JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Zvulun ben Moshe on May 30, 2007, 06:04:04 PM
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Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?
If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
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Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?
If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
Oh yes, we Christians just had no other choice but to adopt that "philosophy". Who would rationally reject the concept of a man jamming his [deleted] up another man's [deleted] where [deleted] is excreted from? Are you a butt bandit Zulu ben?
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Oh yes, we Christians just had no other choice but to adopt that "philosophy". Who would rationally reject the concept of a man jamming his [deleted] up another man's [deleted] where [deleted] is excreted from? Are you a butt bandit Zulu ben?
Is this acceptable behavior on the part of a moderator of this forum? Why are Christians permitted to intimidate Jews here?
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Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?
If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
Oh yes, we Christians just had no other choice but to adopt that "philosophy". Who would rationally reject the concept of a man jamming his [deleted] up another man's [deleted] where [deleted] is excreted from? Are you a butt bandit Zulu ben?
By "had no other choice but to adapt the same concept" I meant that since both Christianity and Islam are based (in different ways) on Judaism, then the condemnation of homosexuality was accepted automatically. I am talking about an official or religious declaration and not word of mouth.
So the question here is not who is more rational, but does such thing as gay anti-semitism exist.
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Allen is not intimidating just putting it in perspective.Now to you question homos side with the moslems
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Zvulun ben Moshe was being derogattory about Christians, so Allen came back at him, no rule against that.
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I assume, many of you have heard that a substantial percentage of Nazi leaders were gay. I have also concluded from casual conversations with some gays that there is some "anger" at Jews deep within them. I could not understand such coincidence, if you will.
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Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?
If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
Oh yes, we Christians just had no other choice but to adopt that "philosophy". Who would rationally reject the concept of a man jamming his [deleted] up another man's [deleted] where [deleted] is excreted from? Are you a butt bandit Zulu ben?
By "had no other choice but to adapt the same concept" I meant that since both Christianity and Islam are based (in different ways) on Judaism, then the condemnation of homosexuality was accepted automatically. I am talking about an official or religious declaration and not word of mouth.
So the question here is not who is more rational, but does such thing as gay anti-semitism exist.
First of all Jews and Christians share a common God, we just disagree on who is Messiah. Islam worships Satan. Jews and Christians both accept homosexuality as evil and wrong because God says so and it's obvious that it is. Anyone who says it isn't is a liar. Islam rejects it but many muslims are gay. The proof is in how muslims treat women. muslims mutilate their women's clitorises so they cannot experience orgasm. This is so the muslim man doesn't have to satisfy the woman, because in reality he cannot because he is gay. A strong man of God satisfies his wife so that she would never think of looking elsewhere for sex. A muslim devil worshipper doesn't have time for that, he is too busy planning cowardly terrorist attacks, so he just chops his wifes vagina up. Sorry for being crude here but truth is truth.
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Oh yes, we Christians just had no other choice but to adopt that "philosophy". Who would rationally reject the concept of a man jamming his [deleted] up another man's [deleted] where [deleted] is excreted from? Are you a butt bandit Zulu ben?
Is this acceptable behavior on the part of a moderator of this forum? Why are Christians permitted to intimidate Jews here?
How did I intimidate anyone? I am mocking your stupid remark. If you are Jewish, oh well.
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If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
What is this about Christians/Muslims "having no choice but to adapt?"
I think it's a matter of carrying on the concepts/laws they agreed with. No one forced them.
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By the way, Zulu Ben Moshe IM'd me this morning and said I should title each Youtube video with "Free Porn Here" or something like that. It's a jokester.
Here is the message;
Zvulun ben Moshe
New JTFer
Posts: 13
Youtube
« Sent to: Allen-T on: Today at 11:57:55 AM » Quote Reply Remove
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Allen,
I have a mad idea here. You could name any coming video as "Better than porn" and add tags like "sex", "porn" etc.
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Moslems are very muich homos but they are closet queers
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Allen, saucepot is not Zvulun ben Moshe, your confusing the two people.
Secondly, regarding homsexual opposition to Jews, it's really rather simple. Homosexuals are doing something that is against God, and enjoying it, willingly and knowingly doing it. Jews are God's chosen people, those that are willingly and knowingly opposing God are going to have some problems with his chosen people aren't they.
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By the way, Zulu Ben Moshe IM'd me this morning and said I should title each Youtube video with "Free Porn Here" or something like that. It's a jokester.
Who's a jokester zevulun.Why did he say to post on youtube porno here?
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Fallen, don't do that. Don't lie. I said, as a matter of experiment, or joke, you could name one video as "Better than porn" to attract visitors.
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Alen, don't do that. Don't lie. I said, as a matter of experiment, or joke, you could name one video as "Better than porn" to attract visitors.
I posted the e-mail. If anyone thinks this is a good idea, by all means....
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Plus, it is not a good practice to reveal a private message, especially when it has nothing to do with the subject being discussed.
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Here queers for arabs [which btw does'nt exist] Who put queers for eretz yisroel ??? http://www.zombietime.com/sf_rally_september_24_2005/queers_for_palestine/
More Fags for moslem arabs http://search.yahoo.com/search?ei=utf-8&fr=slv8-msgr&p=queers%20for%20palestine
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Plus, it is not a good practice to reveal a private message, especially when it has nothing to do with the subject being discussed.
Why are you embarassed by what you suggested? Is your faith in God so shakey you feel the need to employ cheap tactics such as you suggested?
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No matter what it is. You are a sort of official representative of JTF on youtube. My private message wasn't personal, obviously, but business confidential. So, I am in no way intimidated. But posting it without my approval is exceeding your commission.
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No matter what it is. You are a sort of official representative of JTF on youtube. My private message wasn't personal, obviously, but business confidential. So, I am in no way intimidated. But posting it without my approval is exceeding your commission.
Write to Chaim and have me fired.
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Easy guys! Let's not let this whole thread blow up out of proportion.
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No matter what it is. You are a sort of official representative of JTF on youtube. My private message wasn't personal, obviously, but business confidential. So, I am in no way intimidated. But posting it without my approval is exceeding your commission.
Write to Chaim and have me fired.
Who cares about that? I am talking about mere decency.
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someone lock the thread
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Fair enough. So can we all please drop this? It's really not worth fighting over. Let's continue to focus on the things we agree on and work together.
As far as enticing YouTube viewers with free porn, people like that are not our target audience.
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I would really prefer not to lock threads on a regular basis. So let's all calm down.
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Was Zvulun ben Moshe banned? Or did he choose to leave? I do not think he deserved to be banned.
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I don't know.
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Why does everybody take everything so seriously? I was laughing earlier when I was responding to this character!! I am surprised to see all this talk about calm down and fighting. :-*
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Most Nazis are faggots, of all religions.
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The only link I can see between sodomy(of all types) and anti-semitism is that they are both evil and evil sometimes gravitates towards evil.
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Oh I see. I was not aware of the private message that ben Moshe sent to Allen-T, so I did not understand why Allen-T was so hostile to that poster. By the way, could you not have posted a quote in the New Testament where it says that homosexuals will never inherit Paradise rather than get aggressive? The roots of Nazi anti-semitism are to be found in the fear of castration. Europeans are incredibly scared of circumcision because they associate it with having their penises cut off. But this is also one of the reasons why many women prefer circumcision, they say it looks better but what they really mean is that they would like to see their men castrated.
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Saucepot, do you have any facts to back up your assertion that women want to see men castrated? That is way off base.
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The roots of Nazi anti-semitism are to be found in the fear of castration. Europeans are incredibly scared of circumcision because they associate it with having their penises cut off. But this is also one of the reasons why many women prefer circumcision, they say it looks better but what they really mean is that they would like to see their men castrated.
Is this guy saucepot or crackpot?
Fruit alert! Fruit alert! Fruit alert!
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I don't think he is Fruit, but he may be a fruitcake.
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To Lisa: I did not say that women in general want to see men castrated.
What is the significance of 'fruit'? Is this related to the healthy living forum?
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To Lisa: I did not say that women in general want to see men castrated.
What is the significance of 'fruit'? Is this related to the healthy living forum?
:D
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To Lisa: I did not say that women in general want to see men castrated.
What is the significance of 'fruit'? Is this related to the healthy living forum?
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
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Europeans are incredibly scared of circumcision because they associate it with having their penises cut off.
It's the Europeans fault they imported workers from the Congo,Zaire,kenya and zimbabwa and so the european male feels inadequite
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When they see European women they become like sharks and alligators on the prowl for game
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But this is also one of the reasons why many women prefer circumcision, they say it looks better but what they really mean is that they would like to see their men castrated.
So how did you mean the above statement, Saucepot?
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But this is also one of the reasons why many women prefer circumcision, they say it looks better but what they really mean is that they would like to see their men castrated.
So how did you mean the above statement, Saucepot?
I mean only in clearly pathological instances, where a woman may exhibit a strong and apparently irrational personal preference for the man to have the Covenant operation performed on him. Many passive homosexual men exhibit the same fantasies as women concerning the membrums virile of other men.
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The World War 2 leader of Germany was intensely jealous of circumcision and he spoke frequently of it as being a 'blemish' on humanity. I have seen cases where neo-Nazis make very outspoken remarks on it. These are clearly pathological cases of repression. Normal people do not care either way. Gay men may be more prone to Nazism because of their narcissism and fixation on their own genitals.
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This was Fruit?
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FRUIT JUICE
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He was Fruit and he was talking knowledgeably about fruits. ;D
Remember him saying that he wanted to see black men having sex with his wife?
Just take Fruit's "wife" out of the picture and you're there.
Fruit, I think that, once again, you just got your membrums virile twisted around and shoved up your pudendum femininum.
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You guys are talking apples and oranges. ;D
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Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?
If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
Oh yes, we Christians just had no other choice but to adopt that "philosophy". Who would rationally reject the concept of a man jamming his [deleted] up another man's [deleted] where [deleted] is excreted from? Are you a butt bandit Zulu ben?
By "had no other choice but to adapt the same concept" I meant that since both Christianity and Islam are based (in different ways) on Judaism, then the condemnation of homosexuality was accepted automatically. I am talking about an official or religious declaration and not word of mouth.
So the question here is not who is more rational, but does such thing as gay anti-semitism exist.
First of all Jews and Christians share a common G-d, we just disagree on who is Messiah. Islam worships Satan. Jews and Christians both accept homosexuality as evil and wrong because G-d says so and it's obvious that it is. Anyone who says it isn't is a liar. Islam rejects it but many muslims are gay. The proof is in how muslims treat women. muslims mutilate their women's clitorises so they cannot experience orgasm. This is so the muslim man doesn't have to satisfy the woman, because in reality he cannot because he is gay. A strong man of G-d satisfies his wife so that she would never think of looking elsewhere for sex. A muslim devil worshipper doesn't have time for that, he is too busy planning cowardly terrorist attacks, so he just chops his wifes vagina up. Sorry for being crude here but truth is truth.
Actually, Christianity is considered Avodah Zara, and Islam isnt.
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Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?
If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
Oh yes, we Christians just had no other choice but to adopt that "philosophy". Who would rationally reject the concept of a man jamming his [deleted] up another man's [deleted] where [deleted] is excreted from? Are you a butt bandit Zulu ben?
By "had no other choice but to adapt the same concept" I meant that since both Christianity and Islam are based (in different ways) on Judaism, then the condemnation of homosexuality was accepted automatically. I am talking about an official or religious declaration and not word of mouth.
So the question here is not who is more rational, but does such thing as gay anti-semitism exist.
First of all Jews and Christians share a common G-d, we just disagree on who is Messiah. Islam worships Satan. Jews and Christians both accept homosexuality as evil and wrong because G-d says so and it's obvious that it is. Anyone who says it isn't is a liar. Islam rejects it but many muslims are gay. The proof is in how muslims treat women. muslims mutilate their women's clitorises so they cannot experience orgasm. This is so the muslim man doesn't have to satisfy the woman, because in reality he cannot because he is gay. A strong man of G-d satisfies his wife so that she would never think of looking elsewhere for sex. A muslim devil worshipper doesn't have time for that, he is too busy planning cowardly terrorist attacks, so he just chops his wifes vagina up. Sorry for being crude here but truth is truth.
Actually, Christianity is considered Avodah Zara, and Islam isnt.
You feel what in common with Islam?
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:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
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You guys are talking apples and oranges. ;D
Yes i going to get a glass of orange juice
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Avodah Zara? What is that? Is this something to do with the Babylonian talmud saying that Jesus was executed for being a sorceror?
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I think it has to do with the statues in churches and photos of saints
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I think it has to do with the statues in churches and photos of saints
He said Christianity, those are exclusively Catholic ideas that are unbiblical. The 2nd Commandent says no graven images.
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I think it has to do with the statues in churches and photos of saints
He said Christianity, those are exclusively Catholic ideas that are unbiblical. The 2nd Commandent says no graven images.
Yes i was going to say that,but 1800 yrs ago the Orthodox and Catholics had a monopoly
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I think it has to do with the statues in churches and photos of saints
He said Christianity, those are exclusively Catholic ideas that are unbiblical. The 2nd Commandent says no graven images.
This is one of those tricky areas where, in the words of Chaim, "we have to agree to disagree."
On another thread, someone attacked Jerry Falwell for believing in Israel not for the sake of the Jews, but for the sake of the Jews who will convert to Christianity.
However that may be, we must seek to rise above these differences. Otherwise, we'll leave ourselves wide open to a deliberate troublemaker like Fruit, who delighted in pointing them out in the hope of seeing us fight.
Whenever I see discussions like this one escalate into arguments, I'm reminded of the old story (repeated in The Hobbit, by J.R.R. Tolkien) of a hero who slew a gaggle of demons by throwing a stone into their midst, causing each demon to think that his neighbor had struck him. When all was said and done, every demon lay dead on the ground, and the hero emerged triumphant from his hiding place in the bushes.
We must try not to act like demons, lest our enemies destroy all of us.
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Fruit was funny a bit eccentric but funny as well as a good writer
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Dissenter is right. I do not want to see fighting on this forum over religion. We are all good people here. So I don't see any point in criticizing each other's beliefs. Let's direct our anger at the moosie fanatics who want to destroy America and Israel instead.
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I think it has to do with the statues in churches and photos of saints
He said Christianity, those are exclusively Catholic ideas that are unbiblical. The 2nd Commandent says no graven images.
This is one of those tricky areas where, in the words of Chaim, "we have to agree to disagree."
On another thread, someone attacked Jerry Falwell for believing in Israel not for the sake of the Jews, but for the sake of the Jews who will convert to Christianity.
However that may be, we must seek to rise above these differences. Otherwise, we'll leave ourselves wide open to a deliberate troublemaker like Fruit, who delighted in pointing them out in the hope of seeing us fight.
Whenever I see discussions like this one escalate into arguments, I'm reminded of the old story (repeated in The Hobbit, by J.R.R. Tolkien) of a hero who slew a gaggle of demons by throwing a stone into their midst, causing each demon to think that his neighbor had struck him. When all was said and done, every demon lay dead on the ground, and the hero emerged triumphant from his hiding place in the bushes.
We must try not to act like demons, lest our enemies destroy all of us.
OOO, what a great strategy...Throw a stone at a bunch of Muslims and blame it on the Shiite and then throw a stone at a bunch of Shia and blame it on the sunnis...and then throw a stone at the Chinese communists and blame it on Putin...hmmm...
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There is NO reason to attack or bash anyone who is not attacking or bashing us. And I am speaking from the perspective of someone who studies (and applies) psychological warfare as more than a hobby.
I wasn't aware that 'psychological warfare' was a hobby.
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I don't think we should be using words like f*****. I am a heterosexual, but what gay people do in private is none of my business, or anyone else's.
if gays were private about what they do, then I would agree. But way too many come out and are "proud" to be gay..making it not private anymore..so let the rebuking of homosexuality continue.
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Re: if gays were private about what they do, then I would agree. But way too many come out and are "proud" to be gay..making it not private anymore..so let the rebuking of homosexuality continue.
Condemnation should focus on lewd public behavior and not on sexual orientation. While the idea of two men or women making out in the middle of the street is disgusting, the phrase "get a [motel] room" has often been directed at heterosexual couples who get too frisky in public.
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It's not a matter of just being frisky... Homosexuality is against Judaism and Christianity. Those who follow scriptures are required to consider the act homosexuality a sin. It's that simple. Albiet, if someone is practicing homosexuality quietly in the privacy of their home, they may still be doing something against Gd, but no one has a right to go in their home and say something. In addition, if someone i cared about confided in me, one should rebuke what they do, but are also required to be compassionate and offer help.
However, when a homosexual marches in a gay pride parade or are simply open about it and have no problem with it, they have permitted me and everyone else in their bed room.
Homosexuality is a type of kinky behavior. It's like me annoucing to the whole world the way I like to have sex...that kind of talk shoudl be kept private..and actions like those do not need to be revealed.
And teh same goes with homosexuality..it is a type of sexual behavior that nobody needs to know about..and it is not something that shoudl be announced in a parade. That's evil!
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This is a religious Jewish forum, so the forum's position in regard to Homosexuality is that of the Torah.
There is NO reason to attack or bash anyone who is not attacking or bashing us. And I am speaking from the perspective of someone who studies (and applies) psychological warfare as more than a hobby.
I wasn't aware that 'psychological warfare' was a hobby.
Well, if you don't get paid for doing it, it might be considered one. I took enormous personal satisfaction, though, in using its techniques to destroy the original Million Mom March (even the NRA couldn't do that) and to cripple MoveOn.org last year--all legally and nonviolently. Hint; you don't attack the other side's rank and file, you persuade them that their own leaders are using and exploiting them, and lying to them. Another technique is to use the other side's own purported issues and positions against it. Want to get left-leaning women to stop supporting the PLO/Hamas Arab Muslim Nazis? Educate them on how the PLO/Hamas Arab Muslim Nazis kill women for "dishonoring" themselves, which includes being a rape victim.
Re: if gays were private about what they do, then I would agree. But way too many come out and are "proud" to be gay..making it not private anymore..so let the rebuking of homosexuality continue.
Condemnation should focus on lewd public behavior and not on sexual orientation. While the idea of two men or women making out in the middle of the street is disgusting, the phrase "get a [motel] room" has often been directed at heterosexual couples who get too frisky in public.
This is very interesting about the psychological warfare where did you learn about it?
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Winged Hussar are you the famous Bill L
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Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?
If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
Oh yes, we Christians just had no other choice but to adopt that "philosophy". Who would rationally reject the concept of a man jamming his [deleted] up another man's [deleted] where [deleted] is excreted from? Are you a butt bandit Zulu ben?
My father once told me that since homosexuality was a big part of the Greek culture, Judaism then needed to condemn homosexuality in order to make themselves different. But then again, he's just a leftist reconstructionist. So what does he know?
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I don't think we should be using words like f*****. I am a heterosexual, but what gay people do in private is none of my business, or anyone else's.
We can use the militant "Islamic" world's oppression of gay people, which includes torturing and killing them, to undermine and even demolish anti-Israel "progressive" coalitions. I made a real mess of SF Bay Area Indymedia by posting articles about the PLO/Hamas Arab Muslim Nazi Authority beating gay people, throwing them into raw sewage, and the like. As expected, the moderators censored my posts, which I promptly reposted on IsraPundit as proof that Indybay.org's support for gay rights ends where the militant Islamic world begins--hopefully causing them enormous credibility damage with their own gay constituents. I did the same with the militant "Islamic" world's treatment of women, and the women's rights issue.
There is NO reason to attack or bash anyone who is not attacking or bashing us. And I am speaking from the perspective of someone who studies (and applies) psychological warfare as more than a hobby.
I'm not so sure you were censored for criticizing the Muslims as much as it was for using the term "throwing them into raw sewage." I wonder what would happen if anyone were to write something like, "throw all the Zionists into raw sewage." There's a chance this still might be censored. But I'm not sure. Perhaps it would be something to experiment with and see what happens.
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If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
What is this about Christians/Muslims "having no choice but to adapt?"
I think it's a matter of carrying on the concepts/laws they agreed with. No one forced them.
I think that they have no choice but to adapt to the extent that if they don't conform to these behavioral practices, they'd probably get their heads lopped off.
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With my own personal experiences, I have known a few people who were gay. They all said the same thing, that they never elected to be this way. This is just the feelings that they experience. This is something that they needed to struggle with for a very long before realizing that they were in fact gay. This is still something they need to struggle with. It's not like they just woke up one day and decided to be rebellious and said, "Hey, ya know what? I think I'll be gay!" Anyone who does something like that or decides to experiment with homosexuality isn't truly gay.
I think it's important to differentiate between homosexual feelings and behavior. There are a good number of people who by no choice of their own, have homosexual feelings. But because of the religious, cultural, and societal pressures, they choose not to follow through with homosexual behavior. On the other hand, there are heterosexuals who experiment with homosexuality. But that in itself doesn't make them homosexual.
I often wonder what the solution is for gays. If they stay true to their feelings and have romantic relations with someone from their same gender, then they are "leading a disgusting lifestyle." However, if they deny their true feelings and end up having romantic relations and marrying someone of their opposite gender, then eventually, their homosexual feelings are going to compromise the relationship where the marriage will eventually come to an end. At that point, they would be accused of "breaking up the family unit." So what's the solution for them? Just stay in the closet for their entire lives and have no romantic relations?
I'm not trying to sound like Tonicali here and would see no point in trying to ask these questions or have these debates with Chaim since he views homosexuality as being equivalent to having sex with cows. I mean, really! It's one thing to be against it for religious purposes. But equating it with cows? There's no way you can have any type of rational debate when someone thinks like this!
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I've jeard of people who claim to be attracted to cows, horses, and even dogs, so what's the difference?
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I've jeard of people who claim to be attracted to cows, horses, and even dogs, so what's the difference?
Bestiality is a fetish. Homosexuality is NOT a fetish! But as I stated before, anyone who equates homosexuality with cows cannot be rationally reasoned with on this issue.
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Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?
If yes, do you think it is because Torah was the first holy book to condemn homosexuality officially, and both Christians and Muslims had no other choice but to adapt the same concept later?
Oh yes, we Christians just had no other choice but to adopt that "philosophy". Who would rationally reject the concept of a man jamming his [deleted] up another man's [deleted] where [deleted] is excreted from? Are you a butt bandit Zulu ben?
My father once told me that since homosexuality was a big part of the Greek culture, Judaism then needed to condemn homosexuality in order to make themselves different. But then again, he's just a leftist reconstructionist. So what does he know?
The Torah is older than Greece. :)
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With my own personal experiences, I have known a few people who were gay. They all said the same thing, that they never elected to be this way. This is just the feelings that they experience. This is something that they needed to struggle with for a very long before realizing that they were in fact gay. This is still something they need to struggle with. It's not like they just woke up one day and decided to be rebellious and said, "Hey, ya know what? I think I'll be gay!" Anyone who does something like that or decides to experiment with homosexuality isn't truly gay.
I think it's important to differentiate between homosexual feelings and behavior. There are a good number of people who by no choice of their own, have homosexual feelings. But because of the religious, cultural, and societal pressures, they choose not to follow through with homosexual behavior. On the other hand, there are heterosexuals who experiment with homosexuality. But that in itself doesn't make them homosexual.
I often wonder what the solution is for gays. If they stay true to their feelings and have romantic relations with someone from their same gender, then they are "leading a disgusting lifestyle." However, if they deny their true feelings and end up having romantic relations and marrying someone of their opposite gender, then eventually, their homosexual feelings are going to compromise the relationship where the marriage will eventually come to an end. At that point, they would be accused of "breaking up the family unit." So what's the solution for them? Just stay in the closet for their entire lives and have no romantic relations?
I'm not trying to sound like Tonicali here and would see no point in trying to ask these questions or have these debates with Chaim since he views homosexuality as being equivalent to having sex with cows. I mean, really! It's one thing to be against it for religious purposes. But equating it with cows? There's no way you can have any type of rational debate when someone thinks like this!
Daniel, I do not disagree with you on this. I, too, have known a few homosexuals and all wonderful people otherwise. If one decides to do act on a certain sexual behavior in the privacy of their home, it is not up to me to rebuke such behavior. When one even acts in that way confides in me, I do have a right to rebuke it if i disagree with it, but they are entitled to my compassion as well.
But you have those, whether by choice or no choice go announcing what they like to do in the privacy of their home and are proud of it. That, to me, is messed up! An openly proud homosexual is doing an evil thing.
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I don't think we should be using words like f*****. I am a heterosexual, but what gay people do in private is none of my business, or anyone else's.
if gays were private about what they do, then I would agree. But way too many come out and are "proud" to be gay..making it not private anymore..so let the rebuking of homosexuality continue.
The gays that I know aren't any more "proud" to be gay anymore than the rest of us are proud to be hetero.
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I've jeard of people who claim to be attracted to cows, horses, and even dogs, so what's the difference?
Bestiality is a fetish. Homosexuality is NOT a fetish! But as I stated before, anyone who equates homosexuality with cows cannot be rationally reasoned with on this issue.
Homosexual might as well be a fetish...We do not know for a fact if homosexuality is nature or nuture. And even if someone were born with it, the wrong thing to do is say, "oh well, so be it." the Right thing to do is talk it out and figure out a way to fix it...
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With my own personal experiences, I have known a few people who were gay. They all said the same thing, that they never elected to be this way. This is just the feelings that they experience. This is something that they needed to struggle with for a very long before realizing that they were in fact gay. This is still something they need to struggle with. It's not like they just woke up one day and decided to be rebellious and said, "Hey, ya know what? I think I'll be gay!" Anyone who does something like that or decides to experiment with homosexuality isn't truly gay.
I think it's important to differentiate between homosexual feelings and behavior. There are a good number of people who by no choice of their own, have homosexual feelings. But because of the religious, cultural, and societal pressures, they choose not to follow through with homosexual behavior. On the other hand, there are heterosexuals who experiment with homosexuality. But that in itself doesn't make them homosexual.
I often wonder what the solution is for gays. If they stay true to their feelings and have romantic relations with someone from their same gender, then they are "leading a disgusting lifestyle." However, if they deny their true feelings and end up having romantic relations and marrying someone of their opposite gender, then eventually, their homosexual feelings are going to compromise the relationship where the marriage will eventually come to an end. At that point, they would be accused of "breaking up the family unit." So what's the solution for them? Just stay in the closet for their entire lives and have no romantic relations?
I'm not trying to sound like Tonicali here and would see no point in trying to ask these questions or have these debates with Chaim since he views homosexuality as being equivalent to having sex with cows. I mean, really! It's one thing to be against it for religious purposes. But equating it with cows? There's no way you can have any type of rational debate when someone thinks like this!
Daniel, I do not disagree with you on this. I, too, have known a few homosexuals and all wonderful people otherwise. If one decides to do act on a certain sexual behavior in the privacy of their home, it is not up to me to rebuke such behavior. When one even acts in that way confides in me, I do have a right to rebuke it if i disagree with it, but they are entitled to my compassion as well.
But you have those, whether by choice or no choice go announcing what they like to do in the privacy of their home and are proud of it. That, to me, is messed up! An openly proud homosexual is doing an evil thing.
So then I suppose it's better for them to be closed and ashamed about this.
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I don't think we should be using words like f*****. I am a heterosexual, but what gay people do in private is none of my business, or anyone else's.
if gays were private about what they do, then I would agree. But way too many come out and are "proud" to be gay..making it not private anymore..so let the rebuking of homosexuality continue.
The gays that I know aren't any more "proud" to be gay anymore than the rest of us are proud to be hetero.
I am not suggesting that every homosexual is proud. Some are private about what they do..and I'm personally cool with that...especially if they can be cool wtih how I feel about it.
I'm talking about "gay" pride...not privacy.
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With my own personal experiences, I have known a few people who were gay. They all said the same thing, that they never elected to be this way. This is just the feelings that they experience. This is something that they needed to struggle with for a very long before realizing that they were in fact gay. This is still something they need to struggle with. It's not like they just woke up one day and decided to be rebellious and said, "Hey, ya know what? I think I'll be gay!" Anyone who does something like that or decides to experiment with homosexuality isn't truly gay.
I think it's important to differentiate between homosexual feelings and behavior. There are a good number of people who by no choice of their own, have homosexual feelings. But because of the religious, cultural, and societal pressures, they choose not to follow through with homosexual behavior. On the other hand, there are heterosexuals who experiment with homosexuality. But that in itself doesn't make them homosexual.
I often wonder what the solution is for gays. If they stay true to their feelings and have romantic relations with someone from their same gender, then they are "leading a disgusting lifestyle." However, if they deny their true feelings and end up having romantic relations and marrying someone of their opposite gender, then eventually, their homosexual feelings are going to compromise the relationship where the marriage will eventually come to an end. At that point, they would be accused of "breaking up the family unit." So what's the solution for them? Just stay in the closet for their entire lives and have no romantic relations?
I'm not trying to sound like Tonicali here and would see no point in trying to ask these questions or have these debates with Chaim since he views homosexuality as being equivalent to having sex with cows. I mean, really! It's one thing to be against it for religious purposes. But equating it with cows? There's no way you can have any type of rational debate when someone thinks like this!
Daniel, I do not disagree with you on this. I, too, have known a few homosexuals and all wonderful people otherwise. If one decides to do act on a certain sexual behavior in the privacy of their home, it is not up to me to rebuke such behavior. When one even acts in that way confides in me, I do have a right to rebuke it if i disagree with it, but they are entitled to my compassion as well.
But you have those, whether by choice or no choice go announcing what they like to do in the privacy of their home and are proud of it. That, to me, is messed up! An openly proud homosexual is doing an evil thing.
So then I suppose it's better for them to be closed and ashamed about this.
Not closed, but private about it...they can confide in good friends and family. Good friends and family shoudl state how they truely feel, but be compassionate and offer help.
IN my opinion, the right thing for a homosexual to do is find the right kind of help if he/she is capable of doing it...I understand it is near impossible to force oneself to be attracted to someone of the opposite sex, when in their mind, the same sex is more attractive. If it cannot be done, then they have the right to be private about what they do. Keep it themselves.
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There are people that honestly believe that the walls talk to them (to take an extreme case) homosexuality is a mental illness, they should seek psychiatric help.
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I've jeard of people who claim to be attracted to cows, horses, and even dogs, so what's the difference?
Bestiality is a fetish. Homosexuality is NOT a fetish! But as I stated before, anyone who equates homosexuality with cows cannot be rationally reasoned with on this issue.
Homosexual might as well be a fetish...We do not know for a fact if homosexuality is nature or nuture. And even if someone were born with it, the wrong thing to do is say, "oh well, so be it." the Right thing to do is talk it out and figure out a way to fix it...
And just about everyone who has tried to "fix it" and go through these so called "conversion programs", trying and praying with all of their might to become hetero, just ends up failing miserably only to realize that their true feelings are there to remain and there's nothing they can do to remove them. Yes, they can choose to ignore their feelings and not follow through with the behavior. But the feelings can't be controlled or changed.
I think that the biggest case for homosexuality being natural is that there is a certain percentage in all of the animal kingdom that prefers to mate with their own gender. We as human, are animals with the same baser instincts and urges. Also, Simon Levay at the Salk institute has done autopsies on the brains of homosexuals and found that the part of the hypothalamus that controls sexual urges is either significantly smaller than those from heterosexual brains or that part is missing altogether. Now I know you won't agree with this and consider this just some liberal hogwash. But that's what I discovered with my research when I was in college.
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There are people that honestly believe that the walls talk to them (to take an extreme case) homosexuality is a mental illness, they should seek psychiatric help.
Again, it's an extremely faulty comparison.
A psychologist doesn't consider homosexuality a mental illness, but would consider homophobia to be a mental illness. If a homosexual would go to a licensed therapist, he/she wouldn't try to treat the homosexuality as a mental illness. But if you were to go an express how you find homosexuality repugnant and evil, the therapist would ask a lot of questions and try to peel away all of the psychological layers and to and delve into why you have an issue with this.
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My father once told me that since homosexuality was a big part of the Greek culture, Judaism then needed to condemn homosexuality in order to make themselves different. But then again, he's just a leftist reconstructionist. So what does he know?
Not much, apparently.
Before their classical period, the Greeks had no public use for homosexuality. Neither Homer nor Hesiod, the first two great Greek poets, mention it with approbation. Later attempts to turn Achilles and Patroclus into lovers instead of friends were mocked by Greek historians like Xenophon.
The Jewish laws against homosexuality were instituted long before Greece's classical period. The Jews felt no urge to outdo the Greeks. In fact, it is doubtful that the early Jews had more than a vague idea of who the Greeks were.
Why homosexuality became acceptable in classical Greece is debatable, but one plausible theory holds that when the Greeks ran out of places to colonize, on the Black Sea and elsewhere, they were forced to institute a system of arranged marriages which gave young men no female outlet for their sexual urges. Girls were confined until they were married, and no man wed until he was thirty, when he had earned enough from Greece's limited economy to buy a wife. In many Third World countries, where a similar system is in place, 90% of the young men have homosexual contacts.
By the way, even the classical Greeks, the ones most "open" to homosexuality, despised what we now call passive homosexuals, men who allow themselves to be penetrated.
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There are people that honestly believe that the walls talk to them (to take an extreme case) homosexuality is a mental illness, they should seek psychiatric help.
Again, it's an extremely faulty comparison.
A psychologist doesn't consider homosexuality a mental illness, but would consider homophobia to be a mental illness. If a homosexual would go to a licensed therapist, he/she wouldn't try to treat the homosexuality as a mental illness. But if you were to go an express how you find homosexuality repugnant and evil, the therapist would ask a lot of questions and try to peel away all of the psychological layers and to and delve into why you have an issue with this.
True, the left is taking over, satan is gaining more and more influence in this world.
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My father once told me that since homosexuality was a big part of the
By the way, even the classical Greeks, the ones most "open" to homosexuality, despised what we now call passive homosexuals, men who allow themselves to be penetrated.
Um, if passivity is defined as "allowing to be penetrated" then that would mean that all women are passive participants :laugh:
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A psychologist doesn't consider homosexuality a mental illness, but would consider homophobia to be a mental illness.
Translation: It's not abnormal to have abnormal sex, but it is abnormal to think that abnormal sex is abnormal. ;D
Which is why all psychologists need to be on couches themselves, and why you, Daniel, need to join them there.
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There are people that honestly believe that the walls talk to them (to take an extreme case) homosexuality is a mental illness, they should seek psychiatric help.
Again, it's an extremely faulty comparison.
A psychologist doesn't consider homosexuality a mental illness, but would consider homophobia to be a mental illness. If a homosexual would go to a licensed therapist, he/she wouldn't try to treat the homosexuality as a mental illness. But if you were to go an express how you find homosexuality repugnant and evil, the therapist would ask a lot of questions and try to peel away all of the psychological layers and to and delve into why you have an issue with this.
True, the left is taking over, satan is gaining more and more influence in this world.
Oh, I think you give Satan just way too much credit! I for one don't believe Satan even exists. But if by chance he does, wouldn't it be nice to think that the creators of South Park got it right and that he's having a homosexual relationship with Saddam Hussein right now? :laugh: Oh, but then again, the work or the South Park creators can also be deemed the work of Satan.
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A psychologist doesn't consider homosexuality a mental illness, but would consider homophobia to be a mental illness.
Translation: It's not abnormal to have abnormal sex, but it is abnormal to think that abnormal sex is abnormal. ;D
Which is why all psychologists need to be on couches themselves, and why you, Daniel, need to join them there.
Hey, how do you know I'm not already joining them? But keep in mind, I'm not a homosexual. Nor do I support them. I just don't demonize them. I guess I need to sit on the couch and say, "Gee doc, ya know, I just can't get myself to despise homosexuality! Do ya think you could help me, doc?"
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Um, if passivity is defined as "allowing to be penetrated" then that would mean that all women are passive participants :laugh:
Um, I've got a news flash for you, Daniel. Women aren't men.
Something else which your father may have confused you about. ;D
By the way, how do your poor, disadvantaged, black and Hispanic students view homosexuals?
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A psychologist doesn't consider homosexuality a mental illness, but would consider homophobia to be a mental illness.
Translation: It's not abnormal to have abnormal sex, but it is abnormal to think that abnormal sex is abnormal. ;D
You're translation assumes facts not in evidence. I could just as easily translate your translation into: It's not abnormal to have homosexual sex. But it is abnormal to think that this is abnormal sex.
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God clearly states in the bible that homosexuality is an abomination, he does not say that you have to hate the people, and I would not say that either, but homosexual activity is evil. It is an illness.
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It's not abnormal to have homosexual sex. But it is abnormal to think that this is abnormal sex.
Daniel, you're even worse off than the lexically challenged Tonicali.
At least he had the brains to smell a rat when he saw two men exploring each other's Hershey highways with their membra virile.
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And just about everyone who has tried to "fix it" and go through these so called "conversion programs", trying and praying with all of their might to become hetero, just ends up failing miserably only to realize that their true feelings are there to remain and there's nothing they can do to remove them. Yes, they can choose to ignore their feelings and not follow through with the behavior. But the feelings can't be controlled or changed.
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Guess what? those methods don't work. Time to find other ways! Not just give up! Unfortunately many psychologists are lazy and liberal today...Ignoring the problem will not help it go away.
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I think that the biggest case for homosexuality being natural is that there is a certain percentage in all of the animal kingdom that prefers to mate with their own gender. We as human, are animals with the same baser instincts and urges. Also, Simon Levay at the Salk institute has done autopsies on the brains of homosexuals and found that the part of the hypothalamus that controls sexual urges is either significantly smaller than those from heterosexual brains or that part is missing altogether. Now I know you won't agree with this and consider this just some liberal hogwash. But that's what I discovered with my research when I was in college.
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1. What may seem as animal homosexuality is simply animals showing dominance over the other. Not gay sex between animals. That's a farce.
2. Me may be animals..but we also have souls which allow us to control certain desires. We have this prefrontal lobe which allows us to judge and to control behavior not acceptable to society and allow us to follow laws. Animals do not have this prefrontal lobe so they mate whenever they want, they eat whenever they want, they sleep whenever they want, etc.
3. It remains to be seen about homosexual brains and heterosexual brains. My understanding of reserach like that was that it was the brains of an AIDS infected person that happened to be a homosexual versus the control. Secondly, it's not the smallness or the largeness of one's brains which qualify behavior. It is the neuron synapses and connections of the brain. We know that as one gets older and they live a certain way through nature or nurture, the connections and quality of their synapses become a certain way. And for all we know, studyign these qualities in humans in INCONCLUSIVE at this point.
4. While we are on the subject of the development of the brain...we know that as fetuses and maybe really young infants, neurons are growing and perhaps multiplying. As we get older, we start losing brain cells, but at the same time as we learn, the connections of our neurons become more quality. And as we practice doing the same things over and over again, these connections become stronger and stronger. So let's say we take a life long scientist, like you and I, as we study biology and chemistry, those synapses in our brain become stronger and stronger in relation to those subjects (in a complicated way of course). But if we chose to ignore the music side, well, at an older age, it would be hard to learn how to play a musical instrument like someone who has been playing for years as a profession. What we know about our synapses is that if you dont' use it, we lose it. Therefore, a homosexual genetic or not who is constantly practicing it and thinking about it may form these synapses and strengthen them over time.. It doesn't mean he is born with it and that it is only natural and Gd made him that way.
Sorry, buddy...
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There are people that honestly believe that the walls talk to them (to take an extreme case) homosexuality is a mental illness, they should seek psychiatric help.
Again, it's an extremely faulty comparison.
A psychologist doesn't consider homosexuality a mental illness, but would consider homophobia to be a mental illness. If a homosexual would go to a licensed therapist, he/she wouldn't try to treat the homosexuality as a mental illness. But if you were to go an express how you find homosexuality repugnant and evil, the therapist would ask a lot of questions and try to peel away all of the psychological layers and to and delve into why you have an issue with this.
True, the left is taking over, satan is gaining more and more influence in this world.
Oh, I think you give Satan just way too much credit! I for one don't believe Satan even exists. But if by chance he does, wouldn't it be nice to think that the creators of South Park got it right and that he's having a homosexual relationship with Saddam Hussein right now? :laugh: Oh, but then again, the work or the South Park creators can also be deemed the work of Satan.
And as Cartmen woudl say, "You will respect my authorita!"
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4. While we are on the subject of the development of the brain...we know that as fetuses and maybe really young infants, neurons are growing and perhaps multiplying. As we get older, we start losing brain cells, but at the same time as we learn, the connections of our neurons become more quality. And as we practice doing the same things over and over again, these connections become stronger and stronger. So let's say we take a life long scientist, like you and I, as we study biology and chemistry, those synapses in our brain become stronger and stronger in relation to those subjects (in a complicated way of course). But if we chose to ignore the music side, well, at an older age, it would be hard to learn how to play a musical instrument like someone who has been playing for years as a profession. What we know about our synapses is that if you dont' use it, we lose it. Therefore, a homosexual genetic or not who is constantly practicing it and thinking about it may form these synapses and strengthen them over time.. It doesn't mean he is born with it and that it is only natural and Gd made him that way.
Sorry, buddy...
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That's a very interesting theory and reminds me a great deal of Albert Ellis's take on homosexuality. He believes that homosexuality is a result of habitual behavior and that one can become heterosexual merely by habitually engaging in heterosexual behavior. I agree with just about about everything Albert Ellis says. But this is the one area that I disagree with Ellis or at the very least am quite sceptical about this. My suspicion is that it's the other way around with you, that you would agree with his views on homosexuality, but would disagree with him in all other areas and consider him to be the great Satan of modern psychology, right? :)
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It's not abnormal to have homosexual sex. But it is abnormal to think that this is abnormal sex.
Daniel, you're even worse off than the lexically challenged Tonicali.
At least he had the brains to smell a rat when he saw two men exploring each other's Hershey highways with their membra virile.
Exploring each other's Hershey highways with their membra virile! Now that's funny! So poetic!
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4. While we are on the subject of the development of the brain...we know that as fetuses and maybe really young infants, neurons are growing and perhaps multiplying. As we get older, we start losing brain cells, but at the same time as we learn, the connections of our neurons become more quality. And as we practice doing the same things over and over again, these connections become stronger and stronger. So let's say we take a life long scientist, like you and I, as we study biology and chemistry, those synapses in our brain become stronger and stronger in relation to those subjects (in a complicated way of course). But if we chose to ignore the music side, well, at an older age, it would be hard to learn how to play a musical instrument like someone who has been playing for years as a profession. What we know about our synapses is that if you dont' use it, we lose it. Therefore, a homosexual genetic or not who is constantly practicing it and thinking about it may form these synapses and strengthen them over time.. It doesn't mean he is born with it and that it is only natural and Gd made him that way.
Sorry, buddy...
That's a very interesting theory and reminds me a great deal of Albert Ellis's take on homosexuality. He believes that homosexuality is a result of habitual behavior and that one can become heterosexual merely by habitually engaging in heterosexual behavior. I agree with just about about everything Albert Ellis says. But this is the one area that I disagree with Ellis or at the very least am quite sceptical about this. My suspicion is that it's the other way around with you, that you would agree with his views on homosexuality, but would disagree with him in all other areas and consider him to be the great Satan of modern psychology, right? :)
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Daniel, I think you are getting me mixed with another dannycookie57 :laugh: I'm on the same page as you, but I'm coming from the right side...you are on the left side. I'm not all the way to the right like the majority of people on this forum.
Don't know Ellis..don't know anything about him. I don't know if one habitually engages in homosexuality or heterosexuality will go either way. I do believe that MANY, but not all, homosexual men are that way because they are truely attracted to masculinity. And that many heterosexual men are attracted to femininity. However, that is also irrelevant. Something in one's life must have given gratificatoin to that person to perpetually be attracted to masculinity or femininity. However, the arguement stands on whether young boys who eventually become homosexual later on in life were never interested in females and from teh beginning were interested in males. That's why, in my mind, it is inconclusive if this is something someone is born with or if it is society/Skinnerism that has resulted in some becoming homosexual...Nature vs nurture.
However, whichever it may be, once one figures out the cause, it can be prevented. Giving up on it like what many psychologists seem to do is the wrong thing to do, in my opinion.
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I'm not so sure you were censored for criticizing the Muslims as much as it was for using the term "throwing them into raw sewage." I wonder what would happen if anyone were to write something like, "throw all the Zionists into raw sewage." There's a chance this still might be censored. But I'm not sure. Perhaps it would be something to experiment with and see what happens.
I didn't say that anyone should be thrown into raw sewage. I said that the Palestinian Authority WAS throwing gay people into raw sewage, for being gay. Indybay.org apparently didn't want it known to its readership that the Palestinian Authority (which they obviously support) was treating gay people in this manner.
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Daniel, even Tonycali has learned homosexuality is an abomination. Why are you so insistent upon arguing a pro-gay viewpoint? Nobody here is saying "gas all the queers" or anything comparable. What is your beef? This is a right-wing Judeo-Christian organization. It's not like you didn't expect anti-homosexuality viewpoints coming in.
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Um, if passivity is defined as "allowing to be penetrated" then that would mean that all women are passive participants :laugh:
Um, I've got a news flash for you, Daniel. Women aren't men.
Something else which your father may have confused you about. ;D
By the way, how do your poor, disadvantaged, black and Hispanic students view homosexuals?
Probably on their PSP2's it's quite common now, I work with animals that watch porn at work on them.
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BTW, Muslims do not oppose homosexual relations (the vast majority of the men, at least, engage in it)--they only believe it is wrong to be the effeminate homosexual in these encounters.
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Daniel, even Tonycali has learned homosexuality is an abomination. Why are you so insistent upon arguing a pro-gay viewpoint? Nobody here is saying "gas all the queers" or anything comparable. What is your beef? This is a right-wing Judeo-Christian organization. It's not like you didn't expect anti-homosexuality viewpoints coming in.
chaimfan, let him argue...
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Daniel, even Tonycali has learned homosexuality is an abomination. Why are you so insistent upon arguing a pro-gay viewpoint? Nobody here is saying "gas all the queers" or anything comparable. What is your beef? This is a right-wing Judeo-Christian organization. It's not like you didn't expect anti-homosexuality viewpoints coming in.
Of course I expect it. I never said otherwise. I don't have a beef. I'm just expressing my viewpoints which I'm entitled to do just like the rest of you.
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Good point
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Who are you to sat that what God has called an abomination is not evil?
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Who are you to sat that what G-d has called an abomination is not evil?
He'll probably say Jesus
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From a practical standpoint, we should be using the militant Islamic world's treatment of gay people to break apart left-wing coalitions that include a lot of gay activists. As an example, two anti-Israel gay groups wanted to boycott the gay pride event in Jerusalem, to protest Israel's "occupation" of "Eretz Yisrael." I posted a cartoon captioned "the gay Judas goat," in which the anti-Israel gay groups were directing gay people to "Hamastine Meat Packing." It portrayed the anti-Israel gays as stooges, and perhaps deliberate ones, for countries that actually kill people for being gay.
Remember, I know what I am doing. In 2000, I broke the back of the Million Mom March, an organization more than ten thousand times my size in terms of personnel-hours and funding, by delivering one solid blow to the right target. I had a bit of luck; a columnist with national coverage printed information I sent her about the MMM using 501(c)(3) tax-exempt money to support a political campaign, but you could SEE the MMM crumple up within a week of it hitting the papers. Since one of the MMM's goals was to get out the vote for Albert Gore, and Gore lost Florida by a few hundred votes, it might have even cost him the election.
Instead of saying that Rachel Corrie was a terrorist, or supported terrorists, I have pointed out that the International Solidarity Movement said openly that she was valuable to it as a "martyr," i.e. the ISM expressed a motive for wanting her dead. Expressing a motive for wanting someone dead is heap bad juju, heap bad medicine, when one is also saying she was murdered--the accusation the ISM levels at Israel. The ISM and its allies no longer talk about Rachel Corrie in online forums where I am likely to confront them on this. There are hundreds of them, and they have a lot of funding, but they are fighting me from the position of the weaker power (i.e. hitting where they can, and running whenever their opponent confronts them). Instead of attacking the sainted memory of the ISM's doe-eyed peace martyr, I have turned her into OUR side's doe-eyed peace martyr, who might have been set up to be killed by people she trusted and considered her friends--and two ISM leaders did say how valuable Saint Rachel is to them dead. The idea is to identify something the enemy cannot possibly defend, and attack it repeatedly.
Remember, if we show tolerance (which does not imply approval or affirmation, but rather, "what you do in private is none of our business") of the gay community, we can disrupt and break up left-wing coalitions that support the Islamofascists against Israel and even the United States. Gay and feminist liberals constitute large portions of these coalitions, and stories about how the PLO/Hamas Arab Muslim Nazis treat gays while committing "honor killings" of women should shatter those coalitions like a hammer hitting an eggshell. Our goal should be to win, not to pick fights with people whose conduct is not hurting anyone else.
Wow, that sounds exactly like what Fidel Castro did to Che Guevara. When that smelly hippie/mass murderer/trustafarian Guevara no longer became useful to Castro (as a live person), and also when Castro became fed up with Guevara's BS, he sent Guevara to Bolivia, in order to spread the cancer of Communist revolution there. Being an inept guerrilla fighter (having absolutely no success outside of Cuba), he was captured (screaming "Please, don't shoot! I'm worth more to alive than dead!"), and even though the CIA wanted to spare him for interrogation, the Bolivian government had other ideas, namely executing him. Next thing you know, you have wiggers, commies, retards, hairy feminists, black pride savages, schvartza rappers, mestizo colonists, Hollywood morons, and other scum of the earth wearing T-shirts featuring Che's likeness. As much as Castro claimed to have hated capitalism, he sure loved how it did its magic in propping up the Che Guevara myth. Anyway, I guess that's where those ISM ghouls got their inspiration from, from their hero Fidel.
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Yes ISM are very cunning they hid Hamas members in there office
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G-d clearly states in the bible that homosexuality is an abomination, he does not say that you have to hate the people, and I would not say that either, but homosexual activity is evil. It is an illness.
We should make a clear distinction between "evil" and "sin." Sin, as I understand it, means "falling short of the mark," or being less of a person than you can be. Japanese might call it "losing your harmony," or failing to improve yourself continuously (an important part of Japanese culture). As an example, spending too much time on the Internet, as I often do, could fall into this category.
Evil can be defined as going against Natural Law, which Christians call the Gospel (Good News), Hindus and Chinese call Dharma and Tao respectively (the Way), and so on. It means doing something to violate the natural rights of another person, e.g. by taking his life, freedom, or property.
Homosexual activity is therefore not evil by itself, nor is out-of-wedlock heterosexual activity. It is evil only if done without consent (i.e. rape), or while exposing another person to a disease or pregnancy without his or her knowledge. As an example, a man with AIDS who has sex with anyone (male or female) without telling them beforehand, is committing evil. A woman who lies about using birth control, becomes pregnant, and then goes after the man for child support has committed an evil. Cheating on a spouse (betraying a sworn agreement) is evil, unless the spouses have what is sometimes known as the French arrangement--which is socially acceptable in certain countries, although not in the United States. It could be argued that indiscriminate consensual sex is sinful, because it cheapens and trivializes relationships, but it is not evil.
If people are born homosexual, it may be an abnormal and undesirable condition, but it is no more evil or "abominable" than having some other kind of birth defect. I do not agree that homosexuality should be taught as a normal lifestyle in our schools, nor do I agree with making gay relationships equal to traditional marriage.
On the other hand, I do not think we should use words like "abomination" or "f*****." I don't see a reason to pick a quarrel with someone over his or her lifestyle, as long as he/she doesn't try to impose it on me or shove it into my face. At that point, it is the shoving into one's face, as opposed to the lifestyle, that becomes a problem.
To quote Charlemagne in the musical comedy Pippin, :)
War is a science
With rules to be applied
Which good soldiers appreciate
Recall and recapitulate
Before they go to decimate
The other side
From a practical standpoint, we should be using the militant Islamic world's treatment of gay people to break apart left-wing coalitions that include a lot of gay activists. As an example, two anti-Israel gay groups wanted to boycott the gay pride event in Jerusalem, to protest Israel's "occupation" of "Eretz Yisrael." I posted a cartoon captioned "the gay Judas goat," in which the anti-Israel gay groups were directing gay people to "Hamastine Meat Packing." It portrayed the anti-Israel gays as stooges, and perhaps deliberate ones, for countries that actually kill people for being gay.
Remember, I know what I am doing. In 2000, I broke the back of the Million Mom March, an organization more than ten thousand times my size in terms of personnel-hours and funding, by delivering one solid blow to the right target. I had a bit of luck; a columnist with national coverage printed information I sent her about the MMM using 501(c)(3) tax-exempt money to support a political campaign, but you could SEE the MMM crumple up within a week of it hitting the papers. Since one of the MMM's goals was to get out the vote for Albert Gore, and Gore lost Florida by a few hundred votes, it might have even cost him the election.
Instead of saying that Rachel Corrie was a terrorist, or supported terrorists, I have pointed out that the International Solidarity Movement said openly that she was valuable to it as a "martyr," i.e. the ISM expressed a motive for wanting her dead. Expressing a motive for wanting someone dead is heap bad juju, heap bad medicine, when one is also saying she was murdered--the accusation the ISM levels at Israel. The ISM and its allies no longer talk about Rachel Corrie in online forums where I am likely to confront them on this. There are hundreds of them, and they have a lot of funding, but they are fighting me from the position of the weaker power (i.e. hitting where they can, and running whenever their opponent confronts them). Instead of attacking the sainted memory of the ISM's doe-eyed peace martyr, I have turned her into OUR side's doe-eyed peace martyr, who might have been set up to be killed by people she trusted and considered her friends--and two ISM leaders did say how valuable Saint Rachel is to them dead. The idea is to identify something the enemy cannot possibly defend, and attack it repeatedly.
Remember, if we show tolerance (which does not imply approval or affirmation, but rather, "what you do in private is none of our business") of the gay community, we can disrupt and break up left-wing coalitions that support the Islamofascists against Israel and even the United States. Gay and feminist liberals constitute large portions of these coalitions, and stories about how the PLO/Hamas Arab Muslim Nazis treat gays while committing "honor killings" of women should shatter those coalitions like a hammer hitting an eggshell. Our goal should be to win, not to pick fights with people whose conduct is not hurting anyone else.
Excellent post! Very well written and thought out.
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Anything that God says is wrong is evil, therefore homosexuality is evil, that's the end of the story.
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Anything that G-d says is wrong is evil, therefore homosexuality is evil, that's the end of the story.
Do you consider eating pork chops just as evil?
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FTF is a Gentile, he is not required to keep kosher. It is not evil if he eats pork chops, even to Jews. But to Jews, it is evil when other Jews eat pork chops.
Okay, point taken. The point I was trying to make is whether or not you would consider something else forbidden in the bible to be just as evil as homosexuality.
Many people claim to hate homosexuality because it says so in the bible. But in reality, it's quite the opposite. They start off with the position of hating homosexuality and then justify their hatred and intolerance by finding the passage in the bible.
Also, another question I have on this issue: Homosexuality is evil because anal sex is unnatural. So does this mean that anal sex between a man and a woman is just as evil?
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Because they are evil. What they partake in is an ABOMINATION
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Anal sex can give you serious diseases
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Sorry, guys, I had to step out for a couple of days.
This thread's original title was "Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?".
I don't know who and why has changed it to the present name.
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Sorry, guys, I had to step out for a couple of days.
This thread's original title was "Is there such a thing as gay Anti-Semitism?".
I don't know who and why has changed it to the present name.
Why did you delete your account?
The big issue about homosexuality is that it is one of the few sins that many people don't think of as a sin, it is no more of a sin than murder, the big difference is that most people recognise that murder is a sin.
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Ftf, I had to do a scientific observation over the behavior of certain creatures in critical conditions.
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Nazis themselves were homosexual, so of course there is homosexual Anti-Semitism. But they are not gay because gay really means happy. The fags hijacked the word.
Actually, the Brownshirts included homosexuals. The Nazis made gays wear pink triangles, and threw them in the gas chambers. The PLO/Hamas Arab Muslim Nazis might not make gays wear pink triangles, but they throw them into raw sewage, beat them, and even kill them. We should be using this to demolish anti-Israel coalitions that include gay people. Ah, here we go (warning, cartoon of graphic violence)--these were designed as military-grade propaganda, i.e. the kind that countries use when they are at war, for distribution at the International Solidarity Movement rally at Georgetown last year.
http://www.omdurman.org/leaflets/gays.html (http://www.omdurman.org/leaflets/gays.html)
http://www.omdurman.org/leaflets/gays.doc (http://www.omdurman.org/leaflets/gays.doc) (leaflet, Word for Windows)
Isn't homosexuality considered acceptable in Islam, provided that it's between a man and a boy?
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Ftf, I had to do a scientific observation over the behavior of certain creatures in critical conditions.
What, you deleted your account so as to scientifically analyse how we'd react?
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Ftf, I had to do a scientific observation over the behavior of certain creatures in critical conditions.
What, you deleted your account so as to scientifically analyse how we'd react?
Ftf, you are not part of them. Thank you for that.
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Zvulun ben Moshe, actually, why did you delete your account? It's good to see you post. You should create an account and take part. We need your help.
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Zvulun ben Moshe, actually, why did you delete your account? It's good to see you post. You should create an account and take part. We need your help.
Jeffguy, my respect to you.
I took a break in order not to engage into confrontation with certain creatures here who, unfortunately, run some important functions for JTF.
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No matter what it is. You are a sort of official representative of JTF on youtube. My private message wasn't personal, obviously, but business confidential. So, I am in no way intimidated. But posting it without my approval is exceeding your commission.
Write to Chaim and have me fired.
I guess, the day has come.
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No matter what it is. You are a sort of official representative of JTF on youtube. My private message wasn't personal, obviously, but business confidential. So, I am in no way intimidated. But posting it without my approval is exceeding your commission.
Write to Chaim and have me fired.
I guess, the day has come.
LOL
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;D
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Has Fruit of Thy Loin's ban been lifted? Even though he doesn't like black men, he was still a good poster.
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Chaim said that his ban will never be lifted.
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FTF is a Gentile, he is not required to keep kosher. It is not evil if he eats pork chops, even to Jews. But to Jews, it is evil when other Jews eat pork chops.
I saw a mistake above. It has come out that FTF is Jewish so he is not allowed to eat pork. Under Jewish Law, he is 100% Jewish. But he is an apostate Jew.
Yacov, I t=do not think of myself as Jewish and have no wish to think of myself as Jewish, my mother does not think of herself as Jewish and I don't think her mother really did either, three generations is a big gap.
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Fruit is banned forever!! God willing. The guy was a bad infulence on this fourm.
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Fruit is banned forever!! G-d willing. The guy was a bad infulence on this fourm.
I don't think he was. Its a communication problem.
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Yes i tend to agree with Sarah