Torah and Jewish Idea > Torah and Jewish Idea
First 5 Pasuqim Of Bereishith The Way It Should Be Read!!!
Spectator:
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on October 14, 2009, 11:32:57 AM ---I'm not sure what point you are making by saying the Ashkenazi pronunciation does the vowels better. Didn't we already say in this thread that this is not a "competition" and that it does not matter who is better or worse? Like I've said, both sides have their strengths and weaknesses, both have had influence from the galut, but there is still only one ideal lashon hakodesh , even if it is some combination of 3 or 4 different dialects that have preserved different aspects of it.
--- End quote ---
Of course it's not a competition. As you said:
--- Quote ---Nobody here is arguing something is better or worse. The point is what is correct. Aspects from either side are correct and incorrect.
--- End quote ---
So I state that the advantage of Askenazi pronouncation is in its vowels, as well as I admit that Sefaradi has advantage in consonants. Ashkenazi is more likely close to the correct in vowels, and Sepharadi is in consonants.
Spectator:
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on October 14, 2009, 11:35:03 AM ---Also, even though I've used the same language as you here, I don't think it's accurate to call these "dialects" of Hebrew because they developed in the galut due to errors, and they were not local differences that sprouted organically in Eretz Yisrael where the language was spoken.
--- End quote ---
I agree that "dialects" is not too correct word for Ashkenazi and Sefaradi pronouncatios. I used it just to show that both of them are legitimate versions of Hebrew, as two recognized dialects of a language can be legitimate.
--- Quote from: Kahane-Was-Right BT on October 14, 2009, 11:35:03 AM ---because they developed in the galut due to errors
--- End quote ---
I agree but I would formulate it otherwise. They both preserved those unique Hebrew features that were similar to the respective languages of peoples Ashkenazim and Sepharadim lived with.
Spectator:
--- Quote from: דוד בן זאב אריה on October 14, 2009, 11:03:16 AM ---
--- Quote from: Zelhar on October 13, 2009, 05:19:05 PM ---The Ashkenazi pronunciation sounds completely alien to Hebrew in my opinion. I think it is Hebrew words pronounced in Yiddish.
--- End quote ---
I agree 100% I am Ashkenazi but I learned to speak Hebrew the Israeli way and now that I am in Israel it makes it much easier for me.
--- End quote ---
Nobody argues here about modern spoken Hebrew. Even Israeli religious Ashkenazim use "Israeli way" in everyday speech.
Sefardic Panther:
I am certainly not prejudiced against the Ashkenazi tradition. On the contrary I study Hasiduth, the Tanya and Rebbe Nachman’s books. I admire the Ashkenazi Rebbes and would never have a bad word said about them. Rashi was Ashkenazi and Rabbi Meir Kahane was Ashkenazi and the Gedol of our generation Rabbi Mordechai Freidman Shlita is Ashkenazi. I hope that Rabbi Mordechai Freidman Shlita will one day become the Chief Rabbi of Israel or the head of the Sanhedrin because he is the best religious Zionist Rabbi.
Certainly Yiddish should be preserved with in the context of Torah study but when it comes to reading the Torah itself the germanic pronounciation of Hebrew is inaccurate. The Torah was mostly written in the ancient Akkadian dialect. I think that’s the reason why Hebrew and Arabic are identical because they both derived from Akkadian. Akkadian was the ancient language of the Arabian peninsula where Avraham Avinu’s ancestors invaded Sumer from. Read Talmud Bavli Berakhoth 13b it says the Daleth in Ehad (not the Heth or the kamats) must be prolonged which is impossible with european pronouciation. And read the Sefer Yetsirah with Saadia Gaon’s commentary he said the Hebrew language has 29 sounds (the 22 letters plus the 7 alternate letter sounds) which are identical to Arabic. With all due respect those sources trump whatever anyone else has said about the correct pronounciation of Toranic Hebrew.
Spectator:
Spephardic Panther, I am happy that you are not against Ashkenazi tradition and scholars.
Regarding Saadia Gaon’s commentary on Hebrew language. As I can see from your post, the commentary deals with the Hebrew letters that represent consonants. What about nekudot that represent vowels? What about the difference between patch and kamatz, segol and tzere, etc?
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version