of it as being a "kooky religion" is an understatement.

[Shlomo]

While I disagree with his religious beliefs, I think Glen Beck's motives are good.

I don't think he has any false agenda. He definitely supports and loves Israel.

Too many people are overly concerned with the supporters of Israel and their "intentions" rather than the enemies of Israel trying to kill the Jews.

Glen beck was one of the only voices on television and radio brave enough to confront many of the same issues we do.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

This is craziness!

Israel, and especially Jerusalem, holds historical and religious importance to many groups of people.  Not just the Jews.  It is just a fact.  That is why we stand with you.  Not against you.  
Yet...many of you sit here and rip us apart.  

What has Glen Beck done to earn your distrust?  He is a Mormon?  So what.  How is that a threat to you?  
You must have confidence in your own faith.  Otherwise, everyone is a perceived threat and that makes you weak.

It has nothing to do with the fact that he's mormon. I couldn't care less what kind of religion he follows.  The main thing is that he thinks jerusalem is not the capital city of the jewish people, that its supposed to be some kind of shared city of western heritage or some such, and as we find out in this thread there are apparently even some people at jtf who think that just because other groups came in and wiped out and expelled jews and then had a "history" there of their own or otherwise have a shared cultural heritage with that city, that therefore jews cannot be allowed to have ownership over it and say what goes.    That is a travesty IMO.

[Lisa]

Wait, who here is saying Jews cannot have ownership of Jerusalem?  What was it that Beck said that led you to believe he doesn't think Jerusalem belongs to the Jews? 

[JTFenthusiast2]

This is craziness!

Israel, and especially Jerusalem, holds historical and religious importance to many groups of people.  Not just the Jews.  It is just a fact.  That is why we stand with you.  Not against you.  
Yet...many of you sit here and rip us apart.  

What has Glen Beck done to earn your distrust?  He is a Mormon?  So what.  How is that a threat to you?  
You must have confidence in your own faith.  Otherwise, everyone is a perceived threat and that makes you weak.

This man has done nothing but support the state of Israel, even though he continues to be villified for strongly and vigorously defending Jews and the Jewish state.  How about some gratitude for this courageous atypical media personality

[muman613]

This man has done nothing but support the state of Israel, even though he continues to be villified for strongly and vigorously defending Jews and the Jewish state.  How about some gratitude for this courageous atypical media personality

I, for one, have always been gracious for what any gentile does when he/she supports the Jewish people in our fight for our homeland. There is the important concept of Hakaret HaTov {Appreciating the Good} ( http://www.tfdixie.com/parshat/vaera/004.htm ) in all things. But I also am cautious because there is a greater purpose for a Jew to settle the land of Israel. Israel is also the center of the Jewish faith, and we cannot accept any other faith because Hashem has told us to worship him and him alone. We will never worship a messiah which we know is not the Jewish redeemer. And we will never forget that there will be a punishment for those who have injured the Jewish people and have not repented for it.

A religious Jew must think twice before allowing representatives of alternative 'gods' to assist us in the Holy task of occupying our land. I am sorry if this sounds anti-egalitarian but I believe it is what Hashem wants from us.

[Dr. Dan]

I, for one, have always been gracious for what any gentile does when he/she supports the Jewish people in our fight for our homeland. There is the important concept of Hakaret HaTov {Appreciating the Good} ( http://www.tfdixie.com/parshat/vaera/004.htm ) in all things. But I also am cautious because there is a greater purpose for a Jew to settle the land of Israel. Israel is also the center of the Jewish faith, and we cannot accept any other faith because Hashem has told us to worship him and him alone. We will never worship a messiah which we know is not the Jewish redeemer. And we will never forget that there will be a punishment for those who have injured the Jewish people and have not repented for it.

A religious Jew must think twice before allowing representatives of alternative 'gods' to assist us in the Holy task of occupying our land. I am sorry if this sounds anti-egalitarian but I believe it is what Hashem wants from us.

What I don't understand is how you seem to feel sorry for starving Somalians who are enemies to Israel, but do not greet with open arms people like Glen Beck who are outspoken, relatively speaking, in supporting Israel and conservative values.

I'm not suggesting asking for an alliance from another nation or a group of people....I'm simply saying accepting help from gentiles like Glen Beck. 

[Shlomo]

A religious Jew must think twice before allowing representatives of alternative 'gods' to assist us in the Holy task of occupying our land

Muman, please stop bashing the Christians. I'm getting really tired of it.

And please spare the 8 paragraph response proving how you should be hateful to the members of the forum. You make our Christian members feel so alienated. And they wind up thinking you sound arrogant and hateful.

No one has any question on where you stand at this point so it's not something you need to rehash over and over again.

Here at JTF, we support our Christian members who assist us in the Holy task... not push them away, embarrass them, and treat them like garbage (reminding me of another forum).

[muman613]

Muman, please stop bashing the Christians. I'm getting really tired of it.

And please spare the 8 paragraph response proving how you should be hateful to the members of the forum. You make our Christian members feel so alienated. And they wind up thinking you sound arrogant and hateful.

No one has any question on where you stand at this point so it's not something you need to rehash over and over again.

Here at JTF, we support our Christian members who assist us in the Holy task... not push them away, embarrass them, and treat them like garbage (reminding me of another forum).

I am not bashing anyone. Is it not important to be honest about things before we get involved in a relationship?

I am agreeing with KWRBT who thinks that there is an ulterior motive for Beck. I have said that I am still open and willing to hear whether there is an ulterior motive. Can you just imagine after all the help from CUFI and Beck and now Hagee that at some point they will say.... "Look we helped you turn things around, now you can be secure in the land due to our help.... But we want a little part of Jerusalem, and this holy site, and that site, etc." I sometimes fear that that will be what it comes to.

JTF is, in my opinion, a religious Zionist organization. Should we not ask questions and ensure that our allies are really on the same page as we are?

[muman613]

What I don't understand is how you seem to feel sorry for starving Somalians who are enemies to Israel, but do not greet with open arms people like Glen Beck who are outspoken, relatively speaking, in supporting Israel and conservative values.

I'm not suggesting asking for an alliance from another nation or a group of people....I'm simply saying accepting help from gentiles like Glen Beck. 

It seems you have missed my entire message...

I am not against Glenn Beck. Read my posts ever since the first post I have said I appreciate Beck, I am moved by Beck, he is a Charismatic speaker who is genuinely interested in making a difference. I am not Anti-Beck and never have been.

And I am not 'sorry' for starving Somalians. I simply stated that they should be self-sufficient so that others do not have to take care of them. Teaching others is not a hard thing to do. I am not for cruelty to the kind, and as I stated in that thread it is a Jewish way to daven for the peace of all the righteous, even those caught up in an unrighteous society.

There is no contradiction in my approach. On the issue of Beck I am open to listen to others opinions. But I also stand firm with what KWRBT is saying and Feiglin is concerned with which is the Jewish nature of Jerusalem. I am against dividing Jerusalem 100% with any non-Jewish entity.

If I have not been clear about this then please ask me another question.

[Dr. Dan]

I am not bashing anyone. Is it not important to be honest about things before we get involved in a relationship?

I am agreeing with KWRBT who thinks that there is an ulterior motive for Beck. I have said that I am still open and willing to hear whether there is an ulterior motive. Can you just imagine after all the help from CUFI and Beck and now Hagee that at some point they will say.... "Look we helped you turn things around, now you can be secure in the land due to our help.... But we want a little part of Jerusalem, and this holy site, and that site, etc." I sometimes fear that that will be what it comes to.

JTF is, in my opinion, a religious Zionist organization. Should we not ask questions and ensure that our allies are really on the same page as we are?

Ask questions, but if we are going to be an uncompromising group of people, then if it were ever to happen if a gentile turned around and said, "We want something in return now that we have helped you." Our answer should be, "Gd will bless you and your children, thank you for your help.  You cannot own any holy sites, but you are welcome to worship and make sacrifices in the righteous gentile section of the holy temple."

That's the thing.  I get it. Some gentiles will help and then potentially turn around and say, "Well, we helped you, what do we get in return from you?"  

I don't care if someone else as ulterior motives.  Let them have ulterior motives.  That does not stop us from being Gd's chosen people. It does not stop us from being Jews. It does not stop us from doing the right things in life.  

I'll put it to you this way, if they want a signed contract to own a part of Jerusalem for their help, we shouldn't sign anything because it is against the Torah to make alliances and treaties.  There should be no promises...just thanks and friendship and a blessing.

[muman613]

Ask questions, but if we are going to be an uncompromising group of people, then if it were ever to happen if a gentile turned around and said, "We want something in return now that we have helped you." Our answer should be, "Gd will bless you and your children, thank you for your help.  You cannot own any holy sites, but you are welcome to worship and make sacrifices in the righteous gentile section of the holy temple."

That's the thing.  I get it. Some gentiles will help and then potentially turn around and say, "Well, we helped you, what do we get in return from you?" 

I don't care if someone else as ulterior motives.  Let them have ulterior motives.  That does not stop us from being Gd's chosen people. It does not stop us from being Jews. It does not stop us from doing the right things in life. 

I'll put it to you this way, if they want a signed contract to own a part of Jerusalem for their help, we shouldn't sign anything because it is against the Torah to make alliances and treaties.  There should be no promises...just thanks and friendship and a blessing.

Amen...

I agree with you...

[Dr. Dan]

Amen...

I agree with you...

So again, where is Glen Beck asking for a contract?  We should reward a Kolekavod when anyone especially the Glen Becks out there say something correct; not turn away and say, "oo, you MIGHT have ulterior motives."

I think KWRBT is wrong on the Glen Beck aspect.  I know that it is just an opinion, but it's incorrect to have this opinion about him.

[Yaakov Mendel]

I do not see any clear evidence that supports Feiglin's interpretation of Beck's words. Feiglin makes assumptions about Beck's motives and obviously has a negative bias toward him. How can he claim that he is able to see Beck's hidden motives ? So far, Beck has done nothing that should cause Jews to be suspicious. He has done anything but good for Israel's perception in America, at a time when we don't have many friends. So, as other JTFers have pointed out before me, I think it is very awkward of Feiglin to give Beck such a cold and hostile greeting.