Author Topic: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory  (Read 18179 times)

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Offline muman613

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #75 on: October 21, 2010, 05:52:52 PM »
DBF,

I dont want to get into it with you. You are not a Jew and I have no business rebuking you. I really dont care what you think about Judaism.

Regarding this topic... Yes, I have heard several normative Orthodox Rabbis discuss the fact that there is some evidence that Jews came across the ocean before Columbus and may have established trading ports here in America. There is nothing against Judaism with this and this is why Tamar Yonah who is a religious Jew in Israel posted this on her blog on IsraelNationalNews. If you have a problem with that then go complain to the Rabbis and other Jewish scientists who have suggested this. I am not the one who invented this and it has nothing to do with Moron religions...

My thread about Roger Waters was less concerned with RW himself {as I have said many times I have a feeling from Pink Floyd lyrics that the band is anti-zionist and antisemitic}... The reason I posted that post was I was surprised that ADL said something about it. When ADL does do something proper I don't have a problem saying so, and when it does wrong {as you are quick to point out} I also say it is wrong and hope that ADL will change.

I examine each and every thing I write and say. I don't think I have done anything wrong against anyone here. I do not bear a grudge and look forward to being able to forgive and ask for forgiveness from my fellow. If you are attempting to give me advice DBF, thank you... If your intention is truly to bring peace that is a noble thing...

http://lazerbrody.typepad.com/lazer_beams/2005/08/the_trail_of_te_1.html
http://www.breslev.co.il/articles/society/jewish_world/the_cherokee_connection.aspx?id=9625&language=english
http://www.jewishmag.com/142mag/mordecai_manuel_noah/mordecai_manuel_noah.htm
http://www.moshiach.com/tribes/ns/6.html

But I am coming to the conclusion that this is an urban myth at this point.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2010, 05:59:32 PM by muman613 »
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Chai

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #76 on: October 21, 2010, 07:07:17 PM »
Yea,  I think its time for me to move on to Hebrew forums only if no one stands up for Judaism here except Chaim ben Pesach and David ben Moshe whom I grew up watching.

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #77 on: October 21, 2010, 07:41:27 PM »
Yea,  I think its time for me to move on to Hebrew forums only if no one stands up for Judaism here except Chaim ben Pesach and David ben Moshe whom I grew up watching.
Who is "not standing up for Judaism"?

Right now I can think of only a couple of current members who have bashed or denigrated Judaism, and they haven't posted in this thread as far as I can see.

Offline Chai

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #78 on: October 21, 2010, 08:02:48 PM »
Im surprised people arent standing up against Massah  better I say that.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #79 on: October 21, 2010, 08:05:09 PM »
Some people are rubbed the wrong way by you too, DBR, and I'm not asking any questions about that!

*sigh* fine, fair enough, but if you have a problem with me, you can always "bring it", either here or over PM, and I will either agree that you have a point or defend myself. If you want to take issue with me (let's say my recent Miley Cyrus threads), then, well, what can I say--a few people were critical of them but I didn't rip into them, although I think it was easy enough for them not to click on them to begin with. I do still believe with all my heart that Cyrus and kin are more dangerous to the souls of young girls than Obama, Buchanan, etc.

I'm afraid you might have misunderstood me.   I don't have a problem with you DBF, but it's readily apparent at times that others here do!   And that doesn't make me curious of you or them.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #80 on: October 21, 2010, 08:06:52 PM »
Yea,  I think its time for me to move on to Hebrew forums only if no one stands up for Judaism here except Chaim ben Pesach and David ben Moshe whom I grew up watching.

Hey dude, I'm all for standing up for Judaism, but in my book that doesn't mean calling someone worse than Hitler!

Offline Dr. Dan

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #81 on: October 21, 2010, 08:44:32 PM »
Im surprised people arent standing up against Massah  better I say that.

i don't take anything he says seriously...he is more of a comic relief..don't mind him.
If someone says something bad about you, say something nice about them. That way, both of you would be lying.

In your heart you know WE are right and in your guts you know THEY are nuts!

"Science without religion is lame; Religion without science is blind."  - Albert Einstein

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #82 on: October 21, 2010, 09:17:20 PM »
I'm afraid you might have misunderstood me.   I don't have a problem with you DBF, but it's readily apparent at times that others here do!   And that doesn't make me curious of you or them.
I never thought you had a problem with me; "you" was meant more in the third-person than literally. It meant everyone.

Offline Chai

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #83 on: October 21, 2010, 09:17:48 PM »
Meh , once in a while he gets lucky and gets in some good dry humor , but mostly its childish , esp for a 60 something year old man, its sad a 20 something like me has to say that.

Offline Kahane-Was-Right BT

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #84 on: October 21, 2010, 09:52:35 PM »
I'm afraid you might have misunderstood me.   I don't have a problem with you DBF, but it's readily apparent at times that others here do!   And that doesn't make me curious of you or them.
I never thought you had a problem with me; "you" was meant more in the third-person than literally. It meant everyone.

Oh , I see.   Yeah I mean there is a guy you've been arguing with lately and it's pretty funny.   

Offline muman613

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #85 on: October 21, 2010, 10:04:24 PM »
Meh , once in a while he gets lucky and gets in some good dry humor , but mostly its childish , esp for a 60 something year old man, its sad a 20 something like me has to say that.

Chai,

Come on... Back off a little. I do believe more respect is due. Massuh is not evil and I know his intentions are good. It does not help that you are being so stubborn about this. I request that you please stop disrespecting Massuh. Everyone has different experiences in life and we should not be judgmental like this. As I stated concerning judging others, Pirkie Avot teaches that we should not judge another Jew unless we have stood in their 'shoes'.

I will reproduce the quote block I posted in the Torah section in order for us to learn from this wisdom:


Quote
Pirkie Avot
Mishnah 1:6
Joshua the son of Perachia and Nitai the Arbelite received from them. Joshua the son of Perachia would say: Assume for yourself a master, acquire for yourself a friend, and judge every man to the side of merit.

Mishnah 1:8
Judah  the son of Tabbai and Shimon the son of Shotach received from them. Judah the son of Tabbai would say: When sitting in judgement, do not act as a counselor-at-law. When the litigants stand before you, consider them both guilty; and when they leave your courtroom, having accepted the judgement, regard them as equally righteous.

Mishnah 2:4
...
Hillel  would say: Do not separate yourself from the community. Do not believe in yourself until the day you die. Do not judge your fellow until you have stood in his place. Do not say something that is not readily understood in the belief that it will ultimately be understood [or: Do not say something that ought not to be heard even in the strictest confidence, for ultimately it will be heard]. And do not say "When I free myself of my concerns, I will study,'' for perhaps you will never free yourself.

Mishnah 3:15
All is foreseen, and freedom of choice is granted. The world is judged with goodness, but in accordance with the amount of man's positive deeds.

Mishnah 4:7
His son, Rabbi Ishmael would say: One who refrains from serving as a judge avoids hatred, thievery and false oaths. One who frivolously hands down rulings is a fool, wicked and arrogant.

Mishnah 4:8
He would also say: Do not judge on your own, for there is none qualified to judge alone, only the One. And do not say, "You must accept my view," for this is their [the majority's] right, not yours.

So I will say again... Let us not demean each other in public. We have some very rotten enemies such as the recent "Saint El Sayyid Nosair" who posted some very vile pictures of dead Jews and loved the picture of the assassination of our beloved Rabbi. How can we fight between brothers when our enemies are laughing?

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Chai

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #86 on: October 21, 2010, 10:18:28 PM »
I'm not. I just don't think he has the right idea so I let him know. He offends me with how he views Judaism...  what respect for Massachusetts lol he insults you too and I'm the bad guy??lol

« Last Edit: October 21, 2010, 10:24:49 PM by Chai »

Offline White Israelite

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #87 on: October 21, 2010, 10:25:34 PM »
Muman, there is no connection to Native Americans or Jews, Jews did not visit America previous to Columbus and any rational person will agree. The only Jews with even slight traces of Native blood are those who either took Native wives or husbands (which there are some), they converted, or they came to South America and mixed with local populations due to the caste system. Even marriage between Jews with North American Indians was and still is extremely rare. I don't know a single person with Jewish and Native American ancestry or even a halfblood. The Natives either mixed with British, Scottish, or Irish descendants or they stuck with their own. Even black and native american mixture was rare and almost non existent, for some reason a lot of blacks think they have Cherokee ancestors when DNA proved that wrong. There are fewer North American Indians than what people think, a lot of people in registered tribes aren't full blooded and there are a lot of frauds running around nowadays like churchill.

The only Jews that would have even a slight amount of Mongoloid admixture would be the Chinese Jews or possibly some of the Russian Jews if they mixed with the Mongoloid population.

Claiming the Cherokee have Jewish ancestry is silly, if they had Jewish ancestry, they would follow our customs, speak our language, and preserve some sort of identity and they do not. These claims of Hebrew and Cherokee being related is false and the words have no meaning, Tsalagi language bears no resemblance to Semitic languages, it doesn't even bear a resemblance to Asian languages. It's like claiming Australoids are Jewish, they are a completely different group of people and while some want to claim they are related to Siberians, even if they are, 20,000 years of separation changes DNA a LOT.

Try posting this on powwows.com or mytribalspace and see what kind of response you get, they are as Jewish as a kosher ham sandwich.

Offline muman613

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #88 on: October 21, 2010, 10:29:27 PM »
I'm not. I just don't think he has the right idea so I let him know. He offends me with how he views Judaism 

Chai,

As I said before, I do believe you have good intentions also. But I will bring up one last item. You point out that you believe Massuh is old. I am sure you have heard the Jewish ideas concerning giving respect to your elders. I am getting up there in years myself {I am going to be 46 in January}.

Here are some Talmudic sources to support the tradition of respect of elders.

Quote
http://www.webshas.org/chesed/zaken.htm

Respectful Behavior

      Not stepping before one who is greater: Megillah 28a
      Standing up for an elder who is not learned: Kiddushin 32b-33a, 33a
      Standing up before a non-Jewish elder: Kiddushin 33a
      Standing up while the elder is still at a distance: Kiddushin 32b, 33a
      Standing up in a bathroom or bathhouse: Kiddushin 32b, 33a
      Whether one must spend money for this show of respect: Kiddushin 32b, 33a
      Pretending that one doesn't see the elder: Kiddushin 32b, 33a
      The responsibility of an elder to keep from burdening others by walking by them when it isn't necessary: Kiddushin 32b, 33a, 33b

From Sichos In English site @ http://www.sichosinenglish.org/essays/67.htm

Quote
...

In fact this is alluded to in the Fifth Commandment: "Honor your father and mother so that your days may be lengthened upon the earth that the L-rd your G-d gives you." If you want your own days lengthened, in respected and useful contribution to society, then honor and respect your own elders now.

That one of the first Ten Commandments given to the Jewish People at Mt. Sinai, and engraved upon the Two Tablets of stone, is respect for elders, is a mark of its prominent place in the Torah. The Torah viewpoint on this is totally opposite to that of modern society. Longevity and old age are considered in the Torah one of the greatest possible blessings. "Many years bring wisdom" (Iyov 32 : 7), says the Biblical verse. "The older elderly scholars get, the more settled their minds become," says the Talmud (End Kinnim). Members of the Sanhedrin (Jewish Supreme Court and governing body during the Biblical and Mishnaic eras) would normally have to be aged over seventy. The Torah (Shulchan Aruch, Yoreh Deah 244:1) tells us to rise before old people aged seventy or older, even if they are not Torah-scholars, out of respect "for the trials and tribulations they have undergone" ( Talmud Kiddushin 33a) .

...

Well, I think everyone gets my drift so I will leave it at that...

Thank you for your consideration Chai. May we let this issue pass...

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline muman613

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #89 on: October 21, 2010, 10:31:32 PM »
Muman, there is no connection to Native Americans or Jews, Jews did not visit America previous to Columbus and any rational person will agree. The only Jews with even slight traces of Native blood are those who either took Native wives or husbands (which there are some), they converted, or they came to South America and mixed with local populations due to the caste system. Even marriage between Jews with North American Indians was and still is extremely rare. I don't know a single person with Jewish and Native American ancestry or even a halfblood. The Natives either mixed with British, Scottish, or Irish descendants or they stuck with their own. Even black and native american mixture was rare and almost non existent, for some reason a lot of blacks think they have Cherokee ancestors when DNA proved that wrong. There are fewer North American Indians than what people think, a lot of people in registered tribes aren't full blooded and there are a lot of frauds running around nowadays like churchill.

The only Jews that would have even a slight amount of Mongoloid admixture would be the Chinese Jews or possibly some of the Russian Jews if they mixed with the Mongoloid population.

Claiming the Cherokee have Jewish ancestry is silly, if they had Jewish ancestry, they would follow our customs, speak our language, and preserve some sort of identity and they do not. These claims of Hebrew and Cherokee being related is false and the words have no meaning, Tsalagi language bears no resemblance to Semitic languages, it doesn't even bear a resemblance to Asian languages. It's like claiming Australoids are Jewish, they are a completely different group of people and while some want to claim they are related to Siberians, even if they are, 20,000 years of separation changes DNA a LOT.

Try posting this on powwows.com or mytribalspace and see what kind of response you get, they are as Jewish as a kosher ham sandwich.

Once again, I am sorry if I posted something which has been disproven. I only posted it because I have heard this from some Rabbis and it was just posted on Tamar Yonahs blog and radio show. Im sorry if this may confuse people. I do not want to spread sheker.

You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #90 on: October 21, 2010, 11:12:58 PM »
Is there anything even remotely Native-looking in Jews?

The vast majority of the world's Jews are of various Caucasian nationalities with trace amounts of Middle Eastern blood in them (except for Mizrachi who have much more). But even the darkest, 100% purely Middle Eastern Jew doesn't remotely resemble an Indian.

I don't know who Tamar Yonah is but I have to question whether or not she has been getting whipped up by the LDS' current propaganda blitz.

Offline Rubystars

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #91 on: October 22, 2010, 05:51:53 AM »
I think I noticed some of their ads on Zootube. I think Mormonism is very destructive so I hate to see people falling into that mindset. It's bad enough you have Glenn Beck giving it such a high profile. The men in Mormonism basically believe that they're going to be gods of their own planet. The women believe that they get to be eternal breeders who pop out baby after baby, and they won't get to be eternal breeding goddesses unless they're married to a Mormon man.

Offline Chaim Ben Pesach

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #92 on: October 22, 2010, 07:59:22 AM »
בס''ד

Once again, I urge an end to all of the personal insults here. There is no reason and no excuse for these personal attacks. Chai and Massa, please put aside this sinat chinam (needless hatred). Even if someone writes something foolish or hateful, that is no reason to pour gasoline on the fire by responding with more hateful invective. I appeal to you to stop this for the good of the movement.


Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #93 on: October 22, 2010, 09:32:33 AM »
I think I noticed some of their ads on Zootube. I think Mormonism is very destructive so I hate to see people falling into that mindset. It's bad enough you have Glenn Beck giving it such a high profile. The men in Mormonism basically believe that they're going to be gods of their own planet. The women believe that they get to be eternal breeders who pop out baby after baby, and they won't get to be eternal breeding goddesses unless they're married to a Mormon man.

If Tamar Yonah has fallen into that, to any extent, I really feel sorry for her.

Offline muman613

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #94 on: October 22, 2010, 09:34:39 AM »
I think I noticed some of their ads on Zootube. I think Mormonism is very destructive so I hate to see people falling into that mindset. It's bad enough you have Glenn Beck giving it such a high profile. The men in Mormonism basically believe that they're going to be gods of their own planet. The women believe that they get to be eternal breeders who pop out baby after baby, and they won't get to be eternal breeding goddesses unless they're married to a Mormon man.

If Tamar Yonah has fallen into that, to any extent, I really feel sorry for her.

This has nothing to do with Mormonism, as I have said many times in this thread. There are some Rabbis who have been telling this story.

I don't believe everything I hear from Tamars show.
You shall make yourself the Festival of Sukkoth for seven days, when you gather in [the produce] from your threshing floor and your vat.And you shall rejoice in your Festival-you, and your son, and your daughter, and your manservant, and your maidservant, and the Levite, and the stranger, and the orphan, and the widow, who are within your cities
Duet 16:13-14

Offline Lewinsky Stinks, Dr. Brennan Rocks

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #95 on: October 23, 2010, 06:44:24 PM »
The Mormon Church (LDS) should not be underestimated. It has a global reach and is enormously wealthy, fanatically devoted to conversion and brainwashing. As far as I am concerned it is the non-violent version of Islam. Salt Lake City (the Mormon Vatican) has virtually every institution under the sun--a Mormon "scientific research" department, an archaeology department, and so on and so on. It is very, very conceivable for some LDS "scientists", without revealing their true identities, to have contacted some gullible rabbis, schmoozed them up, and gotten them to sign off on their wacky idea.

Offline Lisa

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #96 on: October 23, 2010, 07:13:57 PM »
Why is the Mormon Church the equivalent of Islam?

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #97 on: October 23, 2010, 07:16:34 PM »
Why is the Mormon Church the equivalent of Islam?
At one time, they did practice jihad. Joseph Smith (ys) routinely ambushed non-Mormon wagon trains out west and/or ordered his followers, such as Brigham Young to do so. Even today, in its non-violent sense, it is like Islam in that it aggressively seeks to establish itself as the sole true religion on earth and wants to establish a theocracy, even if by peaceful means.

Offline JTFenthusiast2

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #98 on: October 23, 2010, 07:44:02 PM »
Dr. Brennan Fan,  I really disagree with this comparison.  Most Mormons are very good people.  They do not commit 'Jihad' against anyone.  Anyway,  how are you?  What part of the US are you in?

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Re: Tamar Yonah Supports Jewish American Indian Theory
« Reply #99 on: October 23, 2010, 11:52:56 PM »
Dr. Brennan Fan,  I really disagree with this comparison.  Most Mormons are very good people.  They do not commit 'Jihad' against anyone.  Anyway,  how are you?  What part of the US are you in?

They destroy families though. I've also thought before that they have quite a bit in common with Islam minus the violence. JWs are worse than Mormons in my opinion because they cause people to die with their crazy superstitions about blood. However Mormons still cut family off from each other, fill people with a lot of super strange ideas, etc. To have the arrogance to think that you can be like God is one of the worst sins in my opinion.