What's Your Idea of the Perfect Day?

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

Skippy, how can you value an animal more than your family, friends and even yourself? Are you a vegan? If not.... no aim to offend, but I find it silly to give one's life for a pet, and eat meat. What's the difference between a pet and cattle?
And G-d commanded men to take care of animals, not to make them suffer and Noah was also commnded to keep each species in the Ark. But He does not command us to give our lives for one animal, nor to love it more than a human being. The Torah says "VeAhavtah lere'acha Kamocha", note it says "Re'acha" not "Behemtecha"

Very simple the more I see of human nature, the more I love animals.

Honestly and loyalty are most highly regarded by me, few people have these traits.

[Sarah]

You can love animals and care for them but you can never relate the honesty and loyalty of an animal to that of a human and say that a human has less.

I would say that even if an animal was say 100% honest, even 10% of that honesty in a human is worth more. Animals have been designed to have loyal characters, some, whereas it takes effort of a human to achieve it.

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

You can love animals and care for them but you can never relate the honesty and loyalty of an animal to that of a human and say that a human has less.

I would say that even if an animal was say 100% honest, even 10% of that honesty in a human is worth more. Animals have been designed to have loyal characters, some, whereas it takes effort of a human to achieve it.

Animals are not designed to be loyal, they are designed to follow a pecking order.

Take Ants and Bees for example, complex social struture of millions, working together. Name one country one people that even comes close.............you can't because they Don't exist.

[Sarah]

You can love animals and care for them but you can never relate the honesty and loyalty of an animal to that of a human and say that a human has less.

I would say that even if an animal was say 100% honest, even 10% of that honesty in a human is worth more. Animals have been designed to have loyal characters, some, whereas it takes effort of a human to achieve it.

Animals are not designed to be loyal, they are designed to follow a pecking order.

Take Ants and Bees for example, complex social struture of millions, working together. Name one country one people that even comes close.............you can't because they Don't exist.

They don't exist because they have to achieve it themselves whereas the animals have been designed physically and mentally to work together yes and when fed and cared for they become loyal. They have been designed in the context  that their limits to free-will make them less rebellious and only follow natural inclinations and instincts that their bodies determine.

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

You can love animals and care for them but you can never relate the honesty and loyalty of an animal to that of a human and say that a human has less.

I would say that even if an animal was say 100% honest, even 10% of that honesty in a human is worth more. Animals have been designed to have loyal characters, some, whereas it takes effort of a human to achieve it.

Animals are not designed to be loyal, they are designed to follow a pecking order.

Take Ants and Bees for example, complex social struture of millions, working together. Name one country one people that even comes close.............you can't because they Don't exist.

They don't exist because they have to achieve it themselves whereas the animals have been designed physically and mentally to work together yes and when fed and cared for they become loyal. They have been designed in the context  that their limits to free-will make them less rebellious and only follow natural inclinations and instincts that their bodies determine.

It doesn't exist because humans are naturally aggressive.

[Ari]

Human Beings are animals, lol.

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

Human Beings are animals, lol.

Yes some more than others, thats why I only like a few 

[Raulmarrio2000]

Are you a vegetarian, Skippy? If you eat meat, there is a problem.....Let's see... you love animals more than your human friends.... if you eat animals, then what's left for your friends whom you love less??? And what about other prople who are not your relatives or friends??? I wouldn't like to meet you, you might kill me!!!!!!! 

[Hail Columbia]

1. To be able to see the forum visits record broken.
2. To learn that Fidel Castro has become worm food.
3. To do very well for the day's studies in college.
4. To be asked out by a nice young lady who looks like the one depicted in my sig.

[Ari]

You want to be asked out by a cartoon?

[Hail Columbia]

You want to be asked out by a cartoon?

No, by a real person who has certain attributes like the one depicted.

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

Are you a vegetarian, Skippy? If you eat meat, there is a problem.....Let's see... you love animals more than your human friends.... if you eat animals, then what's left for your friends whom you love less??? And what about other prople who are not your relatives or friends??? I wouldn't like to meet you, you might kill me!!!!!!! 

LOL Raul you can rest happy knowing I will not eat you,  .

I have a farm yes, I don't kill my animals to eat them, I go to the butcher. No I am not a vegetatian, yes I wear real fur and leather.

We are all apart of a circle of life, that is the natural order of things. Humans are both plant and meat eaters that is what we are designed for.

But you bring me a lamb and say raise until it is fat, then we kill it,  I SAY NO WAY, I will fight you till the end.

[Lubab]

Skippy, how can you value an animal more than your family, friends and even yourself? Are you a vegan? If not.... no aim to offend, but I find it silly to give one's life for a pet, and eat meat. What's the difference between a pet and cattle?
And G-d commanded men to take care of animals, not to make them suffer and Noah was also commnded to keep each species in the Ark. But He does not command us to give our lives for one animal, nor to love it more than a human being. The Torah says "VeAhavtah lere'acha Kamocha", note it says "Re'acha" not "Behemtecha"

Very simple the more I see of human nature, the more I love animals.

Honestly and loyalty are most highly regarded by me, few people have these traits.

Yes. But animals do this out of instinct, not out of their free will.
Unlike humans. We have more potential for bad, but we have more potential for doing good too. Our good is a real good because we do it out of free choice. It is a higher level of soul in that regard, and the higher they are the harder they can fall. But none of this is any reason why you should risk your life (a human soul) for an animal (an instinctive, animal soul who is just there to serve the human souls).

The animals were created to help humans. If we value them more than us, we are perverting the order of creation.

[New Yorker]

Dogs definitely have souls, cute, tail wagging, smiling, souls, and I'm sure the good ones get into heaven. 

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

Dogs definitely have souls, cute, tail wagging, smiling, souls, and I'm sure the good ones get into heaven. 

All dogs go to heaven they are all G-ds creatures. 

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

The animals were created to help humans. If we value them more than us, we are perverting the order of creation.

We are created to help the animals.
And no I don't ever believe I am a pervert for protecting them, helping them, and saving them.

They are nurtured, allowed to have a good quality of life in my hands, I can't see how G-d would condemn me for that.

I ask no other to do as I do. 

I no more believe animals are evil than a new born child.

If this means G-d will reject me from entering heaven, then so be it. I could not bear the thought of loving G-ds creations as being wrong.

Or standing back and allowing the abuse and evil of man to go on about me, and forcing me to do nothing.

I prefer to be dead than live a enslaved soulless life.

[Lubab]

The animals were created to help humans. If we value them more than us, we are perverting the order of creation.

We are created to help the animals.
And no I don't ever believe I am a pervert for protecting them, helping them, and saving them.

They are nurtured, allowed to have a good quality of life in my hands, I can't see how G-d would condemn me for that.

I ask no other to do as I do. 

I no more believe animals are evil than a new born child.

If this means G-d will reject me from entering heaven, then so be it. I could not bear the thought of loving G-ds creations as being wrong.

Or standing back and allowing the abuse and evil of man to go on about me, and forcing me to do nothing.

I prefer to be dead than live a enslaved soulless life.

Not at all Skippy. I think you completely misunderstood. Not everything is a package deal in this world.
Just because I said animals have a more limited level of free choice and therfore a lower level of soul, does NOT mean they are evil.

Animals in many ways are better than humans and we have an obligation never to harm them needlessly.

It is not a sin to care for animals, it's a wonderful thing. But when you value them more than human life, then things have simply gone out of proportion.

However, man was NOT created to serve the animals. If the animals were leading us the human race would all be dead pretty fast.

It's the other way around. Animals can do things we can't like plow a field all day...for instance. Each creation has it's own unique purpose. When each one fulfills it's mission, then that's pure good.


P.S. Perverted doesn't mean a "pervert" in the sexual sense of the word. Look it up. It just means things have gone out of whack.
G-d created man last, and he went UP in levels as he created stuff.

There is a certain order to this creation, a certain reason why G-d created some things before others, and we need to be aware of this order if the world is to function properly.

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

The animals were created to help humans. If we value them more than us, we are perverting the order of creation.

We are created to help the animals.
And no I don't ever believe I am a pervert for protecting them, helping them, and saving them.

They are nurtured, allowed to have a good quality of life in my hands, I can't see how G-d would condemn me for that.

I ask no other to do as I do. 

I no more believe animals are evil than a new born child.

If this means G-d will reject me from entering heaven, then so be it. I could not bear the thought of loving G-ds creations as being wrong.

Or standing back and allowing the abuse and evil of man to go on about me, and forcing me to do nothing.

I prefer to be dead than live a enslaved soulless life.

Not at all Skippy. I think you completely misunderstood. Not everything is a package deal in this world.
Just because I said animals have a more limited level of free choice and therfore a lower level of soul, does NOT mean they are evil.

Animals in many ways are better than humans and we have an obligation never to harm them needlessly.

It is not a sin to care for animals, it's a wonderful thing. But when you value them more than human life, then things have simply gone out of proportion.

However, man was NOT created to serve the animals. It's the other way around. Animals can do things we can't like plow a field all day...for instance. Each creation has it's own unique purpose. When each one fulfills it's mission, then that's pure good.

Serve?? I never said serve.

[Lubab]

The animals were created to help humans. If we value them more than us, we are perverting the order of creation.

We are created to help the animals.
And no I don't ever believe I am a pervert for protecting them, helping them, and saving them.

They are nurtured, allowed to have a good quality of life in my hands, I can't see how G-d would condemn me for that.

I ask no other to do as I do. 

I no more believe animals are evil than a new born child.

If this means G-d will reject me from entering heaven, then so be it. I could not bear the thought of loving G-ds creations as being wrong.

Or standing back and allowing the abuse and evil of man to go on about me, and forcing me to do nothing.

I prefer to be dead than live a enslaved soulless life.

Not at all Skippy. I think you completely misunderstood. Not everything is a package deal in this world.
Just because I said animals have a more limited level of free choice and therfore a lower level of soul, does NOT mean they are evil.

Animals in many ways are better than humans and we have an obligation never to harm them needlessly.

It is not a sin to care for animals, it's a wonderful thing. But when you value them more than human life, then things have simply gone out of proportion.

However, man was NOT created to serve the animals. It's the other way around. Animals can do things we can't like plow a field all day...for instance. Each creation has it's own unique purpose. When each one fulfills it's mission, then that's pure good.

Serve?? I never said serve.

You said "help"=serve, no?

Helping the animals is NOT our purpose in creation. We have a lot more to do than that. They are here to help us.

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

You said "help"=serve, no?

Helping the animals is NOT our purpose in creation. We have a lot more to do than that. They are here to help us.

Not there i come from mate, help and serve are two different things.

Help
Definition: To furnish with strength or means for the successful performance of any action or the attainment of any object; to aid; to assist; as, to help a man in his work; to help one to remember; the following infinitive is commonly used without to; as, "Help me scale yon balcony."

Serve
Definition: The performance of work or duties for a superior or as a servant

I never said it was our sole duty, but is apart of it, everyone has a role, you can't have all leaders and no workers, its called delegation.

And mine is with the protection and helping of G-ds creatures.

Your role is different to mine, as a rabbi you are  people focused.

I don't disrespect you for your choice in life.

[JTFFan]

Human Beings are animals, lol.

Yes some more than others, thats why I only like a few 

Good to hear

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

Human Beings are animals, lol.

Yes some more than others, thats why I only like a few 

Good to hear

Don't worry you are one of them 

[Lubab]

You said "help"=serve, no?

Helping the animals is NOT our purpose in creation. We have a lot more to do than that. They are here to help us.

Not there i come from mate, help and serve are two different things.

Help
Definition: To furnish with strength or means for the successful performance of any action or the attainment of any object; to aid; to assist; as, to help a man in his work; to help one to remember; the following infinitive is commonly used without to; as, "Help me scale yon balcony."

Serve
Definition: The performance of work or duties for a superior or as a servant

I never said it was our sole duty, but is apart of it, everyone has a role, you can't have all leaders and no workers, its called delegation.

And mine is with the protection and helping of G-ds creatures.

Your role is different to mine, as a rabbi you are  people focused.

I don't disrespect you for your choice in life.

Wrong. I am a Jew first and foremost. My goal is to elevate ALL of creation including the animals to their purpose for which they were created. That is my job description.

It's good you take care of them, just remember who is supposed to be leading who.

Animals generally do okay without human assistance. Usually it's when humans get involved we mess it up.

[Tina Greco - Melbourne]

You said "help"=serve, no?

Helping the animals is NOT our purpose in creation. We have a lot more to do than that. They are here to help us.

Not there i come from mate, help and serve are two different things.

Help
Definition: To furnish with strength or means for the successful performance of any action or the attainment of any object; to aid; to assist; as, to help a man in his work; to help one to remember; the following infinitive is commonly used without to; as, "Help me scale yon balcony."

Serve
Definition: The performance of work or duties for a superior or as a servant

I never said it was our sole duty, but is apart of it, everyone has a role, you can't have all leaders and no workers, its called delegation.

And mine is with the protection and helping of G-ds creatures.

Your role is different to mine, as a rabbi you are  people focused.

I don't disrespect you for your choice in life.

Wrong. I am a Jew first and foremost. My goal is to elevate ALL of creation including the animals to their purpose for which they were created. That is my job description.

It's good you take care of them, just remember who is supposed to be leading who.

Animals generally do okay without human assistance. Usually it's when humans get involved we mess it up.

I never forget who is my leader

[JTFFan]

The Perfect Day would be no to wake up one day and there are no muSSlims and no iSSlam anymore