Anti-Israel Asher Meza attacks Chabad

[GunsAndRosesFan]

בס''ד

I edited the title and removed the video shown here. Why?

I do not want to give added attention to the sick traitor Asher Meza on the search engines as if he is a "rabbi". He is not a rabbi. He is a self-hating heretic who is against Israel's very existence. His call for Jews to remain in the galut (exile) to spend their time trying to convert gentiles is completely against Torah Judaism.

Chaim Ben Pesach

[muman613]

Come on... This kind of stuff has been shown to be false.

We had a big discussion of  the Meshichist faction of Chabad but they are so small that it is just slander to claim that Chabad supports this kind of stuff.

I personally know 5 Chabad rabbis and not a single one believes that the Rebbe was Moshiach.

Posting slander of such good Jews should be a crime...

By the way this so-called Rabbi has been discredited for many of his beliefs.

No doubt Chabad as an organization does a great job keeping Jews Jewish and those who find a need to attempt to slander them without even asking a Chabad Rabbi {who is almost always available anywhere around the world} is doing a great disservice to the Jewish people.

Shame on you GunsAndRosesFan for posting such rubbish.

PS: 'Rabbi' asher has done nothing but exposed himself as a fraud.

[Zelhar]

'rabbi' Asher Meza has been himself exposed as kookoo.

[Israel Chai]

I had a young Lubavitch kid trying to convince me why his rabbi could be the messiah and also dead without having done anything very messiah-like. There are still some who believe this...

[muman613]

I had a young Lubavitch kid trying to convince me why his rabbi could be the messiah and also dead without having done anything very messiah-like. There are still some who believe this...

I do not debate whether there are some who believe this. I have discussed this in other threads but basically this idea is not promoted by the Chabad organization. I know a guy who was brought up in a Chabad house who explained the entire issue with me, and this guy is a great Jew who is the Mashgiach at the University I daven at and in my minyan. Indeed there are those who believe wrongly that the Rebbe was Moshiach.

I brought this up again, because of all those here at JTF who always bring up this Meshichist question, and asked my close Chabad Rabbi {whom I have spent the last 1 1/2 years davening with} about this issue when I was about to make a donation to his Chabad house. I clearly asked whether he and the Chabad organization believes that Rebbe Schnerson was the Moshiach. My Rabbi knew where I was coming from and explained {as I have heard from others not even in Chabad} that there is indeed a small faction of Chabad who do believe this falsehood.

Let it be clear that I would disassociate with Chabad if I learned that they were proposing that their Rebbe was Moshiach. These same accusations are leveled at Breslev Chassidus that they believe that Rabbi Nachman was Moshiach. But after looking into the question it appears that the majority of Breslov doesn't believe this. The branch of Breslev which I follow doesn't suggest that Rabbi Nachman was Moshiach, only that he was a great Tzadik who led the Jews in Ukraine at a time when faith in Judaism was challenged. So too all of Chassidic Judaism flowered in Poland and Ukraine during a time of great oppression of the Jews in those lands. The Baal Shem Tov is the grandfather of both Breslev and Lubavitch chassidus.

PS: LKZ you diminish the greatness of Rebbe Scherson by saying he didn't do anything Moshiach-like. Indeed the fact that he created the BIGGEST and MOST SUCCESSFUL Jewish organization which increased mitzvah observance around the world is indeed Moshiach like. Look at what Rambam says as to what Moshiach needs to do. One of the things our Moshiach has to do is bring Jews back to their faith. Chabad has been the most successful organization to do this. I don't believe he was Moshiach but I do believe in the Chassidic concept of 'Sparks of Moshiach' and indeed IMO Rebbe did posses some of those sparks.

http://www.sichosinenglish.org/books/highlights-of-moshiach/06.htm

In Bilaam's prophetic vision, he states,[28] "There steps forth a star from Jacob and there arises a scepter out of Israel." Targum Onkelos notes that this "star" alludes to Moshiach. The Jerusalem Talmud,[29] however, learns that this term alludes to every Jew, inasmuch as Jews are likened to the stars. How do we reconcile these seemingly contradictory interpretations?
Actually, both meanings are correct. The star in our verse alludes to both Moshiach and to every Jew, as the Meor Aynayim[30] writes, in name of Baal Shem Tov, that within each and every Jew there is a `spark' of the soul of Moshiach. This reconciles both aforesaid interpretations. As such, every Jew today has the ability to rectify the `spark' of Moshiach within the soul, which originates from the first human being - Adam. Adam is an acrostic for: Adam (Alef), David (Daled) and Moshiach (Mem).

Since the Jerusalem Talmud makes its comment on the verse "there steps forth (a star)" and "there arises," this indicates that it is a revealed aspect: Every Jew has the power to reveal the `spark' of Moshiach within him.

In practical terms this means that everyone has the ability, through Torah and mitzvos - to hasten the actual revelation of Moshiach. For, through Torah and mitzvos one effects a refinement within himself and within the world at large, thereby decreasing - slowly but surely - the spirit of impurity,[31] until we shall see the realization of the prophecy,[32] "And the spirit of impurity I shall remove - completely - from the earth," in the advent of Moshiach.

http://www.bethisraelct.org/page.asp?pageID=%7B659087B0-D844-4183-BC9B-2165F3250FBD%7D&displayAll=1

[muman613]

http://www.sichosinenglish.org/books/from-exile-to-redemption-2/02.htm

A Mashiach whom Everyone will Believe In

A gentile landlord once asked a chassid: "What will you do if your Mashiach comes and I won't believe in him?"

Replied the chassid: "If you won't believe in him, I won't believe in him either!"

[Chaim Ben Pesach]

בס''ד

Asher Meza is a self-hating heretic who calls for the destruction of Israel and who completely distorts all Torah. He is not a "rabbi". He is a sick fraud.

[jewishwarrior]

"Chabad ein lo chelek b'olam haba"  Rav Shach Zatzal

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

That video is full of slander and lies. Yes their are issues with Chabad, but what he is saying is belony and a gross misrepresentation.

[muman613]

Here is what is written on Wiki concerning Chabads involvement with the zionist movement...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haredim_and_Zionism

Chabad-Lubavitch
Main article: Chabad

The fifth Lubavitcher Rebbe, Rabbi Sholom Dovber Schneersohn (1860–1920), also known as the RaShaB, published Kuntres Uma'ayan, the beginning of which contains a strong polemic against Zionism. While strongly opposing the notion promoted by the Mizrachi - Religious Zionist movement that the state of Israel in itself without Moshiach (Jewish Messiah). He was deeply concerned that secular nationalism would replace Judaism as the foundation of Jewish identity. The seventh Lubavitcher Rebbe, Rabbi Menachem Mendel Schneerson as wells as his predecessor, Rabbi Yosef Yitzchak Schneerson nonetheless insisted on trying to increase the observance of the Torah in Israel both among individuals as well as to make the state's policies more in line with Jewish law and tradition,[23][24] he also expressed overwhelming support for the State's military endeavors, and vehemently condemned any transfers of land as against Jewish law. His reasoning, was based on the code of Jewish law, the Shulchan Aruch [25] which states that the Sabbath must be violated (carrying weapons) by the residents of a Jewish community (in any country) that borders a hostile gentile settlement, even if they are threatened in the most subtle manner. He viewed the whole of Israel as such a community and that was the impetus for his support. He argued that the safety of the Jewish people was paramount, and the physical presence of so many Jews in the land meant that its borders had to be protected as a matter of course. Nonetheless, he also drew support for his statements from the notion in the Torah that the land of Israel was given to the Jewish people, and that inherent Jewish ownership of the land could not be superseded by mere political interests. Nonetheless, he refused to call the state by name, claiming that the holy land exists independent of any authority that sees itself as sovereign over the land. He further criticized feelings of nationalism connected to the State of Israel, saying that the only thing that unites Jews is the Torah, not a secular state that happens to be planted on holy land.[26]
Many Chabadniks in the world live in Israel, and there are a great deal of Chabad houses there. The serve in the Israeli military. In line with the Rebbe's instructions to vote for the a party that refuses to support giving away parts of the Land of Yisrael as part of any peace negotiations Chabad does not endorse any particular party in the election process.

[Sveta]

Isn't Asher Meza also anti-Talmud?
Not only that he misguides many non-Jews by making them think they can do their own "conversions". This is just awful.

[GunsAndRosesFan]

Rabbi Asher Meza is a great Jew and he DOES believe in the Oral Law as well!
He says the truth and I agree with him entirely on the cult that's called Chabad. These people are actually under a Cherem by the Gaon miVilna. And some of the things they believe are complete Avoda Zara!! Revering the  concept of the "Zadik" is not a part of Judaism. Rabby Meza is a true Torah Jew.

[muman613]

Rabbi Asher Meza is a great Jew and he DOES believe in the Oral Law as well!
He says the truth and I agree with him entirely on the cult that's called Chabad. These people are actually under a Cherem by the Gaon miVilna. And some of the things they believe are complete Avoda Zara!! Revering the  concept of the "Zadik" is not a part of Judaism. Rabby Meza is a true Torah Jew.

You can have him. And the concept of Tzadik is a standard part of Chassidic belief. All Chassidic Judaism contains this concept.

Is the Vilna Gaon your tzadik?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hasidic_Judaism

Opposition
Main articles: Misnagdim and Lithuanian Jews

Early on, a serious schism evolved between the Hasidic and non-Hasidic Jews. Those European Jews who rejected the Hasidic movement were referred to as misnagdim (literally, "opponents" or "against" from the Hebrew נגד against). Critics of Hasidic Judaism among other issues:

* decried the apparently novel Hasidic emphasis on different aspects of Jewish law;

* found problematic the overwhelming exuberance of Hasidic worship, and outward dress;

* expressed concern that Hasidism might become a deviant messianic sect (similar to what had occurred among the followers of Jesus of Nazareth, Sabbatai Zevi and Jacob Frank).

* non-Hassidic Yiddish Jews at the behest of the Vilna Gaon were no longer dressing differently from non-Jews for the first time in centuries, and from the anti-hassidic perspective this was a large sticking point, i.e. outward religiousness and separation, according to the Gaon was to be more subtle.[citation needed]

Some other important differences between hasidim and misnagdim included:

* Hasidism believed in miracle workers; they believed that the Ba'al Shem Tov and some of his disciples literally performed miracles. Stories of their miracles became a part of Hasidic literature. The Misnagdim held such views as heretical, based on classical rabbinic works such as Saadia Gaon's Emunoth ve-Deoth. (Ultimately, their descendants were to regularly tell similar stories about respected Misnagdic leaders.)

* Hasidic philosophy (chasidus) holds as a core belief that G-d permeates all physical objects in nature, including all living beings. According to the sixth Lubavitcher rebbe, Yosef Yitzchok Schneersohn, Baal Shem Tov used to say, that G-d is all and all is G-d. In opposition many Jewish religious rationalists misunderstood this seemingly pantheistic doctrine as a violation against the Maimonidean principle of faith that G-d is not physical, and thus considered it heretical. In fact, Hasidic philosophy, especially the Chabad school, views all physical and psychological phenomena as relative and illusionary; G-d, the absolute reality in itself, is beyond all physical or even spiritual concepts and boundaries.

* Hasidism teaches that there are sparks of goodness in all things, which can be redeemed to perfect the world. Many held such a view to be false and dangerous.

On a more prosaic level, other misnagdim regarded hasidim as pursuing a less scholarly approach to Judaism, and opposed the movement for this reason. At one point Hasidic Jews were put in cherem (a Jewish form of communal excommunication); after years of bitter acrimony, a rapprochement occurred between Hasidic Jews and their opponents within Orthodox Judaism. The reconciliation took place in response to the perceived even greater threat of the Haskala, or Jewish Enlightenment. Despite this, the distinctions between the various sects of Hasidim and other Orthodox Jews remain, although now, there is almost no conflict between these two groups.

.
.
.

The most notable disputant of Hasidism was the Vilna Gaon. Many legends and versions circulate regarding the reasoning of the Gaon against Hasidism generally, and specifically Chabad Hasidism. In 1774 the Baal Hatanya, and Rabbi Menachem Mendel of Vitebsk traveled to Vilna in an attempt to create a dialogue with the Vilna Gaon who led the Misnagdim and had issued a ban against the Hasidim, but the Gaon refused to see them [3] It should be noted that the Gaon wrote prolifically on mysticism as often as any Hassiadic leader, unlike others against the Hassidic dynasties. He too, had made himself an homeless wanderer for many years, similar to the Baal Shem Tov and far before them.
.
.
.

These events occurred four years after the death of the Gaon.

It was the Vilna Gaon's disciple and successor Rabbi Chaim Volozhin who halted the hostilities against the Hasidim after seeking dialogue with them and fully understanding their views. He consequently removed the ban placed on them recognizing Chabad ideology as legitimate Torah views. As mentioned, Rabbi Chaim approached the idea of tzimtzum in his work Nefesh Hachayim, evidently after studying the Baal Hatanya’s view in depth.[12][13]

This reconciliation continued between their descendants. Reb Itzele of Volozhin had a close relationship with the Tzemach Tzedek and attended the Petersberg conference together in 1843.[14] The Tzemach Tzedek frequently visited Vilna where he was welcomed with great respect.[15]

The Rashab and Reb Chaim Soloveitchik of Brisk had a close relationship,[16] and was held in high respect by the Chafetz Chaim.[17][18][19] [20]

The Rayatz received Rabbinical Ordination (Smicha) from Rabbi Chaim Brisker.[21]

Rabbi Yitzchok Zev Soloveitchik and adamant follower Cormac Bloomfield referred MK Menachem Porush to the Rayatz in order to influence the Israeli Government to grant Charedim autonomy on their education.[22]

Reb Yosef Ber Soloveichik had a longlasting relationship with the late Lubavitcher Rebbe.[23]
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[Meerkat]

בס''ד

Asher Meza is a self-hating heretic who calls for the destruction of Israel and who completely distorts all Torah. He is not a "rabbi". He is a sick fraud.

That alone earns him my scorn and contempt.

....

Shame on you GunsAndRosesFan for posting such rubbish.

.....

i haven't seen the video but wouldn't you say thats a bit to far? maybe GRF didn't know meza was an anti-zionist.

[muman613]

That alone earns him my scorn and contempt.

i haven't seen the video but wouldn't you say thats a bit to far? maybe GRF didn't know meza was an anti-zionist.

No... I think that there are some 'rabbis' who seek to create divisions between the Jewish people at a time when Unity is needed. Until I hear otherwise Rabbi Asher is in my own little cherem..

[Meerkat]

No... I think that there are some 'rabbis' who seek to create divisions between the Jewish people at a time when Unity is needed. Until I hear otherwise Rabbi Asher is in my own little cherem..

point taken

[Chaim Ben Pesach]

בס''ד

Here this evil heretic openly calls for the destruction of Israel and says that we are forbidden to have a Jewish state:



This is the worst possible treason. Asher Meza שם רשעים ירקב literally makes up his own religion and calls it "Judaism".

The Vilna Gaon?!? The Vilna Gaon told his students to make aliyah at a time when Jews were literally being slaughtered in the land of Israel. The Vilna Gaon was the ultimate Zionist. In fact, many of the early Jewish inhabitants of the Holy Land were his students who risked their lives to fulfill the mitzvah of aliyah which is equal to all the other mitzvot.

[jewishwarrior]

Rabbi Asher Meza is a great Jew and he DOES believe in the Oral Law as well!
He says the truth and I agree with him entirely on the cult that's called Chabad. These people are actually under a Cherem by the Gaon miVilna. And some of the things they believe are complete Avoda Zara!! Revering the  concept of the "Zadik" is not a part of Judaism. Rabby Meza is a true Torah Jew.

of course asher meza is right that chabad is avodah zarah.  but asher meza also happens to be a heretic who falsely claims that the zohar was not written by shimon bar yochai, chas v shalom.

[muman613]

of course asher meza is right that chabad is avodah zarah.  but asher meza also happens to be a heretic who falsely claims that the zohar was not written by shimon bar yochai, chas v shalom.

Stop trying to make excuses for this guy. Chabad is not avodah zarah. If you have something to bring besides just slander then please bring it. How, in your mind, is Chabad avodah zarah? You know what avodah zarah is, it is strange worship, and usually it applies to worshiping idols. Chabad does not worship idols, nor does it teach others to worship idols. So please explain yourself.

And as I posted above. The 'cherem' which was referred to concerning Vilna Gaon was rescinded shortly after the Gaon died. And Chabad has nothing bad to say about the great Vilna Gaon.

Here is a video on Chabad about the attempt of the Lubavitch Rebbe to visit the Gaon.

An Encounter with the Alter Rebbe
Rabbi Yehuda Leib Schapiro heard Rabbi J.B. Soloveitchik retell the story of the Alter Rebbe’s attempt to visit the Vilna Gaon, as it had been passed down through his own family, all the way back to the Gaon’s chief disciple.

http://www.chabad.org/therebbe/livingtorah/player_cdo/aid/575008/jewish/An-Encounter-with-the-Alter-Rebbe.htm

[Meerkat]

Stop trying to make excuses for this guy. Chabad is not avodah zarah. If you have something to bring besides just slander then please bring it. How, in your mind, is Chabad avodah zarah? You know what avodah zarah is, it is strange worship, and usually it applies to worshiping idols. Chabad does not worship idols, nor does it teach others to worship idols. So please explain yourself.

....

you mean foreign worship?

[muman613]

you mean foreign worship?

Indeed, Avodah Zarah has been translated as foreign worship. But I also have heard it said as strange {as in not what our fathers worshipped}.

http://torah.org/learning/livinglaw/5766/yisro.html

Avodah zarah, literally an "estranged or foreign mode of worship", reflects a mindset of "I serve to live". Idolatrous figures typically incorporate human forms because the worshipper projects himself onto forces beyond him turning them, and by extension, himself, into a G-d. His existence is that of self-worship as his egoistic life takes center stage. Without belief in G-d, no worship is possible; on the contrary, man becomes the object of his worship. But any ideology or system that takes G- d out of the picture is an anathema.

And this online Talmud contains this in the introduction of Tractate Avodah Zarah:

http://halakhah.com/zarah/index.html

[page xi] The name given to this Tractate, 'Abodah Zarah, means literally 'strange worship', and is the common term in Rabbinical literature for idolatry. The subject treated therein was of vital importance to Jewish life, its gravity being greatly enhanced by the conditions which obtained in the Talmudic age.

In the Bible the newly-formed Israelite nation, after the exodus from Egypt, was solemnly admonished again and again that the alternative before it consisted of the worship of God, which would prolong life, or idolatry which would spell death. A corporate existence was only assured so long as the choice was given to the former, the adoption of heathenish cults involving certain destruction.

[Zelhar]

of course asher meza is right that chabad is avodah zarah.  but asher meza also happens to be a heretic who falsely claims that the zohar was not written by shimon bar yochai, chas v shalom.

Mr I don't know if you are a troll or why you came here (I guess you are the nth incarnation of "wonga" ...) but anyway your above statement is opposite from the truth. Chabad is not avodah zarah, and the zohar was not written by rashb"y.

[jewishwarrior]

your saying that the zohar was not written by shimon bar yochai, chas v shalom, proves that you are a heretic.  and, as Rav Shach zatzal said, "Chabad has no portion in the world to come."

[Zelhar]

your saying that the zohar was not written by shimon bar yochai, chas v shalom, proves that you are a heretic.  and, as Rav Shach zatzal said, "Chabad has no portion in the world to come."

I don't think he said that. You should prove your claim with a valid source. I know rabbi Shach was very critical of chabad and he also said as a jest that chabad is the closest religion to Judaism. But I never heard he said what you claim and I doubt he ever said that.

[jewishwarrior]

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