JTF.ORG Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Yerusha on October 28, 2012, 08:03:37 PM
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Would the "New Kach" party http://www.jpost.com/Headlines/Article.aspx?id=289591
led by Marzel, Ben Ari and Ben Gvir get Chayim's vote?
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_JBpDTzxDREY/TMgQxettXQI/AAAAAAAADLM/GazaH2P1Mrw/s1600/ben+gvir,+marzel+(2r)+en+Michael+ben+Ari.jpg)
Or is it still too early to tell?
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I wouldn't trust Marzel as far as I could throw him. I remember Chaim saying once that Marzel denied receiving a large donation from him, when he needed funds to run for office. For that alone, Marzel wouldn't get dime 1 from me, or my vote.
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Sounds great. Ben-Ari, Federman, Marzel and Ben Gvir.
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Ir says in the article, they are specifically not making a new Kach.
Btw didn't ben ari announce last week he was running with aryeh eldad?
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Oh Federman's on the list? Sweet.
Actually not sure (Dont know), but from the picture it is (from left to right) Ben Gvir, Noam Federman, Baruch Marzel and Ben Ari.
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I am planning to vote for them (bli neder), unless an even more right wing option becomes available.
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בס''ד
Noam Federman the hero does not support them. Neither do I.
After the presidential election in the U.S., we plan on doing Hebrew videos where we will explain why these are phony political opportunists who have betrayed all Kahanist principles.
The Knesset election is January 22. We are still concentrating on trying to beat Barack Hussein Obama. But after November 6, we will deal with the Israeli election extensively.
Stay tuned.
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Oh Federman's on the list? Sweet.
I don't think so, it seems like just a random picture taken in Hebron on some unrelated matter. I would be very surprised if Federman joined them.
What really happened is that the National Union combined with Haba'it Hayehudi, and in that arrangement they pushed Michael Ben Ari down the list with little to no chances of getting in the Knesset, they pushed down and out Aryeh Eldad too. So Ben Ari and Eldad are probably going to run together in a joint list.
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I don't think so, it seems like just a random picture taken in Hebron on some unrelated matter. I would be very surprised if Federman joined them.
What really happened is that the National Union combined with Haba'it Hayehudi, and in that arrangement they pushed Michael Ben Ari down the list with little to no chances of getting in the Knesset, they pushed down and out Aryeh Eldad too. So Ben Ari and Eldad are probably going to run together in a joint list.
Exactly.
Although I don't think Ben Ari or Eldad are bad people, they certainly say openly they are NOT kahanists. So thinking of this arrangement as "New Kach" is completely senseless. Not to mention, that whatever they are doing will not succeed.
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Sad to see that people with basically the same ideology fighting each other. Think of it this way, the leftists want different groups fighting each other over petty differences. It is not like their are 2 different parties and you are saying to vote for 1 and not the other. Inflating these little differences makes it worse for all of us. (Whether it is them to you or you to them).
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Sad to see that people with basically the same ideology fighting each other. Think of it this way, the leftists want different groups fighting each other over petty differences. It is not like their are 2 different parties and you are saying to vote for 1 and not the other. Inflating these little differences makes it worse for all of us. (Whether it is them to you or you to them).
lol, but they are the ones who just now formed a splinter party.
And the fact is, that they do NOT have the same ideology. Ben Ari does NOT have the same ideology as Kahanists. And he openly states his differences. Although I believe he's generally a good person.
You are right that people can't agree on the basic things and prioritize them. But the fault lies with the mainstream religious zionist politicians who have the wrong and very twisted values and therefore will never agree to certain basic Jewish values, and of course the religious zionist public who follows such people like sheep and therefore lends the major support to them rather than to people like Eldad or Ben Ari (or, perish the thought, an actual Kahanist)
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lol, but they are the ones who just now formed a splinter party.
And the fact is, that they do NOT have the same ideology. Ben Ari does NOT have the same ideology as Kahanists. And he openly states his differences. Although I believe he's generally a good person.
what is soo different about his ideology then let's say to yours, or to Chaim's? It is basically the same.
By the way why are soo harsh and exacting with them yett are willing to work with different religions and turn a blind eye to that. Perhaps if they happened to say something about JTF they were really saying about the non-Jewish pandering that they were attacking (but either way why not push both of these things aside).
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what is soo different about his ideology then let's say to yours, or to Chaim's? It is basically the same.
Ben Ari doesn't want the arabs out. And does Ben Ari want to radically change the nature of the state of Israel to a Jewish state rather than state of Jews? Not from what I've seen.
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Ben Ari doesn't want the arabs out. And does Ben Ari want to radically change the nature of the state of Israel to a Jewish state rather than state of Jews? Not from what I've seen.
Really? I don't think that is true. Not at all. He might not be as vocal about it, but for sure he wants the Arabs about. I did hear him say such things.
Anyway even if we don't get the 100% results we would like, not voting is almost basically giving the votes to the Leftists.
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what is soo different about his ideology then let's say to yours, or to Chaim's? It is basically the same.
By the way why are soo harsh and exacting with them yett are willing to work with different religions and turn a blind eye to that. Perhaps if they happened to say something about JTF they were really saying about the non-Jewish pandering that they were attacking (but either way why not push both of these things aside).
Personally, I would work with them. From what I understand they do not want to work with Chaim, but I don't know the specifics.
I am sick and tired of all the fool's gold, phony right wing parties (National Union being a prime example).
Speaking of individuals involved in this, anyone who goes around making a point of professing to be a "former Kahanist" is clearly someone who is not prepared to deal with the Arab terrorist problem.
That said, I do think MARZEL is a Kahanist, and I respect him. I certainly wouldn't want to impede any good things they try to do, and I would hope whatever good things they do would succeed. I definitely don't want to combat them.
But this idea for yet another splinter party just will not work. I suspect they also will not be able to formulate a coherent ideology or platform, just as all failed sectoral parties.
And they certainly don't have the charismatic personality to make this party a hit.
And they certainly are not going to attack the RZ establishment to take votes away from them.
And they certainly are not going to attack the Shas treason to take votes away from them.
They will certainly have yet another failed political strategy while the Likud and Lieberman tyranny will reign supreme with no one to stop them.
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Surely the Likud-Beiteinu bloc is going to force the Ultra-Rightwing Wing parties to unify in to one bloc party.
Eldad, Feiglin, Marzel, Federman, Ben Ari, Laniado, Druckman, Ben Gvir, Katzaleh etc all have HUMONGOUS egos and typical overblown, misplaced Israeli self-inflated pride, grudges, irks and petty jealousies.
But they are soon going to realise that "uni nous somme plus fort- disuni nous somme perdus!" - "United we are strong - disunited WE ARE DOOMED!"
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I agree with Tag that in a way {I am not putting words in his mouth}. While we may not find actual politicians who would openly support the 'kahanist' position, we should be looking for some who may be on the fence and who could influence their party to shift. I believe that there are some, such as these, who offer more hope than the 'phony right' which is spoken about so much here.
Constantly belittling Feiglin and Marzel for whatever they may have said concerning JTF doesn't really help matters. Maybe they need to distance themselves from appearing too much associated with the far right, so they try to say things which will give them cover for their true beliefs.
I agree that none of these are of the level of Rabbi Kahane, nor do they seem to want to go down that road. But I believe that sometimes, especially in politics, one needs to make alliances even if the core goals are not achieved right away, with the hope of shifting political opinion toward the right.
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I think it's going to have to take a third generation Kahanist to unite the Jewish people. Those were under the tutoledge of Kahane (with the exception of Chaim) are not capable of changing the hearts and minds of Israeli Jews. It will be the generation that did not know Kahane, but only knew of him, that will be able to change the hearts and minds of Israeli Jews. And that person will be able to unite true Kahanists along with wanna be Kahanists making the wanna be Kahanists become more true Kahanists.
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Surely the Likud-Beiteinu bloc is going to force the Ultra-Rightwing Wing parties to unify in to one bloc party.
Eldad, Feiglin, Marzel, Federman, Ben Ari, Laniado, Druckman, Ben Gvir, Katzaleh etc all have HUMONGOUS egos and typical overblown, misplaced Israeli self-inflated pride, grudges, irks and petty jealousies.
Frst off I dont think you would get away (here) with saying that Federman has an inflated ego. Nor do I believe that the other necessarily do either.
Are you trying to furthur stirr things? Seems like it, WONGA.
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Frst off I dont think you would get away (here) with saying that Federman has an inflated ego. Nor do I believe that the other necessarily do either.
Are you trying to furthur stirr things? Seems like it, WONGA.
This is what I thought since his first post...
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I think it's going to have to take a third generation Kahanist to unite the Jewish people. Those were under the tutoledge of Kahane (with the exception of Chaim) are not capable of changing the hearts and minds of Israeli Jews. It will be the generation that did not know Kahane, but only knew of him, that will be able to change the hearts and minds of Israeli Jews. And that person will be able to unite true Kahanists along with wanna be Kahanists making the wanna be Kahanists become more true Kahanists.
How are we to change the minds of Israelis if they would be and are exposed to different Kahanists not uniting and not changing things, but spending time and effort fighting THEMSELVES. Would the average, uninformed or even informed person like or want people like that taking over and running the country. Is that the hope and change "Kahanists" would bring?
By the way I dont even think one necessarily needs to be classified even as a "Kahanist" to be working together for the betterment of the Jewish nation and for Kiddush Hashem. Compromises in Halacha and core belief should not be tolerated yett their are some differences (in strategy) that can be tolerated and accepted.
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In the interests of unity Katzaleh is prepared to lower his position on the list to 7th in order, he believes, to increase the winnings for Ichud Leumi/Bayit Yehudi
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/161536
He states: "I also asked the party to ensure that the five candidates in front of me in the National Union are all Sephardim".
But "Be not overly humble", and does this not give the impression that an Ashkenaz is deferring, even demeaning himself, before Sephardim?
Or is Katz savvy?
(http://www.ziontimes.com/images/israel/20081012_2.jpg)
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Yawn!
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Yawn!
Lol.
Indeed.
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Again starting to stirr sh^t as usual. I dont know a lot about Ktzelen but posting an old photo of him with Sharon in an attempt to make him look bad is low. At that time it was Sharon who was building and supporting Jewish settlement in the land of Israel. That was then. Soo what if he appears in a picture with him? That is like defaming Rav Kahane for him earlier supporting Begin although later Begin did F@$% up.
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Again starting to stirr sh^t as usual. I dont know a lot about Ktzelen but posting an old photo of him with Sharon in an attempt to make him look bad is low. At that time it was Sharon who was building and supporting Jewish settlement in the land of Israel. That was then. Soo what if he appears in a picture with him? That is like defaming Rav Kahane for him earlier supporting Begin although later Begin did F@$% up.
I don't know what the dude's malfunction is, but certain things he puts up are better off ignored. This stuff about katzeleh certainly doesn't make logical sense nor does it have a coherent point. Par for the course.
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How are we to change the minds of Israelis if they would be and are exposed to different Kahanists not uniting and not changing things, but spending time and effort fighting THEMSELVES. Would the average, uninformed or even informed person like or want people like that taking over and running the country. Is that the hope and change "Kahanists" would bring?
By the way I dont even think one necessarily needs to be classified even as a "Kahanist" to be working together for the betterment of the Jewish nation and for Kiddush Hashem. Compromises in Halacha and core belief should not be tolerated yett their are some differences (in strategy) that can be tolerated and accepted.
The reason why I say third generation is because it will take that long for a logical group of Jews to know how to present this idealism properly without fighting about minutia.
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The reason why I say third generation is because it will take that long for a logical group of Jews to know how to present this idealism properly without fighting about minutia.
I think we can and should do what needs to be done now. Waiting to repair some possible old wounds wont do it. Their is such things as forgiveness and forgetting silly divisive things. Dont we all ask for forgiveness at least at the time of the 10 days of repentance? (BW Rosh Hashana and Yom Kippur).
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Sad to see that people with basically the same ideology fighting each other. Think of it this way, the leftists want different groups fighting each other over petty differences. It is not like their are 2 different parties and you are saying to vote for 1 and not the other. Inflating these little differences makes it worse for all of us. (Whether it is them to you or you to them).
בס''ד
What the leftists really want is for us to support "right-wingers" who betray all of their principles just to have seats in the Knesset.
Ben Ari, Marzel and Ben Gvir have "basically the same ideology" as JTF? Here is just a small sample of what they stand for:
*Ben Ari has said that "the stupidest thing Israel could do" is to destroy Iran's nuclear bomb-making program. Thus, Ben Ari is to the left of Bibi Netanyahu and even Ehud Barak on the Iranian nuclear threat.
*Ben Ari has repeatedly said "zichrono livracha" (may his memory be blessed) after mentioning the name of Yitzchak Rabin ys"v. Thus, Ben Ari uses the traditional Jewish blessing to bless the memory of Rabin, who murdered 16 Jewish heroes in cold blood on the Altalena. Rabin is also responsible for the murder of 1800 Jews who were slaughtered as a result of the treasonous Oslo accords. No one forced Ben Ari to do this, indeed no one asked him to. He on his own initiative wrote a letter to the chairman of the Knesset in which Ben Ari repeatedly blessed Rabin's memory. Ben Ari might as well bless the memory of Rabin's friend Yasser Arafat.
*Ben Ari shook hands with the traitors of the extreme leftwing Meretz party (who favor Israel's destruction) and blessed them as well with "shana tova" (good new year).
*Marzel took money that I sent him and placed it in an Arab Muslim Nazi bank.
*Marzel and Ben Gvir had a forum on their web site. They appointed Uzi Zalka to be the administrator of the forum. The mentally ill Zalka then started praising Hitler and the holocaust on the forum and also uploaded numerous videos to youtube praising Hitler and the holocaust. When I told Ben Gvir about this, he incredibly refused to remove Zalka from his position for several months until I finally started exposing this with videos.
*Ben Ari publicly condemned a courageous Kahanist young lady because she called Sudanese Muslim illegal alien criminals "animals". Ben Ari said that they are not "animals" and that he personally helped one. Of course, helping them in any way only encourages them to flood into Israel.
*Ben Ari said that Israeli Jewish taxpayers should bail out the extreme left-wing Maariv newspaper from bankruptcy. Ben Ari will say or do anything to suck up to the Bolshevik Israeli news media.
I am not even mentioning how Ben Ari publicly ridiculed our movement in Israel in order to show his friends in the left-wing news media that he is not an "extremist".
Rabin, Meretz, Maariv and the Sudanese Muslims he blesses, praises and defends. True Kahanists he condemns and ridicules. Now you see why the left-wing news media gives him so much favorable coverage.
"Basically the same ideology"?!
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In defense of those statements I must say that the image, not knowing what you know Chaim, is that these guys have said things which can be seen as similar to our position. I am sure that you know more than most of us. But my question to you Chaim is this.... What are we doing?
Our situation seems pretty hopeless at this point. I don't mean to be controversial but I have a legitimate question of us all. What are we going to do? We have no politician in the current system which can do anything to save our land. What I think we need is to make alliances with the existing political system, establish which politicians are the ones who will achieve the goals we envision.
But it seems we are always knocking the people in government, and we have no tangible ability to influence the system.
While bringing down the 'phony right' let us also build up an alternative, one which offers hope to us all. Because without hope we cannot continue, without strength from Hashem to keep us moving in the right direction we will wither.
In your most honest opinion, Chaim, could you offer us some names and parties which you think offer us hope?
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Ben Ari on Iran- http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/159550#.UJE4QsXA99U
He is saying to attack Gaza first before Iran and not ignore that problem (the missiles coming in from Gaza).
I dont see him directly saying not to attack Iran and not to confront that issue
About the statements on rabin. Perhaps it was sarcastic? What was the exact context and is their proof (like a video or something?). Other similar statements were made by different people but they were sarcastic. From what I know Noam Federman also made such statements such as "its a holiday soo we celebrate" and other such things basically mocking them. Soo it could have been the same here just reading it somewhere is not the same as actually seeing it.
Shaking hands is not necessarily a crime. Some would others do not. Heck Romney shakes hands with Obama yett they hate each other and are enemies. Perhaps he was trying to win them over since their are different ways to approach a situation. sometimes with full force (also very good) other times perhaps giving them chance to change their heart.
The rest I dont know too much about.
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I was really hoping Chaim would answer this question.... I am patient but I hope this thread doesn't just disappear.
http://jtf.org/forum/index.php/topic,64901.msg566947.html#msg566947
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I agree with Muman. What alternatives are there. And if not now, when? When will there be one. Kahanism today is completely disorganized. There are remnants of the older Kahanist generation and their kids/grandkids. There are newcomers to Kahanism. But no central leadership and no central authority. No one can stand up to the task because if someone does, the other groups immediately discredit each other. Whether in the days of Revava vs Kfar Tapuach vs Kahane.org vs JTF vs Bnai Elim vs JDL vs.. every other group. We are all "splinters" "liars" "do nothing" "traitors" etc..etc.. No one can be first, no one can step up and no one can lead "Kahanism". So then where is the future of Kahanism? What are WE doing to change Israel and the world?
Ahavat Yisrael, Hadar, Barzel, Mishma'at, Bitachon. We all believe in it but heaven forbid someone try to organize anything. I think the only time where Kahanist try to put their issues aside is during the yearly Rabbi Kahane memorial. And Rav Binyamin''s memorial. (http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/Flash.aspx/253494#.UJIEZoZqA1I (http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/Flash.aspx/253494#.UJIEZoZqA1I))
From my perspective. While I am completely pro-Kahanism...if a group comes into power that is not Kahanist but pro-Torah, right wing etc I would support them.
I don't expect Moshiach to be a hardcore Kahanist, maybe he won't be, maybe he will. That's ok.
To me the message of Kahanism is that it is a step in the right direction. And a message that will go on and will continue. But a central Kahanist leadership is close to impossible. And if it is close to impossible, I believe it can inspire the next generation of future rightwing leadership.
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I hope I didn't offend anyone with my post. If I did then I apologize.
I did not mean anything against this group. I just get frustrated in general with the way things are.
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In defense of those statements I must say that the image, not knowing what you know Chaim, is that these guys have said things which can be seen as similar to our position. I am sure that you know more than most of us. But my question to you Chaim is this.... What are we doing?
Our situation seems pretty hopeless at this point. I don't mean to be controversial but I have a legitimate question of us all. What are we going to do? We have no politician in the current system which can do anything to save our land. What I think we need is to make alliances with the existing political system, establish which politicians are the ones who will achieve the goals we envision.
But it seems we are always knocking the people in government, and we have no tangible ability to influence the system.
While bringing down the 'phony right' let us also build up an alternative, one which offers hope to us all. Because without hope we cannot continue, without strength from Hashem to keep us moving in the right direction we will wither.
In your most honest opinion, Chaim, could you offer us some names and parties which you think offer us hope?
בס''ד
Do you want the hard truth? The hard truth is that all of the politicians and parties in Israel are phonies who are more concerned about their own political future than the future of the Jewish people. That includes Michael Ben Ari, Baruch Marzel and Itamar Ben Gvir.
Ben Ari has been in the Knesset for almost four years. He has not accomplished anything because he is unwilling to truly confront the establishment that is destroying the country. During the time Ben Ari has been in the Knesset, things have gotten worse on every issue. Giving him another four years in the Knesset will not bring any better results than the past four years.
The only solution is to tell the truth and wake up the Jewish people. That is what we are trying to do. It is very hard to do with a very limited budget but we must reach as many Jews as possible. We have no intention of giving Jews false hopes and illusions. Jews must change their entire way of thinking and acting in order to bring redemption. There are no shortcuts.
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I agree with Muman. What alternatives are there. And if not now, when? When will there be one. Kahanism today is completely disorganized. There are remnants of the older Kahanist generation and their kids/grandkids. There are newcomers to Kahanism. But no central leadership and no central authority. No one can stand up to the task because if someone does, the other groups immediately discredit each other. Whether in the days of Revava vs Kfar Tapuach vs Kahane.org vs JTF vs Bnai Elim vs JDL vs.. every other group. We are all "splinters" "liars" "do nothing" "traitors" etc..etc.. No one can be first, no one can step up and no one can lead "Kahanism". So then where is the future of Kahanism? What are WE doing to change Israel and the world?
Ahavat Yisrael, Hadar, Barzel, Mishma'at, Bitachon. We all believe in it but heaven forbid someone try to organize anything. I think the only time where Kahanist try to put their issues aside is during the yearly Rabbi Kahane memorial. And Rav Binyamin''s memorial. (http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/Flash.aspx/253494#.UJIEZoZqA1I (http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/Flash.aspx/253494#.UJIEZoZqA1I))
From my perspective. While I am completely pro-Kahanism...if a group comes into power that is not Kahanist but pro-Torah, right wing etc I would support them.
I don't expect Moshiach to be a hardcore Kahanist, maybe he won't be, maybe he will. That's ok.
To me the message of Kahanism is that it is a step in the right direction. And a message that will go on and will continue. But a central Kahanist leadership is close to impossible. And if it is close to impossible, I believe it can inspire the next generation of future rightwing leadership.
בס''ד
We are the true Kahanist leadership. We do not betray principles and we have a history of accomplishing great historic things - such as freeing over 1.5 Soviet Jews.
Our message is the message that can change things. You see it with our great videos in both Hebrew and English - our videos are powerful and convincing. But we have to achieve one of three goals in order to become a mass movement:
*If we can ever raise millions of dollars, we will become a mass movement. Unfortunately, this was something that Rabbi Kahane also was unable to do - he never had a multimillion dollar budget. When will we finally have an adequate budget? I have no idea. But when we do, with G-d's help, we will take off in Israel like a rocket.
*If I am able to finally make aliyah, that will also be a big boost for our movement in Israel.
*If we find a way to increase the number of people seeing our videos from thousands every month to millions every month - or even hundreds of thousands in Israel every month, then we will become a mass movement. How do we do this? If I knew, we would have done it already.
If we achieve any of these three goals, we will be in a position to dramatically changes for the better. So we have to keep striving in the hope that eventually we catch a break, G-d willing. In the meantime, we still try to change things with what we have. We are not allowed to be silent and we are not. We do influence the thousands who see our videos on a regular basis. Admittedly, it's not enough but it is worthwhile. The young Israeli Jews seeing these videos can become the Kahanes of the future.
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I am not happy about some of the statements MK Ben Ari has made about "African refugees" and his stance on the issue of the Oslo Criminal, Rabin.
But on the majority of issues, I probably agree with him, and he and his new party are the ones most likely to press for the repeal of Anti-Kahane laws and most of our agenda.
In any case, Rabbi Yisrael Ariel (head of Machon Hamikdash) , who was #2 on Rabbi Kahane's party list, told me (several years ago, when I was thinking of boycotting the elections) that I have to vote and choose the lesser of evils.
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בס''ד
Ben Ari on Iran- http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/159550#.UJE4QsXA99U
He is saying to attack Gaza first before Iran and not ignore that problem (the missiles coming in from Gaza).
I dont see him directly saying not to attack Iran and not to confront that issue
This shows that Ben Ari is completely unfit to be a Jewish leader. What an idiotic statement. Hamas missiles from Gaza are a "bigger problem" than a nuclear Iran which can lead to a nuclear holocaust?! BTW Ben Ari also has no solution for missiles from Gaza because he has abandoned the Kahanist platform of getting the Arab Nazis out of Gaza which is the only thing that would solve the problem.
As far as your claim that Ben Ari is not suggesting that Israel not attack Iran, just to clear up any doubt, here is the interview that he did in Hebrew in which he explicitly states: "one of the stupidest things that Israel could do is to attack the Iranians". Ben Ari adds: "It is impossible to stop nuclear arming [of Iran]". He also says that Iran is not Israel's problem and that "we [Israel] are the last ones who are threatened by the Iranian threat". Ben Ari then tells us that the Saudis and the Europeans are more threatened by the Iranian threat than Israel!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tf9fpeJRscM
G-d help us with leaders like Ben Ari who learned nothing from the holocaust and are willing to allow Iranian Muslim Nazis who vow to exterminate us obtain nuclear weapons.
One final point: you really should change your user name if you want to support Ben Ari. Because in this same interview, he condemns the underground fighters of Tag Mechir who risk their freedom and their lives to try to save the Jewish people.
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Michael Ben-Ari is reminding me a whole lot of that other fraud, Mike Guzofsky.
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This is like the worst interview ever. It is not a simple slip of the tong or a rush dismissal, he developed a whole thesis against attacking Iran while also admitting the sanctions aren't going to stop them either and it is inevitable that they will go nuke so we should just let them and be quiet.
He is worse then Shimon Peres and any other Israeli politician on that issue.
And one more thing, at the last sentence he also condemns tag mechir. This is no Kahanist.
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Chaim serious question- if you had the opportunity to be in Israel now and to run but your only way of getting in (at least in the beginning) would be with them would you turn it down? Wouldn't you run, be in and try to use that influence to change things for the good of Am Yisrael? Just a though.
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Chaim serious question- if you had the opportunity to be in Israel now and to run but your only way of getting in (at least in the beginning) would be with them would you turn it down? Wouldn't you run, be in and try to use that influence to change things for the good of Am Yisrael? Just a though.
בס''ד
It would be difficult for me to run with someone who says that a nuclear Iran is not a problem for Israel. Or someone who literally had a Nazi as an admin on their forum. Or someone who puts money given to them in Arab Nazi banks. Or someone who blesses mass murderers like Rabin or Meretz members but condemns the underground fighters of Tag Mechir.
Most of all, it would difficult for me to run with someone who does these things and then claims that this is Kahanism.
I could run with non-Kahanists whom I disagree with on some issues more easily than with fake "Kahanists" who are distorting the ideology of my rabbi, my leader and my mentor.
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What do you mean about him putting money into muslim banks? What is he doing exactly and what is his purpose?
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What do you mean about him putting money into muslim banks? What is he doing exactly and what is his purpose?
בס''ד
I sent money to Baruch Marzel and when my check came back, I noticed that it had been deposited in an Arab Nazi bank. Marzel opened bank accounts in Arab Nazi banks.
A true Kahanist boycotts Arab Nazi businesses.
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בס''ד
I sent money to Baruch Marzel and when my check came back, I noticed that it had been deposited in an Arab Nazi bank. Marzel opened bank accounts in Arab Nazi banks.
A true Kahanist boycotts Arab Nazi businesses.
That is bizarre. Why would he do that?
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That is bizarre. Why would he do that?
Obviously, because he is a Judenrat kapo.
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That is bizarre. Why would he do that?
בס''ד
Who knows? Maybe they offered a higher interest rate or it was more convenient to bank there for some reason.
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Chaim, after months of open for support for Mitt Romney as the lesser of evils, I have difficulty in understanding why you can't apply the same logic to supporting Israeli politicians who at least claim to be Kahanists, even if they have some of the drawbacks that you have already pointed out.
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Chaim, after months of open for support for Mitt Romney as the lesser of evils, I have difficulty in understanding why you can't apply the same logic to supporting Israeli politicians who at least claim to be Kahanists, even if they have some of the drawbacks that you have already pointed out.
How is Chaim being inconsistent?
He is opposing the so-called "conservative Republican" Dan Halloran (ysv) because he is an evil piece of crap. He would back an honest liberal Republican or even a pro-Obama Democrat before he would back Halloran, because Halloran is worse.
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בס''ד
Who knows? Maybe they offered a higher interest rate or it was more convenient to bank there for some reason.
I dont know these laws well, nor am I in such a position (to borrow or lend), but perhaps this has to do with the fact that many still hold that a Jew cannot earn interest from another Jew (directly for sure everyone agrees) with a bank still many do hold by that, although some say that with a bank it is different since its a business and has investors etc.
Soo if he was making $ off a bank, he did not want to earn interest from a Jewish bank soo made $ off an Arab bank. Anyway he was making $ off them and not the other way around.
According to Halacha a Jew cannot charge another Jew interest nor can he pay interest to another Jew. With a non-Jew both are allowed. To pay and get paid. Soo maybe he was taking that into consideration since i believe Haredim (most if not all) hold that way and thus would not and do not deal with any Jewish owned bank.
Can you directly speak with him or some of these people and deal with these issues?
http://machonshilo.org/en/eng/list-audio-shiurim/41-audiohalakha/234-prosbol-how-can-a-torah-misswah-be-cancelled-
- He holds it is not forbidden for a Jewish Bank to charge interest.
- But never-the-less I did discuss a little about this with another Rabbi and he did say that one should not pay interest to a Jewish owned bank (thus meaning not to borrow from them).
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Anyone who saw Ibn Assad (Ben Ari in Arabic) speaking live on Thursday could understand what this fag is all about: he said the word "Knesset" 10 times more than he said "Kahane". No wonder the entire audience (even his sworn supporters) fell asleep
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Would you rather give them the interest back, invest in the Swiss, or give money to people that will us it to kill your brothers?
No, but I said their could have been a misunderstanding or something and a mistake perhaps.
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Fine, scratch that, we all suddenly support giving money to muslims, and we understand the little whoopsies when your money just happens to fall into an Arabic ATM. There are some Jews named mohammed like this imaginary friend nobody has, and he said shalom, so this guy thought he was wearing a big square kippah. Also, something validates this.
Do you still like this guy?
Are you ookay? Where did I say to do any dealings with Arabs in Israel?
I would like to hear directly from him (if possible) to give his explanation and or perhaps say he did wrong and move on.
I was just saying and giving possible scenarios that could have arisen because lending and taking interest from a Jew is a serious matter.
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I dont know these laws well, nor am I in such a position (to borrow or lend), but perhaps this has to do with the fact that many still hold that a Jew cannot earn interest from another Jew (directly for sure everyone agrees) with a bank still many do hold by that, although some say that with a bank it is different since its a business and has investors etc.
Soo if he was making $ off a bank, he did not want to earn interest from a Jewish bank soo made $ off an Arab bank. Anyway he was making $ off them and not the other way around.
According to Halacha a Jew cannot charge another Jew interest nor can he pay interest to another Jew. With a non-Jew both are allowed. To pay and get paid. Soo maybe he was taking that into consideration since i believe Haredim (most if not all) hold that way and thus would not and do not deal with any Jewish owned bank.
Can you directly speak with him or some of these people and deal with these issues?
http://machonshilo.org/en/eng/list-audio-shiurim/41-audiohalakha/234-prosbol-how-can-a-torah-misswah-be-cancelled-
- He holds it is not forbidden for a Jewish Bank to charge interest.
- But never-the-less I did discuss a little about this with another Rabbi and he did say that one should not pay interest to a Jewish owned bank (thus meaning not to borrow from them).
בס''ד
You have to be kidding.
First of all, you are allowed to put money in a bank and earn interest. Marzel opened a bank account with money he raised. He didn't take out a loan.
You are never allowed to conduct business with Nazi Jew-killers who are working to destroy your people. Arab Nazi banks are the economic pillars of the Arab Nazi campaign to destroy Israel from within. Marzel was willing to do business with them and give them legitimacy.
When his donors started to complain, Marzel changed course and opened an account in an Israeli bank. The fact that he was willing to open an account in an Arab Nazi bank shows that Marzel has no principles and cannot be trusted.
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Chaim, after months of open for support for Mitt Romney as the lesser of evils, I have difficulty in understanding why you can't apply the same logic to supporting Israeli politicians who at least claim to be Kahanists, even if they have some of the drawbacks that you have already pointed out.
בס''ד
You're comparing apples and oranges.
Unlike Obama, Romney will not obsessively pressure Israel to retreat to the pre-1967 suicidal borders and to allow Nazi Iran to build nuclear bombs. So Romney is obviously preferable.
But electing phony "Kahanists" to the Knesset in Israel only hurts the Jewish cause. Michael Ben Ari the "Kahanist" says that Iranian nuclear bombs are not a problem for Israel. Ben Ari tells us that Netanyahu is lying when he says that a nuclear Iran is a threat to Israel. Ben Ari claims that it is impossible to stop the Iranian nuclear program and it would be "the stupidest thing" for Israel to try to stop it. Ben Ari's position is dangerous and crazy - he is misleading his fellow Jews and doing so in the name of Kahanism.
And this is just one of numerous issues in which Ben Ari does great damage.
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The politicians here including the self proclaimed "Kahanists"(sic) like Ben Ari,Ben Givir & Marzel make a great deal of noise about the Sudanese infiltrators but are totally silent about the smega infested uncircumcised Russsian Goyim Anti-Semites who are given Israeli citizenship,why the silence? Why the hypocracy?
If the Sudanese must go the Russian Goyim must go as well.
See http://pogrom.org.il/eng_articles.php?art_id=16
& also see http://pogrom.org.il/eng_articles.php?art_id=36
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Chaim is is 100 % correct on his assessment of Ben Ari.
Real Authentic Jews are denied the right to make aliyah or even enter the country like Chaim while smega infested uncircumcised Russian Goyim get "aliyah" with ease.
There are Russian Goyim neo-nazis with a teudat zehut (Israeli ID card) with all benefits & Ben Ari is busy chasing schvartzers & doing nothing to help real Jews.
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The politicians here including the self proclaimed "Kahanists"(sic) like Ben Ari,Ben Givir & Marzel make a great deal of noise about the Sudanese infiltrators but are totally silent about the smega infested uncircumcised Russsian Goyim Anti-Semites who are given Israeli citizenship,why the silence? Why the hypocracy?
If the Sudanese must go the Russian Goyim must go as well.
See http://pogrom.org.il/eng_articles.php?art_id=16
& also see http://pogrom.org.il/eng_articles.php?art_id=36
Everything has its time and place. It is like accusing Rav Kahane ZTL HYD of not being for a fully Jewish state because he was talking about expelling the Arab enemies and not about establishing the Shabbath to the full extent. Or not talking as much about Yom tiv or something else. Everything has and had its correct time and circumstances.
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Everything has its time and place. It is like accusing Rav Kahane ZTL HYD of not being for a fully Jewish state because he was talking about expelling the Arab enemies and not about establishing the Shabbath to the full extent. Or not talking as much about Yom tiv or something else. Everything has and had its correct time and circumstances.
Neo-Nazis from Russia have no place here & don't overlook that Jews are being denied aliyah while these scum are given carte blanche to enter & enjoy citizenship & benefits
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Indeed brother, Chaim Ben Pesah, and likely almost every Jew denied aliyah would be of more benefit to Israel then all the illegal immigrants in Israel combined.
My point is these Russian Goyim are here legally with the blessings of the Israeli government.
They were brought here because the leftists feared that the religious would outnumber them & take away their power so they brought in even those with forged papers claiming that they had some distant Jewish relative.
They are here & Chaim & others can not be here,what garbage this is & it must be publicised that Russian Goyim are more welcome by the Israeli government than religious Jews.
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all of those I trust 100% I know a copule of them and they are great and always continue in the way of the Rav
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Either these fake "Kahanists" must be a shtikel simple, or they have been infiltrated or are even infiltrators, sent to subvert the right from within cf Sharon and Raviv. Some claim that the "New Kach" is actually a Shabak operation!
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Either these fake "Kahanists" must be a shtikel simple, or they have been infiltrated or are even infiltrators, sent to subvert the right from within cf Sharon and Raviv. Some claim that the "New Kach" is actually a Shabak operation!
Who cares (actually we do) but the main thing is the message of Rav Kahane and the Torah. I will not and do not believe that those who operate the Yeshiva of the Jewish idea would be some shabak agents.
In fact I would have a lot more suspicion on someone like you who is trying to stirr the pot constantly here (and perhaps elsewhere as well, who knows).
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Speaking about the fake Right Wing, we nevertheless wish to be melamed zechuss on everyone wherever possible.
Are there any good points about the new head of Habayit Hayehudi Naftali Bennet?
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/1,7340,L-4302091,00.html
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5d/NaftaliBennett.jpg/250px-NaftaliBennett.jpg)
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Feiglin's opinion of Bennett:
" Bennett was born to USA olim from San Francisco, was a super combat soldier in Israel's elite fighting unit and is famous for being one of Israel's bright guys who started a hi-tech company and sold it for tens of millions of dollars.
Yesterday – the day when close to 60 million people voted for Barack Obama – a little less than 24,000 members of Bayit Yehudi voted and chose the man who many refer to as "the Feiglin of the Mafdal".
Bennett is a breath of fresh air and will infuse the "knitted kippot" political scene with energy and hope.
I expect Bennett's party to rise in the polls and receive many more seats that they currently have, which will have a negative impact on Likud.
The Likud today – especially after its merger with Avigdor Liberman's party – no longer appeals to the Religious Zionists.
There is of course, one thing, that can save Likud and bring back these votes.
If Moshe Feiglin receives a significant spot on the Likud Knesset "lineup", then – and only then - will Likud have a chance to convince these voters to come back.
Elections for the Likud Knesset "lineup" is scheduled for November 25th and we are working very hard and making sure that Moshe receives a strong and secure spot on that slate.
There is another reason why Moshe needs to be a key member of Likud's Knesset team.
Yesterday's victory for Obama means that Israel will face a very hostile USA president for the next 4 years.
Not only is Obama a lame duck president but he certainly wants "pay-back" for the support that Netanyahu's buddy, Sheldon Adelson, gave to his opponent.
Bibi will now face a very angry and unfriendly USA president that will make the last 4 years look like the Garden of Eden.
The pressure on Bibi will be enormous and the only way he will survive this pressure will be to have a strong Likud team in the Knesset who will give him the backbone he lacks.
Moshe could be the answer to that problem.
While this is not our main goal, it is an important by-product, and can make the difference to an Israel who bends or stands strong will a steel spine."
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Feiglin's opinion of Bennett:
" Bennett was born to USA olim from San Francisco, was a super combat soldier in Israel's elite fighting unit and is famous for being one of Israel's bright guys who started a hi-tech company and sold it for tens of millions of dollars.
Yesterday – the day when close to 60 million people voted for Barack Obama – a little less than 24,000 members of Bayit Yehudi voted and chose the man who many refer to as "the Feiglin of the Mafdal".
Bennett is a breath of fresh air and will infuse the "knitted kippot" political scene with energy and hope.
I expect Bennett's party to rise in the polls and receive many more seats that they currently have, which will have a negative impact on Likud.
The Likud today – especially after its merger with Avigdor Liberman's party – no longer appeals to the Religious Zionists.
There is of course, one thing, that can save Likud and bring back these votes.
If Moshe Feiglin receives a significant spot on the Likud Knesset "lineup", then – and only then - will Likud have a chance to convince these voters to come back.
Elections for the Likud Knesset "lineup" is scheduled for November 25th and we are working very hard and making sure that Moshe receives a strong and secure spot on that slate.
There is another reason why Moshe needs to be a key member of Likud's Knesset team.
Yesterday's victory for Obama means that Israel will face a very hostile USA president for the next 4 years.
Not only is Obama a lame duck president but he certainly wants "pay-back" for the support that Netanyahu's buddy, Sheldon Adelson, gave to his opponent.
Bibi will now face a very angry and unfriendly USA president that will make the last 4 years look like the Garden of Eden.
The pressure on Bibi will be enormous and the only way he will survive this pressure will be to have a strong Likud team in the Knesset who will give him the backbone he lacks.
Moshe could be the answer to that problem.
While this is not our main goal, it is an important by-product, and can make the difference to an Israel who bends or stands strong will a steel spine."
It seems to me Feiglin has ceased to make logical sense. In what way would Feiglin impact the relations between Obama and Netanyahu? Even if he got 2nd seat on the list (which obviously will not happen) how would that impact it? Even though his message doesn't make sense anymore, he's trying to get himself a higher seat. And I get that. He made it pretty close and seems to me like he wants to make a name for himself before he abandons this trainwreck and resets the whole manhigut yehudit program. If he's not thinking of resetting that, then I don't know what he's thinking.
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Chaim is is 100 % correct on his assessment of Ben Ari.
Real Authentic Jews are denied the right to make aliyah or even enter the country like Chaim while smega infested uncircumcised Russian Goyim get "aliyah" with ease.
There are Russian Goyim neo-nazis with a teudat zehut (Israeli ID card) with all benefits & Ben Ari is busy chasing schvartzers & doing nothing to help real Jews.
lol, interesting point. And amusing way of phrasing it.
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all of those I trust 100% I know a copule of them and they are great and always continue in the way of the Rav
What is your comment in reference to?
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The new party is called "Otzma l'Yisrael"
http://www.jpost.com/DiplomacyAndPolitics/Article.aspx?id=291611
Presumably most 'Kahanists' will vote for it!
(http://www.jpost.com/HttpHandlers/ShowImage.ashx?ID=207237)
But will it detract seats from the "Ichud Leumi/Bayit Yehudi" faction, who although wimpish, are betta than nothing!
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I will have nothing to do with it unless they deal with the smega infested uncircumcised Russian Goyim & send them back to Russia or elsewhere!!!!!
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A reminder for those who may have forgotten or never the learned the laws against lashon hara {slander and gossip}
Quote from http://www.torah.org/learning/halashon/chapter8.html#Forbidden
Speaking Lashon Hara About Scholars and Non-Scholars
The prohibition of Lashon Hara applies even with regard to an "Am HaAretz" (person of low intelligence or limited education), because he is also considered part of the nation of G-d's emissaries who were taken out of Egypt.
All the more so is it forbidden to speak about a Torah scholar (lit. "Talmid Chacham", also a role model in study, observance, and righteous conduct) certainly the speaker's violation is even more severe [because he transgresses additional commandments]. The Sages tell us, "Anyone who speaks about the strayings of a Torah scholar falls to Gehinom...." Also, by speaking the Lashon Hara, one might violate the prohibition against shaming a Torah scholar. The punishment of disgracing a Torah scholar is described in tractate Sanhedrin, and the Shulchan Arukh cites this in Yoreh Deah 243:6, "For he has disgraced the word of G-d....his soul shall be cut off."
The evil inclination incites man to believe that the law regarding shaming a Torah scholar is no longer relevant: that it is from the times of the Talmud, and refers to people as great as the scholars from those times, not those living today. This is a grave error, for the ranking of a Torah scholar is according to the generation, so even if nowadays someone is trained only in Yoreh Deah (the basic program for Rabbinic ordination, consisting primarily of the laws of Kashruth) and is accomplished in Torah study, he merits to be called a Torah scholar.
Therefore one who disgraces any Torah scholar--even through meaningless comments--whether to the scholar's face or when he isn't present, commits a severe sin and is thereby deserving of excommunication (as discussed in Yoreh Deah 243:7 and also the Shach's comments on 334 in note 68).
The transgression is more serious if the speaker of Lashon Hara is a community leader. Each community member is obliged to regard the scholar as a communal authority, treating him with respect and following his guidance. Furthermore, by disparaging the Torah leader he dissuades others from the worship of G-d, for in response to his words others will say, "Why should we go ask him [the Rabbi] the details of the Torah that we need to clarify, since he [is not qualified to] pass judgement?" Then everyone will "build their own altar" [a reference to the days of the Judges, when individuals created their own moral guidelines and modes of worship], and otherwise contribute to a breakdown of Torah observance, may Hashem protect us from this.
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I will have nothing to do with it unless they deal with the smega infested uncircumcised Russian Goyim & send them back to Russia or elsewhere!!!!!
The word is spelled "[censored]", not "smega"!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/[censored]
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בס''ד
I will discuss this on the next "Ask JTF", G-d willing.
These sell-outs are now running with the secularist Aryeh Eldad at the head of their new party. Eldad has said that "Jewish terrorists" (Jews who defend themselves against Muslim Nazis) should "die in prison". Eldad also opposed any meaningful resistance to the expulsion in Gush Katif.
The new party they are presenting is actually a combination of two parties: Eldad's secular party and the Ben Ari-Marzel-Ben Gvir party which is called the "Jewish National Front". When I was still supporting them, I urged them not to run with that name because the "National Front" in England is a Nazi party. But as always, they ignored my advice and now they are running with that name again.
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The word is spelled "[censored]", not "smega"!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/[censored]
I know how it is spelled this was a typo because I was typing too fast
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I know how it is spelled this was a typo because I was typing too fast
Chaim could you also comment on the thousands of Russian Goyim with Israeli citizenship who came here by fraudulent means & many who are neo nazis?
See www.pogrom.org.il about the numerous acts of Jew-hatred & neo-nazi activities purportrated here in the land of Israel by these [censored]!!!
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בס''ד
I will discuss this on the next "Ask JTF", G-d willing.
These sell-outs are now running with the secularist Aryeh Eldad at the head of their new party. Eldad has said that "Jewish terrorists" (Jews who defend themselves against Muslim Nazis) should "die in prison". Eldad also opposed any meaningful resistance to the expulsion in Gush Katif.
The new party they are presenting is actually a combination of two parties: Eldad's secular party and the Ben Ari-Marzel-Ben Gvir party which is called the "Jewish National Front". When I was still supporting them, I urged them not to run with that name because the "National Front" in England is a Nazi party. But as always, they ignored my advice and now they are running with that name again.
That's because these pseudo-Kahanist serpents are Nazis, Chaim.
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PS: Chaim, I am 99% sure that Yerusha is the troll Mifletzet/Nonny/Wonga.
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PS: Chaim, I am 99% sure that Yerusha is the troll Mifletzet/Nonny/Wonga.
For sure!
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PS: Chaim, I am 99% sure that Yerusha is the troll Mifletzet/Nonny/Wonga.
I am new here why do you say he is a troll?
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This is one heck of a development....hope there is a true awakening in Israel and America as well! God bring us back from the brink!