Who is A Blue Thread really?

[Dr. Dan]

You are still a confused individual, but this time as someone who thinks black or white is bad, but gray is good. 

Meaning.  There is only right and only wrong. And only good or evil. There is no in between. Anything that is in between is still evil.

I doubt you are a true convert since most true converts don't feed into moral relativism like you do. A true Jewish convert knows the Torah and Talmud like the back of their hand. You are unable to think properly like a true Jewish convert.

And if you say some reform or conservative rabbi had a hand in converting you, you've been fooled.

I don't buy your crap.

Actually, the recent court decisions in the US a few days ago regarding 'gay marriage' had prompted me to go back and look up exactly what Leviticus says about it before I posted a reply to blog post on the subject that was in support of the decision- and this was a Jewish blogger, mind you, supporting gay marriage so I felt it was necessary for me to remind him what the Torah has to say on the issue. That's why the law was on my mind when I first saw that post; otherwise I probably would not have given it near the amount of thought I did at the time.

I see your point on the first item, the posting of anti-Semitic behavior. But in the case of the McDonald's decision, is it *really* anti-Semitic, or just anti-Israel, or just a business decision? That was my whole point on the matter. Even if McDonald's is critical of Israel on its policies toward Gaza and/or the West Bank, that doesn't automatically equate to a criticism of Judaism- do you see the difference?

I don't push the enemy's perspective all the time- but it's always a good policy to know where the opposition's mind is before you move against them, right? For example, we think "X" is a good thing, but They think "X" is a bad thing- why do they think "X" is bad? Do they have a valid reason for thinking "X" is bad, or is it just a knee-jerk reaction to us thinking "X" is good? You have to get into the enemy's thoughts before you can have much of a chance of defeating him or persuading him to change his mind.

And I really wish you folks would quit saying I'm a 'stormfronter' or whatnot- I admitted in good faith that I had some dealings with them over a decade ago, but none since then, and I left that way of thinking behind long ago. I do agree with you, though, when I first went there I was a very confused individual- I didn't think so at the time, but age and experience showed me the error of my ways and I changed for the better.

[A Blue Thread]

ET AL

You don't have to believe me if you don't want to; I'm not here to 'prove myself' to you or anyone else. I can't make you believe anything you don't want to, so in the end it's all on you. If your distrust of me is such that you- as an administrator- don't want me here, I'll be on my way; I won't stay where I'm not wanted.

[Dr. Dan]

No you missed my point.  It's not that I don't believe you. It's that it is a fact.  Your not a true convert. Get THAT through your head. You sound like a transgendered boy who insists he's a girl.

You are not a Jew.

And I disagree with your opinions. They are wrong. No matter how eloquently your putting them together, they reek of insensitivity to the good guys. You are attempting to show cruelty to the kind and kindness to the cruel through your moral equivalent approaches.

You are like Ishmael who was the same way. And if you were a true Jewish convert you would understand that metaphor.

[kyel]

Why do people think you're a Karaite convert? are you?

[A Blue Thread]

You are not a Jew.

In Shakespearean terms, "Methinks the gentleman doth protest too much". Let that suffice.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

How do you know Ralph?

I think everyone knows who Ralph is

[A Blue Thread]

Why do people think you're a Karaite convert? are you?

Perhaps they have me confused with the individual who has a Karaite website titled 'A Blue Thread'.

As for my conversion, I respectfully decline to answer that, because there are already too many labels on Jews and I refuse to add to the insanity. I don't ask anyone if they're Reform, Conservative, Orthodox, Karaite, or what have you- I don't make distinctions based on who converted whom.

[Israel Chai]

Perhaps they have me confused with the individual who has a Karaite website titled 'A Blue Thread'.

As for my conversion, I respectfully decline to answer that, because there are already too many labels on Jews and I refuse to add to the insanity. I don't ask anyone if they're Reform, Conservative, Orthodox, Karaite, or what have you- I don't make distinctions based on who converted whom.

Obvious goy is obvious.

I found the shul he converted with:

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

The only "shul" Ralph "converted" in was when he sero-converted in the men's room of a Greenwich Village sodomite brothel.

[ChabadKahanist]

Who is Ralph?
Only Ralph's I know are Ralph Hoffman & Ralph Bieber.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

I don't ask anyone if they're Reform, Conservative, Orthodox, Karaite, or what have you-

But there's nothing wrong with asking that.    A real follower of any of those things wouldn't be ashamed to admit it.   

lol.

I don't make distinctions based on who converted whom.

But Judaism does.   Reform and "Conservative" conversions are not valid.  Only orthodox conversions are performed according to the Jewish law.

[Kahane-Was-Right BT]

I haven't delved deeply enough into the post count to see what all has been said previously about McDonald's

What?  I quoted YOUR comment about Mcdonalds directly and then responded directly to you.   Stop playing dumb.

and Israel- apparently there is a lot going on there that I am not aware of. My responses to date on the McDonald's issue have been solely on the decision by McDonald's to not build a franchise in the Ariel settlement area, and nothing more.

And that's what I responded to.

They are discriminating against Jews who live in a certain place, hold certain beliefs, and will not accede to the leftist agenda which requires their suicide.   That is unjust evil.  Unjust evil which you support.

However, if there IS a problem and McDonald's is actively working against the best interest of Israel, why doesn't Tel Aviv just pull their business license and send them packing as enemies of the state? Seems to be the logical thing to do.

When did I say mcdonald's was doing that?   Either you have really poor reading comprehension or you just didn't bother to read my comment, erased all the words except for a few and wrote ET AL, followed by a reply that was completely irrelevant and very dishonest.   
And you mean "etc," not "et al."   "Et al" refers to people.   

Slimy behavior on your part.

[Dr. Dan]

In Shakespearean terms, "Methinks the gentleman doth protest too much". Let that suffice.

I know I found you out and you have nothing to say to prove who you are. You are insincere and only have your beliefs and agenda which is nazi like. If I were you, I would leave thus forum before you get banned from ever returning.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Can we just ban this sodomite already, Dan?

[Dr. Dan]

Can we just ban this sodomite already, Dan?

Not my call to do it.

[Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks]

Not my call to do it.

Wrong Dan, I meant DBN.

[Tag-MehirTzedek]

The reason I guessed Karaite is because A Blue Thread is a Karaite blog (I didn't say you were necessarily the owner), but you also have a Karaite tzitzit on your profile pic.  Karaites are the only ones that use blue threads in their tzitziot.  There are a very few Orthodox who do, but I doubt you are one of them because Orthodox would definitely be concerned with proper conversions.  Normal Orthodox Jews only wear white tzitziot because the proper blue dye (techelet) is not produced currently.

 I wear Tehellit and not a Karaite. And it is produced currently, the problem is that their are people who are never never ready for change thus now having the opportunity to wear it again is not concidered because after all one's grandfather in Poland or Morocco or Bukhara or Lithuania didn't wear it. Thats what it comes down to.
 Same with Temple, same with the laws of Eress Yisrael and knowing how to fight our enemies and all the "forgotten Halachot". Our grandparents didn't do them or its not mentioned in the Shulhan Aruch therfore it arbitrarily doesn't exist.

[angryChineseKahanist]

Do you celebrate 2-day holidays like Rosh HaShana on only one day now that we can precisely determine the correct date?

  I don't understand what you guys are talking about, but that was funny.

[muman613]

Do you celebrate 2-day holidays like Rosh HaShana on only one day now that we can precisely determine the correct date?

We do not currently use the system of calendar described by the Torah. Our calendar is pre-calculated according to an algorithm derived many years ago. In order to have a proper Jewish calender we require a sanhedrin and witnesses who report about when the New moon is visible. Thus it is impossible to determine the 'correct date' according to the current calendar. Outside of Eretz Yisrael we all observe two days of Chagim. And I believe it will be the case till we reconstruct the Sanhedrin.

[muman613]

See this article for a basic explanation of the Jewish calendar:

http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/526874/jewish/The-Jewish-Month.htm

The Lunar Cycle

The Jewish calendar is based on lunar cycles.1 Towards the beginning of the moon’s cycle, it appears as a thin crescent. That is the signal for a new Jewish month. The moon grows until it is full, the middle of the month, and then it begins to wane until it cannot be seen. It remains invisible for approximately two days2—and then the thin crescent reappears, and the cycle begins again.

The entire cycle takes approximately 29½ days.3 Since a month needs to consist of complete days, a month is sometimes twenty-nine days long (such a month is known as chaser, “missing”), and sometimes thirty (malei, “full”).

Knowing exactly when the month begins has always been important in Jewish practice, because the Torah schedules the Jewish festivals according to the days of the month.

The first day of the month, as well as the thirtieth day of a malei month, is called Rosh Chodesh, the “Head of the Month,” and has semi-festive status. See Why is Rosh Chodesh sometimes one day and sometimes two?
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Sanctifying the Month

“The L‑rd spoke to Moses and to Aaron in the land of Egypt, saying, ‘This chodesh shall be to you the head of months.’” (Exodus 12:1–2)

From the wording of this verse, “shall be to you,” the sages deduced that the responsibility of pinpointing and consecrating the chodesh, the crescent new moon, was entrusted to the leaders of our nation, the Sanhedrin, the rabbinical supreme court of every generation.

Originally, there was no fixed calendar. There was no way to determine in advance the exact day of a coming holiday or bar mitzvah, because there was no way to determine in advance when the month would begin. Each month anew, the Sanhedrin would determine whether the month would be 29 or 30 days long—depending on when the following month’s new moon was first sighted—and would sanctify the new month.

Nowadays

In the 4th century CE, the sage Hillel II foresaw the disbandment of the Sanhedrin, and understood that we would no longer be able to follow a Sanhedrin-based calendar. So Hillel and his rabbinical court established the perpetual calendar which is followed today.

According to this calendar, every month of the year, except for three, has a set number of days:

Nissan—30
Iyar—29
Sivan—30
Tamuz—29
Menachem Av—30
Elul—29
Tishrei—30
Mar Cheshvan—29 or 30
Kislev—29 or 30
Tevet—29
Shevat—30
Adar—29 (in leap years, Adar I has 30 days)

Regarding the variable months of Kislev and Cheshvan, there are three options: 1) Both can be 29 days (the year is chaser), 2) both are 30 (the year is malei), or 3) Cheshvan is 29 and Kislev is 30 (the year is k’sidran, meaning these two months follow the alternating pattern of the rest of the months). Hillel also established the rules that are used to determine whether a year is chaser, malei, or k’sidran.

The rules of the perpetual calendar also ensure that the first day of Rosh Hashanah will never take place on Sunday, Wednesday or Friday.6

When Hillel established the perpetual calendar, he sanctified every Rosh Chodesh until Moshiach will come and reestablish the Sanhedrin.

The Sanhedrin Sanctification

The following is a brief description of the procedure the Sanhedrin followed in days of yore to determine the date of the onset of a new month.

On the 30th day of every month,7 the Sanhedrin would “open for business” in a large courtyard in Jerusalem called Beit Ya’azek. Witnesses who claimed to have seen the new moon on the previous night would come to give their testimony and be cross-examined.8

The members of the Sanhedrin were well schooled in astronomy. They knew exactly when the new moon would have appeared, and where it would have been visible. Nevertheless, the sanctification of the moon depends on the crescent new moon actually being seen by two witnesses. The word “this” (in the above-quoted verse, “This month shall be to you . . .”) implies something that is actually seen.

The rabbis of the Sanhedrin would question the witnesses in the order of their arrival. They knew what the proper responses to their questions ought to be, and were thus quickly able to identify fraudulent claims. Starting with the elder of each pair, they would ask:9 “Tell us how you saw the moon:

* In which direction was it in relation to the sun?10
* Was it to the north or south?
* How high in the sky did the moon appear to be?
* In which direction were the crescent’s tips facing?
* How wide was it?”

After they had finished questioning the first witness, they would bring in his partner and question him in similar fashion. If the two accounts corroborated, the evidence was accepted.11

That day, the thirtieth day, was now declared Rosh Chodesh of the new month. The head of the Sanhedrin would proclaim: “Mekudash!” (“Sanctified!”) and everyone would respond, “Mekudash! Mekudash!” The previous month was now retroactively determined to have had only twenty-nine days.

[A Blue Thread]

Shabbat Shalom, everyone ~

As it seems I am not welcome here and my presence is distressing to many of you, I will make this my final post here and continue my search for a more open community. I am dismayed that I caused so much of a firestorm here by posting my thoughts; it was not my intention to do so. I should have spent more time researching what type of forum this is before I joined; I take responsibility for that mistake.

As for my being Jewish, I can't make any of you believe what you don't want to believe- nor should I have to. As I noted in a previous post, I was not born into Judaism- I chose it- and doing so this late in life leaves me at a disadvantage among those who have lived their whole lives immersed in the faith. There is much I still have to learn- even the most thorough conversion program can't produce someone who knows everything at the drop of a hat on Day 1. Apparently even a lifetime isn't long enough to learn everything, so why should anyone be singled out for not surpassing the best scholars? In any case, so much for welcoming converts into the community.

In closing I wish all of you all the best, and I hope that if at some point our paths cross again either in person or online it's a happier experience than this has been for me. Good afternoon, and a Good Shabbat to all.

-----

ABT

[muman613]

 I wear Tehellit and not a Karaite. And it is produced currently, the problem is that their are people who are never never ready for change thus now having the opportunity to wear it again is not concidered because after all one's grandfather in Poland or Morocco or Bukhara or Lithuania didn't wear it. Thats what it comes down to.
 Same with Temple, same with the laws of Eress Yisrael and knowing how to fight our enemies and all the "forgotten Halachot". Our grandparents didn't do them or its not mentioned in the Shulhan Aruch therfore it arbitrarily doesn't exist.

You are wrong as to the reason Orthodox Jews do not wear the thread of blue. Actually the reason we do not wear it is because there is still a valid question as to whether the dye used for the blue color is the correct Techilis as was used in the time of the giving of the Torah. It is because of this doubt as to the correct dye which leads us to not use any blue dye, not because it is what our fathers did. If there was complete agreement on the Techilis (blue die from a particular species of snail) then we would all wear the Blue Fringe.

Your explanation is simply not the truth.

http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/529771/jewish/Why-do-some-have-a-blue-string-in-their-tzitzit.htm

http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/530127/jewish/Techelet-Blue-Thread.htm

In the past century, there have been certain venerable rabbis who claimed to have identified the chilazon, based on this fish's distinguishing features described in the Talmud. Since then, tzitzit with techelet has made a comeback, and one can often spot people sporting such tallitot. There are many, however, who have cast doubts on the re-identification of the chilazon.

Rabbi Sholom DovBer, the fifth Rebbe of Lubavitch, maintained that according to the teachings of Kabbalah the chilazon will not reemerge until the coming of the Messiah.

[muman613]

Aish.com explains even more:
http://www.aish.com/atr/Blue_Techelet_Thread.html

I was in Israel recently and saw some religious men wearing tzitzit strings with a blue thread. I thought the strings were supposed to be white. What was this blue?

The Aish Rabbi Replies:

The Torah prescribes a blue dye called "techelet" to be used as one of the strings on the Tzitzit, and also used for dying priestly garments. (see Exodus 25:4 and Numbers 15:38)

However, Tzitzit are still fit for use even if they lack the blue string.

Techelet was a bluish color, obtained from the fluid of a sea creature called the chilazon (Tosefta Menachot 9:6). It is found on the coast of northern Israel, though here is a disagreement among scholars regarding what the chilazon actually is. Some say it is a snail, others say a squid, and some claim it is another type of mollusk.

At any rate, this particular dye was very precious and because of its value, the Romans (who conquered Israel in 63 BCE) seized control of its usage. This caused the Jewish dyers to go underground. By 639 CE, at the time of the Arab conquest, the secret of techelet was lost all together.

In the 1850s, Rabbi Gershon Henoch Leiner, the Radzyner Rebbe, began to search for the long lost chilazon. What he came up with was a type of squid that fit the Talmud's description. Within a few years, thousands of the rebbe's followers were wearing techelet.

However, in 1913 Rabbi Isaac Herzog (the Chief Rabbi of Ireland and later the Chief Rabbi of Israel) discovered that the techelet dye of the Radzyner Rebbe included iron fillings in the process. Rabbi Herzog ruled that this makes the dye synthetic – and thus unfit for use. Nevertheless, there are still people today who wear the Techelet of the Radzyner Rebbe.

As Rabbi Herzog continued his research, he found that the French zoologist Henri de Lacase-Duthiers had discovered a mollusk called murex trunculus that could create a blue dye. Subsequent research has prompted other Jews to use Rabbi Herzog's techelet.

Today, however, the majority of Jews still do not wear Techelet because we don't have a bona fide tradition coming from the time of the Sages of exactly which animal is used.

Next time you are in Israel, you can stop by the "Temple Institute" located in the Old City of Jerusalem to see examples of wool dyed from the various sea creatures thought to be the Chilazon. To learn more, go to www.temple.org.il and www.tekhelet.co.il.

There are many esoteric meanings to the techelet thread. The Midrash says, "Whoever observes the mitzvah of tzitzit is considered as if he greeted the Divine Presence, for techelet resembles the sea, and the sea resembles the sky, and the sky resembles God's holy throne." (Sifrei – Shelach) Thus the techelet thread is a method of gaining the highest levels of spirituality.

May the Almighty reveal the secret of the chilazon, speedily in our days!

[muman613]

I have a friend in minyan who does wear a blue thread, but he is the only one in our community who does. Anyone is entitled to do so, but whether it is Techelit is still debatable.

[muman613]

http://www.oztorah.com/2007/06/thread-of-blue-ask-the-rabbi/

Thread of blue – Ask the Rabbi

Q. Why don’t we have a thread of blue among the fringes of the tallit, as required by the 3rd paragraph of the Sh’ma?

A. The thread of blue commanded in Parashat Sh’lach (Num. 15:38) had to be t’chelet. Its purpose, according to the rabbis, is that blue suggests the sea, the sea suggests the heavens, and the heavens suggest the Throne of Glory. Thus the tzitziyyot with the blue thread are a reminder of our duty to God. In other ancient cultures the wearing of blue or purple was also highly esteemed as a mark of royalty (“royal blue”) or nobility.

The t’chelet dye derived from a snail called a chillazon, a small marine creature with a hard shell which was found along Israel’s northern coast. The dyeing process came to an end in the 7th century CE when the secret of the chillazon was lost. The Midrash then declared, “Now we have only white (fringes), for the t’chelet is not found” (Num. R. 17:5). It appears that with the Arab conquest the Palestinian dyeing industry came to an end, though here and there traces of it remained.
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