Response to crazy maniac and cult leader Chaim Ben Pesach:
בס''ד
"Benyamin Solomon" has given our members another live example of the hopelessly twisted thinking of cowardly, self-hating Jews:
So the Arab Muslim Nazis who live in the land of Israel and who have supported a holocaust against the Jewish people for more than 100 years are "innocent people". The Arab Nazi political parties who openly call for Israel's destruction consistently win 95% or more of the Arab vote in the Knesset elections. These Arab "civilians" who are voting for parties that praise the terrorist mass murderers of Fatah, Hamas and Hezballah are "innocent people".
No, the Arab Nazis aren't innocent people. But the Arabs, who aren't terrorists, are innocent people
What utter ignorance of the Torah. When a war for survival is being waged, olive trees are more important than Jewish lives? Olive trees are more important than pikuach nefesh (saving lives)? If these olive trees provide income for Arab Nazis to be able to live in Israel and to be able to produce huge families, then they are a danger to Jewish lives.
But there is no pikuach nefesh involved when it comes to destroying olive trees. Which lives did it save?
Pathetic. The only non-Jewish residents that we must respect in the land according to the Torah are those who accept Jewish sovereignty and Jewish law, in other words, bnei Noach. The Torah commands us to expel the others. Moses, Joshua and King David would never have tolerated Arab Muslim Nazis living in the land of Israel.
Yea, the Torah did say that the non-Jews [in Israel] were to live according to the Noahide laws [the non-Jews out of Israel were to lie according to the Noahide laws as well] and respect Jewish sovereignty. That's true. But do you have any proof that Moses, Joshua, and King David would have expelled all the Arab residents [don't mean just the terrorists]? In any case, modern Israel as of today is not the same as biblical Israel [but that's not to write off Moses, Joshua, and King David; for they were all inspirational heroic G-d fearing leaders]. These are different times. Back in the times of the Tanakh, idolatry threatened the spirituality of the people of Israel. The character of the modern state is quite different from biblical Israel.
So even though the Arab Muslim Nazis are genocidal, it is forbidden to vandalize their property. When wimpy Jews become self-haters, there is no limit to their insanity.
No. It's forbidden to damage property of innocent people. I wasn't talking about Arab terrorists. I know that you think they're all the same. Yes, I understand that the Islamo-Fascist Nazi-like terrorists [like Hamas] are in control of the "Palestinian" society. And I think that Israel has not only the right, but also the duty, to defend herself against the Arab Muslim terrorist barbarians. But that doesn't mean that every single Arab or Muslim is a terrorist.
So Jews are not allowed to throw rocks at Arab "civilians" even though Arabs throw rocks at Jews day and night. Jews are not allowed to retaliate. Because right now, Tag Mechir are the only Jews who are retaliating and the only Jews who deal with the Arabs in a language they understand.
Two wrongs don't make a right. Just because Arab terrorists are genocidal to the core doesn't mean that Tag Machir has a right to retaliate against innocent people. Many times, Tag Machir retaliates not so much against Arab terrorism; but in retaliation to Israeli Government policies that they don't like. And many times they attack those who have nothing to do with the Israeli Government's decision.
"Greater Israel cult" means keeping Judea, Samaria, Gaza, Jerusalem and the Golan Heights which would make Israel about the size of New Jersey. Saying that Israel should be the size of New Jersey makes you part of a crazy "cult", according to this Judenrat kapo. Within these "Greater Israel" borders, the 66 nations of the Muslim world are still 2,000 times the size of tiny Israel. But even this is just too much land for the Jews, according to this endlessly appeasing worm.
One other point. The "Greater Israel cult" is Torah Judaism. The Torah actually commands us to liberate from the Nile to the Euphrates. Every time Jews commit the unforgivable crime of surrendering Jewish land or expelling Jews, it always leads to G-d's punishment.
Again, the modern state of Israel is not biblical Israel. In fact, some Orthodox Jews are against Israel existing prior to the Moshiach coming [I strongly and vehemently disagree with that viewpoint; just so everyone knows].The point is that Israel can not return to being "biblical Israel" prior to the Moshiach coming because, for one thing, that would mean rebuilding the Beit Hamikdash, which is a result of the Moshiach coming. As of now, there is no practical way for Israel to get all the territory "from the Nile to the Euphrates." And no one in Israel is even thinking about that. As of now, there is no contradiction between the Torah and the two-state solution, as long as the two-state solution brings peace. I'm not endorsing the two-state solution. As seen from the history, I'm pessimistic about the two-state solution bringing peace because the "Palestinians" use any territory they receive as a terrorist base, thusly resulting in terrorism on Israel increasing. But if a two-state solution does bring an end to the conflict, then that would mean that it would be permitted at least because of Pikuach Nefesh because it means an end to people dying.
Here again, Israel doesn't have the "morale or the resources" to be the size of New Jersey. Leftist traitors may refuse to serve in the IDF - big deal, these "soldiers" are a fifth column anyway. The best thing that could happen would be for the leftist traitors to refuse to serve. Better yet would be if they left Israel altogether.
So the IDF is a "fifth column" and only Chaim Ben Pesach and his little cult know what's good for Israel.
Yes, if Israel would pursue a greater Israel agenda, the ranks of the left would grow and so would the number of those who refuse to serve the IDF. They're not going to leave the country. But they will grow if Israel pursues a "greater Israel" agenda. Part of the problem is that Israelis, when defending their country, have to deal with tough moral scenarios over how to best defend Israel and respect the civilian Arab population in the territories. Yes, some of what the IDF and the Shin Bet has to do for Israel's security bothers their conscience. And it'll create more problems if Israel pursues the "Greater Israel" agenda.
True. Even the most liberal Americans never suggest that the U.S. surrender American land. You are way beyond liberal.
I'm not talking about America. I'm talking about being pragmatic vs. being stuck with your ideological vision. I used to believe in the Greater Israel agenda. I still support it ideologically; but as of now, reality can not meet with the ideological ideal.
You are the immoral one because Jews like you leave the Jewish people defenseless. You are so worried about appeasing world opinion that you allow Jews to be murdered so as not to "look bad" in the eyes of the anti-Semites. You fail to realize that one of the biggest reasons for anti-Semitism is cowardice. People detest cowards. Jewish youth often assimilate and are ashamed to be Jewish because of cowardly behavior of Jews like you. People respect courageous fighters even if they disagree with them. I personally witnessed how Rabbi Meir Kahane was respected more than all of the other Jewish leaders because he was regarded as a courageous, principled, idealistic warrior. "Practical" Jewish wimps who are unprincipled opportunists and who are willing to abandon their own land just for a moment of peace are despised. The brave fighting Israeli of the 1967 Six Day War was officially condemned but privately respected by the world. The gutless "pragmatic" Jews like you are held in contempt.
I already think that all of Jerusalem is Israel's capital. I'm opposed to Israel returning back to the pre-1967 borders. I already think that Israel should defend herself, regardless of what the world says. I don't want to appease the anti-Semites. But I don't support vandalizing property and attacking innocent people in the name of being courageous. Because that, in reality, is cowardice.
But even if the world would be against us for doing what has to be done, it wouldn't matter. As Rabbi Kahane, the greatest Jewish leader of modern times, always said:
"I would rather have a strong Israel that the whole world hates than an Auschwitz that the whole world loves."
Yes, a strong Israel. Is Israel "strong" enough to carry out the "Greater Israel" agenda? No. Most Israelis are sick and tired of conflict.
One last point. Many Israeli Jews love Tag Mechir. Below is a Hebrew video showing leftist reporters stunned to find virtually all of the passing Jews on the street in Jerusalem strongly applauding Tag Mechir. We in JTF cannot applaud them for legal reasons because we are a law-abiding organization. But we certainly do not condemn them. Many Israeli Jews, especially young Jews, adore them.
So one video showing some Israelis allegedly supporting Tag Machir says nothing. Generally speaking, most Israelis condemn tag Machir. Even most Jewish residents in Judea and Samaria condemn Tag Machir. In fact, settler leaders have come out denouncing Tag Machir:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_tag_policyhttp://www.vosizneias.com/32682/2009/06/02/israel-rabbi-harshly-condemns-violence-by-jewish-hooligans-against-arabs/“What happened yesterday is not violation of law and order – it’s much worse,”
-Rabbi Menachem Fruman, Rabbi of Tekoa [Jewish community in the "West Bank" and one of the leading religious figures among Israeli settlers]. Rabbi Fruman called the Tag Machir attackers "hooligans". So the fact is that the settler leaders are embarrassed by Tag Machir for conforming into the stereotypes that the international community has of them. Case closed.
Topic: Tag machir aka(price tag) major success (Read 67242 times)